ObamaCare - "Give up your phone to get it!!!"

\\OFF-TOPIC// conversations about everything that has nothing to do with Conquer Club.

Moderators: Global Moderators, Community Team

Forum rules
Please read the Community Guidelines before posting.

Re: Liberty VS ObamaCare: Back to Supreme Court

Postby jj3044 on Thu Nov 29, 2012 9:18 pm

Phatscotty wrote:
jj3044 wrote:
Phatscotty wrote:
jj3044 wrote:
Phatscotty wrote:ummmmmmm, unemployment and medicare?

there is currently a battle over planned parent hood funding, as well as tax-payer subsidized contraceptives and abortions on demand.

What's wrong with "if you want it, then you go get it" Not like anyone is trying to tell another what to do or what not to do.....pretty simple

Yes... if you never use unemployment, should you pay for the "freeloaders"?

Same thought process with medicare, although I admit it is a weaker example as most people will be on medicare assuming they make it to the appropriate age.

My point is that there probably aren't ANY government-funded programs that at least one person couldn't go say "I'll never use that service, so I'm not paying that percentage of my taxes!".

So... where does it end?


I have no idea what you are talking about

The thesis of your main point is basically that if you don't use it, you don't want to have to pay for it. My point is that if you are complaining about paying for some programs that you don't/won't use, then you have to complain about EVERY program, including ones like unemployment and Medicare.


we're talking about the picture right? The point of the picture is the hypocrisy of those who say "keep your government out of my uterus" but then demand government intervention into their birth control and contraceptive use and abortions.


No, I'm talking about your main point:

Phatscotty wrote:pretty sure you have completely forgotten to factor in the entire premise......FORCING someone else to pay for your contraception or abortion, to be specific.

It's about how tax dollars are spent, it has nothing to do with your privacy.


And back to my point... I may never use unemployment, so why should I pay?

Get it?
Image
User avatar
Brigadier jj3044
 
Posts: 515
Joined: Tue Jun 12, 2007 10:22 pm
Medals: 73
Standard Achievement (3) Doubles Achievement (3) Triples Achievement (3) Quadruples Achievement (3) Terminator Achievement (2)
Assassin Achievement (1) Manual Troops Achievement (1) Freestyle Achievement (1) Polymorphic Achievement (1) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (2)
Fog of War Achievement (4) Trench Warfare Achievement (2) Speed Achievement (2) Teammate Achievement (2) Random Map Achievement (2)
Cross-Map Achievement (3) Beta Map Achievement (1) Battle Royale Achievement (1) Ratings Achievement (4) Tournament Achievement (1)
General Achievement (6) Clan Achievement (25)

Re: Liberty VS ObamaCare: Back to Supreme Court

Postby Phatscotty on Thu Nov 29, 2012 10:00 pm

Nope. I didn't say that because I don't use birth control...

Put simply, taxpayer dollars should not go to fund abortions or contraceptives
"I want you to remember that, to remind you to stay out of my way. In all the years to come, in all your most private moments, I want you to remember my hand at your throat. I want you to remember the one man who beat you."
User avatar
Major Phatscotty
SoC Training Adviser
 
Posts: 2353
Joined: Mon Dec 10, 2007 5:50 pm
Medals: 94
Standard Achievement (4) Doubles Achievement (3) Triples Achievement (3) Quadruples Achievement (4) Terminator Achievement (2)
Assassin Achievement (1) Manual Troops Achievement (4) Freestyle Achievement (2) Polymorphic Achievement (1) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (3)
Fog of War Achievement (4) Trench Warfare Achievement (3) Speed Achievement (3) Teammate Achievement (3) Random Map Achievement (2)
Cross-Map Achievement (3) Beta Map Achievement (2) Battle Royale Achievement (1) Ratings Achievement (4) Tournament Achievement (5)
General Achievement (2) Clan Achievement (10) Training Achievement (9) Challenge Achievement (1) Tournament Contribution (13)

Re: Liberty VS ObamaCare: Back to Supreme Court

Postby Iliad on Thu Nov 29, 2012 11:58 pm

Phatscotty wrote:Nope. I didn't say that because I don't use birth control...

Put simply, taxpayer dollars should not go to fund abortions or contraceptives

You still didn't get it. Please try and actually engage the other side.


Scotty, you'll never go to school again. Yet, you as a taxpayer are forced to fund the education of other children. Don't see you frothing at the mouth about that program. Or literally every other program, just because you don't agree to a war doesn't mean you can just deduct that from your tax. Programs doesn't have to directly affect you for it to be beneficial, and that's such a selfish, blinkered and narrow minded perspective.As Medefe and other repeatedly pointed out increasing the access to contraceptives is beneficial and cost-saving to the entire community.



This is as much about Victorian prudishness and attitude to sex as it is about perceived government spending.
User avatar
Private 1st Class Iliad
 
Posts: 10439
Joined: Mon Mar 05, 2007 12:48 am
Medals: 1
Standard Achievement (1)

Re: Liberty VS ObamaCare: Back to Supreme Court

Postby Night Strike on Fri Nov 30, 2012 10:54 am

Iliad wrote:
Phatscotty wrote:Nope. I didn't say that because I don't use birth control...

Put simply, taxpayer dollars should not go to fund abortions or contraceptives

You still didn't get it. Please try and actually engage the other side.


Scotty, you'll never go to school again. Yet, you as a taxpayer are forced to fund the education of other children. Don't see you frothing at the mouth about that program. Or literally every other program, just because you don't agree to a war doesn't mean you can just deduct that from your tax. Programs doesn't have to directly affect you for it to be beneficial, and that's such a selfish, blinkered and narrow minded perspective.As Medefe and other repeatedly pointed out increasing the access to contraceptives is beneficial and cost-saving to the entire community.



This is as much about Victorian prudishness and attitude to sex as it is about perceived government spending.


So why, in 2012, are women suddenly unable to pay for their own contraceptives when they've been buying them for themselves for the nearly 100 years they've been around? Why must people buy their own contraceptives AND buy for others who refuse to buy their own?

By the way, national defense is actually a Constitutionally-defined role of the federal government. Where is providing/mandating contraceptives a Constitutionally-defined role?
Image
User avatar
Captain Night Strike
 
Posts: 8646
Joined: Wed Apr 18, 2007 2:52 pm
Medals: 79
Standard Achievement (3) Doubles Achievement (3) Triples Achievement (2) Quadruples Achievement (2) Terminator Achievement (2)
Assassin Achievement (1) Manual Troops Achievement (1) Freestyle Achievement (1) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (3)
Speed Achievement (1) Teammate Achievement (1) Random Map Achievement (2) Cross-Map Achievement (3) Ratings Achievement (3)
Tournament Achievement (2) General Achievement (7) Clan Achievement (11) Tournament Contribution (12) General Contribution (18)

Re: Liberty VS ObamaCare: Back to Supreme Court

Postby Metsfanmax on Fri Nov 30, 2012 12:04 pm

Night Strike wrote:By the way, national defense is actually a Constitutionally-defined role of the federal government. Where is providing/mandating contraceptives a Constitutionally-defined role?


That would be a valid response if invading Afghanistan could in any rational way be interpreted as providing for the "national defense."
User avatar
Lieutenant Metsfanmax
 
Posts: 4264
Joined: Wed Apr 11, 2007 11:01 pm
Location: NY
Medals: 43
Standard Achievement (3) Doubles Achievement (2) Triples Achievement (1) Quadruples Achievement (1) Terminator Achievement (1)
Assassin Achievement (1) Manual Troops Achievement (2) Freestyle Achievement (1) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (3)
Trench Warfare Achievement (1) Speed Achievement (3) Teammate Achievement (1) Random Map Achievement (1) Cross-Map Achievement (1)
Battle Royale Achievement (1) Ratings Achievement (2) Tournament Achievement (1) General Achievement (7) Clan Achievement (2)
General Contribution (7)

Re: Liberty VS ObamaCare: Back to Supreme Court

Postby Night Strike on Fri Nov 30, 2012 12:53 pm

Metsfanmax wrote:
Night Strike wrote:By the way, national defense is actually a Constitutionally-defined role of the federal government. Where is providing/mandating contraceptives a Constitutionally-defined role?


That would be a valid response if invading Afghanistan could in any rational way be interpreted as providing for the "national defense."


Considering the group that attacked us on 9-11 was not actually a national army, does that mean we weren't allowed to retaliate for those attacks? If a non-governmental entity attacks a country, that country is not able to do anything because the entity is not a country that can be retaliated upon? The US should have just set idol for the past 11 years and let Al-Qaeda attack us as much as they desired since they weren't part of a nation to stop?
Image
User avatar
Captain Night Strike
 
Posts: 8646
Joined: Wed Apr 18, 2007 2:52 pm
Medals: 79
Standard Achievement (3) Doubles Achievement (3) Triples Achievement (2) Quadruples Achievement (2) Terminator Achievement (2)
Assassin Achievement (1) Manual Troops Achievement (1) Freestyle Achievement (1) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (3)
Speed Achievement (1) Teammate Achievement (1) Random Map Achievement (2) Cross-Map Achievement (3) Ratings Achievement (3)
Tournament Achievement (2) General Achievement (7) Clan Achievement (11) Tournament Contribution (12) General Contribution (18)

Re: Liberty VS ObamaCare: Back to Supreme Court

Postby Phatscotty on Fri Nov 30, 2012 4:50 pm

Iliad wrote:
Phatscotty wrote:Nope. I didn't say that because I don't use birth control...

Put simply, taxpayer dollars should not go to fund abortions or contraceptives

You still didn't get it. Please try and actually engage the other side.


I don't get my own point?

GET A CLUE! :lol:
"I want you to remember that, to remind you to stay out of my way. In all the years to come, in all your most private moments, I want you to remember my hand at your throat. I want you to remember the one man who beat you."
User avatar
Major Phatscotty
SoC Training Adviser
 
Posts: 2353
Joined: Mon Dec 10, 2007 5:50 pm
Medals: 94
Standard Achievement (4) Doubles Achievement (3) Triples Achievement (3) Quadruples Achievement (4) Terminator Achievement (2)
Assassin Achievement (1) Manual Troops Achievement (4) Freestyle Achievement (2) Polymorphic Achievement (1) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (3)
Fog of War Achievement (4) Trench Warfare Achievement (3) Speed Achievement (3) Teammate Achievement (3) Random Map Achievement (2)
Cross-Map Achievement (3) Beta Map Achievement (2) Battle Royale Achievement (1) Ratings Achievement (4) Tournament Achievement (5)
General Achievement (2) Clan Achievement (10) Training Achievement (9) Challenge Achievement (1) Tournament Contribution (13)

Re: Liberty VS ObamaCare: Back to Supreme Court

Postby Symmetry on Fri Nov 30, 2012 5:06 pm

Night Strike wrote:
Metsfanmax wrote:
Night Strike wrote:By the way, national defense is actually a Constitutionally-defined role of the federal government. Where is providing/mandating contraceptives a Constitutionally-defined role?


That would be a valid response if invading Afghanistan could in any rational way be interpreted as providing for the "national defense."


Considering the group that attacked us on 9-11 was not actually a national army, does that mean we weren't allowed to retaliate for those attacks? If a non-governmental entity attacks a country, that country is not able to do anything because the entity is not a country that can be retaliated upon? The US should have just set idol for the past 11 years and let Al-Qaeda attack us as much as they desired since they weren't part of a nation to stop?


What's a non-governmental entity, NS?
User avatar
Sergeant 1st Class Symmetry
 
Posts: 1776
Joined: Sat Feb 24, 2007 5:49 am
Medals: 2
Standard Achievement (1) Triples Achievement (1)

Re: Liberty VS ObamaCare: Back to Supreme Court

Postby Night Strike on Fri Nov 30, 2012 5:16 pm

Symmetry wrote:
Night Strike wrote:
Metsfanmax wrote:
Night Strike wrote:By the way, national defense is actually a Constitutionally-defined role of the federal government. Where is providing/mandating contraceptives a Constitutionally-defined role?


That would be a valid response if invading Afghanistan could in any rational way be interpreted as providing for the "national defense."


Considering the group that attacked us on 9-11 was not actually a national army, does that mean we weren't allowed to retaliate for those attacks? If a non-governmental entity attacks a country, that country is not able to do anything because the entity is not a country that can be retaliated upon? The US should have just set idol for the past 11 years and let Al-Qaeda attack us as much as they desired since they weren't part of a nation to stop?


What's a non-governmental entity, NS?


Al-Qaeda. A group that does not act under the direct authority of a national government. This is opposed to if a military had attacked.
Image
User avatar
Captain Night Strike
 
Posts: 8646
Joined: Wed Apr 18, 2007 2:52 pm
Medals: 79
Standard Achievement (3) Doubles Achievement (3) Triples Achievement (2) Quadruples Achievement (2) Terminator Achievement (2)
Assassin Achievement (1) Manual Troops Achievement (1) Freestyle Achievement (1) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (3)
Speed Achievement (1) Teammate Achievement (1) Random Map Achievement (2) Cross-Map Achievement (3) Ratings Achievement (3)
Tournament Achievement (2) General Achievement (7) Clan Achievement (11) Tournament Contribution (12) General Contribution (18)

Re: Liberty VS ObamaCare: Back to Supreme Court

Postby Symmetry on Fri Nov 30, 2012 5:27 pm

Night Strike wrote:
Symmetry wrote:
Night Strike wrote:
Metsfanmax wrote:
Night Strike wrote:By the way, national defense is actually a Constitutionally-defined role of the federal government. Where is providing/mandating contraceptives a Constitutionally-defined role?


That would be a valid response if invading Afghanistan could in any rational way be interpreted as providing for the "national defense."


Considering the group that attacked us on 9-11 was not actually a national army, does that mean we weren't allowed to retaliate for those attacks? If a non-governmental entity attacks a country, that country is not able to do anything because the entity is not a country that can be retaliated upon? The US should have just set idol for the past 11 years and let Al-Qaeda attack us as much as they desired since they weren't part of a nation to stop?


What's a non-governmental entity, NS?


Al-Qaeda. A group that does not act under the direct authority of a national government. This is opposed to if a military had attacked.


A non-governmental entity is Al-Qaeda? I think you may have a few problems in your thinking there, from a number of directions.
User avatar
Sergeant 1st Class Symmetry
 
Posts: 1776
Joined: Sat Feb 24, 2007 5:49 am
Medals: 2
Standard Achievement (1) Triples Achievement (1)

Re: Liberty VS ObamaCare: Back to Supreme Court

Postby Night Strike on Fri Nov 30, 2012 5:31 pm

Symmetry wrote:A non-governmental entity is Al-Qaeda? I think you may have a few problems in your thinking there, from a number of directions.


Then enlighten me.
Image
User avatar
Captain Night Strike
 
Posts: 8646
Joined: Wed Apr 18, 2007 2:52 pm
Medals: 79
Standard Achievement (3) Doubles Achievement (3) Triples Achievement (2) Quadruples Achievement (2) Terminator Achievement (2)
Assassin Achievement (1) Manual Troops Achievement (1) Freestyle Achievement (1) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (3)
Speed Achievement (1) Teammate Achievement (1) Random Map Achievement (2) Cross-Map Achievement (3) Ratings Achievement (3)
Tournament Achievement (2) General Achievement (7) Clan Achievement (11) Tournament Contribution (12) General Contribution (18)

Re: Liberty VS ObamaCare: Back to Supreme Court

Postby Symmetry on Fri Nov 30, 2012 5:39 pm

Night Strike wrote:
Symmetry wrote:A non-governmental entity is Al-Qaeda? I think you may have a few problems in your thinking there, from a number of directions.


Then enlighten me.


I think you might have have found them re-reading your comments, as you've removed them from this reply.

Are you ok with me quoting them?
User avatar
Sergeant 1st Class Symmetry
 
Posts: 1776
Joined: Sat Feb 24, 2007 5:49 am
Medals: 2
Standard Achievement (1) Triples Achievement (1)

Re: Liberty VS ObamaCare: Back to Supreme Court

Postby Night Strike on Fri Nov 30, 2012 5:42 pm

Symmetry wrote:
Night Strike wrote:
Symmetry wrote:A non-governmental entity is Al-Qaeda? I think you may have a few problems in your thinking there, from a number of directions.


Then enlighten me.


I think you might have have found them re-reading your comments, as you've removed them from this reply.

Are you ok with me quoting them?


What are you talking about? I removed quotes because you can only embed a certain number of quotes within each other and we were at or near that limit. Would you just spit out what you're wanting to say?
Image
User avatar
Captain Night Strike
 
Posts: 8646
Joined: Wed Apr 18, 2007 2:52 pm
Medals: 79
Standard Achievement (3) Doubles Achievement (3) Triples Achievement (2) Quadruples Achievement (2) Terminator Achievement (2)
Assassin Achievement (1) Manual Troops Achievement (1) Freestyle Achievement (1) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (3)
Speed Achievement (1) Teammate Achievement (1) Random Map Achievement (2) Cross-Map Achievement (3) Ratings Achievement (3)
Tournament Achievement (2) General Achievement (7) Clan Achievement (11) Tournament Contribution (12) General Contribution (18)

Re: Liberty VS ObamaCare: Back to Supreme Court

Postby Symmetry on Fri Nov 30, 2012 5:53 pm

Night Strike wrote:
Symmetry wrote:
Night Strike wrote:
Symmetry wrote:A non-governmental entity is Al-Qaeda? I think you may have a few problems in your thinking there, from a number of directions.


Then enlighten me.


I think you might have have found them re-reading your comments, as you've removed them from this reply.

Are you ok with me quoting them?


What are you talking about? I removed quotes because you can only embed a certain number of quotes within each other and we were at or near that limit. Would you just spit out what you're wanting to say?


"at or near" that limit?

We gonna have to embed to the limit before you make sense?

But anyway, you were being very very silly and suggesting that an attack by a non-governmental entity, let's say, Al-Qaida, or Blackwater, justifies retaliation in any form.
User avatar
Sergeant 1st Class Symmetry
 
Posts: 1776
Joined: Sat Feb 24, 2007 5:49 am
Medals: 2
Standard Achievement (1) Triples Achievement (1)

Re: Liberty VS ObamaCare: Back to Supreme Court

Postby Metsfanmax on Fri Nov 30, 2012 6:45 pm

Night Strike wrote:Al-Qaeda. A group that does not act under the direct authority of a national government. This is opposed to if a military had attacked.


I have some qualms with the way our drone program has operated, but if there were better oversight and they were used with more restraint, this could be a great tool for fighting terrorism. We wouldn't need to completely invade a country and topple its government as a means of getting at a small terrorist organization.
User avatar
Lieutenant Metsfanmax
 
Posts: 4264
Joined: Wed Apr 11, 2007 11:01 pm
Location: NY
Medals: 43
Standard Achievement (3) Doubles Achievement (2) Triples Achievement (1) Quadruples Achievement (1) Terminator Achievement (1)
Assassin Achievement (1) Manual Troops Achievement (2) Freestyle Achievement (1) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (3)
Trench Warfare Achievement (1) Speed Achievement (3) Teammate Achievement (1) Random Map Achievement (1) Cross-Map Achievement (1)
Battle Royale Achievement (1) Ratings Achievement (2) Tournament Achievement (1) General Achievement (7) Clan Achievement (2)
General Contribution (7)

Re: Liberty VS ObamaCare: Back to Supreme Court

Postby PLAYER57832 on Sun Dec 02, 2012 11:15 am

jj3044 wrote:
And back to my point... I may never use unemployment, so why should I pay?

Get it?

Becuase its INSURANCE. You don't know that you never will need it. You may be lucky. But, you just don't know. Just like you don't know if your house will burn, you will get into a car accident or anything else.

IN this case, the damage to society for your "personal decision" that you "don't need" unemployment insurance is just not worth it. So, we are all mandated to buy it .. just like you have to buy auto insurance if you want to drive, even if you are a fantastic driver.

And, yes.. you ought to have to buy medical insurance because, no matter how much you might protest, the truth is that if your child's appendix is about to burst, you WILL show up at the hospital for surgary whether you "have the money" or not!
Corporal 1st Class PLAYER57832
 
Posts: 2585
Joined: Fri Sep 21, 2007 9:17 am
Location: Pennsylvania
Medals: 30
Standard Achievement (4) Doubles Achievement (1) Triples Achievement (1) Quadruples Achievement (1) Terminator Achievement (2)
Assassin Achievement (1) Manual Troops Achievement (1) Freestyle Achievement (1) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (4)
Speed Achievement (2) Teammate Achievement (1) Random Map Achievement (1) Cross-Map Achievement (4) Ratings Achievement (4)
Training Achievement (1)

Re: Liberty VS ObamaCare: Back to Supreme Court

Postby PLAYER57832 on Sun Dec 02, 2012 11:19 am

Phatscotty wrote:Nope. I didn't say that because I don't use birth control...

Put simply, taxpayer dollars should not go to fund abortions or contraceptives

They don't go to fund abortions.

Contraceptive use is part of female medical care, as determined by the American Medical profession and the US Supreme Court. Denying somethign so fundamental to the health of one gender becuase you happen to dislike it is gender discrimination.

Also, the claim that you are actually paying for this is pretty loose, becuase most of the cost is paid through private insurance, not state or federal funding.

Or, to put it in economic terms.. I am roughly OK with the US population deciding my personnal healthcare choices comminserate with the percentage they contribute to said care. That means that you get roughly a 0.0000000001 vote in this decision. To contrast, I get a 99.99% stake.
Corporal 1st Class PLAYER57832
 
Posts: 2585
Joined: Fri Sep 21, 2007 9:17 am
Location: Pennsylvania
Medals: 30
Standard Achievement (4) Doubles Achievement (1) Triples Achievement (1) Quadruples Achievement (1) Terminator Achievement (2)
Assassin Achievement (1) Manual Troops Achievement (1) Freestyle Achievement (1) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (4)
Speed Achievement (2) Teammate Achievement (1) Random Map Achievement (1) Cross-Map Achievement (4) Ratings Achievement (4)
Training Achievement (1)

Re: Liberty VS ObamaCare: Back to Supreme Court

Postby Phatscotty on Sun Dec 02, 2012 2:49 pm

PLAYER57832 wrote:
Phatscotty wrote:Nope. I didn't say that because I don't use birth control...

Put simply, taxpayer dollars should not go to fund abortions or contraceptives

They don't go to fund abortions.


Yes, they do. I posted an article from my state just a couple pages ago. Maybe you want to go back and read it
"I want you to remember that, to remind you to stay out of my way. In all the years to come, in all your most private moments, I want you to remember my hand at your throat. I want you to remember the one man who beat you."
User avatar
Major Phatscotty
SoC Training Adviser
 
Posts: 2353
Joined: Mon Dec 10, 2007 5:50 pm
Medals: 94
Standard Achievement (4) Doubles Achievement (3) Triples Achievement (3) Quadruples Achievement (4) Terminator Achievement (2)
Assassin Achievement (1) Manual Troops Achievement (4) Freestyle Achievement (2) Polymorphic Achievement (1) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (3)
Fog of War Achievement (4) Trench Warfare Achievement (3) Speed Achievement (3) Teammate Achievement (3) Random Map Achievement (2)
Cross-Map Achievement (3) Beta Map Achievement (2) Battle Royale Achievement (1) Ratings Achievement (4) Tournament Achievement (5)
General Achievement (2) Clan Achievement (10) Training Achievement (9) Challenge Achievement (1) Tournament Contribution (13)

Re: Liberty VS ObamaCare: Back to Supreme Court

Postby Night Strike on Sun Dec 02, 2012 9:46 pm

PLAYER57832 wrote:Contraceptive use is part of female medical care, as determined by the American Medical profession and the US Supreme Court. Denying somethign so fundamental to the health of one gender becuase you happen to dislike it is gender discrimination.


Using contraceptives to treat issues such as irregular periods is part of female medical care. Using it to avoid pregnancies is a personal choice that no other person should be forced to pay for.
Image
User avatar
Captain Night Strike
 
Posts: 8646
Joined: Wed Apr 18, 2007 2:52 pm
Medals: 79
Standard Achievement (3) Doubles Achievement (3) Triples Achievement (2) Quadruples Achievement (2) Terminator Achievement (2)
Assassin Achievement (1) Manual Troops Achievement (1) Freestyle Achievement (1) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (3)
Speed Achievement (1) Teammate Achievement (1) Random Map Achievement (2) Cross-Map Achievement (3) Ratings Achievement (3)
Tournament Achievement (2) General Achievement (7) Clan Achievement (11) Tournament Contribution (12) General Contribution (18)

Re: Liberty VS ObamaCare: Back to Supreme Court

Postby Metsfanmax on Sun Dec 02, 2012 11:46 pm

Night Strike wrote:
PLAYER57832 wrote:Contraceptive use is part of female medical care, as determined by the American Medical profession and the US Supreme Court. Denying somethign so fundamental to the health of one gender becuase you happen to dislike it is gender discrimination.


Using contraceptives to treat issues such as irregular periods is part of female medical care. Using it to avoid pregnancies is a personal choice that no other person should be forced to pay for.


So it's ok to make a personal choice to avoid irregular periods, but it's not ok to make a personal choice to avoid all periods?
User avatar
Lieutenant Metsfanmax
 
Posts: 4264
Joined: Wed Apr 11, 2007 11:01 pm
Location: NY
Medals: 43
Standard Achievement (3) Doubles Achievement (2) Triples Achievement (1) Quadruples Achievement (1) Terminator Achievement (1)
Assassin Achievement (1) Manual Troops Achievement (2) Freestyle Achievement (1) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (3)
Trench Warfare Achievement (1) Speed Achievement (3) Teammate Achievement (1) Random Map Achievement (1) Cross-Map Achievement (1)
Battle Royale Achievement (1) Ratings Achievement (2) Tournament Achievement (1) General Achievement (7) Clan Achievement (2)
General Contribution (7)

Re: Liberty VS ObamaCare: Back to Supreme Court

Postby Night Strike on Mon Dec 03, 2012 7:38 am

Metsfanmax wrote:
Night Strike wrote:
PLAYER57832 wrote:Contraceptive use is part of female medical care, as determined by the American Medical profession and the US Supreme Court. Denying somethign so fundamental to the health of one gender becuase you happen to dislike it is gender discrimination.


Using contraceptives to treat issues such as irregular periods is part of female medical care. Using it to avoid pregnancies is a personal choice that no other person should be forced to pay for.


So it's ok to make a personal choice to avoid irregular periods, but it's not ok to make a personal choice to avoid all periods?


Of course it's ok for people to make that personal choice. It's not ok to force me to pay for someone else to make that choice. The only contraceptives I'm responsible for paying for is those my family may or may not choose to use. It's not my job to work to pay for others to have contraceptives.
Image
User avatar
Captain Night Strike
 
Posts: 8646
Joined: Wed Apr 18, 2007 2:52 pm
Medals: 79
Standard Achievement (3) Doubles Achievement (3) Triples Achievement (2) Quadruples Achievement (2) Terminator Achievement (2)
Assassin Achievement (1) Manual Troops Achievement (1) Freestyle Achievement (1) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (3)
Speed Achievement (1) Teammate Achievement (1) Random Map Achievement (2) Cross-Map Achievement (3) Ratings Achievement (3)
Tournament Achievement (2) General Achievement (7) Clan Achievement (11) Tournament Contribution (12) General Contribution (18)

Re: Liberty VS ObamaCare: Back to Supreme Court

Postby Lootifer on Mon Dec 03, 2012 8:30 pm

Night Strike wrote:Of course it's ok for people to make that personal choice. It's not ok to force me to pay for someone else to make that choice. The only contraceptives I'm responsible for paying for is those my family may or may not choose to use. It's not my job to work to pay for others to have contraceptives.

In the context of the conservative american framework, yes, this is perfectly fine.

However there are two opposing arguments here:
- Firstly what if, by supplying free/mandated cover contraception resulted in a net finacial gain for the country that otherwise wouldnt be realised in the market, which meant the country could be run marginally more efficiently and thus increased everyones paychecks, lowered everyones costs, etc etc. At some point you make a scarifice in standard of living to maintain your pure "freedom". What point do you give in?
- What if, through democratic process the above argument is sufficient such that the bulk of the population supports scarificing some personal freedoms for the global increase in standard of living?

Bear in mind these are thought experiments; it is impossible to know exactly what the return on investment for government supplied contraception would be. The liberal-left argument is that the investment is low cost and low risk but has a fairly large potential upside.
I go to the gym to justify my mockery of fat people.
User avatar
Sergeant 1st Class Lootifer
 
Posts: 789
Joined: Mon Feb 16, 2009 7:30 pm
Location: Competing
Medals: 15
Standard Achievement (3) Doubles Achievement (2) Triples Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (2) Trench Warfare Achievement (1)
Cross-Map Achievement (2) Ratings Achievement (2) Tournament Achievement (1) General Contribution (1)

Re: Liberty VS ObamaCare: Back to Supreme Court

Postby Phatscotty on Mon Dec 03, 2012 9:00 pm

Loot: Do you really, honestly, understand American Conservatism? If yes, why or what have you studied or spent time on in the past concerning the topic?
"I want you to remember that, to remind you to stay out of my way. In all the years to come, in all your most private moments, I want you to remember my hand at your throat. I want you to remember the one man who beat you."
User avatar
Major Phatscotty
SoC Training Adviser
 
Posts: 2353
Joined: Mon Dec 10, 2007 5:50 pm
Medals: 94
Standard Achievement (4) Doubles Achievement (3) Triples Achievement (3) Quadruples Achievement (4) Terminator Achievement (2)
Assassin Achievement (1) Manual Troops Achievement (4) Freestyle Achievement (2) Polymorphic Achievement (1) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (3)
Fog of War Achievement (4) Trench Warfare Achievement (3) Speed Achievement (3) Teammate Achievement (3) Random Map Achievement (2)
Cross-Map Achievement (3) Beta Map Achievement (2) Battle Royale Achievement (1) Ratings Achievement (4) Tournament Achievement (5)
General Achievement (2) Clan Achievement (10) Training Achievement (9) Challenge Achievement (1) Tournament Contribution (13)

Re: Liberty VS ObamaCare: Back to Supreme Court

Postby Night Strike on Mon Dec 03, 2012 9:25 pm

It takes 159 pages to explain a few new taxes in Obamacare. How many more pages will it take to explain how government-provided insurance will work? And how many work-hours will it take to understand AND COMPLY with all of them? And you all thought private insurance paperwork was too much to read. Welcome to government insurance!

(Reuters) - The Internal Revenue Service has released new rules for investment income taxes on capital gains and dividends earned by high-income individuals that passed Congress as part of the 2010 healthcare reform law.

The 3.8 percent surtax on investment income, meant to help pay for healthcare, goes into effect in 2013. It is the first surtax to be applied to capital gains and dividend income.

The tax affects only individuals with more than $200,000 in modified adjusted gross income (MAGI), and married couples filing jointly with more than $250,000 of MAGI.

The tax applies to a broad range of investment securities ranging from stocks and bonds to commodity securities and specialized derivatives.

The 159 pages of rules spell out when the tax applies to trusts and annuities, as well as to individual securities traders.

Released late on Friday, the new regulations include a 0.9 percent healthcare tax on wages for high-income individuals.

Both sets of rules will be published on Wednesday in the Federal Register.

The proposed rules are effective starting January 1. Before making the rules final, the IRS will take public comments and hold hearings in April.

Together, the two taxes are estimated to raise $317.7 billion over 10 years, according to a Joint Committee on Taxation analysis released in June.

To illustrate when the tax applies, the IRS offered an example of a taxpayer filing as a single individual who makes $180,000 in wage income plus $90,000 from investment income. The individual's modified adjusted gross income is $270,000.

The 3.8 percent tax applies to the $70,000, and the individual would pay $2,660 in surtaxes, the IRS said.

The IRS plans to release a new form for taxpayers to fill out for this tax when filing 2013 returns.

The new rules leave some questions unanswered, tax experts said. It was unclear how rental income will be treated under the new rules, said Michael Grace, managing director at Milbank, Tweed, Hadley & McCloy LLP law firm in Washington.

"The proposed regulations surely will increase tax compliance burdens for individuals," said Grace, a former IRS official. "There's clearly some drafting left to be done."

[url]http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/12/03/us-usa-tax-irs-idUSBRE8B21HA20121203[/quote]
Image
User avatar
Captain Night Strike
 
Posts: 8646
Joined: Wed Apr 18, 2007 2:52 pm
Medals: 79
Standard Achievement (3) Doubles Achievement (3) Triples Achievement (2) Quadruples Achievement (2) Terminator Achievement (2)
Assassin Achievement (1) Manual Troops Achievement (1) Freestyle Achievement (1) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (3)
Speed Achievement (1) Teammate Achievement (1) Random Map Achievement (2) Cross-Map Achievement (3) Ratings Achievement (3)
Tournament Achievement (2) General Achievement (7) Clan Achievement (11) Tournament Contribution (12) General Contribution (18)

Re: Liberty VS ObamaCare: Back to Supreme Court

Postby notyou2 on Mon Dec 03, 2012 10:19 pm

Is it OK to force people to pay taxes for road improvements if they don't drive or have a car?

Is it OK to force people to pay taxes for schools if they don't have children?

Hospitals if they never get sick?

Military spending if they are pacifists?

The list goes on..........
Image
User avatar
Captain notyou2
 
Posts: 3233
Joined: Thu Jan 15, 2009 10:09 am
Location: In the here and now
Medals: 40
Standard Achievement (2) Doubles Achievement (2) Triples Achievement (2) Quadruples Achievement (3) Terminator Achievement (2)
Manual Troops Achievement (1) Freestyle Achievement (1) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (3) Trench Warfare Achievement (1)
Teammate Achievement (1) Random Map Achievement (2) Cross-Map Achievement (3) Ratings Achievement (4) Tournament Achievement (3)
General Achievement (3) Clan Achievement (5) Training Achievement (1)

PreviousNext

Return to Babble-On Five

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: GoranZ

cron
Login