Repeal Gun Free School Zones!?

\\OFF-TOPIC// conversations about everything that has nothing to do with Conquer Club.

Moderators: Global Moderators, Community Team

Forum rules
Please read the Community Guidelines before posting.

Should Schools Have an Armed Professional on Campus?

Yes
17
26%
Sounds like a good idea
5
8%
Maybe
2
3%
Sounds like a bad idea
9
14%
No
30
46%
IDK
2
3%
 
Total votes : 65

Re: Repeal Gun Free School Zones!?

Postby stahrgazer on Thu Dec 20, 2012 9:06 pm

Phatscotty wrote:
stahrgazer wrote:I like how the airlines do it. Pilots volunteer for an extensive program that, when completed, allows them to carry in the cockpit. Schools could, similarly, have teachers, administrators, etc., volunteer to complete a similar extensive training program to allow them to carry in the classroom.

"Who" is not publicly disclosed, so the potential is, any/all. Thus, schools are no longer totally defenseless, and maniac cowards might choose other targets.

Most assuredly, maniacs will always choose targets, and most assuredly, they'll find a way be it knives, guns, bombs, poison (remember Tylenol and other over-the-counter pill poisonings years back?) But at least kids in school would no longer be totally defenseless sitting ducks because the prof might be packing.


Sounds great! I fully back it!


After thinking about it, I'm not sure it'd work too well in a classroom. Kids these days are more and more violent in general. I wouldn't like to have a program like this in place to protect the kids who gang up on a "packing" professor, take his weapon, and use it against other kids in the classrooms or halls, but I'm sure it would happen if a program like this were instituted.

And what if we said "some principles" or "administrators" instead of some teachers? Well, the chance of kids getting to those arms is less, but would that fear-factor be enough to keep the maniacs at bay?

Then there are those who say, "hire more armed security/policemen to patrol the schools." Sounds great, right? Who wants double school real estate taxes to pay for this? Given the current "fiscal cliff" in the news about whether to raise taxes and reduce spending; raise taxes and not reduce spending; only reduce spending... seems pretty clear to me that no one really would wish to pay for this.

Maybe some parents could volunteer for a program where they get trained and registered and get to sit in their cars (locked) in front of the schools with their nearly-assault-but-not-quite-technically-assault-rifles ready to shoot any perp who'd come try to shoot the kids. Citizen patrol/neighborhood watch type. But wait, I live in Florida, where a citizen on neighborhood watch may or may not have illegally assaulted and killed someone who wasn't causing any trouble, out of fear he would, or racism (both arguments have been brought up about why he did it if it wasn't self-defense.) Trayvon Martin is the victim I'm referring to here, if you hadn't guessed.

There's no 100% solution.

But, signs, "gun free zone" really do make places like that targets for maniacal cowards who want to be violent and make the news.
Image
User avatar
Sergeant 1st Class stahrgazer
 
Posts: 1424
Joined: Thu May 22, 2008 11:59 am
Location: Figment of the Imagination...
Medals: 57
Standard Achievement (3) Doubles Achievement (3) Triples Achievement (3) Quadruples Achievement (3) Terminator Achievement (1)
Assassin Achievement (1) Manual Troops Achievement (1) Freestyle Achievement (1) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (4)
Trench Warfare Achievement (1) Speed Achievement (2) Teammate Achievement (2) Random Map Achievement (1) Cross-Map Achievement (3)
Bot Achievement (3) Ratings Achievement (3) Tournament Achievement (1) General Achievement (4) Clan Achievement (8)
Tournament Contribution (1) General Contribution (7)

Re: Repeal Gun Free School Zones!?

Postby Symmetry on Fri Dec 21, 2012 5:21 am

stahrgazer wrote:
Phatscotty wrote:
stahrgazer wrote:I like how the airlines do it. Pilots volunteer for an extensive program that, when completed, allows them to carry in the cockpit. Schools could, similarly, have teachers, administrators, etc., volunteer to complete a similar extensive training program to allow them to carry in the classroom.

"Who" is not publicly disclosed, so the potential is, any/all. Thus, schools are no longer totally defenseless, and maniac cowards might choose other targets.

Most assuredly, maniacs will always choose targets, and most assuredly, they'll find a way be it knives, guns, bombs, poison (remember Tylenol and other over-the-counter pill poisonings years back?) But at least kids in school would no longer be totally defenseless sitting ducks because the prof might be packing.


Sounds great! I fully back it!


After thinking about it, I'm not sure it'd work too well in a classroom. Kids these days are more and more violent in general. I wouldn't like to have a program like this in place to protect the kids who gang up on a "packing" professor, take his weapon, and use it against other kids in the classrooms or halls, but I'm sure it would happen if a program like this were instituted.

And what if we said "some principles" or "administrators" instead of some teachers? Well, the chance of kids getting to those arms is less, but would that fear-factor be enough to keep the maniacs at bay?

Then there are those who say, "hire more armed security/policemen to patrol the schools." Sounds great, right? Who wants double school real estate taxes to pay for this? Given the current "fiscal cliff" in the news about whether to raise taxes and reduce spending; raise taxes and not reduce spending; only reduce spending... seems pretty clear to me that no one really would wish to pay for this.

Maybe some parents could volunteer for a program where they get trained and registered and get to sit in their cars (locked) in front of the schools with their nearly-assault-but-not-quite-technically-assault-rifles ready to shoot any perp who'd come try to shoot the kids. Citizen patrol/neighborhood watch type. But wait, I live in Florida, where a citizen on neighborhood watch may or may not have illegally assaulted and killed someone who wasn't causing any trouble, out of fear he would, or racism (both arguments have been brought up about why he did it if it wasn't self-defense.) Trayvon Martin is the victim I'm referring to here, if you hadn't guessed.

There's no 100% solution.

But, signs, "gun free zone" really do make places like that targets for maniacal cowards who want to be violent and make the news.


I'm not sure that's the case. A person who enters a situation like this with the intent to die isn't going to be deterred by a sign, let alone one that says that it's not a place he'll be shot.

One of the worst killing sprees in recent US history occurred at a military base- Fort Hood in 2009.
User avatar
Sergeant 1st Class Symmetry
 
Posts: 1776
Joined: Sat Feb 24, 2007 5:49 am
Medals: 2
Standard Achievement (1) Triples Achievement (1)

Re: Repeal Gun Free School Zones!?

Postby stahrgazer on Fri Dec 21, 2012 6:50 am

Symmetry wrote:But, signs, "gun free zone" really do make places like that targets for maniacal cowards who want to be violent and make the news.


I'm not sure that's the case. A person who enters a situation like this with the intent to die isn't going to be deterred by a sign, let alone one that says that it's not a place he'll be shot.

One of the worst killing sprees in recent US history occurred at a military base- Fort Hood in 2009.[/quote]

It's not the sign, it's the knowledge that they're sitting ducks. The Fort Hood shooting was a at a graduation ceremony, a time when the perp could be reasonably sure that most of the targets would not be well armed, so, again, "sitting ducks."
Image
User avatar
Sergeant 1st Class stahrgazer
 
Posts: 1424
Joined: Thu May 22, 2008 11:59 am
Location: Figment of the Imagination...
Medals: 57
Standard Achievement (3) Doubles Achievement (3) Triples Achievement (3) Quadruples Achievement (3) Terminator Achievement (1)
Assassin Achievement (1) Manual Troops Achievement (1) Freestyle Achievement (1) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (4)
Trench Warfare Achievement (1) Speed Achievement (2) Teammate Achievement (2) Random Map Achievement (1) Cross-Map Achievement (3)
Bot Achievement (3) Ratings Achievement (3) Tournament Achievement (1) General Achievement (4) Clan Achievement (8)
Tournament Contribution (1) General Contribution (7)

Re: Repeal Gun Free School Zones!?

Postby Symmetry on Fri Dec 21, 2012 6:58 am

stahrgazer wrote:
Symmetry wrote:
stahrgazer wrote:But, signs, "gun free zone" really do make places like that targets for maniacal cowards who want to be violent and make the news.

I'm not sure that's the case. A person who enters a situation like this with the intent to die isn't going to be deterred by a sign, let alone one that says that it's not a place he'll be shot.

One of the worst killing sprees in recent US history occurred at a military base- Fort Hood in 2009.


It's not the sign, it's the knowledge that they're sitting ducks. The Fort Hood shooting was a at a graduation ceremony, a time when the perp could be reasonably sure that most of the targets would not be well armed, so, again, "sitting ducks."


I'm pretty sure that a military base isn't a good target for "sitting ducks".

Could you restate your point? I don't know what you're saying about gun-free signs anymore.

stahrgazer wrote:But, signs, "gun free zone" really do make places like that targets for maniacal cowards who want to be violent and make the news.


stahrgazer wrote:It's not the sign, it's the knowledge that they're sitting ducks.


Are you saying they matter, or not?

You might also consider reading about the Fort Hood shooting for the "graduation ceremony" inaccuracy.
User avatar
Sergeant 1st Class Symmetry
 
Posts: 1776
Joined: Sat Feb 24, 2007 5:49 am
Medals: 2
Standard Achievement (1) Triples Achievement (1)

Re: Repeal Gun Free School Zones!?

Postby stahrgazer on Fri Dec 21, 2012 8:42 pm

Symmetry wrote:
stahrgazer wrote:
Symmetry wrote:
stahrgazer wrote:But, signs, "gun free zone" really do make places like that targets for maniacal cowards who want to be violent and make the news.

I'm not sure that's the case. A person who enters a situation like this with the intent to die isn't going to be deterred by a sign, let alone one that says that it's not a place he'll be shot.

One of the worst killing sprees in recent US history occurred at a military base- Fort Hood in 2009.


It's not the sign, it's the knowledge that they're sitting ducks. The Fort Hood shooting was a at a graduation ceremony, a time when the perp could be reasonably sure that most of the targets would not be well armed, so, again, "sitting ducks."


I'm pretty sure that a military base isn't a good target for "sitting ducks".

Could you restate your point? I don't know what you're saying about gun-free signs anymore.

stahrgazer wrote:But, signs, "gun free zone" really do make places like that targets for maniacal cowards who want to be violent and make the news.


stahrgazer wrote:It's not the sign, it's the knowledge that they're sitting ducks.


Are you saying they matter, or not?

You might also consider reading about the Fort Hood shooting for the "graduation ceremony" inaccuracy.


Maybe you should read about military bases. On most bases, only the MPs carry guns/ammo, the rest are usually locked away except when training is ongoing.

I did read about the Fort Hood shooting, An army psychologist with Muslim leanings didn't want to be deployed to the Middle East so "went postal." Some of the trainees were "graduating" the day he picked so it wasn't an inaccuracy, and since there was this ceremony going on there probably wasn't a lot of shooting training going on, so only a few MPs carrying to worry about at least until some damage was done.

To clarify my point about "gun free zones" - we all know what the "gun free zones" are, right? Areas where even those who have permits to carry concealed weapons, cannot legally bring them in. Thus, areas where there are likely to be no persons - or very few persons - shooting back. Thus, areas where there are a bunch of "sitting ducks," helpless in front of someone with the intention to do violence.

After 9/11 they instituted a program where pilots could volunteer to carry in the cockpit, so they have something to defend themselves, the passengers, the plane against folks intending to do violence with things like box cutters. It's a possible deterrent.

Few mass murders happen in police stations, because so many of them will be armed and the nutsoids know it, so they also know they cannot generate the fear they can where there's defenseless or nearly-defenseless "sitting ducks."

Get it now?
Image
User avatar
Sergeant 1st Class stahrgazer
 
Posts: 1424
Joined: Thu May 22, 2008 11:59 am
Location: Figment of the Imagination...
Medals: 57
Standard Achievement (3) Doubles Achievement (3) Triples Achievement (3) Quadruples Achievement (3) Terminator Achievement (1)
Assassin Achievement (1) Manual Troops Achievement (1) Freestyle Achievement (1) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (4)
Trench Warfare Achievement (1) Speed Achievement (2) Teammate Achievement (2) Random Map Achievement (1) Cross-Map Achievement (3)
Bot Achievement (3) Ratings Achievement (3) Tournament Achievement (1) General Achievement (4) Clan Achievement (8)
Tournament Contribution (1) General Contribution (7)

Re: Repeal Gun Free School Zones!?

Postby Symmetry on Sat Dec 22, 2012 2:22 pm

stahrgazer wrote:
Symmetry wrote:
stahrgazer wrote:
Symmetry wrote:
stahrgazer wrote:But, signs, "gun free zone" really do make places like that targets for maniacal cowards who want to be violent and make the news.

I'm not sure that's the case. A person who enters a situation like this with the intent to die isn't going to be deterred by a sign, let alone one that says that it's not a place he'll be shot.

One of the worst killing sprees in recent US history occurred at a military base- Fort Hood in 2009.


It's not the sign, it's the knowledge that they're sitting ducks. The Fort Hood shooting was a at a graduation ceremony, a time when the perp could be reasonably sure that most of the targets would not be well armed, so, again, "sitting ducks."


I'm pretty sure that a military base isn't a good target for "sitting ducks".

Could you restate your point? I don't know what you're saying about gun-free signs anymore.

stahrgazer wrote:But, signs, "gun free zone" really do make places like that targets for maniacal cowards who want to be violent and make the news.


stahrgazer wrote:It's not the sign, it's the knowledge that they're sitting ducks.


Are you saying they matter, or not?

You might also consider reading about the Fort Hood shooting for the "graduation ceremony" inaccuracy.


Maybe you should read about military bases. On most bases, only the MPs carry guns/ammo, the rest are usually locked away except when training is ongoing.

I did read about the Fort Hood shooting, An army psychologist with Muslim leanings didn't want to be deployed to the Middle East so "went postal." Some of the trainees were "graduating" the day he picked so it wasn't an inaccuracy, and since there was this ceremony going on there probably wasn't a lot of shooting training going on, so only a few MPs carrying to worry about at least until some damage was done.

To clarify my point about "gun free zones" - we all know what the "gun free zones" are, right? Areas where even those who have permits to carry concealed weapons, cannot legally bring them in. Thus, areas where there are likely to be no persons - or very few persons - shooting back. Thus, areas where there are a bunch of "sitting ducks," helpless in front of someone with the intention to do violence.

After 9/11 they instituted a program where pilots could volunteer to carry in the cockpit, so they have something to defend themselves, the passengers, the plane against folks intending to do violence with things like box cutters. It's a possible deterrent.

Few mass murders happen in police stations, because so many of them will be armed and the nutsoids know it, so they also know they cannot generate the fear they can where there's defenseless or nearly-defenseless "sitting ducks."

Get it now?


Not at all, you've clarified none of your points, and made others murkier. The Fort Hood shooting does not indicate that anyone was "graduating" that day, certainly not the people who were targeted, although I do note that you're backing away from that claim with the quotation marks.

Clearly the base's civilian police were armed, as one of them shot him, which goes against your claim that only MP's were carrying firearms.

Furthermore, even a school not designated as a gun free zone can suffer mass shootings- Columbine notably had people with guns.

Finally, there really is no conclusive evidence that concealed carry laws decrease violence.
User avatar
Sergeant 1st Class Symmetry
 
Posts: 1776
Joined: Sat Feb 24, 2007 5:49 am
Medals: 2
Standard Achievement (1) Triples Achievement (1)

Re: Repeal Gun Free School Zones!?

Postby Phatscotty on Sat Dec 22, 2012 2:31 pm

Stargahzer is doing an A+ job, even better than I can do. But Gaze doesn't have the rep that I do, so people do not constantly come at Gaze sideways with personal attacks either.

I don't think I have ever agreed with Gazer before, but it does give me comfort as I know there are a lot of pro-gun liberals out there who understand Freedom and Liberty. I had a liberal co-worker say to me a few months back "I might not agree with you on most of this stuff, but tell you what, if they come to take our guns, I will be standing right beside you"

Those are the real Liberals
"I want you to remember that, to remind you to stay out of my way. In all the years to come, in all your most private moments, I want you to remember my hand at your throat. I want you to remember the one man who beat you."
User avatar
Major Phatscotty
SoC Training Adviser
 
Posts: 2439
Joined: Mon Dec 10, 2007 5:50 pm
Medals: 94
Standard Achievement (4) Doubles Achievement (3) Triples Achievement (3) Quadruples Achievement (4) Terminator Achievement (2)
Assassin Achievement (1) Manual Troops Achievement (4) Freestyle Achievement (2) Polymorphic Achievement (1) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (3)
Fog of War Achievement (4) Trench Warfare Achievement (3) Speed Achievement (3) Teammate Achievement (3) Random Map Achievement (2)
Cross-Map Achievement (3) Beta Map Achievement (2) Battle Royale Achievement (1) Ratings Achievement (4) Tournament Achievement (5)
General Achievement (2) Clan Achievement (10) Training Achievement (9) Challenge Achievement (1) Tournament Contribution (13)

Re: Repeal Gun Free School Zones!?

Postby PLAYER57832 on Sun Dec 23, 2012 9:41 am

thegreekdog wrote:Can you provide me some more examples of items that are illegal because they can be used by criminals to cuase great harm? I doubt there are many things.

Nuclear bombs, Cocaine, PCB, etc.

But more to the point, MANY things have limits, which is actually what is being proposed with guns. You can drive/opwn a car, but you cannot drive a race car on a normal road and cannot drive a normal car 100 MPH, or over 15 MPH near most schools.

Administering drugs is controlled, you have to be judged to have a need by a trained professional before you can obtain a perscription.

Even your profession requires limits. To legally declare yourself an attorney or tax expert you have to have passed some pretty hefty exams. Why? Because someone attempting to do the job without qualifications would cause people great harm... though some criminals certainly try to do so!


thegreekdog wrote:To the extent you can find many things that are illegal because they can be used by criminals to cause great harm, my response to that is that we should make those things legal. Just because there are other laws that denigrate the rights of the law-abiding in favor of protecting society from criminals does not make any of them right.

I don't see a lot of murderers, attempted murderers, or accused in Philadelphia arguing about their right to carry firearms.

Then you should purchase a gun, which is legal.

So you are fine with untrained people passing themselves off as attorneys? OR your average 16 year old driving a race car on the freeway at 100 MPH? Becuase that is one of they key points being made.. while people ought to be allowed to own guns, they also ought to have to demonstrate some knowledge of proper use and ability to use them. That, and some types of guns might not be appropriate for average people in everyday type situations. It might be appropriate to limit certain types of weapons to certain types of people.

Note .. I am not saying I agree to any specific limitation right now. I am saying that we need to discuss and talk about them without lapsing into "take one gun.. its the end of democracy" [not your argument, no] or even "criminals can misuse anything, so don't rely on laws to prevent it". [which does seem pretty much your argument] We cannot completely end criminal misuse, but laws can limit and control the potential for harm from such abuse to some extent. The question is not IF such limits are necessary, the question is which ones.
Last edited by PLAYER57832 on Sun Dec 23, 2012 10:05 am, edited 1 time in total.
Corporal 1st Class PLAYER57832
 
Posts: 2600
Joined: Fri Sep 21, 2007 9:17 am
Location: Pennsylvania
Medals: 30
Standard Achievement (4) Doubles Achievement (1) Triples Achievement (1) Quadruples Achievement (1) Terminator Achievement (2)
Assassin Achievement (1) Manual Troops Achievement (1) Freestyle Achievement (1) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (4)
Speed Achievement (2) Teammate Achievement (1) Random Map Achievement (1) Cross-Map Achievement (4) Ratings Achievement (4)
Training Achievement (1)

Re: Repeal Gun Free School Zones!?

Postby PLAYER57832 on Sun Dec 23, 2012 9:45 am

stahrgazer wrote:I like how the airlines do it. Pilots volunteer for an extensive program that, when completed, allows them to carry in the cockpit. Schools could, similarly, have teachers, administrators, etc., volunteer to complete a similar extensive training program to allow them to carry in the classroom.

"Who" is not publicly disclosed, so the potential is, any/all. Thus, schools are no longer totally defenseless, and maniac cowards might choose other targets.

Something like this might be very workable. One big problem, though, is that in any small town, who has the gun will be known relatively quickly. Big cities already tend to have schools as armed camps, for the most part. It would probably be most used in smaller towns where the secrecy part would effectively be minimal.

Still, this is an idea work thinking about.
Corporal 1st Class PLAYER57832
 
Posts: 2600
Joined: Fri Sep 21, 2007 9:17 am
Location: Pennsylvania
Medals: 30
Standard Achievement (4) Doubles Achievement (1) Triples Achievement (1) Quadruples Achievement (1) Terminator Achievement (2)
Assassin Achievement (1) Manual Troops Achievement (1) Freestyle Achievement (1) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (4)
Speed Achievement (2) Teammate Achievement (1) Random Map Achievement (1) Cross-Map Achievement (4) Ratings Achievement (4)
Training Achievement (1)

Re: Repeal Gun Free School Zones!?

Postby Timminz on Sun Dec 23, 2012 9:49 am

Image
jay_a2j wrote:lets not be so quick to judge Hitler
User avatar
Major Timminz
 
Posts: 5571
Joined: Tue Feb 27, 2007 1:05 pm
Location: At the store
Medals: 56
Standard Achievement (4) Doubles Achievement (3) Triples Achievement (3) Quadruples Achievement (2) Terminator Achievement (2)
Assassin Achievement (1) Manual Troops Achievement (2) Polymorphic Achievement (1) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (3)
Speed Achievement (4) Teammate Achievement (2) Random Map Achievement (1) Cross-Map Achievement (3) Ratings Achievement (4)
Tournament Achievement (6) General Achievement (2) Clan Achievement (10) Tournament Contribution (1) General Contribution (1)

Re: Repeal Gun Free School Zones!?

Postby PLAYER57832 on Sun Dec 23, 2012 10:11 am

Good point, Timminz. At the same time, there is a distinction between these type of incidents, which are rare and specific, and putting a dent in gun violance in general.

Limiting some automatic weapons might make mass shootings more difficult, but you start getting to the point where we have to ask if, bad as these incidents are, is the damage caused by taking the measure necessary to prevent them worse than the damage itself. Of course, if it were my child killed, I could not be objective about this (nor should the folks in NC right now!!!). One key to these incidents is that they are conducted by people who spend a lot of tiem thinking out and planning details. It is quite likely that they would get around any limits presented. That is not to say we can do nothing. Speed bumps might not stop all speeding, but they do tend to slow traffic in specific sections. A ban on high intensity assault rifles might mean fewer kids killed in such an incident.. or it might mean that these guys look to bombs instead. (its a question worthy of discussion).

HOWEVER, when you talk about more widespread and common violance, a modicum of more protection migth well make a big impact. There is a reason why so many schools already have trained, armed gaurds or police. As I have noted in other threads, part of the problem in finding solutions is that we are not really looking at just one problem.
Corporal 1st Class PLAYER57832
 
Posts: 2600
Joined: Fri Sep 21, 2007 9:17 am
Location: Pennsylvania
Medals: 30
Standard Achievement (4) Doubles Achievement (1) Triples Achievement (1) Quadruples Achievement (1) Terminator Achievement (2)
Assassin Achievement (1) Manual Troops Achievement (1) Freestyle Achievement (1) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (4)
Speed Achievement (2) Teammate Achievement (1) Random Map Achievement (1) Cross-Map Achievement (4) Ratings Achievement (4)
Training Achievement (1)

Re: Repeal Gun Free School Zones!?

Postby Phatscotty on Sun Dec 23, 2012 5:11 pm

http://frontpagemag.com/2012/dgreenfiel ... l-shooter/

1997
At 8 a.m. on Oct. 1, Luke Woodham, 16, bookish and overweight, drove a white Chevy Corsica up to his high school. That was already a sign of trouble: the young man had poor vision and was driven to school every day by his mother. But three hours earlier that morning, Mary Ann Woodham, 50, had been stabbed to death with a butcher knife in the home she shared with her son.

Luke Woodham walked into Pearl High’s commons, an enclosure created by the school’s buildings. He then took a .30-.30 rifle from beneath his blue trench coat and opened fire, wounding seven schoolmates and killing two, Lydia Kaye Dew, 17, and Christina Menefee, 16, a girl he once dated.

Roy Balentine, the principal, dashed out of his office when he heard the first shots.

“I ran out to see if something possibly malfunctioned,” he said. “I was hoping that’s what it was, but I knew it sounded like gunshots.”

He saw Woodham, about 15 or 20 feet away, wearing a big, blue coat and holding a rifle. Balentine dangled both arms to show how Woodham held the rifle low out in front of him.

Fearing Woodham would come for him next, Balentine ran to his office to call the police. As he dialed, more shots rang out. More students fell.

Methodically Woodham began moving through the commons, shooting his victims as students and teachers hid or fled screaming. One of those hit was Lydia Dew, 17, killed with a bullet in the back.

“He was so cool and calm. I saw him shoot a kid, and he ejected the shell,” says assistant principal Joel Myrick. “He was walking along, thumbing fresh rounds into the side port of the rifle.”

Minutes later, Assistant Principal Joel Myrick chased Woodham down outside the school, held him at bay with a Colt .45-caliber automatic pistol he kept in his truck in the school parking lot. He forced Woodham to the ground and put his foot on the youth’s neck.

“I think he’s a coward,” Myrick said. “I had my weapon pointed at his face, and he didn’t want to die.”
"I want you to remember that, to remind you to stay out of my way. In all the years to come, in all your most private moments, I want you to remember my hand at your throat. I want you to remember the one man who beat you."
User avatar
Major Phatscotty
SoC Training Adviser
 
Posts: 2439
Joined: Mon Dec 10, 2007 5:50 pm
Medals: 94
Standard Achievement (4) Doubles Achievement (3) Triples Achievement (3) Quadruples Achievement (4) Terminator Achievement (2)
Assassin Achievement (1) Manual Troops Achievement (4) Freestyle Achievement (2) Polymorphic Achievement (1) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (3)
Fog of War Achievement (4) Trench Warfare Achievement (3) Speed Achievement (3) Teammate Achievement (3) Random Map Achievement (2)
Cross-Map Achievement (3) Beta Map Achievement (2) Battle Royale Achievement (1) Ratings Achievement (4) Tournament Achievement (5)
General Achievement (2) Clan Achievement (10) Training Achievement (9) Challenge Achievement (1) Tournament Contribution (13)

Re: Repeal Gun Free School Zones!?

Postby Phatscotty on Tue Dec 25, 2012 9:22 pm

NJ town to station armed cop at schools

Like I said, American's are waking up all around the country. All the people who voted no in this poll, now is the time take it from some gaming forum to the next level, and to Call New Jersey and express the outrage over a gun being in a school zone. Now you can turn your opinion into a meaningful impact! By all means, demand the gun be removed immediately, and that our children continue to remain unprotected.

For everyone else, the common sense Revolution is now


Don’t mess with Marlboro Township.

The leafy, well-heeled New Jersey suburb will station a permanent armed cop in each of its nine schools starting Jan. 2.

It’s apparently the first district nationwide bent on packing heat in every schoolhouse since madman Adam Lanza gunned down 20 children and six adults at Sandy Hook Elementary in Newtown, Conn., on Dec. 14.

“We’ve made a collective decision as a town that we need armed security in each of our schools,” Mayor Jonathan Hornik told The Post.

“With this new evil, you can’t just sit there and hope that it doesn’t happen in your town. We must protect our kids.”

The mayor and other town officials had approved the initiative before the chief of the National Rifle Association ignited a firestorm on Friday by calling for armed guards for schools.

Besides putting a cop in each of its schools — one kindergarten, five elementary, two middle and one high school — Marlboro will consider fortifying entrances with steel doors and bulletproof glass and installing surveillance cameras “all over” to feed to the police department, Hornik said.

Cost won’t stand in the way of “state-of-the-art” safety, he added.

“This isn’t a luxury item. This is a necessity, based on what we saw happen in Connecticut,” said Hornik, a Democrat who supports an assault-weapons ban and stricter gun control.

The 40,000-resident Monmouth County town, home to many former Brooklynites and Staten Islanders, has taken groundbreaking safety measures before. In March 2001, it became one of the first towns in the nation to ban cellphone use while driving.

No other school districts in New York, New Jersey or Connecticut have decided to use guns to guard against an assault, officials said.

“If a district in New York state were to pursue that same solution — to bring armed police officers into the schools — we would support that decision,” said David Albert, spokesman for the New York School Boards Association.

But it won’t happen in New York City, said Department of Education spokeswoman Marge Feinberg, noting, “We are not considering having armed security officers in our buildings.”

The NYPD oversees 5,000 unarmed safety agents and staffs each city school with at least one. It also sends 350 armed cops to patrol and visit campuses — mostly junior and senior highs.

“On any given day, there are armed police officers assigned to schools. It’s not every school and not every day,” said NYPD spokesman Paul Browne.

He said the NYPD will step up efforts to detect danger signs, such as comments on public Web sites, to scope out potential killers.

Ed Massey, president of the National School Boards Association, said his home district in Boone County, Ky., took up arms in the late 1990s after Ryle HS junior Clay Shrout, 17, killed his mom, dad and two sisters, then used a handgun to hold his class hostage for hours. An assistant principal talked him into surrendering.

Each school or cluster of schools in the district has at least one armed cop on duty, and the community has embraced them, Massey said.

The cops “interact with students, respond to emergencies and deter bullying,” he said.

Despite an armed guard at Columbine HS, students Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold killed 15 and wounded 23 in their rampage in 1999. A sheriff’s officer outside the school exchanged fire with Harris but missed him.

Massey predicts others will follow Marlboro’s lead.

“This has rung an alarm bell in the boardroom of every school district in the nation,” he said.


http://www.nypost.com/p/news/local/jers ... uWbD62d51K
"I want you to remember that, to remind you to stay out of my way. In all the years to come, in all your most private moments, I want you to remember my hand at your throat. I want you to remember the one man who beat you."
User avatar
Major Phatscotty
SoC Training Adviser
 
Posts: 2439
Joined: Mon Dec 10, 2007 5:50 pm
Medals: 94
Standard Achievement (4) Doubles Achievement (3) Triples Achievement (3) Quadruples Achievement (4) Terminator Achievement (2)
Assassin Achievement (1) Manual Troops Achievement (4) Freestyle Achievement (2) Polymorphic Achievement (1) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (3)
Fog of War Achievement (4) Trench Warfare Achievement (3) Speed Achievement (3) Teammate Achievement (3) Random Map Achievement (2)
Cross-Map Achievement (3) Beta Map Achievement (2) Battle Royale Achievement (1) Ratings Achievement (4) Tournament Achievement (5)
General Achievement (2) Clan Achievement (10) Training Achievement (9) Challenge Achievement (1) Tournament Contribution (13)

Re: Repeal Gun Free School Zones!?

Postby stahrgazer on Wed Dec 26, 2012 6:15 pm

Phatscotty wrote:Stargahzer is doing an A+ job, even better than I can do. But Gaze doesn't have the rep that I do, so people do not constantly come at Gaze sideways with personal attacks either.

I don't think I have ever agreed with Gazer before, but it does give me comfort as I know there are a lot of pro-gun liberals out there who understand Freedom and Liberty. I had a liberal co-worker say to me a few months back "I might not agree with you on most of this stuff, but tell you what, if they come to take our guns, I will be standing right beside you"

Those are the real Liberals


I'm not really a Liberal, scotty, but that'll just have to be another thing we disagree on, since I did vote Obama over Romney.
Image
User avatar
Sergeant 1st Class stahrgazer
 
Posts: 1424
Joined: Thu May 22, 2008 11:59 am
Location: Figment of the Imagination...
Medals: 57
Standard Achievement (3) Doubles Achievement (3) Triples Achievement (3) Quadruples Achievement (3) Terminator Achievement (1)
Assassin Achievement (1) Manual Troops Achievement (1) Freestyle Achievement (1) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (4)
Trench Warfare Achievement (1) Speed Achievement (2) Teammate Achievement (2) Random Map Achievement (1) Cross-Map Achievement (3)
Bot Achievement (3) Ratings Achievement (3) Tournament Achievement (1) General Achievement (4) Clan Achievement (8)
Tournament Contribution (1) General Contribution (7)

Re: Repeal Gun Free School Zones!?

Postby Phatscotty on Wed Dec 26, 2012 6:21 pm

stahrgazer wrote:
Phatscotty wrote:Stargahzer is doing an A+ job, even better than I can do. But Gaze doesn't have the rep that I do, so people do not constantly come at Gaze sideways with personal attacks either.

I don't think I have ever agreed with Gazer before, but it does give me comfort as I know there are a lot of pro-gun liberals out there who understand Freedom and Liberty. I had a liberal co-worker say to me a few months back "I might not agree with you on most of this stuff, but tell you what, if they come to take our guns, I will be standing right beside you"

Those are the real Liberals


I'm not really a Liberal, scotty, but that'll just have to be another thing we disagree on, since I did vote Obama over Romney.


:o :o :o

and you admit that? OMG he just admitted it!
"I want you to remember that, to remind you to stay out of my way. In all the years to come, in all your most private moments, I want you to remember my hand at your throat. I want you to remember the one man who beat you."
User avatar
Major Phatscotty
SoC Training Adviser
 
Posts: 2439
Joined: Mon Dec 10, 2007 5:50 pm
Medals: 94
Standard Achievement (4) Doubles Achievement (3) Triples Achievement (3) Quadruples Achievement (4) Terminator Achievement (2)
Assassin Achievement (1) Manual Troops Achievement (4) Freestyle Achievement (2) Polymorphic Achievement (1) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (3)
Fog of War Achievement (4) Trench Warfare Achievement (3) Speed Achievement (3) Teammate Achievement (3) Random Map Achievement (2)
Cross-Map Achievement (3) Beta Map Achievement (2) Battle Royale Achievement (1) Ratings Achievement (4) Tournament Achievement (5)
General Achievement (2) Clan Achievement (10) Training Achievement (9) Challenge Achievement (1) Tournament Contribution (13)

Re: Repeal Gun Free School Zones!?

Postby stahrgazer on Wed Dec 26, 2012 6:25 pm

Symmetry wrote:Not at all, you've clarified none of your points, and made others murkier. The Fort Hood shooting does not indicate that anyone was "graduating" that day, certainly not the people who were targeted, although I do note that you're backing away from that claim with the quotation marks.


An extensive article on it I read last week at work spoke of graduating. If the article was wrong, so be it. My use of "Quotemarks" wasn't backing away from the claim. I think maybe it's your mind that's making things murky :lol:

Symmetry wrote:Clearly the base's civilian police were armed, as one of them shot him, which goes against your claim that only MP's were carrying firearms.


Not at all, the civilian officer wasn't assigned to the base but he responded when the shooting started.

Symmetry wrote:Furthermore, even a school not designated as a gun free zone can suffer mass shootings- Columbine notably had people with guns.
True.

Symmetry wrote:Finally, there really is no conclusive evidence that concealed carry laws decrease violence.

There is, albeit extensive studies have not been done.
Image
User avatar
Sergeant 1st Class stahrgazer
 
Posts: 1424
Joined: Thu May 22, 2008 11:59 am
Location: Figment of the Imagination...
Medals: 57
Standard Achievement (3) Doubles Achievement (3) Triples Achievement (3) Quadruples Achievement (3) Terminator Achievement (1)
Assassin Achievement (1) Manual Troops Achievement (1) Freestyle Achievement (1) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (4)
Trench Warfare Achievement (1) Speed Achievement (2) Teammate Achievement (2) Random Map Achievement (1) Cross-Map Achievement (3)
Bot Achievement (3) Ratings Achievement (3) Tournament Achievement (1) General Achievement (4) Clan Achievement (8)
Tournament Contribution (1) General Contribution (7)

Re: Repeal Gun Free School Zones!?

Postby General Brock II on Thu Dec 27, 2012 12:02 pm

crispybits wrote:These shooters know that within minutes of starting to shoot armed cops will turn up in ever increasing numbers.

How is it a deterrant that they might get shot maybe 5 minutes quicker than they would without the guns in the school buildings?


Are we talking deterrent or safety of the children? Those five minutes would save dozens of lives. Not only that, but the police have to penetrate the building, which takes time. The teacher or principal would be able to nail the shooter from the inside - possibly before he even really got started.

It's like this... One person has the gun, many people die. If everybody has a gun, only the assailant and victims of crossfire will die.

Keeping an armed guard? Talk about expensive and impractical. We see how well armed guards work... You have got to have at least five teachers authorized to utilize a firearm and equipped to do so in the case of emergency.
Image

We shall fight in France. We shall fight on the seas and oceans. We shall fight, with growing confidence and strength in the air. ~ Winston Churchill
User avatar
Major General Brock II
 
Posts: 614
Joined: Mon Aug 25, 2008 4:15 pm
Location: Tactical HQ Caravan, On Campaign
Medals: 59
Standard Achievement (3) Doubles Achievement (3) Triples Achievement (3) Quadruples Achievement (3) Terminator Achievement (1)
Assassin Achievement (1) Manual Troops Achievement (2) Freestyle Achievement (2) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (2) Fog of War Achievement (4)
Trench Warfare Achievement (1) Speed Achievement (2) Teammate Achievement (2) Random Map Achievement (2) Cross-Map Achievement (3)
Ratings Achievement (3) Tournament Achievement (5) General Achievement (6) Clan Achievement (11)

Re: Repeal Gun Free School Zones!?

Postby Woodruff on Thu Dec 27, 2012 2:26 pm

What has become clear is that we obviously need to station armed guards at all firestations, so that those armed guards can go out with firemen when they respond to calls. This is clearly necessary in order to ensure the safety of our firefighters.
...I prefer a man who will burn the flag and then wrap himself in the Constitution to a man who will burn the Constitution and then wrap himself in the flag.
User avatar
Corporal 1st Class Woodruff
 
Posts: 4974
Joined: Sat Jan 05, 2008 9:15 am
Medals: 27
Standard Achievement (4) Quadruples Achievement (1) Terminator Achievement (2) Manual Troops Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (3)
Speed Achievement (3) Teammate Achievement (1) Random Map Achievement (1) Cross-Map Achievement (3) Ratings Achievement (4)
Tournament Contribution (4)

Re: Repeal Gun Free School Zones!?

Postby Symmetry on Thu Dec 27, 2012 2:32 pm

Woodruff wrote:What has become clear is that we obviously need to station armed guards at all firestations, so that those armed guards can go out with firemen when they respond to calls. This is clearly necessary in order to ensure the safety of our firefighters.


That's ridiculous, we need an armed guard in front of all flammable houses and buildings, including fire stations.
User avatar
Sergeant 1st Class Symmetry
 
Posts: 1776
Joined: Sat Feb 24, 2007 5:49 am
Medals: 2
Standard Achievement (1) Triples Achievement (1)

Re: Repeal Gun Free School Zones!?

Postby Phatscotty on Thu Dec 27, 2012 3:45 pm

General Brock II wrote:
crispybits wrote:These shooters know that within minutes of starting to shoot armed cops will turn up in ever increasing numbers.

How is it a deterrant that they might get shot maybe 5 minutes quicker than they would without the guns in the school buildings?


Are we talking deterrent or safety of the children? Those five minutes would save dozens of lives. Not only that, but the police have to penetrate the building, which takes time. The teacher or principal would be able to nail the shooter from the inside - possibly before he even really got started.

It's like this... One person has the gun, many people die. If everybody has a gun, only the assailant and victims of crossfire will die.

Keeping an armed guard? Talk about expensive and impractical. We see how well armed guards work... You have got to have at least five teachers authorized to utilize a firearm and equipped to do so in the case of emergency.


I understand the cost issue. I have an idea to help with that. Let's relocate all the armed guards out of the social security offices and the welfare offices.

I think we can all agree our children, in their school, should be one of the safest places in the country.
"I want you to remember that, to remind you to stay out of my way. In all the years to come, in all your most private moments, I want you to remember my hand at your throat. I want you to remember the one man who beat you."
User avatar
Major Phatscotty
SoC Training Adviser
 
Posts: 2439
Joined: Mon Dec 10, 2007 5:50 pm
Medals: 94
Standard Achievement (4) Doubles Achievement (3) Triples Achievement (3) Quadruples Achievement (4) Terminator Achievement (2)
Assassin Achievement (1) Manual Troops Achievement (4) Freestyle Achievement (2) Polymorphic Achievement (1) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (3)
Fog of War Achievement (4) Trench Warfare Achievement (3) Speed Achievement (3) Teammate Achievement (3) Random Map Achievement (2)
Cross-Map Achievement (3) Beta Map Achievement (2) Battle Royale Achievement (1) Ratings Achievement (4) Tournament Achievement (5)
General Achievement (2) Clan Achievement (10) Training Achievement (9) Challenge Achievement (1) Tournament Contribution (13)

Re: Repeal Gun Free School Zones!?

Postby Symmetry on Thu Dec 27, 2012 4:29 pm

Phatscotty wrote:
General Brock II wrote:
crispybits wrote:These shooters know that within minutes of starting to shoot armed cops will turn up in ever increasing numbers.

How is it a deterrant that they might get shot maybe 5 minutes quicker than they would without the guns in the school buildings?


Are we talking deterrent or safety of the children? Those five minutes would save dozens of lives. Not only that, but the police have to penetrate the building, which takes time. The teacher or principal would be able to nail the shooter from the inside - possibly before he even really got started.

It's like this... One person has the gun, many people die. If everybody has a gun, only the assailant and victims of crossfire will die.

Keeping an armed guard? Talk about expensive and impractical. We see how well armed guards work... You have got to have at least five teachers authorized to utilize a firearm and equipped to do so in the case of emergency.


I understand the cost issue. I have an idea to help with that. Let's relocate all the armed guards out of the social security offices and the welfare offices.

I think we can all agree our children, in their school, should be one of the safest places in the country.


Indeed, if each and every child is guarded with any less protection than that afforded to a nuclear warhead, the country is failing.
User avatar
Sergeant 1st Class Symmetry
 
Posts: 1776
Joined: Sat Feb 24, 2007 5:49 am
Medals: 2
Standard Achievement (1) Triples Achievement (1)

Re: Repeal Gun Free School Zones!?

Postby Phatscotty on Thu Dec 27, 2012 4:30 pm

Symmetry wrote:
stahrgazer wrote:
Phatscotty wrote:
stahrgazer wrote:I like how the airlines do it. Pilots volunteer for an extensive program that, when completed, allows them to carry in the cockpit. Schools could, similarly, have teachers, administrators, etc., volunteer to complete a similar extensive training program to allow them to carry in the classroom.

"Who" is not publicly disclosed, so the potential is, any/all. Thus, schools are no longer totally defenseless, and maniac cowards might choose other targets.

Most assuredly, maniacs will always choose targets, and most assuredly, they'll find a way be it knives, guns, bombs, poison (remember Tylenol and other over-the-counter pill poisonings years back?) But at least kids in school would no longer be totally defenseless sitting ducks because the prof might be packing.


Sounds great! I fully back it!


After thinking about it, I'm not sure it'd work too well in a classroom. Kids these days are more and more violent in general. I wouldn't like to have a program like this in place to protect the kids who gang up on a "packing" professor, take his weapon, and use it against other kids in the classrooms or halls, but I'm sure it would happen if a program like this were instituted.

And what if we said "some principles" or "administrators" instead of some teachers? Well, the chance of kids getting to those arms is less, but would that fear-factor be enough to keep the maniacs at bay?

Then there are those who say, "hire more armed security/policemen to patrol the schools." Sounds great, right? Who wants double school real estate taxes to pay for this? Given the current "fiscal cliff" in the news about whether to raise taxes and reduce spending; raise taxes and not reduce spending; only reduce spending... seems pretty clear to me that no one really would wish to pay for this.

Maybe some parents could volunteer for a program where they get trained and registered and get to sit in their cars (locked) in front of the schools with their nearly-assault-but-not-quite-technically-assault-rifles ready to shoot any perp who'd come try to shoot the kids. Citizen patrol/neighborhood watch type. But wait, I live in Florida, where a citizen on neighborhood watch may or may not have illegally assaulted and killed someone who wasn't causing any trouble, out of fear he would, or racism (both arguments have been brought up about why he did it if it wasn't self-defense.) Trayvon Martin is the victim I'm referring to here, if you hadn't guessed.

There's no 100% solution.

But, signs, "gun free zone" really do make places like that targets for maniacal cowards who want to be violent and make the news.


I'm not sure that's the case. A person who enters a situation like this with the intent to die isn't going to be deterred by a sign, let alone one that says that it's not a place he'll be shot.


How do you know that?

I speculate it's highly likely the evil-doer will pick another location, possibly even just save us all the trouble and turn their weapon on themselves.
"I want you to remember that, to remind you to stay out of my way. In all the years to come, in all your most private moments, I want you to remember my hand at your throat. I want you to remember the one man who beat you."
User avatar
Major Phatscotty
SoC Training Adviser
 
Posts: 2439
Joined: Mon Dec 10, 2007 5:50 pm
Medals: 94
Standard Achievement (4) Doubles Achievement (3) Triples Achievement (3) Quadruples Achievement (4) Terminator Achievement (2)
Assassin Achievement (1) Manual Troops Achievement (4) Freestyle Achievement (2) Polymorphic Achievement (1) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (3)
Fog of War Achievement (4) Trench Warfare Achievement (3) Speed Achievement (3) Teammate Achievement (3) Random Map Achievement (2)
Cross-Map Achievement (3) Beta Map Achievement (2) Battle Royale Achievement (1) Ratings Achievement (4) Tournament Achievement (5)
General Achievement (2) Clan Achievement (10) Training Achievement (9) Challenge Achievement (1) Tournament Contribution (13)

Re: Repeal Gun Free School Zones!?

Postby Phatscotty on Thu Dec 27, 2012 4:32 pm

Symmetry wrote:
stahrgazer wrote:
Symmetry wrote:
stahrgazer wrote:
Symmetry wrote:
stahrgazer wrote:But, signs, "gun free zone" really do make places like that targets for maniacal cowards who want to be violent and make the news.

I'm not sure that's the case. A person who enters a situation like this with the intent to die isn't going to be deterred by a sign, let alone one that says that it's not a place he'll be shot.

One of the worst killing sprees in recent US history occurred at a military base- Fort Hood in 2009.


It's not the sign, it's the knowledge that they're sitting ducks. The Fort Hood shooting was a at a graduation ceremony, a time when the perp could be reasonably sure that most of the targets would not be well armed, so, again, "sitting ducks."


I'm pretty sure that a military base isn't a good target for "sitting ducks".

Could you restate your point? I don't know what you're saying about gun-free signs anymore.

stahrgazer wrote:But, signs, "gun free zone" really do make places like that targets for maniacal cowards who want to be violent and make the news.


stahrgazer wrote:It's not the sign, it's the knowledge that they're sitting ducks.


Are you saying they matter, or not?

You might also consider reading about the Fort Hood shooting for the "graduation ceremony" inaccuracy.


Maybe you should read about military bases. On most bases, only the MPs carry guns/ammo, the rest are usually locked away except when training is ongoing.

I did read about the Fort Hood shooting, An army psychologist with Muslim leanings didn't want to be deployed to the Middle East so "went postal." Some of the trainees were "graduating" the day he picked so it wasn't an inaccuracy, and since there was this ceremony going on there probably wasn't a lot of shooting training going on, so only a few MPs carrying to worry about at least until some damage was done.

To clarify my point about "gun free zones" - we all know what the "gun free zones" are, right? Areas where even those who have permits to carry concealed weapons, cannot legally bring them in. Thus, areas where there are likely to be no persons - or very few persons - shooting back. Thus, areas where there are a bunch of "sitting ducks," helpless in front of someone with the intention to do violence.

After 9/11 they instituted a program where pilots could volunteer to carry in the cockpit, so they have something to defend themselves, the passengers, the plane against folks intending to do violence with things like box cutters. It's a possible deterrent.

Few mass murders happen in police stations, because so many of them will be armed and the nutsoids know it, so they also know they cannot generate the fear they can where there's defenseless or nearly-defenseless "sitting ducks."

Get it now?


Not at all.


Gazer, meet Symmetry.
"I want you to remember that, to remind you to stay out of my way. In all the years to come, in all your most private moments, I want you to remember my hand at your throat. I want you to remember the one man who beat you."
User avatar
Major Phatscotty
SoC Training Adviser
 
Posts: 2439
Joined: Mon Dec 10, 2007 5:50 pm
Medals: 94
Standard Achievement (4) Doubles Achievement (3) Triples Achievement (3) Quadruples Achievement (4) Terminator Achievement (2)
Assassin Achievement (1) Manual Troops Achievement (4) Freestyle Achievement (2) Polymorphic Achievement (1) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (3)
Fog of War Achievement (4) Trench Warfare Achievement (3) Speed Achievement (3) Teammate Achievement (3) Random Map Achievement (2)
Cross-Map Achievement (3) Beta Map Achievement (2) Battle Royale Achievement (1) Ratings Achievement (4) Tournament Achievement (5)
General Achievement (2) Clan Achievement (10) Training Achievement (9) Challenge Achievement (1) Tournament Contribution (13)

Re: Repeal Gun Free School Zones!?

Postby Phatscotty on Thu Dec 27, 2012 4:34 pm

Question specifically for Player, or any other Americans.

Do you seriously trust this post-PatriotAct post-NDAA government tinkering with our rights?
"I want you to remember that, to remind you to stay out of my way. In all the years to come, in all your most private moments, I want you to remember my hand at your throat. I want you to remember the one man who beat you."
User avatar
Major Phatscotty
SoC Training Adviser
 
Posts: 2439
Joined: Mon Dec 10, 2007 5:50 pm
Medals: 94
Standard Achievement (4) Doubles Achievement (3) Triples Achievement (3) Quadruples Achievement (4) Terminator Achievement (2)
Assassin Achievement (1) Manual Troops Achievement (4) Freestyle Achievement (2) Polymorphic Achievement (1) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (3)
Fog of War Achievement (4) Trench Warfare Achievement (3) Speed Achievement (3) Teammate Achievement (3) Random Map Achievement (2)
Cross-Map Achievement (3) Beta Map Achievement (2) Battle Royale Achievement (1) Ratings Achievement (4) Tournament Achievement (5)
General Achievement (2) Clan Achievement (10) Training Achievement (9) Challenge Achievement (1) Tournament Contribution (13)

Re: Repeal Gun Free School Zones!?

Postby Symmetry on Thu Dec 27, 2012 4:39 pm

Phatscotty wrote:
Symmetry wrote:
stahrgazer wrote:But, signs, "gun free zone" really do make places like that targets for maniacal cowards who want to be violent and make the news.


I'm not sure that's the case. A person who enters a situation like this with the intent to die isn't going to be deterred by a sign, let alone one that says that it's not a place he'll be shot.


How do you know that?

I speculate it's highly likely the evil-doer will pick another location, possibly even just save us all the trouble and turn their weapon on themselves.


I've actually given you an article or two in the past about what constitutes a deterrent to suicide, suicidal thinkers tend to be very driven toward a single method. Especially those who chose something with a degree of spectacle. It's easily applied to a shooting spree where the shooter expects to die, and in many cases either is killed, or commits suicide.

Do you still have the NYTimes article I sent you about suicide? The findings it mentioned surprised me to be fair, as I said when I sent it to you, but the idea that a fixated individual will simply turn to something else doesn't pan out in the majority of cases.
User avatar
Sergeant 1st Class Symmetry
 
Posts: 1776
Joined: Sat Feb 24, 2007 5:49 am
Medals: 2
Standard Achievement (1) Triples Achievement (1)

PreviousNext

Return to Babble-On Five

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: patches70, riskllama

cron
Login