The Great Presidential Debate

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Re: Debate!

Postby Phatscotty on Thu Oct 04, 2012 9:58 pm

thegreekdog wrote:
Phatscotty wrote:
thegreekdog wrote:Hey guys, get a room.


TGD, almost forgot about you.

That post about Johnson, you really think he is doing everything he can?


Everything he can to do what exactly?

Let's say he pickets outside the debates. He won't get any press. Let's say he storms into the debates and gets arrested. He gets labelled a crazy nutjob and becomes even more irrelevant and possibly dangeous to Libertarians.

But seriously, you, Symm and Woodruff should just get a room.


Woodruff is just going through the motions. I forget what you call people who constantly talk behind your back.....

anyways, if he did get arrested...idk. It would be pretty easy to get the impression that his speech was being stifled, it would get him a monster interview (free press), plus, this is America. Did people label Martin Luther King crazy for getting arrested for something he believed in so strongly he literally did put his life on the line? Do you not think we are in need of another major change, on a much larger scale, and we have a severe leadership deficit?

I know my rant is not the best idea possible, but if he doesn't do anything, then the only thing that will happen for sure is "nothing"
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Re: Debate!

Postby Symmetry on Thu Oct 04, 2012 10:05 pm

Gary Johnson ain't Martin Luther King by any stretch of the mind.
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Re: Debate!

Postby Phatscotty on Thu Oct 04, 2012 10:06 pm

Symmetry wrote:Gary Johnson ain't Martin Luther King by any stretch of the mind.


.....because that was my point.....Gary Johnson = Martin Luther King....

:roll: :lol:
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Re: Debate!

Postby Symmetry on Thu Oct 04, 2012 10:08 pm

Phatscotty wrote:
Symmetry wrote:Gary Johnson ain't Martin Luther King by any stretch of the mind.


.....because that was my point.....Gary Johnson = Martin Luther King....

:roll: :lol:


Phatscotty is a troll.
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Re: Debate!

Postby Phatscotty on Thu Oct 04, 2012 10:13 pm

anyways, back to the debate

Only one thing can be said about what happened to Obama last night
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Re: Debate!

Postby john9blue on Thu Oct 04, 2012 10:23 pm

hey scotty, you can't show such enthusiastic support for both ron paul AND mitt romney.

choose one
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Re: Debate!

Postby Juan_Bottom on Thu Oct 04, 2012 10:24 pm

Nobunaga wrote:... Obama had his ass handed to him last night.

... It was seen by all during the debate that the President cannot win the argument based on facts, on policy, nor on anything else.... so what are they to do...? ... Now the strategy of the Dems is only too predictable.

... Convincing the public that Romney is full of shite is the first step. Then character assassination is the only answer.

... How long until we see commercials... "Romney lied when he said..."

... And how long before the dems pay off some whore to say Romney attacked her at a hotel? (or similar) While major media runs with the story 24/7 for weeks?

... It is just a matter of time. They are out of options. I would bet money on it.

... Predictable as hell. When you can't win the argument of ideas, you destroy your opponent through other means.

...


Are you crazz?
I don't know what Obama was doing, but everything Romney said was a lie, or falsehood, and I don't Romney can keep this up in the next debate. I doubt Obama will fail to pursue Romney's obvious lies the next time. I think he'll be better prepared.

Fact checkers:
http://factcheck.org/2012/10/dubious-de ... larations/

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Re: Debate!

Postby Nobunaga on Fri Oct 05, 2012 5:48 am

Juan_Bottom wrote:
Nobunaga wrote:... Obama had his ass handed to him last night.

... It was seen by all during the debate that the President cannot win the argument based on facts, on policy, nor on anything else.... so what are they to do...? ... Now the strategy of the Dems is only too predictable.

... Convincing the public that Romney is full of shite is the first step. Then character assassination is the only answer.

... How long until we see commercials... "Romney lied when he said..."

... And how long before the dems pay off some whore to say Romney attacked her at a hotel? (or similar) While major media runs with the story 24/7 for weeks?

... It is just a matter of time. They are out of options. I would bet money on it.

... Predictable as hell. When you can't win the argument of ideas, you destroy your opponent through other means.

...


Are you crazz?
I don't know what Obama was doing, but everything Romney said was a lie, or falsehood, and I don't Romney can keep this up in the next debate. I doubt Obama will fail to pursue Romney's obvious lies the next time. I think he'll be better prepared.

Fact checkers:
http://factcheck.org/2012/10/dubious-de ... larations/



... Factcheck? Ohhhh, there's a solid, professional analysis. :roll:

... Show me something from a national financial magazine not owned by George Soros, or from the WSJ and I'll take you seriously.

... LIES! LIES! LIES! ... I so much enjoy being right.

...
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Re: Debate!

Postby thegreekdog on Fri Oct 05, 2012 6:41 am

Symmetry wrote:
thegreekdog wrote:
Phatscotty wrote:
thegreekdog wrote:Hey guys, get a room.


TGD, almost forgot about you.

That post about Johnson, you really think he is doing everything he can?


Everything he can to do what exactly?

Let's say he pickets outside the debates. He won't get any press. Let's say he storms into the debates and gets arrested. He gets labelled a crazy nutjob and becomes even more irrelevant and possibly dangeous to Libertarians.

But seriously, you, Symm and Woodruff should just get a room.


As if you don't want to join in. Aren't we all on your most frustrating list? But you can't resist?


I have no interest in joining a conversation to determine who is the biggest asshole/troll between the three of you. If Woodruff, PS, or you want to talk about the debate, then yes, I would like to join in that conversation.
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Re: Debate!

Postby thegreekdog on Fri Oct 05, 2012 6:44 am

Phatscotty wrote:
thegreekdog wrote:
Phatscotty wrote:
thegreekdog wrote:Hey guys, get a room.


TGD, almost forgot about you.

That post about Johnson, you really think he is doing everything he can?


Everything he can to do what exactly?

Let's say he pickets outside the debates. He won't get any press. Let's say he storms into the debates and gets arrested. He gets labelled a crazy nutjob and becomes even more irrelevant and possibly dangeous to Libertarians.

But seriously, you, Symm and Woodruff should just get a room.


Woodruff is just going through the motions. I forget what you call people who constantly talk behind your back.....

anyways, if he did get arrested...idk. It would be pretty easy to get the impression that his speech was being stifled, it would get him a monster interview (free press), plus, this is America. Did people label Martin Luther King crazy for getting arrested for something he believed in so strongly he literally did put his life on the line? Do you not think we are in need of another major change, on a much larger scale, and we have a severe leadership deficit?

I know my rant is not the best idea possible, but if he doesn't do anything, then the only thing that will happen for sure is "nothing"


It sounds like you've bought into the premise that a vote for Gary Johnson or any Libertarian is a wasted vote. I suppose if you were in a "battleground state" where one vote one way or another would sway the electoral college in that particular state, you'd have a good argument. But you have to wonder why the Repocrat machine doesn't want you to vote for a Libertarian when clearly your vote won't sway the election one way or the other, but may be enough to get a third party (who you supposedly like and agree with more than the Repocrats) some much-needed loot.
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Re: Debate!

Postby thegreekdog on Fri Oct 05, 2012 6:51 am

Nobunaga wrote:
Juan_Bottom wrote:
Nobunaga wrote:... Obama had his ass handed to him last night.

... It was seen by all during the debate that the President cannot win the argument based on facts, on policy, nor on anything else.... so what are they to do...? ... Now the strategy of the Dems is only too predictable.

... Convincing the public that Romney is full of shite is the first step. Then character assassination is the only answer.

... How long until we see commercials... "Romney lied when he said..."

... And how long before the dems pay off some whore to say Romney attacked her at a hotel? (or similar) While major media runs with the story 24/7 for weeks?

... It is just a matter of time. They are out of options. I would bet money on it.

... Predictable as hell. When you can't win the argument of ideas, you destroy your opponent through other means.

...


Are you crazz?
I don't know what Obama was doing, but everything Romney said was a lie, or falsehood, and I don't Romney can keep this up in the next debate. I doubt Obama will fail to pursue Romney's obvious lies the next time. I think he'll be better prepared.

Fact checkers:
http://factcheck.org/2012/10/dubious-de ... larations/



... Factcheck? Ohhhh, there's a solid, professional analysis. :roll:

... Show me something from a national financial magazine not owned by George Soros, or from the WSJ and I'll take you seriously.

... LIES! LIES! LIES! ... I so much enjoy being right.

...


I can only assume Juan did not read any of the Obama fact check stuff (although he did say he didn't know what Obama was doing, so perhaps he did).

I'm not really qualified to comment on any part of the Fact Check article except the tax section. I'm not certain why this is so hard for people to grasp. Romney definitely did not provide any details as to what deductions, credits, or exemptions he would do away with, so there's that caveat. But, as I indicated above, one can certainly cut the tax rate while also maintaining the same level of revenue by changing a deduction, credit, and/or exemption. It's done on a semi-regular basis in state taxation.

For example, the Pennsylvania legislature recently proposed a reduction in its 9.99% corporate tax rate (to, I believe, 6%). The bill where that tax rate reduction was included also provided for the elimination of certain available corporate deductions which made the tax rate decrease revenue-neutral. Let's do another simple math example.

State X's tax rate is currently 10%. Bill has $5,000 of income and gets a deduction of $2,000 for whatever, so his taxable income is $3,000 and his tax is $300.

State X lowers its tax rate to 8% and eliminates the whatever deduction. Bill has $5,000 of income, gets no deductions, so his taxable income is $5,000 and his tax is $400.
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Re: Debate!

Postby Phatscotty on Fri Oct 05, 2012 7:27 am

john9blue wrote:hey scotty, you can't show such enthusiastic support for both ron paul AND mitt romney.

choose one


Can I just dislike Obama?

8-[
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Re: Debate!

Postby Phatscotty on Fri Oct 05, 2012 7:32 am

thegreekdog wrote:
Symmetry wrote:
thegreekdog wrote:
Phatscotty wrote:
thegreekdog wrote:Hey guys, get a room.


TGD, almost forgot about you.

That post about Johnson, you really think he is doing everything he can?


Everything he can to do what exactly?

Let's say he pickets outside the debates. He won't get any press. Let's say he storms into the debates and gets arrested. He gets labelled a crazy nutjob and becomes even more irrelevant and possibly dangeous to Libertarians.

But seriously, you, Symm and Woodruff should just get a room.


As if you don't want to join in. Aren't we all on your most frustrating list? But you can't resist?


I have no interest in joining a conversation to determine who is the biggest asshole/troll between the three of you. If Woodruff, PS, or you want to talk about the debate, then yes, I would like to join in that conversation.


Trying to! I have Woodruff and Symm on perma-foe now, so you will not have to be bothered by the trolls ganging up on me anymore.
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Re: Debate!

Postby tzor on Fri Oct 05, 2012 8:00 am

thegreekdog wrote:It sounds like you've bought into the premise that a vote for Gary Johnson or any Libertarian is a wasted vote.


Unless Gary can "win" the state you are in, then the vote is somewhat "wasted." I put the word in quotes because there are exceptions to the rule. In New York State, for example, if you are a minor party you need to pull a certain percentage of the vote for Governor in order to continue being listed as a minor party. But those issues aside, there is the larger issue of the movement to do an end run around the electoral college by rigging the electoral college to the global popular vote. So even though you are in a large state that might always go one way, your vote the other way would be a vote among equals in the arguments of popular votes vs electoral college votes.
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Re: Debate!

Postby thegreekdog on Fri Oct 05, 2012 9:30 am

tzor wrote:
thegreekdog wrote:It sounds like you've bought into the premise that a vote for Gary Johnson or any Libertarian is a wasted vote.


Unless Gary can "win" the state you are in, then the vote is somewhat "wasted." I put the word in quotes because there are exceptions to the rule. In New York State, for example, if you are a minor party you need to pull a certain percentage of the vote for Governor in order to continue being listed as a minor party. But those issues aside, there is the larger issue of the movement to do an end run around the electoral college by rigging the electoral college to the global popular vote. So even though you are in a large state that might always go one way, your vote the other way would be a vote among equals in the arguments of popular votes vs electoral college votes.


Well, there is the concept of matching funds where the party must get a certain portion of the popular vote to be able to receive additional funds from the government for elections.

Furthermore, if you are in a state such as New York, where polling shows that the president has a commanding lead over Romney, a vote for Mitt Romney would be just as wasted as a vote for Gary Johnson.
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Re: THE GREAT DEBATE!

Postby AndyDufresne on Fri Oct 05, 2012 10:40 am

patrickaa317 wrote:
AndyDufresne wrote:I think all the presidential debates will be pretty stalemated. The vice-presidential debate is the only one in which I think someone will really win.


--Andy


I would have agreed with you before the debate last night. Kinda odd you posted this after 95% of people have said Romney won the first debate hands down.

I think they will be stalemated, in terms of having a real impact. I don't think either candidate will really get much of a bump from these debates.


--Andy
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Re: Debate!

Postby Woodruff on Fri Oct 05, 2012 11:10 am

thegreekdog wrote:
tzor wrote:
thegreekdog wrote:It sounds like you've bought into the premise that a vote for Gary Johnson or any Libertarian is a wasted vote.


Unless Gary can "win" the state you are in, then the vote is somewhat "wasted." I put the word in quotes because there are exceptions to the rule. In New York State, for example, if you are a minor party you need to pull a certain percentage of the vote for Governor in order to continue being listed as a minor party. But those issues aside, there is the larger issue of the movement to do an end run around the electoral college by rigging the electoral college to the global popular vote. So even though you are in a large state that might always go one way, your vote the other way would be a vote among equals in the arguments of popular votes vs electoral college votes.


Well, there is the concept of matching funds where the party must get a certain portion of the popular vote to be able to receive additional funds from the government for elections.

Furthermore, if you are in a state such as New York, where polling shows that the president has a commanding lead over Romney, a vote for Mitt Romney would be just as wasted as a vote for Gary Johnson.


It is more of a wasted vote then, in my opinion, as it doesn't impact anything whereas a vote for Gary Johnson or Jill Stein could.
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Re: Debate!

Postby 72o on Fri Oct 05, 2012 4:08 pm

I'm in South Carolina, who should I waste my vote on?
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Re: Debate!

Postby muy_thaiguy on Fri Oct 05, 2012 4:50 pm

72o wrote:I'm in South Carolina, who should I waste my vote on?

Your neighbor's dog.
I am what I am.


What, you expected something deep or flashy?
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Re: Debate!

Postby Phatscotty on Fri Oct 05, 2012 6:52 pm

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Re: Debate!

Postby Nobunaga on Fri Oct 05, 2012 7:00 pm

Phatscotty wrote:


... My wife loved that. Thanks Phat. :D
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Re: Debate!

Postby Phatscotty on Fri Oct 05, 2012 9:39 pm

Nobunaga wrote:
Phatscotty wrote:


... My wife loved that. Thanks Phat. :D


lmao I know! I probly laughed the hardest when Obama spun the propeller on top of his hat

bwahahahhahaha

for some reason, that reminds me of how incredibly dorky Obama looks when he is riding a bike

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Re: Debate!

Postby Phatscotty on Fri Oct 05, 2012 11:22 pm

Here is the cherry video of Al Gore the scientist :lol: He describes what he is about to say as "controversial" but someone should tell him it's just plain stupid



I can't believe how many people have cracked up in the last 48 hours. I mean I can...but....WOW! :D

Listen to the bootlickers around him.... "Excatly!" and "oh, that's interesting!" You can tell they don't give a damn about whether it's true or not, all that matters if they have an excuse they can sell to sheeple in order to cover for Obama IE "do their job".
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Re: Debate!

Postby Night Strike on Sat Oct 06, 2012 7:05 am

Why did Obama give his 2008 nomination acceptance speech in Denver if he's so affected by high altitude? Or was he ok that night because he was simply reading the teleprompter instead of being forced to defend his policies?
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Re: Debate!

Postby tzor on Sat Oct 06, 2012 3:14 pm

thegreekdog wrote:Furthermore, if you are in a state such as New York, where polling shows that the president has a commanding lead over Romney, a vote for Mitt Romney would be just as wasted as a vote for Gary Johnson.


That depends. But even then, unless you are planning to go jump off the line for the other elections and vote for Gary/republicans for everything else your vote can have a coattail effect. There are several congressional races that are very close and can easily cause the Democrat to fall. NY1 is my area and the Democratic Candidate Tim Bishop is on the ropes. His victory was only by a hundred votes back in 2010.

Senator Gillibrand has a strong contender in Long. She can't fall back on her gender because her opponent is also a woman.

So it's absolutely vital that the Republican base gets their bottoms off of the chairs and goes to vote this year, even in NY.

Besides, I'm still hoping that this whole Big Gulp Revolution is going to turn NY Red this year.
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