_sabotage_ wrote:Can you agree that everything comes from nothing?
Maybe, it comes from nothing, maybe the universe is an infinite cycle or maybe it's some other explanation that our monkey brains can't even begin to comprehend. I don't really know.
_sabotage_ wrote:If so, can you agree that inherent qualities in matter construct the world and we can reasonably decide that these are random or guided?
If so, what does the choice say about out interest? What does it say about our belief in a purpose?
The person who believes the universe is guided presumably believes there is some higher purpose whereas the person that believes it's random presumably believes there is no such purpose.
If you mean what's the interest in holding the belief, I don't think you can tease out a singular interest that justifies a belief from the web of culture, experience, chance, personality and so on that leads to us holding a certain belief. (i.e. even if you were to give me very strong incentive to believe in god, I could not force myself to do so, at best I could pretend to believe in god)
_sabotage_ wrote:
Reality, we can never define where we came from. If we say the big bang, it is no different from saying god, because you are saying that something was there. Where did this something come from, you are not saying. Reality is it will eventually come down to a choice, is it random, or is it guided. Do we just happen to be here because of the interrelation of matter which sprang from nothingness, or is the fact that matter has interrelation which has resulted in us some meaning. If, like me, you say it has meaning, then that meaning is god. There is no more grounding in taking one point than the other. Therefore there is no 100% that you mention, it will always be 50/50.
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God is everything. I'm part of everything. Each one of us is part of everything. Combined we all make up god.
Haggis_McMutton wrote:Are you a physicalist?
If not what else is encompassed in "everything" other than the physical universe?
If yes where does the soul and afterlife talk come from?
_sabotage_ wrote:Haggis_McMutton wrote:
All your post is just a story. You are telling a story about how belief in god is good for society, but you're not basing this on any facts or reasoned arguments, it's just a story. I can tell the exact opposite story from yours if you want, but it still won't be worth anything.
Shakespeare just wrote stories. He is quite well known, his critics aren't. Science is just a story. I have tried to post both sides of the story. I have tried to define my position through the sides and show where my conclusion comes from.
Shakespeare wasn't claiming to tell us how the universe works.
Science isn't a story, science relies on empiricism, replicable facts and logical deduction and induction.
If your whole story is that you wish to call the physical universe god and you wish to call molecular interactions "guided" in a way that is undetectable to us, then fine, I have nothing to argue.
You haven't explained where the soul and the afterlife come into the story though.