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Refusing to bake a cake for a gay wedding.

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Are you or have you personally spoke to someone who would refuse to bake a gay wedding cake?

Yes
6
27%
No
16
73%
 
Total votes : 22

Re: Refusing to bake a cake for a gay wedding.

Postby Thorthoth on Fri Oct 13, 2017 12:41 am

Symmetry wrote:
2dimes wrote:I don't know if "in mind" would be accurate. I tend to remember when I come back here.


Fair enough, 2D. I mostly don't remember what he's having a tantrum about either. Figuring out what he's angry about is difficult.

I'm not angry, I'm invigorated by declaring the correct viewpoint in these otherwise lame forum debates.
On the other hand, it is you Symbo, who is seething with ill-concealed passive-aggressive rage.
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Re: Refusing to bake a cake for a gay wedding.

Postby mrswdk on Fri Oct 13, 2017 1:55 am

Dukasaur wrote:After a colour change, smart editors always allow a line of white space for the eye to reset before resuming text.


After a TT post, smart CCers allow their eyes to hibernate.
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Re: Refusing to bake a cake for a gay wedding.

Postby Symmetry on Fri Oct 13, 2017 11:45 pm

Thorthoth wrote:
Symmetry wrote:
2dimes wrote:I don't know if "in mind" would be accurate. I tend to remember when I come back here.


Fair enough, 2D. I mostly don't remember what he's having a tantrum about either. Figuring out what he's angry about is difficult.

I'm not angry, I'm invigorated by declaring the correct viewpoint in these otherwise lame forum debates.
On the other hand, it is you Symbo, who is seething with ill-concealed passive-aggressive rage.


You do kinda come across as a bit angry with your posts. One of your tells is that you get kinda wordy when you're upset.
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Re: Refusing to bake a cake for a gay wedding.

Postby Woodruff on Tue Oct 17, 2017 3:26 am

Symmetry wrote:I've read and argued for and against this. I guess for me the issues divide into-

1) Is this really a religious issue? Plenty of religious folks follow the same faith without it being an issue, after all. It's not a key tenet.
2) Is it a political issue? Are they arguing that it's a political opinion that they oppose, however offensive?

With 1, I'm wary of people who mask bigotry under the cloak of religion. I doubt they'd be happy to bake a gay wedding cake if they had some sort of crisis of faith, and likewise, I doubt that baking a gay wedding cake would be something that broke their faith.

With 2- I have more sympathy. I don't agree with their opinion, but it is a political stance.


Regarding #2...blacks drinking at their own water fountain was a political stance as well...
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Re: Refusing to bake a cake for a gay wedding.

Postby mrswdk on Tue Oct 17, 2017 3:35 am

One they quite rightly got arrested for. Can't break the law just because you disagree with it.
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Re: Refusing to bake a cake for a gay wedding.

Postby Thorthoth on Tue Oct 17, 2017 3:03 pm

mrswdk wrote:One they quite rightly got arrested for. Can't break the law just because you disagree with it.

Just so stupid, swdk...
Who makes the 'law' determines who breaks the 'law'.
Of course, in the real world it's all just enforcement anyway.
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Re: Refusing to bake a cake for a gay wedding.

Postby mrswdk on Tue Oct 17, 2017 4:08 pm

Thorthoth wrote:
mrswdk wrote:One they quite rightly got arrested for. Can't break the law just because you disagree with it.

Image
betiko wrote:When exactly has china not been the king of the world?

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Re: Refusing to bake a cake for a gay wedding.

Postby Thorthoth on Tue Oct 17, 2017 5:41 pm

mrswdk wrote:
Thorthoth wrote:
mrswdk wrote:One they quite rightly got arrested for. Can't break the law just because you disagree with it.

Image

All the tea in China?
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Re: Refusing to bake a cake for a gay wedding.

Postby Woodruff on Sat Oct 21, 2017 12:43 am

mrswdk wrote:One they quite rightly got arrested for. Can't break the law just because you disagree with it.


All of the dictators in the world love your perspective.
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Re: Refusing to bake a cake for a gay wedding.

Postby mrswdk on Sat Oct 21, 2017 3:29 pm

Yeah, those darned dictators. What kind of whack job both creates a law and consistently enforces it?

show
betiko wrote:When exactly has china not been the king of the world?

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Re: Refusing to bake a cake for a gay wedding.

Postby Dukasaur on Sat Oct 21, 2017 3:30 pm

mrswdk wrote:Yeah, those darned dictators. What kind of whack job both creates a law and consistently enforces it?

show


Yup.
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Postby 2dimes on Sun Oct 22, 2017 6:52 am

saxitoxin pretty much won the forum with this and should post the celebratory dancing bear gif again.


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Re: Refusing to bake a cake for a gay wedding.

Postby Symmetry on Sun Oct 29, 2017 6:04 pm

Woodruff wrote:
Symmetry wrote:I've read and argued for and against this. I guess for me the issues divide into-

1) Is this really a religious issue? Plenty of religious folks follow the same faith without it being an issue, after all. It's not a key tenet.
2) Is it a political issue? Are they arguing that it's a political opinion that they oppose, however offensive?

With 1, I'm wary of people who mask bigotry under the cloak of religion. I doubt they'd be happy to bake a gay wedding cake if they had some sort of crisis of faith, and likewise, I doubt that baking a gay wedding cake would be something that broke their faith.

With 2- I have more sympathy. I don't agree with their opinion, but it is a political stance.


Regarding #2...blacks drinking at their own water fountain was a political stance as well...


I don't agree with it, I just have more sympathy with the way the argument is framed. For me, the difference between this and the "water-fountain" would be that there is no definitive segregation. If they're willing to make cakes for gay folk, but not for gay weddings, then that's a political issue.

If they won't make cakes for gay people at all, then I think you've got a fair comparison with water fountains.
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Re: Refusing to bake a cake for a gay wedding.

Postby mrswdk on Sun Oct 29, 2017 6:24 pm

So you support a baker’s right to discriminate against gay people through their actions, but you don’t support CCers’ right to discriminate against gay people through their words?

You've spun yourself into quite a web here.
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Re: Refusing to bake a cake for a gay wedding.

Postby Symmetry on Sun Oct 29, 2017 6:35 pm

mrswdk wrote:So you support a baker’s right to discriminate against gay people through their actions, but you don’t support CCers’ right to discriminate against gay people through their words?

You've spun yourself into quite a web here.


Not really mate, try reading the posts you're afraid of quoting directly.
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Re: Refusing to bake a cake for a gay wedding.

Postby Woodruff on Fri Nov 03, 2017 9:16 pm

Symmetry wrote:
Woodruff wrote:
Symmetry wrote:I've read and argued for and against this. I guess for me the issues divide into-

1) Is this really a religious issue? Plenty of religious folks follow the same faith without it being an issue, after all. It's not a key tenet.
2) Is it a political issue? Are they arguing that it's a political opinion that they oppose, however offensive?

With 1, I'm wary of people who mask bigotry under the cloak of religion. I doubt they'd be happy to bake a gay wedding cake if they had some sort of crisis of faith, and likewise, I doubt that baking a gay wedding cake would be something that broke their faith.

With 2- I have more sympathy. I don't agree with their opinion, but it is a political stance.


Regarding #2...blacks drinking at their own water fountain was a political stance as well...


I don't agree with it, I just have more sympathy with the way the argument is framed. For me, the difference between this and the "water-fountain" would be that there is no definitive segregation. If they're willing to make cakes for gay folk, but not for gay weddings, then that's a political issue.

If they won't make cakes for gay people at all, then I think you've got a fair comparison with water fountains.


Except in some areas, the service provider may be the only one available. What then? For example, should some ISP decide that
they're not going to serve homosexuals, and that ISP is the only one in the area. Still not problematic for you? What if it's a grocery
store instead of an ISP?
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Re: Refusing to bake a cake for a gay wedding.

Postby Symmetry on Fri Nov 03, 2017 9:28 pm

Woodruff wrote:
Symmetry wrote:
Woodruff wrote:
Symmetry wrote:I've read and argued for and against this. I guess for me the issues divide into-

1) Is this really a religious issue? Plenty of religious folks follow the same faith without it being an issue, after all. It's not a key tenet.
2) Is it a political issue? Are they arguing that it's a political opinion that they oppose, however offensive?

With 1, I'm wary of people who mask bigotry under the cloak of religion. I doubt they'd be happy to bake a gay wedding cake if they had some sort of crisis of faith, and likewise, I doubt that baking a gay wedding cake would be something that broke their faith.

With 2- I have more sympathy. I don't agree with their opinion, but it is a political stance.


Regarding #2...blacks drinking at their own water fountain was a political stance as well...


I don't agree with it, I just have more sympathy with the way the argument is framed. For me, the difference between this and the "water-fountain" would be that there is no definitive segregation. If they're willing to make cakes for gay folk, but not for gay weddings, then that's a political issue.

If they won't make cakes for gay people at all, then I think you've got a fair comparison with water fountains.

n
Except in some areas, the service provider may be the only one available. What then? For example, should some ISP decide that
they're not going to serve homosexuals, and that ISP is the only one in the area. Still not problematic for you? What if it's a grocery
store instead of an ISP?


It's still problematic, but I probably need to reiterate my point for you. You used an example of a business that would refuse to serve homosexuals. I oppose that. Making cakes for gay weddings? I'm inclined to think it's a political issue.
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Re: Refusing to bake a cake for a gay wedding.

Postby Woodruff on Fri Nov 03, 2017 9:32 pm

Symmetry wrote:
Woodruff wrote:
Symmetry wrote:
Woodruff wrote:
Symmetry wrote:I've read and argued for and against this. I guess for me the issues divide into-

1) Is this really a religious issue? Plenty of religious folks follow the same faith without it being an issue, after all. It's not a key tenet.
2) Is it a political issue? Are they arguing that it's a political opinion that they oppose, however offensive?

With 1, I'm wary of people who mask bigotry under the cloak of religion. I doubt they'd be happy to bake a gay wedding cake if they had some sort of crisis of faith, and likewise, I doubt that baking a gay wedding cake would be something that broke their faith.

With 2- I have more sympathy. I don't agree with their opinion, but it is a political stance.


Regarding #2...blacks drinking at their own water fountain was a political stance as well...


I don't agree with it, I just have more sympathy with the way the argument is framed. For me, the difference between this and the "water-fountain" would be that there is no definitive segregation. If they're willing to make cakes for gay folk, but not for gay weddings, then that's a political issue.

If they won't make cakes for gay people at all, then I think you've got a fair comparison with water fountains.

n
Except in some areas, the service provider may be the only one available. What then? For example, should some ISP decide that
they're not going to serve homosexuals, and that ISP is the only one in the area. Still not problematic for you? What if it's a grocery
store instead of an ISP?


It's still problematic, but I probably need to reiterate my point for you. You used an example of a business that would refuse to serve homosexuals. I oppose that. Making cakes for gay weddings? I'm inclined to think it's a political issue.


Refusing to make a cake for a gay wedding isn't refusing to serve homosexuals?
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Re: Refusing to bake a cake for a gay wedding.

Postby Symmetry on Fri Nov 03, 2017 9:52 pm

Woodruff wrote:
Symmetry wrote:
Woodruff wrote:
Symmetry wrote:
Woodruff wrote:
Symmetry wrote:I've read and argued for and against this. I guess for me the issues divide into-

1) Is this really a religious issue? Plenty of religious folks follow the same faith without it being an issue, after all. It's not a key tenet.
2) Is it a political issue? Are they arguing that it's a political opinion that they oppose, however offensive?

With 1, I'm wary of people who mask bigotry under the cloak of religion. I doubt they'd be happy to bake a gay wedding cake if they had some sort of crisis of faith, and likewise, I doubt that baking a gay wedding cake would be something that broke their faith.

With 2- I have more sympathy. I don't agree with their opinion, but it is a political stance.


Regarding #2...blacks drinking at their own water fountain was a political stance as well...


I don't agree with it, I just have more sympathy with the way the argument is framed. For me, the difference between this and the "water-fountain" would be that there is no definitive segregation. If they're willing to make cakes for gay folk, but not for gay weddings, then that's a political issue.

If they won't make cakes for gay people at all, then I think you've got a fair comparison with water fountains.

n
Except in some areas, the service provider may be the only one available. What then? For example, should some ISP decide that
they're not going to serve homosexuals, and that ISP is the only one in the area. Still not problematic for you? What if it's a grocery
store instead of an ISP?


It's still problematic, but I probably need to reiterate my point for you. You used an example of a business that would refuse to serve homosexuals. I oppose that. Making cakes for gay weddings? I'm inclined to think it's a political issue.


Refusing to make a cake for a gay wedding isn't refusing to serve homosexuals?


Not exactly, no. It's refusing to make a cake about a political issue. If they refused to make any cake for gay people, then that's clear cut discrimination.
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Re: Refusing to bake a cake for a gay wedding.

Postby DoomYoshi on Fri Nov 03, 2017 11:05 pm

Almost everyone agrees that PC actually stands for "partially coherent".

https://www.cato.org/survey-reports/state-free-speech-tolerance-america
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Re: Refusing to bake a cake for a gay wedding.

Postby Thorthoth on Sat Nov 04, 2017 12:23 am

Symmetry wrote:Not exactly, no. It's refusing to make a cake about a political issue. If they refused to make any cake for gay people, then that's clear cut discrimination.

So what? Stop implying a pejorative. We all discriminate constantly. It's the intelligent thing to do. If anything it is lack of discrimination that should be more often censured. Your manipulative and self-serving idiocy must be constantly corrected, Sym.
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Re: The poodle is looking right at you.

Postby betiko on Sat Nov 04, 2017 8:08 pm

2dimes wrote:saxitoxin pretty much won the forum with this and should post the celebratory dancing bear gif again.


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Did he actually add the poodle? If so, is that a gay cake thing?
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Re: Refusing to bake a cake for a gay wedding.

Postby 2dimes on Sat Nov 04, 2017 8:20 pm

Nah, that's Joe Smith's poodle. They were really popular in the 1800s in Illinois.
Want to go for a rip on my Jackwagon?
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Re: Refusing to bake a cake for a gay wedding.

Postby Symmetry on Sun Nov 05, 2017 3:55 pm

Thorthoth wrote:
Symmetry wrote:Not exactly, no. It's refusing to make a cake about a political issue. If they refused to make any cake for gay people, then that's clear cut discrimination.

So what? Stop implying a pejorative. We all discriminate constantly. It's the intelligent thing to do. If anything it is lack of discrimination that should be more often censured. Your manipulative and self-serving idiocy must be constantly corrected, Sym.


Your dislike of me has once again buried your reason. I have no idea what point you're trying to make beyond being basically bitchy.

If my reading is correct, however, and you're conflating two definitions of the word "discriminate" as if they are the same, then that might well have been the most banal insult I've ever received. If so, congrats, I guess.
the world is in greater peril from those who tolerate or encourage evil than from those who actually commit it- Albert Einstein
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Re: Refusing to bake a cake for a gay wedding.

Postby DoomYoshi on Sun Nov 05, 2017 7:32 pm

Symmetry wrote:
Thorthoth wrote:
Symmetry wrote:Not exactly, no. It's refusing to make a cake about a political issue. If they refused to make any cake for gay people, then that's clear cut discrimination.

So what? Stop implying a pejorative. We all discriminate constantly. It's the intelligent thing to do. If anything it is lack of discrimination that should be more often censured. Your manipulative and self-serving idiocy must be constantly corrected, Sym.


Your dislike of me has once again buried your reason. I have no idea what point you're trying to make beyond being basically bitchy.

If my reading is correct, however, and you're conflating two definitions of the word "discriminate" as if they are the same, then that might well have been the most banal insult I've ever received. If so, congrats, I guess.


They are the same. We've already had this discussion. I discriminate against hot stoves and don't touch them.
Hilary Clinton wrote:Deep breath. Feel the air fill my lungs
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