For those who claim to be for freedom...

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Re: For those who claim to be for freedom...

Postby BigBallinStalin on Sat Jun 22, 2013 10:58 pm

Woodruff wrote:
BigBallinStalin wrote:


Is it the Executive position and the incentives which turn good men evil?

Or are those 'good' men morally decrepit and corrupt before attaining office?


You know the old adage about politics...the ones who would be good for the position aren't interested in the position.


My favorite defense of "politics is teh best" is this:

If I, the best, does not become a politician,
then someone of lesser ability will become the politician.
What then? Shall I let such a shame occur?
Of course not! Therefore I must become the politician!
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Re: For those who claim to be for freedom...

Postby Woodruff on Sun Jun 23, 2013 1:16 am

john9blue wrote:
Woodruff wrote:Perhaps you can point out for me where I've done that?

Perhaps you can point out to me where I have criticized Christianity based on the Bible, instead of criticizing Christianity based on CHRISTIANS (which is what I almost always criticize).

Still working hard for that "gotcha" moment, are you?


you're the one who is trying to "gotcha" me lol... and i never said you did.


I am? You came into the discussion with a question from out of nowhere that really wasn't relevant to the discussion...I guess I dragged you in here by way of trying to gotcha you? You really are too much...but not in a good way.
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Re: For those who claim to be for freedom...

Postby Woodruff on Sun Jun 23, 2013 3:14 am

Stolen from Reddit:

WHO IS MICHAEL CHERTOFF?

If that name rings a bell it's probably because Chertoff was the co-author of the infamous PATRIOT Act. Or perhaps it rings a bell to you because, after writing that abomination of a law, he went on to become Director of the Department of Homeland Security. And those of you that recall his term as DHS chief probably still remember vividly how aggressively he insisted on the use of "watchlists" and "body scanners".

Now, how many of you know that upon leaving office he started his own company called THE CHERTOFF GROUP -- and that TCG is the company that handles the multi-billion dollar contract to manage the watchlists he pushed for while in office? How many of you know that TCG represents the company that provides the body scanners?

How many of you know that his partner in business is MICHAEL V. HAYDEN, the former head of the CIA and the NSA?

While we're at it... How many of you know that JAMES R. CLAPPER, the current intelligence boss in Washington, was the former CEO of Booz Allen Hamilton (Booz). If Booz sounds familiar it's probably because you already know they help handle the PRISM contract.

Can we all say unconscionable conflicts of interests?
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Re: For those who claim to be for freedom...

Postby warmonger1981 on Sun Jun 23, 2013 8:36 am

Now welcome to the great USA. This is how our economy and country is ran. Big names in big interest corporations. I think the lady who was in charge of Motorola was working for the NSA. These people are putting each other in high level positions in the government then they go work for large corporations. This is not a mere coincidence. Land of the slaves. You just don't know it yet. And you think it is for safety. Funny.
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Re: For those who claim to be for freedom...

Postby john9blue on Sun Jun 23, 2013 11:36 am

but those conspiracy theorists are so CRAZY right? there's no conspiracy here, kids. sit down and shut up like a good citizen.
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Re: For those who claim to be for freedom...

Postby john9blue on Sun Jun 23, 2013 11:37 am

Woodruff wrote:
john9blue wrote:
Woodruff wrote:Perhaps you can point out for me where I've done that?

Perhaps you can point out to me where I have criticized Christianity based on the Bible, instead of criticizing Christianity based on CHRISTIANS (which is what I almost always criticize).

Still working hard for that "gotcha" moment, are you?


you're the one who is trying to "gotcha" me lol... and i never said you did.


I am? You came into the discussion with a question from out of nowhere that really wasn't relevant to the discussion...I guess I dragged you in here by way of trying to gotcha you? You really are too much...but not in a good way.


i think my question was intended for any anti-christian. i didn't frame it as an accusation because i wasn't trying to blame you in particular for anything.
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Re: For those who claim to be for freedom...

Postby PLAYER57832 on Tue Jun 25, 2013 9:31 pm

john9blue wrote:but those conspiracy theorists are so CRAZY right? there's no conspiracy here, kids. sit down and shut up like a good citizen.

Google will, of course, provide you the engine to find all the truth. No influence, bias or steering involved.
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Re: For those who claim to be for freedom...

Postby john9blue on Wed Jun 26, 2013 1:24 am

PLAYER57832 wrote:
john9blue wrote:but those conspiracy theorists are so CRAZY right? there's no conspiracy here, kids. sit down and shut up like a good citizen.

Google will, of course, provide you the engine to find all the truth. No influence, bias or steering involved.


i'm not sure if this is sarcasm or not...?

google will definitely lead a discriminating searcher to more resources than any library or news network.
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Re: For those who claim to be for freedom...

Postby warmonger1981 on Wed Jun 26, 2013 10:42 pm

startpage.com to search the net without being tracked
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Re: For those who claim to be for freedom...

Postby Woodruff on Fri Jun 28, 2013 1:04 am

warmonger1981 wrote:startpage.com to search the net without being tracked


You might be surprised to find out how many of the reasonably-known "make yourself anonymous on the net" stuff really isn't very effective any longer and almost certainly are compromised by the NSA and other organizations. You've essentially got to stay on the cutting edge of the stuff to maintain true anonymity on the Internet.
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Re: For those who claim to be for freedom...

Postby oVo on Fri Jun 28, 2013 2:04 am

Of course there are high resolution satellites focused on the USA
for as long as they've been in existence.
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Re: For those who claim to be for freedom...

Postby warmonger1981 on Fri Jun 28, 2013 8:00 am

Startpage uses encrypted code. They don't record your address even. You can search the net using Google and Bing through startpage. They have never been asked by the NSA for any info. It is good I think. You should check there page and read the privacy section. It truly is anonymous.
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Re: For those who claim to be for freedom...

Postby Woodruff on Fri Jun 28, 2013 5:11 pm

warmonger1981 wrote:They don't record your address even.


I am curious how they could send the information to your machine without recording your IP address. It's probably encrypted, but it's recorded. As to encryption, the thing is that there really isn't any such thing as an unbreakable encryption, although some encryption methodologies do make it extremely difficult, along with tunneling protocols and things like that. But given enough time, every encryption method is breakable.
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Re: For those who claim to be for freedom...

Postby Woodruff on Sat Jun 29, 2013 1:51 am

Well at least they have their priorities straight:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/06/28/obama-generic-drugs_n_3513011.html
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Re: For those who claim to be for freedom...

Postby PLAYER57832 on Sun Jun 30, 2013 8:25 am

john9blue wrote:
PLAYER57832 wrote:
john9blue wrote:but those conspiracy theorists are so CRAZY right? there's no conspiracy here, kids. sit down and shut up like a good citizen.

Google will, of course, provide you the engine to find all the truth. No influence, bias or steering involved.


i'm not sure if this is sarcasm or not...?

google will definitely lead a discriminating searcher to more resources than any library or news network.

It was absolutely sarcasm.

Leading to more resources doesn't necessarily mean more good resources. It certainly is easier and yes, more is available through the internet than your local library. The problem is Google still uses algorithms that essentially target popularity, not veracity. When people see 20 links that say "the sky is not blue, it is purple and green", then they tend to give that much more credence than they would if they just saw it in a random link or even heard it on the street. I have shown in several debates here that a lot of what even people here (who I think are above average when it comes to research and such) post is pure garbage without realizing it.

Viceroy can find plenty of "proof" that evolution is wrong, Nightstrike firmly believes that global warming is not happening and will cite multiple sources to prove it, and those are just 2 of the most obvious cases. Even folks like greekdog and yes, myself, have been "nabbed". I am often frustrated by NOT being able to find anything more than opinions and repeats of the exact same data without much real explanation.
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Re: For those who claim to be for freedom...

Postby Woodruff on Mon Jul 08, 2013 5:14 pm

...I prefer a man who will burn the flag and then wrap himself in the Constitution to a man who will burn the Constitution and then wrap himself in the flag.
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Re: For those who claim to be for freedom...

Postby Woodruff on Mon Jul 08, 2013 6:34 pm

I am beginning to wonder how long it will be before it becomes commonplace for individuals to be disappeared:

http://www.techdirt.com/articles/20130708/01055723732/doj-says-public-has-no-right-to-know-about-secret-laws-feds-use-to-spy-us.shtml
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Re: For those who claim to be for freedom...

Postby Woodruff on Tue Jul 09, 2013 2:49 pm

http://rt.com/usa/state-secrets-nsa-lawsuit-continue-807/

Ok, so this is a very good thing. And yet...

Let's assume that this makes it to the SCOTUS and PRISM is deemed unconstitutional by them. That means that technically it was always unConstitutional as the Constitution never actually changed.

So what happens when they make a "PRISM 2.0" and just do an even better job of keeping it secret. I mean...what's to stop them from doing it and why shouldn't they?

I guess my point is... there should really be super, insanely fucking severe consequences for someone approving something that is this severely and painfully obviously unConstitutional. Otherwise, it'll just be repeated ad nauseum.
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Re: For those who claim to be for freedom...

Postby AndyDufresne on Tue Jul 09, 2013 3:10 pm

What is this constitution you speak of? Is it this?

Image

No, I think it is more likely this:

Image


--Andy
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Re: For those who claim to be for freedom...

Postby BigBallinStalin on Tue Jul 09, 2013 3:25 pm

Woodruff wrote:http://rt.com/usa/state-secrets-nsa-lawsuit-continue-807/

Ok, so this is a very good thing. And yet...

Let's assume that this makes it to the SCOTUS and PRISM is deemed unconstitutional by them. That means that technically it was always unConstitutional as the Constitution never actually changed.

So what happens when they make a "PRISM 2.0" and just do an even better job of keeping it secret. I mean...what's to stop them from doing it and why shouldn't they?


Nothing really. They have their congressional committees which "supervise" those intelligence agencies, so of course it'll work out. People believe that all the time whenever we place a bureaucracy or committee above some sector, so 5-10 years from now, something 'wild and unexpected' will occur.
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Re: For those who claim to be for freedom...

Postby Woodruff on Tue Jul 09, 2013 4:09 pm

AndyDufresne wrote:What is this constitution you speak of? Is it this?

Image

No, I think it is more likely this:

Image


Dude, that's the Constellation. Get your Star Trek ships straight, man!!!!
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Re: For those who claim to be for freedom...

Postby AndyDufresne on Tue Jul 09, 2013 8:57 pm

It was a test, don't worry. You passed. Just checking to see if you were commie or not.


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Re: For those who claim to be for freedom...

Postby Woodruff on Wed Jul 10, 2013 8:11 am

...I prefer a man who will burn the flag and then wrap himself in the Constitution to a man who will burn the Constitution and then wrap himself in the flag.
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Re: For those who claim to be for freedom...

Postby BigBallinStalin on Wed Jul 10, 2013 11:26 am

So, what happens when the government continues violating the constitution? (Or rather when people continue to 'redefine' terms within the Constitution?)

Does it really matter? And, over the decades, what were the outcomes?
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Re: For those who claim to be for freedom...

Postby thegreekdog on Wed Jul 10, 2013 12:02 pm

Woodruff wrote:
AndyDufresne wrote:What is this constitution you speak of? Is it this?

Image

No, I think it is more likely this:

Image


Dude, that's the Constellation. Get your Star Trek ships straight, man!!!!


Looks like the Borg violated the Constellation.

Also - inb4 Jonesy.
Image
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