Modern Populist Movements

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Modern Populist Movements

Postby Phatscotty on Mon Dec 26, 2011 1:04 am


Based on Richard A. Epstein's new Broadside, this video outlines the differences between the classical liberalism of the Tea Parties and the progressive agenda advanced by the OWS movement, and reveals that the painful performance of the American economy in the past decade is not a function of bad luck, but the product of flawed institutional design.

We are reaping the harvest of efforts to reinvigorate the progressive programs of the New Deal that stress high progressive taxes, large transfer payments, strong labor laws, and major barriers to free trade. This combination of public finance and market regulation has proved a potent force for disaster.

Richard Allen Epstein (born April 17, 1943) is the Laurence A. Tisch Professor of Law at the New York University School of Law and Professor of Law Emeritus at the University of Chicago Law School.
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Re: Modern Populist Movements

Postby nietzsche on Mon Dec 26, 2011 3:47 am

Ok I'm gonna watch it but it better be good, it's almost 6 minutes.
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Re: Modern Populist Movements

Postby nietzsche on Mon Dec 26, 2011 4:09 am

Compelling but since I'm economically illiterate I cannot believe it until I hear the other side.
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Re: Modern Populist Movements

Postby Phatscotty on Mon Dec 26, 2011 4:41 am

nietzsche wrote:Compelling but since I'm economically illiterate I cannot believe it until I hear the other side.




Obama's recent "New Nationalism" Speech, delivered at the same place Teddy Roosevelt gave his "Progressive Nationalism" speech 100 years ago. Ah, heck, that's almost an hour

Stealth Marxism is one of the best philosophical presentations of Progressivism


Taken from a report from the Commonweal Institute authored by Kyle Gillette Ph.D., the progressive agenda consists of the following:
The greatest danger to the American Republic and Constitutional freedoms comes from within. It isn’t a military or terroristic threat. It isn’t illegal immigration or even economic decline. It isn’t an energy crisis or a lack of innovation or productive labor. It is a political ideology that is counter to everything that has made this country the lone super power in the world and has provided the highest standard of living for its people in history. It is called “Modern Progressivism”.

What fertilizes the gardens where “modern progressivism” grows? What do these “modern Progressives” believe?

Over the past few years, many progressive thinkers have addressed this question, and the values conversation has grown robust. This report consolidates their work and performs a systematic analysis of the underlying conceptual frameworks. The results of this analysis distill the frameworks into three core pairs of values: Freedom / Security, Community / The Commons, and Truth / Justice. After detailing what each value pair addresses, this report connects these values to American mental constructs, community identities, and communication strategies.

Each value pair speaks to a different realm of political life: Freedom / Security defines the opportunities and protections the government gives individuals; Community / The Commons describes the relationships among groups and shared resources; and Truth / Justice refers to the formal structures of language and law that mediate between individual and communal concerns. Rather than separate values, each pair describes a dynamic relationship that motivates progressive morality and ethics.

Even as the “modern Progressive” aggressively asserts that they are for American ideals, we can, in their own words, examine the logical disconnects between the progressive agenda and traditional American Constitutional values.

Freedom:

“Progressives believe that the government should give individuals Freedom of choice and speech and allow people to determine the course of their own lives…The differences between what progressives and conservatives mean by “Freedom” have to do with the role of empathy and responsibility, and the definition of who counts as an individual…In other words, adhering too strictly to principles of free market economics can backfire and undermine the ability of average Americans to participate in that very Freedom that ostensibly belongs to them.”

I would argue that this statement is the antithesis of the concept of freedom. The first statement is telling, “…the government should give…” indicates a belief that freedom is “given” by the government and is not an inherent natural state. This is not a freedom based on self determination; it is a reliance on a government to determine what amount of freedom we are allowed to have. It also established a basis for anti-capitalism by espousing “economic justice” as a foundation for freedom.

Security:

While progressives…respect the power of the free market, they consider protection from capitalism’s excesses and exploitations crucial to being “free.” Since progressives believe that one of the essential roles of government is to provide security against the harm and the vicissitudes of fate and such protection is not free, they support taxation for the purpose of providing Security against fate, even if taxation lessens individuals’ right to do what they choose with their money.

More anti-capitalist and redistributionist policies -the only way for us to be truly “free” is for the government to completely de-risk daily life, limit opportunity (because to take advantage of opportunity requires varying degrees of risk) and take from the successful to insure against “fate”, even if that “taxation lessens individuals’ right to do what they choose with their money.”

Community:

For progressives, to value Community means to value people, human bonds, social structures, and healthy families…Progressives particularly value communities characterized by creativity, equality, diversity, and a strong sense of mutual interdependence. Progressives are motivated by empathy and responsibility. The traditional hierarchies and marital institutions that conservatives hold so sacred do not make sense to progressives, who…strive for changing society as needed to meet the demands of the present.

A “a strong sense of mutual interdependence” - what could this possibly be? If it were not for the economic implications of the former statements, this might be taken as simply recognition that we need each other to create a strong nation. We can’t ignore the former positions. What this means is a trend toward communal or communistic policies enforced by an overweening government.

The intellectual discontinuities of the last parts of the agenda are staggering. Empathy and responsibility? Empathy for sure – feelings over facts, emotion over logic, we see evidence of this in enaction of social policy, affirmative action and “hate crime” laws are prime examples. How is it even possible that a society can be held responsible when the very next belief statement implies that “traditional hierarchies” will change to fit the needs of times? Responsibility implies accountability; accountability implies being measured against a standard. If the standard changes, the measure is invalid. Moral relativity fits more with this definition than responsibility does.

The Commons:

The Commons are what we share, what no one can claim as private property and what all of us need to live healthy, happy lives. Progressives recognize that all humans have The Commons in common. [P]rogressives inclusively see future generations as a much broader category than their own particular children.

The implication here is that there is no right to private property if someone determines that what you have should be held “in common”. Who gets to determine this? Some government of governmental agency does. Look at this as an unlimited Eminent Domain clause for the entire globe. This is global governance writ large.

Truth:

Progressives value telling the Truth because it is true. [The] value of Truth dictates a strong progressive desire for objective and rational analysis. Although many progressive values align with the values of most major religions, progressives no more accept the dictates of Bush’s alleged conversations with God than they would Osama bin Laden’s. The “separation of church and state” on the one hand protects religious minorities from persecution, a function as important today as it was in the late 18th century. More importantly, though, this separation protects the government’s objectivity and the citizenry’s ability to access objective Truth.

This most interesting facet of this proposition is that the author of the paper uses Al Gore as an example of objective truth. Given that the paper was written in 2008 and now we have Climategate, the implication of the Progressives’ quest for “truth” seems to be less objective and more with what fits their political objectives. It is also interesting that the agenda removes all possibility of the supernatural (a belief in God) which would seem to be inconsistent with the possibility for empathy.

Justice:

Equality of opportunity has long been the cornerstone of the progressive sense of Justice. While having equal access to opportunities does indeed enhance Freedom and acknowledges and protects the type of interdependent Community that Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr., advocated, it also and independently plays on the progressive love of Justice and antipathy toward special privilege. Progressives believe that everyone should play fair, and that the terms of fairness derive neither from birthright nor from mere convention or tradition. The terms of fairness derive rather from a rational sense of Justice that lies beyond power, beyond privilege, and even beyond the traditions established by legal precedent.

Justice “beyond the traditions established by legal precedent.”? Who gets to determine this when we go beyond legal precedent? This is the faulty rationale that exists behind our tendency to pass laws that we have no intent to enforce or not to enforce laws that are out of favor. The notions of “fairness” are based on a belief that rules and regulations create fairness – they do not. They restrict freedom in contradiction to many of the Progressives positions and stated “antipathy toward special privilege”, the very reasons that Progressives use rules and regulations are to create special privilege for classes that they determine to need them. They seek to create equality of outcomes, not equal opportunity.

Sounds great, right? Who could disagree with the concepts of freedom, security, community, truth and justice? These guys could be Superman, professing the ideals of “truth, justice and the American way” but almost all of the beliefs stated are contradictory to each other. The Progressive agenda as stated is an exercise in opposing points of logic.

In fact, the Progressive agenda fits like a glove with the pillars of Marxism, those being: 1) socialism, 2) the labor theory of value, 3) dialectical materialism 4) class struggle and the dictatorship of the proletariat. There is nothing traditionally American about it.
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Re: Modern Populist Movements

Postby nietzsche on Mon Dec 26, 2011 4:51 am

Yeah, ok but the OWS label themselves as progressivists?
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Re: Modern Populist Movements

Postby john9blue on Mon Dec 26, 2011 6:15 pm

decent video but i feel that it jumped to conclusions too fast

i guess the details are explained in the book?

the informative value of the video is limited, though
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Re: Modern Populist Movements

Postby Aradhus on Mon Dec 26, 2011 6:56 pm

Great video. I do love me an argument that takes the percieved weaknesses of one idea, the percieved strengths of another idea and then uses this perception to compare the two. Awesome.

And by 'awesome', clearly, I mean 'retarded'.

And by explaining that I'm clearly using a word to represent the opposite of what it means, you should infer that it is implicit in that explanation that I think you should try to be more retarded. please.
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Re: Modern Populist Movements

Postby PLAYER57832 on Wed Dec 28, 2011 10:44 pm

I like the phrase the "classic liberalism of the Tea Party".... lol
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Re: Modern Populist Movements

Postby Nobunaga on Mon Jan 02, 2012 12:20 am

Aradhus wrote:Great video. I do love me an argument that takes the percieved weaknesses of one idea, the percieved strengths of another idea and then uses this perception to compare the two. Awesome.

And by 'awesome', clearly, I mean 'retarded'.

And by explaining that I'm clearly using a word to represent the opposite of what it means, you should infer that it is implicit in that explanation that I think you should try to be more retarded. please.


... For god's sake man, buy an argument if you can't come up with one on your own.

... Do you have a point about the content of the video? Flat Tax, Property Rights, Free Market... with which of these "perceived strengths" do you disagree, and why do you disagree?

...
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Re: Modern Populist Movements

Postby Nobunaga on Mon Jan 02, 2012 12:22 am

PLAYER57832 wrote:I like the phrase the "classic liberalism of the Tea Party".... lol


... Yeah, I like that one, too, LOL! (cause' it's so true).

...
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Re: Modern Populist Movements

Postby Phatscotty on Tue Jan 03, 2012 4:51 pm

PLAYER57832 wrote:I like the phrase the "classic liberalism of the Tea Party".... lol


you would.
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