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Phatscotty wrote:It's indoctrination. I have went through the system myself. I cannot find a link on the internet that shows my experience where a teacher mentally bullies and brow-beats an entire class into political correctness. I can show you others
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Nobunaga wrote:Indoctrination, or the level of indoctrination, depends on the school. I don't believe there is any overt and clearly defined goal to indoctrinate students.
Nobunaga wrote: think it is the case where liberals found themselves in the majority at universities, and kept it that way. Being liberals, and generally superior people with their awesome degrees and titles, they see it as their responsibility to educate their students on the evils of capitalism, the free market, and America in general.
Also being liberals, they accept no counter argument to their ideology.
Nobunaga wrote:I honestly do not think it is a specific goal to indoctrinate. It just happens, a lot.
Having really ignorant, very low-information youth is part of the problem.
Phatscotty wrote:It's the norm today, in America, for schools to teach and train students to have anti-American values and indoctrinate them in political correctness.
Phatscotty wrote:Their aim is to teach students what to think, and not how to think.
Phatscotty wrote:So far I have showed you a lot of clips from the last couple weeks where teachers and schools are putting the entire student body through a bunch of extreme experiences concerning even the mention of the word gun, or biting a pop tart into a gun shape, or pointing a pencil at someone and saying "bang bang", or wearing a second amendment t-shirt. All of those children are learning to be scared of something that is their constitutional right. Those are all great examples of how fear is used to control.
Phatscotty wrote:But that's just a few examples of how they are terrifying students and mind-fucking them concerning the right to bear arms. But it goes beyond that, and every single American value is under attack in our education system, and the narrative in all cases is Leftism.
Phatscotty wrote:There is no tolerance for Christianity, but any other religion is protected and even promoted in our schools.
Phatscotty wrote:Even asking students to recite the American pledge came under attack and has been removed in a majority of schools.
Phatscotty wrote:But if an Islamic group of students wants to recite the pledge, and change the words to "under Allah", it's protected, and even promoted over the loud speaker so every person in the building is forced to hear it.
Phatscotty wrote:The majority of education system promotes anti-Americanism, in every way.
Phatscotty wrote:And I can't get over this weird feeling why I am asking these questions to someone who doesn't live in America and has zero experience in America's education system, and why I would.
Phatscotty wrote:And I will remind you I only threw common core out there as an example of how the education system is becoming more and more centralized, one size fits all. Concerning indoctrination, that's what would be expected.
Phatscotty wrote:BigBallinStalin wrote:So, since the national policy goals do not conform with PS' claims, perhaps he should move onto the policies and/or in particular the actions of educational boards within the States.
Texas is a good example (IIRC). Their board mandates Creationism to be taught in all public schools. Talk about indoctrination! (of course, to the Creationists, this isn't indoctrination... <cue ominous tune>).
So, since the national policy goals are 100% the truth and there is no way it's bullshit.....The reinvestment act Lootifer sourced can be anything you want it to be. It's pretty clear by now all it was was a fix to keep states spending money they still don't have in hopes we could ride out the Great Recession without making cuts. I don't see anything in those goals that address homosexuality. But homosexuality in the classroom is part of common core. Tell me, which of those goals does that topic fit into?
BBS, why do you take the national policy goals as gospel? Just because they say those are the goals....those are the goals? Is it at all possible, that even if the goals are not just the standard bullshit everyone has to say when requesting hundreds of billions of dollars to support? Really, all those goals say is "It's for the kids, and it's good" Were those not the goals of no child left behind? What happened? It didn't work? Oh, but they had goals....
Sure we can move to the goals of the states. Can we also move to the goals of the teachers unions?
thegreekdog wrote:are fiscally liberal (i.e. more spending, especially on teachers' salaries)
Nobunaga wrote:I think it is the case where liberals found themselves in the majority at universities, and kept it that way. Being liberals, and generally superior people with their awesome degrees and titles, they see it as their responsibility to educate their students on the evils of capitalism, the free market, and America in general.
Nobunaga wrote:Also being liberals, they accept no counter argument to their ideology.
Woodruff wrote:Nobunaga wrote:I think it is the case where liberals found themselves in the majority at universities, and kept it that way. Being liberals, and generally superior people with their awesome degrees and titles, they see it as their responsibility to educate their students on the evils of capitalism, the free market, and America in general.
Here's my thought on the idea of the majority of college professors being liberal (Phatscotty ignored it in the other thread):
That's probably because the more conservative-minded people focus on making money and the more liberal-minded people focus on degrees. And I don't mean either of those in a bad way (either could be bad). It simply follows along a conservative viewpoint that they would be more concerned with money, as money is a means of security (which is important to the conservative mind). That's not to say that a liberal person isn't going to want money or have it as a focus either (we're all individuals, after all), but it is generally true to be more of a focus of a conservative viewpoint. Whereas the idea of "elite education" is more of a draw for a liberal perspective.
So I really do think that is why collegiate faculty is more often liberal. I certainly don't think it's some sort of a conspiracy by the universities...that just seems dumb.
Woodruff wrote:Nobunaga wrote:Also being liberals, they accept no counter argument to their ideology.
This doesn't make sense to me. True liberals are very open-minded to other ideas.
Woodruff wrote:thegreekdog wrote:are fiscally liberal (i.e. more spending, especially on teachers' salaries)
Today I learned I am fiscally liberal. <evil smile>
Woodruff wrote:thegreekdog wrote:are fiscally liberal (i.e. more spending, especially on teachers' salaries)
Today I learned I am fiscally liberal. <evil smile>
thegreekdog wrote:Woodruff wrote:thegreekdog wrote:are fiscally liberal (i.e. more spending, especially on teachers' salaries)
Today I learned I am fiscally liberal. <evil smile>
To be fair to you, my teacher friends don't fit into the category of "well-informed." Although, to be fair to them, they seem to have picked the right issue to be informed about (teachers' salaries).
BigBallinStalin wrote:Woodruff wrote:thegreekdog wrote:are fiscally liberal (i.e. more spending, especially on teachers' salaries)
Today I learned I am fiscally liberal. <evil smile>
Haha, almost everyone is fiscally liberal when they realize that their coffers can be padded by others (through coercion)*.*such a dirty word! Shh, let's relax and dream of money from heaven.
I know you're mostly joking, but it's a seriously perverse incentive created and reinforced by democratic institutions.
PLAYER57832 wrote:BigBallinStalin wrote:Woodruff wrote:thegreekdog wrote:are fiscally liberal (i.e. more spending, especially on teachers' salaries)
Today I learned I am fiscally liberal. <evil smile>
Haha, almost everyone is fiscally liberal when they realize that their coffers can be padded by others (through coercion)*.*such a dirty word! Shh, let's relax and dream of money from heaven.
I know you're mostly joking, but it's a seriously perverse incentive created and reinforced by democratic institutions.
The same can very much be said for most conservatives. People want the system that they feel will most benefit them.
BigBallinStalin wrote:PLAYER57832 wrote:BigBallinStalin wrote:Woodruff wrote:thegreekdog wrote:are fiscally liberal (i.e. more spending, especially on teachers' salaries)
Today I learned I am fiscally liberal. <evil smile>
Haha, almost everyone is fiscally liberal when they realize that their coffers can be padded by others (through coercion)*.*such a dirty word! Shh, let's relax and dream of money from heaven.
I know you're mostly joking, but it's a seriously perverse incentive created and reinforced by democratic institutions.
The same can very much be said for most conservatives. People want the system that they feel will most benefit them.
It pretty much applies to nearly all voters--whether the profit is monetary (teacher salaries) or non-monetary (makes me feel good to have government transfer wealth from one group and give it to another).
PLAYER57832 wrote:BigBallinStalin wrote:PLAYER57832 wrote:BigBallinStalin wrote:Woodruff wrote:thegreekdog wrote:are fiscally liberal (i.e. more spending, especially on teachers' salaries)
Today I learned I am fiscally liberal. <evil smile>
Haha, almost everyone is fiscally liberal when they realize that their coffers can be padded by others (through coercion)*.*such a dirty word! Shh, let's relax and dream of money from heaven.
I know you're mostly joking, but it's a seriously perverse incentive created and reinforced by democratic institutions.
The same can very much be said for most conservatives. People want the system that they feel will most benefit them.
It pretty much applies to nearly all voters--whether the profit is monetary (teacher salaries) or non-monetary (makes me feel good to have government transfer wealth from one group and give it to another).
And therefore it is senseless to use it as a means of attacking one or the other system.
That said, there IS another set of motivations that actually do drive people. When folks truly are convinced of a common good that will supercede the personal.
During WWII, people really did save things to help support the war effort. Today, people really do donate millions to groups like the American Cancer society.
I would argue that this is the reason why so many people have vested so much in disuading folks from the reality of issues like global climate change... because if people learned and really believed they would act.
Nobunaga wrote:Indoctrination, or the level of indoctrination, depends on the school. I don't believe there is any overt and clearly defined goal to indoctrinate students.
I think it is the case where liberals found themselves in the majority at universities, and kept it that way. Being liberals, and generally superior people with their awesome degrees and titles, they see it as their responsibility to educate their students on the evils of capitalism, the free market, and America in general.
Also being liberals, they accept no counter argument to their ideology.
I honestly do not think it is a specific goal to indoctrinate. It just happens, a lot.
Having really ignorant, very low-information youth is part of the problem.
Public schools K - 12 is another story.
thegreekdog wrote:Woodruff wrote:thegreekdog wrote:are fiscally liberal (i.e. more spending, especially on teachers' salaries)
Today I learned I am fiscally liberal. <evil smile>
To be fair to you, my teacher friends don't fit into the category of "well-informed." Although, to be fair to them, they seem to have picked the right issue to be informed about (teachers' salaries).
BigBallinStalin wrote:Woodruff wrote:thegreekdog wrote:are fiscally liberal (i.e. more spending, especially on teachers' salaries)
Today I learned I am fiscally liberal. <evil smile>
Haha, almost everyone is fiscally liberal when they realize that their coffers can be padded by others (through coercion)*.
BigBallinStalin wrote:I know you're mostly joking, but it's a seriously perverse incentive created and reinforced by democratic institutions.
PLAYER57832 wrote:BigBallinStalin wrote:PLAYER57832 wrote:BigBallinStalin wrote:Woodruff wrote:thegreekdog wrote:are fiscally liberal (i.e. more spending, especially on teachers' salaries)
Today I learned I am fiscally liberal. <evil smile>
Haha, almost everyone is fiscally liberal when they realize that their coffers can be padded by others (through coercion)*.*such a dirty word! Shh, let's relax and dream of money from heaven.
I know you're mostly joking, but it's a seriously perverse incentive created and reinforced by democratic institutions.
The same can very much be said for most conservatives. People want the system that they feel will most benefit them.
It pretty much applies to nearly all voters--whether the profit is monetary (teacher salaries) or non-monetary (makes me feel good to have government transfer wealth from one group and give it to another).
And therefore it is senseless to use it as a means of attacking one or the other system.
PLAYER57832 wrote:That said, there IS another set of motivations that actually do drive people. When folks truly are convinced of a common good that will supercede the personal.
During WWII, people really did save things to help support the war effort. Today, people really do donate millions to groups like the American Cancer society.
I would argue that this is the reason why so many people have vested so much in disuading folks from the reality of issues like global climate change... because if people learned and really believed they would act.
Woodruff wrote:PLAYER57832 wrote:BigBallinStalin wrote:It pretty much applies to nearly all voters--whether the profit is monetary (teacher salaries) or non-monetary (makes me feel good to have government transfer wealth from one group and give it to another).
And therefore it is senseless to use it as a means of attacking one or the other system.
I don't believe BBS was attacking anything. He was simply making a valid point.
BigBallinStalin wrote:PLAYER57832 wrote:That said, there IS another set of motivations that actually do drive people. When folks truly are convinced of a common good that will supercede the personal.
During WWII, people really did save things to help support the war effort. Today, people really do donate millions to groups like the American Cancer society.
I would argue that this is the reason why so many people have vested so much in disuading folks from the reality of issues like global climate change... because if people learned and really believed they would act.
While that is true, there was still a personal incentive for most people. Concerning the war effort, it was obviously in everyone's interest here in the United States that the Nazis not be allowed to rule the world. And I would suggest that the vast majority of folks who donate to things like the American Cancer society do so because they know someone who has that particular disease/situation or they fear they may contract it.
Also, BBS kind of covered that with the "it makes me feel good" aspect as well.
PLAYER57832 wrote:... Too bad, you have not been educated enough to really understand that hatred of disputing ideas is not a substitute for thought.
Lootifer wrote:Nobunaga wrote:Indoctrination, or the level of indoctrination, depends on the school. I don't believe there is any overt and clearly defined goal to indoctrinate students.
I think it is the case where liberals found themselves in the majority at universities, and kept it that way. Being liberals, and generally superior people with their awesome degrees and titles, they see it as their responsibility to educate their students on the evils of capitalism, the free market, and America in general.
Also being liberals, they accept no counter argument to their ideology.
I honestly do not think it is a specific goal to indoctrinate. It just happens, a lot.
Having really ignorant, very low-information youth is part of the problem.
Public schools K - 12 is another story.
I value you as one of the smarter Conservatives on this forum Nobunga, but this post dissapoints me.
Take the high road dude. We have pleanty of others covering the liberals-are-evil-and-want-to-brain-wash-your-children mentality.
(if you want a serious response: as Woodruff mentions the underlined bit of your quote is in direct contrast to actual liberal idealogy, that is the whole point of being a liberal is to be open to everyones ideas - dont let people like Professor Bradley (PS posted a clip of him in the other thread, the eco-facist guy) fly the flag for us liberals, you wouldnt let the KKK be a adequate generalisation for Conservatives would you?)
Nobunaga wrote:PLAYER57832 wrote:... Too bad, you have not been educated enough to really understand that hatred of disputing ideas is not a substitute for thought.
Typical, personal attack in lieu of argument. The classic liberal deflection.
I have no hatred for disputing ideas, only for the blind faith put in those ideas by people with very selective awareness.
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