An Unproven Hypothesis, The Rise of Ignorance.

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What are the facts? Please keep an open mind and read the article first before casting your vote.

While there is certainly proof that mutations do occur in nature; There is absolutely no real evidence to support the theory of evolution at this time (for over the past 150 years of "Dino-digging"). Including the sedimentary column.
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26%
There probably is evidence to support this theory, yet scientist are at a loss to explain it appropriately.
17
26%
Scientist are great at making shit up when they have no evidence to prove something that is false to begin with.
8
12%
I believe in Santa. He's a real person that lives all the way deep at the north pole and brings me presents every year. The presents prove that he's real. I also leave him milk and cookies to snack on and while I don't ever see him, I just know with all my heart, that he is the one who eats all the cookies and milk. Or, I wish I had a dogasaur like Dino.
23
35%
 
Total votes : 65

Re: An Unproven Hypothesis, The Rise of Ignorance.

Postby crispybits on Thu Mar 21, 2013 4:09 pm

crispybits wrote:Player has already covered it in detail, but I just ave to say that I find the irony delicious that someone who claims that so much is a hoax would use Nessie, possibly the most hoaxed story on the planet, as evidence for their case :twisted:


I feel I should apologise for this. Nessie is only the third most hoaxed story on the planet, behind bigfoot and aliens...

Image

PLAYER57832 wrote:
Lootifer wrote:I almost want to put on a "creationist" hat and try and argue for Viceroys point because he is doing such a spectactularly shit job of it....


Almost.

Yeah, he is sounding more and more like just an idiot, not someone who actually believes what he is saying. Even lionz did a better job than him... and Lionz mostly just wanted to post pictures and ask more questions.

EXCEPT.. make no mistake, there are plenty of Americans who believe things very much like what Viceroy is putting forth, and their numbers are growing, not shrinking. PLUS.. they tend to vote.


Indeedy - and to boot...

Image

(I'm resorting to mostly image based posts as it makes it easier on them to speak in their language, after all why read a bunch of complicated stuff that actually explains everything when you can have pictures right?)
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Re: An Unproven Hypothesis, The Rise of Ignorance.

Postby PLAYER57832 on Thu Mar 21, 2013 4:15 pm

LOL... well, not quite. Sadly, a lot of creationists are actually intelligent, but they have been carefully taught that science is wrong.

If, from the time of age 4-5 to you get into college, ALL you hear is stuff put out by the Institute for Creationist Studies, including what they say about evolution, then that becomes your world view.
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Re: An Unproven Hypothesis, The Rise of Ignorance.

Postby chang50 on Fri Mar 22, 2013 1:39 am

PLAYER57832 wrote:LOL... well, not quite. Sadly, a lot of creationists are actually intelligent, but they have been carefully taught that science is wrong.

If, from the time of age 4-5 to you get into college, ALL you hear is stuff put out by the Institute for Creationist Studies, including what they say about evolution, then that becomes your world view.


If otherwise intelligent people are being brainwashed on this scale what are the implications for free will?
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Re: An Unproven Hypothesis, The Rise of Ignorance.

Postby PLAYER57832 on Fri Mar 22, 2013 4:16 am

chang50 wrote:
PLAYER57832 wrote:LOL... well, not quite. Sadly, a lot of creationists are actually intelligent, but they have been carefully taught that science is wrong.

If, from the time of age 4-5 to you get into college, ALL you hear is stuff put out by the Institute for Creationist Studies, including what they say about evolution, then that becomes your world view.


If otherwise intelligent people are being brainwashed on this scale what are the implications for free will?

Its not "brainwashing" per se. They are thinking human beings. It is really no different from people who grew up in the 1400's who often thought the world was flat... they just did not have evidence to the contrary and it really did not matter much to their daily lives.

And.. the implication is that the internet, absent any check on credibility, is the most dangerous invention of all time.
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Re: An Unproven Hypothesis, The Rise of Ignorance.

Postby chang50 on Fri Mar 22, 2013 4:33 am

PLAYER57832 wrote:
chang50 wrote:
PLAYER57832 wrote:LOL... well, not quite. Sadly, a lot of creationists are actually intelligent, but they have been carefully taught that science is wrong.

If, from the time of age 4-5 to you get into college, ALL you hear is stuff put out by the Institute for Creationist Studies, including what they say about evolution, then that becomes your world view.


If otherwise intelligent people are being brainwashed on this scale what are the implications for free will?

Its not "brainwashing" per se. They are thinking human beings. It is really no different from people who grew up in the 1400's who often thought the world was flat... they just did not have evidence to the contrary and it really did not matter much to their daily lives.

And.. the implication is that the internet, absent any check on credibility, is the most dangerous invention of all time.


Interesting,I agree the internet can be dangerous especially to world views that cannot stand up to close scrutiny like creationism.Some like Thunderf00t think the internet is where religions come to die..it's food for thought at least.
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Re: An Unproven Hypothesis, The Rise of Ignorance.

Postby PLAYER57832 on Fri Mar 22, 2013 2:44 pm

chang50 wrote:
PLAYER57832 wrote:
chang50 wrote:
PLAYER57832 wrote:LOL... well, not quite. Sadly, a lot of creationists are actually intelligent, but they have been carefully taught that science is wrong.

If, from the time of age 4-5 to you get into college, ALL you hear is stuff put out by the Institute for Creationist Studies, including what they say about evolution, then that becomes your world view.


If otherwise intelligent people are being brainwashed on this scale what are the implications for free will?

Its not "brainwashing" per se. They are thinking human beings. It is really no different from people who grew up in the 1400's who often thought the world was flat... they just did not have evidence to the contrary and it really did not matter much to their daily lives.

And.. the implication is that the internet, absent any check on credibility, is the most dangerous invention of all time.


Interesting,I agree the internet can be dangerous especially to world views that cannot stand up to close scrutiny like creationism.Some like Thunderf00t think the internet is where religions come to die..it's food for thought at least.

No, because no one is required to do more than check into the links of people who think just like them. Google searches will even do the "favor" or tailoring results that a person likes, so Viceroy won't find anything by real evolutions for maybe 20 pages or so. And, there are plenty of creationist websites out there that give the illusion of veracity.

Its partly flat out lying... not worrying about verification, and just putting down whatever. Partly, its psychology. You look at hundred cites that say essentially the same thing and you begin to think "hey, this really DOES make sense... why else would all these people agree? It really doesn't matter if they are all using the same skewed source or no source at all, or are utterly misrepresenting sources. (Creation “scientists” like to cite evolution proponents out of context and claim the evolutionary expert really agrees with the creation “scientist”).

This happens in a LOT of fronts, by the way… it is why our political climate is so divisive and why so many people plain refuse to listen to opposition.. they are never, ever forced to even HEAR real opposition. They hear, instead, a bunch of straw man arguments that are put forward to give the illusion of considering the opposition.. pretty much like Viceroy’s claim about living dinosaurs. He could care less how many times we point out that living dinosaurs won’t disprove evolution, he keeps saying it. In his case, I suspect he is just game-playing, but true believers will say that, and basically turn away from the argument and go back to their source which will verify for them that the person to whom they are speaking is just wrong about this and evolution really does depend on things like creatures dying, that mutations must mean loss of information and that any transition fossil is just showing microevolution or is plain faked. We see the same thing in debates over things like minimum wage, socialized medicine, even pollution impacts.
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Re: An Unproven Hypothesis, The Rise of Ignorance.

Postby crispybits on Fri Mar 22, 2013 3:27 pm

I forget if it was Dawkins or someone else but I remember watching a debate in which someone said that they really didn't like the way Google and Amazon and their ilk do the "If you liked this... you might also like this" or tailored searches kind of thing. They said that what these sites should do is suggest things that are massively different to the things you've previously clicked on in order to give you fresh perspectives and new experiences as often as possible. I have to say I agree.

Also, it might surprise Viceroy and some others to learn that I have looked into creationism independently of the discussions I've had on here - not because I ever expected to believe it or anything like that, but because if I'm going to argue against it then first I have to understand it properly. I have to be able to competently answer questions based on what creationist views say about various different issues. Actually, maybe that deserves a little repitition....

If I'm going to argue against it then first I have to understand it properly. I have to be able to competently answer questions based on what creationist views say about various different issues.

If I'm going to argue against it then first I have to understand it properly. I have to be able to competently answer questions based on what creationist views say about various different issues.

If I'm going to argue against it then first I have to understand it properly. I have to be able to competently answer questions based on what creationist views say about various different issues.

If I'm going to argue against it then first I have to understand it properly. I have to be able to competently answer questions based on what creationist views say about various different issues.

(maybe they could do evolution the same courtesy)
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Re: An Unproven Hypothesis, The Rise of Ignorance.

Postby PLAYER57832 on Fri Mar 22, 2013 3:35 pm

Yeah, that's why I speant a good part of 2 years reading essentially everything the Institute for Creation Research put out.

And... why I grew from tolerant to plain outright angry. Despite all claims, don't believe for a SECOND that religion is really behind all this. Sure, many players are "true believers" of Christianity, but the backers and originators... are either solely extremely sloppy and very stupid scientists or they are flat out liars and decievers.

One cannot truly follow Christ AND be a constant purveyor of falsehood. mistakes, erors, sure. We are human, and to be human is to err. However, so many errors that are so systematic and careful manner that they simply have to be intentional ... no way!
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Re: Are the Ica Stones fake or real?

Postby Dukasaur on Sat Mar 23, 2013 2:53 pm

Viceroy63 wrote:The following is an excerpt from the article "Are the Ica Stones fake or real?" This article can be read in it's entirety at...
http://www.creationliberty.com/articles/icastones.php

Are the Ica Stones fake or real?
Author: Christopher J. E. Johnson
Published: Sept 12, 2011

In some of our CLE seminars, I show pictures of large stones with drawings carved into them called "Ica Stones." Originally collected by a man named Dr. Javier Cabrera, these Ica Stones portray clear and detailed dinosaurs, as well as complex medical surgery, and other devices such as telescopes and magnifying glasses.

To take an absolute stance that they are all real or all fake would not be wise because there are some fakes out there, but vice versa, just because some fakes and frauds have been made, doesn't mean the real ones are discredited. However, there are many evolutionists that take the position that they are all fakes and frauds because one of these stones being real would disrupt the entire evolution religion, and that is a scary thought for many people who scoff at the Bible.

There are many articles and documentaries made that have, in their own words, "proven" these Ica Stones to be fakes, but the whole truth is not told. [Viceroy63: if something is a half truth, then it is a whole "LIE!"] Most of these shows and documents are simply not well-researched because there is a presuppositional bias that wants to prove them fraudulent. For example, a man by the name of Philip Coppens wrote an article on his website that attempts to squelch any credibility to the Ica Stones, but the extent of his research is seen in his labeling of Dr. Cabrera's father:

Dr. Cabrera's father's name is Dom Pedro. This may not seem that important, but I say this to emphasize the lack of research that is being done, and this is but one of many such mistakes in articles written on the subject of the Ica Stones. [Viceroy63: To not really look into a subject and then post it as truth or self evident, is a "LIE!"]

[Note:]
For a fraud to carry on from one generation to the next is a very Mayor undertaking for a small town community where every knows your business even before God Himself knows it. I know this because I live in a small town. This is truly an elaborate hoax??? :-s
-Viceroy63


Those that say all the Ica Stones are fake have to find a way around the scientific and archeological evidence. For example, these stones were first discovered and reported by the Spanish in 1535.

"Father Simon, a Jesuit missionary, accompanied Pizarro along the Peruvian coast and recorded his amazement upon viewing the stones. In 1562, Spanish explorers sent some of the stones back to Spain."

[Note:]
Ah yes, 1562; Of course! That was the year that the "Dentist Drill" was invented??? :roll:
-Viceroy63


Are we to believe that 500 years ago someone, living in South America, was carving thousands of these stones, just to fool the evolutionists? However, they must believe such things in order to reconcile their theory with the evidence.

[Note]
Man, are those evolutionist smart. Even 500 years ago, they were already plotting the debunking of these Ica stones as fackes! :twisted:
-Viceroy63


In 1967, Dr. Cabrera picked 33 stones out of his collection and sent them to Maurico Hochshild Mining Company in Lima, Peru to be examined for age, and test to see if they had been recently deposited by a grave-robber who was carving them just to make extra money. Eric Wolf, geologist who worked at the MHMC laboratory sent back his signed analysis which read:

"The stones are covered with a fine patina of natural oxidation which also covers the grooves, by which age should be able to be deduced..."

Erich von Daniken analyzed these stones on a microscopic level, and found the following:

"Right angled clean scratches showed on the new stone under the microscope, whereas microorganisms could be seen in the grooves of Cabrera's stones under a fine glaze... that was the tiny major difference between genuine and false stones."

Though shows, like NOVA, will attempt to convince an audience that the stones' cuts have been made recently, F.G. Hawley, an experienced chemist and archaeologist, said:

"Many [artifacts] in dry western country show little or no patina after seven or eight hundred years."

[Note]
How Shocking that LIES would be spread on the airwaves influencing the minds and thoughts of our little children to believe in a LIE! :shock:
-Viceroy63


Under microscopic analysis, we can see that the real Ica Stones can be verified. Yet, commonly, evolutionists will still attack the authenticity of the Ica Stones without the evidence, and commonly I find they do not provide any references to what they are talking about.

Another common evidence used against the Ica Stones is the farmer Uchuya, who was said to be making the stones and selling them to tourists. However, before we analyze this story, let's assume it to be true for the moment.

If it is true that he is making some stones and selling them, does that account for the stones found 500 years ago? Do his fake stones account for all the Ica Stones discovered over the past few decades? Using this admission of forgery does not disprove the Ica Stones altogether.

This is about the same as someone taking a picture of a stick in the water, claiming it as a picture of the Lochness monster, and then when it is proven fraudulent, the evolutionists will jump on it and say that all accounts are disproven because one person lied. (This is also called a "false dilemma" logical fallacy, claiming they're either all real or all fake.) This emphasis on forgeries, without considering all the evidence, is an immature childish tactic used to persuade an audience, not a method used by researchers seeking the truth.

In addition, Dr. Cabrera alone had over 11,000 stones in his collection, so where is the gigantic crater that would be required to have dug up that many stones? And how could these two people have done all this by themselves without anyone noticing? Hamilton Forman, archaeologist researching the Ica Stones, said:

"If one family did this, they must have had an army of elves helping them."

A Peruvian jail sentence is almost the same as an American death sentence. They don't feed you. They don't cloth you. They don't help you in any way. If your family does not come to give you food and assistance, you will die in a Peruvian jail. Selling Peruvian treasures without government authorization is against the law, so when police officers brought in Irma and Basilio, both said they make the stones and sell them, because if the two confessed to digging up the stones and selling them, they would be immediately thrown in Peruvian jail. [Viceroy63: Sure they did! That makes perfect sense when you put it like that??? :roll:]

Even Philip Coppens, who writes against the authenticity of the Ica Stones, wrote:

"When von Däniken visited the farmer in 1973, Uschuya confirmed to him that he had faked the stones; but later on, in an interview with the German journalist Andreas Fischer, Uschuya claimed the opposite. They were genuine, he insisted, and he admitted to a hoax to [u][b]avoid imprisonment."

[Note:]
Oh, Come on People; Does any reasonably intelligent person really believe that any police, any where on the planet, would try to coerce a confession from a suspect? Ha, ha, ha, Get real??? :lol:
-Viceroy63


There is still a lot to be learned by the Ica Stones, but few people are willing to pay for the research because, after all, these stones completely destroy the general theory of evolution.

Who would want to pay for research that destroys the only presupposition evolutionists have to help them reject true Biblical history?

If the skeptics would do a little research, they wouldn't have to be so skeptical.

Man, that is some pretty use of colour! The juxtaposition of the red lines and the blue lines is absolutely brilliant! You have a great career as an artist ahead of you!
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Re: An Unproven Hypothesis, The Rise of Ignorance.

Postby Dukasaur on Sat Mar 23, 2013 2:59 pm

[quote="crispybits"]Image
Gotta love it!
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Re: An Unproven Hypothesis, The Rise of Ignorance.

Postby Viceroy63 on Mon May 27, 2013 7:43 pm

Originally posted in the forum thread below and reposted here because it pertains to this topic of the theory of evoloution not being factual but a myth of science.
viewtopic.php?f=8&t=110240&p=4182949#p4182949

Image

I would add to Universalchiro's statement that the Geological Sedimentary Column is NOT Science fact but presented as truth that Evolution of life did happen on this planet when in fact it is only proof that heavier sediments drop faster than lighter sediments in a world wide flood like situation. That is all that it proves. Why Scientist and Teachers continue to lie to us and to small school children (innocent trusting minds) must be out of pride and unwilling to say that they are wrong. Or probably for fear of losing their employments if they did teach the truth, as has happened repeatedly when Teachers do teach the truth to children, they simply get fired.

The fact is that the Geo. Column only exist in text books and not in real life. If the sedimentary Column was in fact real it would reach down 150 miles into the earth. Also for some reason, you can't find some layers in some parts of the world where they do appear in others??? What happened there for those millions of years? In some columns certain creatures are found in a certain layer while in other columns in other parts of the world, the same creatures are found in completely different layers of those columns. Can anyone explain how that could happen over millions of Years of sediments? No because it's a bullshit lie that they tell us in school.

The fact is that the sedimentary column did not take millions of years to form but happened rather quickly in a world wide flood. That is the only explanation that answer these questions. The G. Column was created by believers of the Bible to explain a world wide flood and then later it was perverted by so called, "men of science" to show how evolution happened when there is really no proof what so ever that evolution of life ever happen on this or any other world what so ever!!!

Check out this quote...


Misconception No. 1.
The geologic column was constructed by geologists who, because of the weight of the evidence that they had found, were convinced of the truth of uniformitarian theory and organic evolution.

The Truth:
It may sound surprising, but the standard geologic column was devised before 1860 by catastrophists who were creationists.1 Adam Sedgewick, Roderick Murchison, William Coneybeare, and others affirmed that the earth was formed largely by catastrophic processes, and that the earth and life were created. These men stood for careful empirical science and were not compelled to believe evolutionary speculation or side with uniformitarian theory. Although most would be called "progressive creationists" in today's terminology, they would not be pleased to see all the evolutionary baggage that has been loaded onto their classification of strata.
http://www.ukapologetics.net/08/geologiccolumn.htm
Last edited by Viceroy63 on Tue May 28, 2013 6:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: An Unproven Hypothesis, The Rise of Ignorance.

Postby AndyDufresne on Tue May 28, 2013 2:05 pm

Viceroy63 wrote: That is all that it proves. Why Scientist and Teachers continue to lie to us and to small school children (innocent trusting minds) must be out of pride and unwilling to say that they are wrong. Or probably for fear of losing their employments if they did teach the truth, as has happened repeatedly when Teachers do teach the truth to children, they simply get fired.


It has long been factually known that Mad Scientists have been corrupting our innocent youth for generations.

Image Image

Fear of losing gainful employment is surely one of the many driving means behind this troublesome continuance of lies. Not mention sheer false pride as well.

Image

But remember, that Mad Scientists aren't the only ones to blame. Teachers play a similarly diabolical and deceiving role in this corruption of our innocent youth.

Image Image

Truth continues to be obscured by willing participants. We must all remain vigilant defenders of the truth.

Image


--Andy
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Re: An Unproven Hypothesis, The Rise of Ignorance.

Postby waauw on Tue May 28, 2013 2:22 pm

An Unproven Hypothesis,
The Rise of the invisible Harry Potter of the skies

writer: Harry Potter

Read it! Read it now!! Entertainment for the whole family!
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George Santayana: Those who do not remember the past are condemned to repeat it.
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Shattering the Myth of Darwinism and evolution!

Postby Viceroy63 on Wed May 29, 2013 8:57 am

Shattering the Myth of Darwinism and Evolution!

Andy would not know what the truth was if it smacked him in the face!

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Re: An Unproven Hypothesis, The Rise of Ignorance.

Postby comic boy on Wed May 29, 2013 9:06 am

Is Viceroy a Troll or a moron ?
Im a TOFU miSfit
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