Conquer Club

Do people actually have the illusion that this is not indoctrination of the basest kind?

Does this still happen in most countries?(I know I had to do it when growing up, but dunno if the practice is still current).
Do you think it should happen? I'm genuinely curious.

Also:

One of my relatives that lives out in the Northwest recently mentioned to me that...
Article, April 22, 2013:

Members of the Oregon House expressed a variety of views on the pledge of allegiance but wound up voting emphatically to require schools to offer its daily recitation
...
House Bill 3014 requires flags in all public and public charter school classrooms, and requires the schools to offer a daily recitation of the pledge for all students. The bill doesn't make it mandatory for students to stand or recite the pledge, but some lawmakers cautioned that students who don't join in would be stigmatized.

--Andy

Never required to do it, but no one gave any mind if you did.

O' Canada is sung in my kids' schools. Someone doesn't want to listen to it, they go in the hall way. Though to be honest, this happens very rarely, if at all in their schools.

I never did it but I don't really care. The Government's job is to brainwash kids; I can't do shit about it.

I remember sometime between grades 5-8, I stopped saying the pledge when we started class in the morning. I think I did it to 'rebel.' I'd still stand, but I'd put my hands behind my back I think.


--Andy

There has been no great war that makes people want to. 7,000 does not count.

Haggis_McMutton wrote:Do people actually have the illusion that this is not indoctrination of the basest kind?

This was just made law here in Nebraska this year. THIS is indoctrination, but I somehow suspect this isn't what Phatscotty is referring to when he complains about indoctrination by our schools.

Haggis_McMutton wrote:Does this still happen in most countries?(I know I had to do it when growing up, but dunno if the practice is still current). Do you think it should happen? I'm genuinely curious.

I'm a patriotic guy. I do think the United States is a great country. If there was something to gain from it, I might be in favor. However, required reciting of the Pledge of Allegience doesn't actually accomplish anything. The kids don't pay ANY attention to the words they're saying...they're just repeating them. Heck, I even find myself just going through the motions sometimes, so I KNOW they are. There is no gain to it. None. So what's the point?

Woodruff wrote: None. So what's the point?

--Andy

I like it. It's a positive kind of indoctrination. Better than most of the shit we're being indoctrinated with everyday.

Woodruff wrote:The kids don't pay ANY attention to the words they're saying...they're just repeating them.

That's the truth right there. I was taught the Pledge of Allegiance when I was in Kindergarten. I had no idea what "indivisible", "republic", or "allegiance" meant. I had a very loose grasp on what exactly America stood for in general. It accomplishes nothing outside of making kids look like creepy, chanting cultists for 15 seconds.

Gillipig wrote:I like it. It's a positive kind of indoctrination. Better than most of the shit we're being indoctrinated with everyday.

What is positive about it? If they're not paying any attention to the words anyway, they're really NOT being indoctrinated. Essentially, it is a waste of a teacher's classroom time. Which they have little enough of as it is. Which means they're less effective. Which is what Phatscotty complains about.

So I would suggest to you that the Pledge of Allegience is actually a DETRIMENT, not a positive.

Gillipig wrote:Better than most of the shit we're being indoctrinated with everyday.

Such as?

Bones2484 wrote:

Gillipig wrote:Better than most of the shit we're being indoctrinated with everyday.

Such as?

You really can't think of any!? Wow, I don't think I want to waste any time discussing it with you if you need to ask me that. Watch the news, that should give you a taste of indoctrination.

I'm not sure I understand the problem. Just move to a country you like enough to want your kids to sing a song about. Or conversely there are probably countries in Africa or South America with less school. You could teach them just the things you feel like.

The Pledge of Allegiance is better than the Obama-worship songs some schools have done.

Night Strike wrote:The Pledge of Allegiance is better than the Obama-worship songs some schools have done.

Hellz yeah, bro!


--Andy

Night Strike wrote:The Pledge of Allegiance is better than the Obama-worship songs some schools have done.

Even if I could write my own custom indoctrination song/chant for all the kids to repeat in school, I wouldn't be interested. We shouldn't be actively engaging in propaganda.

Frigidus wrote:

Night Strike wrote:The Pledge of Allegiance is better than the Obama-worship songs some schools have done.

Even if I could write my own custom indoctrination song/chant for all the kids to repeat in school, I wouldn't be interested. We shouldn't be actively engaging in propaganda.

terrorist

Gillipig wrote:

Bones2484 wrote:

Gillipig wrote:Better than most of the shit we're being indoctrinated with everyday.

Such as?

You really can't think of any!? Wow, I don't think I want to waste any time discussing it with you if you need to ask me that. Watch the news, that should give you a taste of indoctrination.

I don't know about you, but I find it best to question and examine news sources before making up my mind. There are multiple outlets reporting on widely differing sides that you can pick from. We aren't being "indoctrinated" towards one news source in America by any stretch of the imagination.

Now if your answer was "religion", you might have an argument.

When I was at school in the US I just stood up during the pledge without speaking.

Here's some trivia - before the Nazi Party was formed, the U.S. civil salute was also the Roman salute of the outstretched arm -



After the U.S. entered WWII they changed their civil salute to be a subdued version of the crossed chest salute used by Mexico.





Someone try to top that for trivia.

When I was in elementary school it was compulsory. I used to get in trouble all the time because I'd either not do it or some of us would make up a mockery pledge.

Frankly, I find the idea of making children repeat a pledge repellant.

-TG

TA1LGUNN3R wrote:When I was in elementary school it was compulsory. I used to get in trouble all the time because I'd either not do it or some of us would make up a mockery pledge.

Frankly, I find the idea of making children repeat a pledge repellant.

-TG

And then you became an anarchist. It's all falling into place....

Gillipig wrote:

Bones2484 wrote:

Gillipig wrote:Better than most of the shit we're being indoctrinated with everyday.

Such as?

You really can't think of any!? Wow, I don't think I want to waste any time discussing it with you if you need to ask me that. Watch the news, that should give you a taste of indoctrination.

It appears to me that you're the one who couldn't think of any...