Gaza-Israel Ceasefire: Prison Conditions on Gaza Lifted

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Re: Another Round of Israeli Attacks on Gaza

Postby Frito Bandito on Sat Nov 17, 2012 6:53 pm

Well, pretty sure... now that sounds like a fact! :) : :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
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Re: Another Round of Israeli Attacks on Gaza

Postby Symmetry on Sun Nov 18, 2012 3:12 pm

Sorry to interrupt, but this seemed kind of interesting as to what the current Israeli government hope to achieve with regards to Israel's operation in Gaza :

Interior Minister Eli Yishai wrote:The goal of the operation is to send Gaza back to the Middle Ages. Only then will Israel be calm for forty years.


Source- Haaretz

The post is at 7:55.
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Re: Another Round of Israeli Attacks on Gaza

Postby saxitoxin on Sun Nov 18, 2012 4:12 pm

One mind ... many tongues.

On November 15 the USA said, "We believe Israel has a right to defend itself"

Immediately, within 24 hours after that ...

    Canada said: "We fundamentally believe that Israel has the right to defend itself."
    Germany said: "It is obvious that Israel has a legitimate right to defend itself."
    Holland said: "Israel has the full right to defend itself."
    Ceska said: "The Czech Republic fully recognizes Israel’s right to self defense."
    Australia said: "Australia supports Israel's right to defend itself."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Pillar_of_Cloud

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Re: Another Round of Israeli Attacks on Gaza

Postby saxitoxin on Sun Nov 18, 2012 4:19 pm

Symmetry wrote:Sorry to interrupt, but this seemed kind of interesting as to what the current Israeli government hope to achieve with regards to Israel's operation in Gaza :

Interior Minister Eli Yishai wrote:The goal of the operation is to send Gaza back to the Middle Ages. Only then will Israel be calm for forty years.


Source- Haaretz

The post is at 7:55.


This is absolute proof of why Israel cannot be tolerated in the community of nations.

An amoeba avoids electric fields. The amoeba doesn't know why an electric field is bad, it just instinctively avoids it. At a visceral level humans understand there is something fundamentally incorrect about the existence of the State of Israel.
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Re: Another Round of Israeli Attacks on Gaza

Postby Symmetry on Sun Nov 18, 2012 4:24 pm

saxitoxin wrote:
Symmetry wrote:Sorry to interrupt, but this seemed kind of interesting as to what the current Israeli government hope to achieve with regards to Israel's operation in Gaza :

Interior Minister Eli Yishai wrote:The goal of the operation is to send Gaza back to the Middle Ages. Only then will Israel be calm for forty years.


Source- Haaretz

The post is at 7:55.


This is absolute proof of why Israel cannot be tolerated as a state in the community of nations.

An amoeba avoids electric fields. The amoeba doesn't know why an electric field is bad, it just instinctively avoids it. At a visceral level humans understand there is something fundamentally incorrect about the State of Israel. Its existence is a violation of the natural order.


Hmm, still trying to see what you can call Israel and Israelis without being openly anti-Semitic? The sad thing is that you've been doing this so long it's not even trolling anymore.
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Re: Another Round of Israeli Attacks on Gaza

Postby saxitoxin on Sun Nov 18, 2012 4:30 pm

Symmetry wrote:
saxitoxin wrote:
Symmetry wrote:Sorry to interrupt, but this seemed kind of interesting as to what the current Israeli government hope to achieve with regards to Israel's operation in Gaza :

Interior Minister Eli Yishai wrote:The goal of the operation is to send Gaza back to the Middle Ages. Only then will Israel be calm for forty years.


Source- Haaretz

The post is at 7:55.


This is absolute proof of why Israel cannot be tolerated as a state in the community of nations.

An amoeba avoids electric fields. The amoeba doesn't know why an electric field is bad, it just instinctively avoids it. At a visceral level humans understand there is something fundamentally incorrect about the State of Israel. Its existence is a violation of the natural order.


Hmm, still trying to see what you can call Israel and Israelis without being openly anti-Semitic? The sad thing is that you've been doing this so long it's not even trolling anymore.


Sorry, I didn't realize "electric field" was a slur.

Stop being such a 120 Volt Outlet, Symmetry.

When - in any other conflict in the modern era - has a nation been conjured into existence for the singular purpose of conquest? Nations war with nations all the time. Only in the case of Israel has a nation been manufactured for the sole purpose of waging war. How is this not a violation of the natural order? How can a nation founded on that ethos ever be redeemed?
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Re: Another Round of Israeli Attacks on Gaza

Postby GreecePwns on Sun Nov 18, 2012 5:42 pm

Symmetry wrote:Hmm, still trying to see what you can call Israel and Israelis without being openly anti-Semitic? The sad thing is that you've been doing this so long it's not even trolling anymore.


Opposing racism, wars of aggression and apartheid is not anti-Semitism. It is wrong no matter who is doing it. In this case it is a group of religious fanatics. Saxi's tone is appropriate given the thousands upon thousands of instances in which Israel has shown total disregard for international law, property rights, contractual law, and human rights, with only the US being in defense.

I thought you would know better than to resort to this.

A side note: Chomsky has noted that in token resolutions calling on nations to follow international laws in the General Assembly, the US and Israel are always voting alone against (along with South Africa under apartheid).
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Re: Another Round of Israeli Attacks on Gaza

Postby Symmetry on Sun Nov 18, 2012 5:47 pm

GreecePwns wrote:
Symmetry wrote:Hmm, still trying to see what you can call Israel and Israelis without being openly anti-Semitic? The sad thing is that you've been doing this so long it's not even trolling anymore.


Opposing racism, wars of aggression and apartheid is not anti-Semitism. It is wrong no matter who is doing it. In this case it is a group of religious fanatics.

I thought you would know better than to resort to this.


I've argued with him in other threads, so fair enough- this is more of of a long running argument with Saxitoxin about how he chooses to portray Israel and Israelis. It was perhaps a bit too oblique for this thread. Let us say that the man has a history.
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Re: Another Round of Israeli Attacks on Gaza

Postby saxitoxin on Sun Nov 18, 2012 5:56 pm

Symmetry wrote:
GreecePwns wrote:
Symmetry wrote:Hmm, still trying to see what you can call Israel and Israelis without being openly anti-Semitic? The sad thing is that you've been doing this so long it's not even trolling anymore.


Opposing racism, wars of aggression and apartheid is not anti-Semitism. It is wrong no matter who is doing it. In this case it is a group of religious fanatics.

I thought you would know better than to resort to this.


I've argued with him in other threads, so fair enough- this is more of of a long running argument with Saxitoxin about how he chooses to portray Israel and Israelis. It was perhaps a bit too oblique for this thread.


oh gotcha, this is another one of your conspiracy theories

carry on
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Re: Another Round of Israeli Attacks on Gaza

Postby GreecePwns on Sun Nov 18, 2012 6:34 pm

Having a harsh view of Israeli citizens is not anti-Semitism. It can be argued that the Israeli citizens, of which 99.9% are sitting on stolen land and of which 116 for every 120 vote for militant Zionist parties (militant to varying degrees, this according to the current Knesset configuration), are just as much a part of the offensive as the IDF. Justice calls for the following:

1. The return of illegally seized property to Palestinian owners or their estate. Theft is theft, and the legal conventions for theft include the return of stolen property.
2. The entire region put under Palestinian administration.
3. The land legally purchased by Jews pre-1948 to stay in the hands of the owners.
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Re: Another Round of Israeli Attacks on Gaza

Postby Phatscotty on Sun Nov 18, 2012 6:53 pm

GreecePwns wrote:
Symmetry wrote:Hmm, still trying to see what you can call Israel and Israelis without being openly anti-Semitic? The sad thing is that you've been doing this so long it's not even trolling anymore.


Opposing racism, wars of aggression and apartheid is not anti-Semitism. It is wrong no matter who is doing it. In this case it is a group of religious fanatics. Saxi's tone is appropriate given the thousands upon thousands of instances in which Israel has shown total disregard for international law, property rights, contractual law, and human rights, with only the US being in defense.

I thought you would know better than to resort to this.

A side note: Chomsky has noted that in token resolutions calling on nations to follow international laws in the General Assembly, the US and Israel are always voting alone against (along with South Africa under apartheid).


just curious, but are you sure that if there was no racism, wars of aggression, or apartheid, there would just be a whole different list of evils to be accused of, and the narrative of the new evils will be even more evil than the previous evils?

Not to mention, there are always 2 different views on who the terrorist is, and who the freedom fighter is, and there always will be, as long as there are targets for terrorists with victims and someone for the freedom fighters to fight. Plus. it could all just be Rothschild and Soros playing both sides off against each other. I mean, who else would want the one world government that would be the only institution that could even possibly enforce international laws.... :twisted:
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Re: Another Round of Israeli Attacks on Gaza

Postby Symmetry on Sun Nov 18, 2012 7:00 pm

GreecePwns wrote:Having a harsh view of Israeli citizens is not anti-Semitism. It can be argued that the Israeli citizens, of which 99.9% are sitting on stolen land and of which 116 for every 120 vote for militant Zionist parties (militant to varying degrees, this according to the current Knesset configuration), are just as much a part of the offensive as the IDF. Justice calls for the following:

1. The return of illegally seized property to Palestinian owners or their estate. Theft is theft, and the legal conventions for theft include the return of stolen property.
2. The entire region put under Palestinian administration.
3. The land legally purchased by Jews pre-1948 to stay in the hands of the owners.


Hmm, as I said, my issue with Saxitoxin's view of Israel and Israeli's goes back a fair way, and goes into other threads. As Saxi's response above suggests, he's uncomfortable with confronting the stuff he's posted.

I'm pretty sympathetic to your points, although I think I take more of a middle ground. I'd advise a degree of caution before you align yourself too closely with Saxitoxin though. Describing Israel as a cockroach to be stamped out sets off my anti-Semitic radar.
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Re: Another Round of Israeli Attacks on Gaza

Postby saxitoxin on Sun Nov 18, 2012 7:07 pm

Symmetry wrote:
GreecePwns wrote:Having a harsh view of Israeli citizens is not anti-Semitism. It can be argued that the Israeli citizens, of which 99.9% are sitting on stolen land and of which 116 for every 120 vote for militant Zionist parties (militant to varying degrees, this according to the current Knesset configuration), are just as much a part of the offensive as the IDF. Justice calls for the following:

1. The return of illegally seized property to Palestinian owners or their estate. Theft is theft, and the legal conventions for theft include the return of stolen property.
2. The entire region put under Palestinian administration.
3. The land legally purchased by Jews pre-1948 to stay in the hands of the owners.


Hmm, as I said, my issue with Saxitoxin's view of Israel and Israeli's goes back a fair way, and goes into other threads. As Saxi's response above suggests, he's uncomfortable with confronting the stuff he's posted.

I'm pretty sympathetic to your points, although I think I take more of a middle ground. I'd advise a degree of caution before you align yourself too closely with Saxitoxin though. Describing Israel as a cockroach to be stamped out sets off my anti-Semitic radar.


I stand by everything I posted. So far you've only been able to make cryptic allusions to some supposed past transgressions of mine. The one example you've managed to conjure is fictitious.

What I did say was: If the "State of Israel" doesn't want to be crushed like a cockroach, it should stop acting like a pest. This was said, specifically, in a discussion about whether Israel should feel threatened by Iran's alleged acquisition of self-defense technology. Meaning, if Israel stopped doing pest-like things such as engaging in military operations whose goal is "to send Gaza back to the Middle Ages" it wouldn't be under threat. The word "cockroach" is frequently used to illustrate nuclear war. But, by all means, keep looking for some hidden meaning that will reinforce your nutter conspiracy theories.
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Re: Another Round of Israeli Attacks on Gaza

Postby Phatscotty on Sun Nov 18, 2012 7:12 pm

saxitoxin wrote:
Symmetry wrote:
GreecePwns wrote:Having a harsh view of Israeli citizens is not anti-Semitism. It can be argued that the Israeli citizens, of which 99.9% are sitting on stolen land and of which 116 for every 120 vote for militant Zionist parties (militant to varying degrees, this according to the current Knesset configuration), are just as much a part of the offensive as the IDF. Justice calls for the following:

1. The return of illegally seized property to Palestinian owners or their estate. Theft is theft, and the legal conventions for theft include the return of stolen property.
2. The entire region put under Palestinian administration.
3. The land legally purchased by Jews pre-1948 to stay in the hands of the owners.


Hmm, as I said, my issue with Saxitoxin's view of Israel and Israeli's goes back a fair way, and goes into other threads. As Saxi's response above suggests, he's uncomfortable with confronting the stuff he's posted.

I'm pretty sympathetic to your points, although I think I take more of a middle ground. I'd advise a degree of caution before you align yourself too closely with Saxitoxin though. Describing Israel as a cockroach to be stamped out sets off my anti-Semitic radar.


I stand by everything I posted. So far you've only been able to make cryptic allusions to some supposed past transgressions of mine. The one example you've managed to conjure is fictitious.

What I did say was: If the "State of Israel" doesn't want to be crushed like a cockroach, it should stop acting like a pest. This was said, specifically, in a discussion about whether Israel should feel threatened by Iran's alleged acquisition of self-defense weapons. Meaning, if Israel stopped doing things like engaging in military operations whose goal is "to send Gaza back to the Middle Ages" it wouldn't be under threat. The word "cockroach" is frequently invoked in discussions about nuclear war. But, by all means, keep looking for some hidden meaning that will reinforce your nutter conspiracy theories.




Maybe your name happened to be mentioned in a newsletter by what someone who is not you wrote in some publication 30 years ago? Ya know, if that's the case, it doesn't matter what you do, your legacy is defined now.

Come to think of it, now Symmetry is screwed too for the next 30 years, because he is writing back and forth with you about something that very well may be viewed as racist in 2042....

:P
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Re: Another Round of Israeli Attacks on Gaza

Postby Symmetry on Sun Nov 18, 2012 7:13 pm

And as I've said, you remain just on the border of anti-Semitism. "Oops, sorry if that came across as anti-Semitic, you're too sensitive", each and every time.

Like hell you picked "cockroach" and "pest" without regard to their connotations.
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Re: Another Round of Israeli Attacks on Gaza

Postby saxitoxin on Sun Nov 18, 2012 7:15 pm

Phatscotty wrote:
saxitoxin wrote:
Symmetry wrote:
GreecePwns wrote:Having a harsh view of Israeli citizens is not anti-Semitism. It can be argued that the Israeli citizens, of which 99.9% are sitting on stolen land and of which 116 for every 120 vote for militant Zionist parties (militant to varying degrees, this according to the current Knesset configuration), are just as much a part of the offensive as the IDF. Justice calls for the following:

1. The return of illegally seized property to Palestinian owners or their estate. Theft is theft, and the legal conventions for theft include the return of stolen property.
2. The entire region put under Palestinian administration.
3. The land legally purchased by Jews pre-1948 to stay in the hands of the owners.


Hmm, as I said, my issue with Saxitoxin's view of Israel and Israeli's goes back a fair way, and goes into other threads. As Saxi's response above suggests, he's uncomfortable with confronting the stuff he's posted.

I'm pretty sympathetic to your points, although I think I take more of a middle ground. I'd advise a degree of caution before you align yourself too closely with Saxitoxin though. Describing Israel as a cockroach to be stamped out sets off my anti-Semitic radar.


I stand by everything I posted. So far you've only been able to make cryptic allusions to some supposed past transgressions of mine. The one example you've managed to conjure is fictitious.

What I did say was: If the "State of Israel" doesn't want to be crushed like a cockroach, it should stop acting like a pest. This was said, specifically, in a discussion about whether Israel should feel threatened by Iran's alleged acquisition of self-defense weapons. Meaning, if Israel stopped doing things like engaging in military operations whose goal is "to send Gaza back to the Middle Ages" it wouldn't be under threat. The word "cockroach" is frequently invoked in discussions about nuclear war. But, by all means, keep looking for some hidden meaning that will reinforce your nutter conspiracy theories.




Maybe your name happened to be mentioned in a newsletter by what someone who is not you wrote in some publication 30 years ago? Ya know, if that's the case, it doesn't matter what you do, your legacy is defined now.


It's possible. I used to keep a Livejournal during my emo/goth cutting phase, but I haven't updated that in like 2 years. And I *highly* doubt Symmetry or anyone else has ever seen it.
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Re: Another Round of Israeli Attacks on Gaza

Postby Symmetry on Sun Nov 18, 2012 7:20 pm

saxitoxin wrote:
Phatscotty wrote:Maybe your name happened to be mentioned in a newsletter by what someone who is not you wrote in some publication 30 years ago? Ya know, if that's the case, it doesn't matter what you do, your legacy is defined now.


It's possible. I used to keep a Livejournal during my emo/goth cutting phase, but I haven't updated that in like 2 years. And I *highly* doubt Symmetry or anyone else has ever seen it.


You guys are odd.
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Postby 2dimes on Sun Nov 18, 2012 7:23 pm

Matityahu didn't mean it, he loved you.
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Re: Another Round of Israeli Attacks on Gaza

Postby Phatscotty on Sun Nov 18, 2012 7:55 pm

MSNBC Anchor Tells Israeli Ambassador Hamas Rockets 'Rarely Do Damage"



MSNBC's Mara Schiavocampo interviews Israeli Ambassador Michael Oren, An example of how much work Israeli officials face in their effort to pass through the filter of the mainstream media and present their side of the story.
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Re: Another Round of Israeli Attacks on Gaza

Postby Ray Rider on Sun Nov 18, 2012 7:56 pm

GreecePwns wrote:Let's start with the fact that 99% of Congress is already Zionist, some vehemently so.

GreecePwns wrote:I'm pretty sure all of what I've written in this thread is true. If you don't think so, prove it.

Actually no, if you make ludicrous statements like that, the onus is on you to prove their veracity, otherwise we'll just dismiss them offhand along with all the other crack-pot claims copied from Ahmadinejad.


Symmetry wrote:Sorry to interrupt, but this seemed kind of interesting as to what the current Israeli government hope to achieve with regards to Israel's operation in Gaza :
Interior Minister Eli Yishai wrote:The goal of the operation is to send Gaza back to the Middle Ages. Only then will Israel be calm for forty years.

Source- Haaretz
The post is at 7:55.

That's rather idiotic of a man in his position to be making statements about foreign policy which A) is none of his business and B) he doesn't know anything about. Now if it was Netanyahu making that statement it would be very troubling.


Here's something I found pretty sad...not only is Hamas firing rockets into Israel at innocent civilians (if they seriously wanted to hit the IDF, they would use a different method instead of firing rockets indiscriminately which only rarely hits the IDF), but they've also killed some of their own with their erratic rocket launches, most recently a four-year-old boy:
Image
But there were signs on Saturday that not all the Palestinian casualties have been the result of Israeli air strikes. The highly publicised death of four-year-old Mohammed Sadallah appeared to have been the result of a misfiring home-made rocket, not a bomb dropped by Israel.

The child’s death on Friday figured prominently in media coverage after Hisham Kandil, the Egyptian prime minister, was filmed lifting his dead body out of an ambulance. "The boy, the martyr, whose blood is still on my hands and clothes, is something that we cannot keep silent about," he said, before promising to defend the Palestinian people.

But experts from the Palestinian Centre for Human Rights who visited the site on Saturday said they believed that the explosion was caused by a Palestinian rocket.
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Re: Another Round of Israeli Attacks on Gaza

Postby Metsfanmax on Sun Nov 18, 2012 8:01 pm

saxitoxin wrote:
Phatscotty wrote:Maybe your name happened to be mentioned in a newsletter by what someone who is not you wrote in some publication 30 years ago? Ya know, if that's the case, it doesn't matter what you do, your legacy is defined now.


It's possible. I used to keep a Livejournal during my emo/goth cutting phase, but I haven't updated that in like 2 years. And I *highly* doubt Symmetry or anyone else has ever seen it.


I lol'd
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Re: Another Round of Israeli Attacks on Gaza

Postby patches70 on Sun Nov 18, 2012 8:25 pm

GreecePwns wrote:Let's start with the fact that 99% of Congress is already Zionist, some vehemently so.


And lets not forget another fact, that 99% of people's statistics are made up.


(Sorry, I couldn't resist, please do continue the Israel bashing).


We should give the Palestinians their own country. Maybe we could give them half of California. No one would mind, and those that did, who cares?

Of course, no one really wants to be neighbors with the Palestinians. They play loud music at all hours of the night, they spit when they talk and generally don't clean up after themselves.

Oh, yeah, and on the one hand they insist that the US solve their problems and on the other hand burn the American flag and chant "Death to America!" They might have better luck if they'd just stick with one or the other sentiment. Preferably the latter. Then we can have ourselves a good old fashioned fight and we'll see who comes out on top. That might not work out too well for the Palestinians though, so I doubt they'll go for it. They'll keep smiling to our face as they seek favor (spitting in our face the whole time) while holding a knife behind their back.

Ahhh, good times, good times.
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Re: Another Round of Israeli Attacks on Gaza

Postby Dukasaur on Sun Nov 18, 2012 8:29 pm

GreecePwns wrote:Having a harsh view of Israeli citizens is not anti-Semitism. It can be argued that the Israeli citizens, of which 99.9% are sitting on stolen land and of which 116 for every 120 vote for militant Zionist parties (militant to varying degrees, this according to the current Knesset configuration), are just as much a part of the offensive as the IDF. Justice calls for the following:

1. The return of illegally seized property to Palestinian owners or their estate. Theft is theft, and the legal conventions for theft include the return of stolen property.
2. The entire region put under Palestinian administration.
3. The land legally purchased by Jews pre-1948 to stay in the hands of the owners.

After you return upstate New York to the Seneca people, the Dakotas to the Sioux, the Ohio valley to the Osage, etc., etc., etc., you might have enough moral stature to start lecturing other countries about how to settle their indigenous land claims.
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Re: Another Round of Israeli Attacks on Gaza

Postby Phatscotty on Sun Nov 18, 2012 8:36 pm

The segments I see on cable news and have come across in some newspapers concerning recent events involving Israel and Gaza offers some of the most sickening opinion and information I have ever seen. Listening to the Palestinian side and watching one particular fellow on CNN, I started to see this guy was absolutely bloodthirsty and evil as the show host let him go on and on unchecked, unchallenged. But she made it a point to check the Isreali guy repeatedly. That's when I realized there are plenty of people who would just stand by and watch of there was another Holocaust

It appeared demonic and it sent a chill up my spine
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Re: Another Round of Israeli Attacks on Gaza

Postby Symmetry on Sun Nov 18, 2012 8:38 pm

Dukasaur wrote:
GreecePwns wrote:Having a harsh view of Israeli citizens is not anti-Semitism. It can be argued that the Israeli citizens, of which 99.9% are sitting on stolen land and of which 116 for every 120 vote for militant Zionist parties (militant to varying degrees, this according to the current Knesset configuration), are just as much a part of the offensive as the IDF. Justice calls for the following:

1. The return of illegally seized property to Palestinian owners or their estate. Theft is theft, and the legal conventions for theft include the return of stolen property.
2. The entire region put under Palestinian administration.
3. The land legally purchased by Jews pre-1948 to stay in the hands of the owners.

After you return upstate New York to the Seneca people, the Dakotas to the Sioux, the Ohio valley to the Osage, etc., etc., etc., you might have enough moral stature to start lecturing other countries about how to settle their indigenous land claims.


That seems like a kind of get out clause. As if you can't say something is wrong unless you go through a set of historic condemnations and apologies first, before you get to point out a wrong in the current day.
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