Dems lose control of Senate?

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Postby Stopper on Mon Dec 18, 2006 5:31 pm

vtmarik wrote:Which is why, before that happens, we need to regroup and get our military back up to spec.

I think the first step would be to take away the "Commander-In-Chief" power from the President and promote/appoint a General to that position. The President, regardless of his military background, is a civilian leader and he needs to focus on that. Congress would still have oversight over the C-in-C, so there needen't be much worry over the General taking over in a coup.


You people are making me nervous with this kind of talk. The only genuine war the US is in is one of its own making. Plus, shifting control of the military TO the military is always a bad idea - do you think men with lots of guns and bombs care about "oversight"? You just need to elect a half-decent president.

Give that Barack Obama fellow a pop, or failing that, Hillary Clinton - I've always fancied her.
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Postby vtmarik on Mon Dec 18, 2006 5:36 pm

Stopper wrote:
vtmarik wrote:Which is why, before that happens, we need to regroup and get our military back up to spec.

I think the first step would be to take away the "Commander-In-Chief" power from the President and promote/appoint a General to that position. The President, regardless of his military background, is a civilian leader and he needs to focus on that. Congress would still have oversight over the C-in-C, so there needen't be much worry over the General taking over in a coup.


You people are making me nervous with this kind of talk. The only genuine war the US is in is one of its own making. Plus, shifting control of the military TO the military is always a bad idea - do you think men with lots of guns and bombs care about "oversight"? You just need to elect a half-decent president.

Give that Barack Obama fellow a pop, or failing that, Hillary Clinton - I've always fancied her.


It just seems to make sense to give control of the military to the military. That way we can avoid the thing we've got now with a president marching troops into Iraq on a personal vendetta.

That being said, if the current system continues, I'm hoping and praying for John McCain. Let's get someone in there who knows both the ups and the downs of being a soldier.
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Postby happysadfun on Mon Dec 18, 2006 6:06 pm

... We have bombs that could take out all of Manchuria. North Korea too. That'll rid us of quite a few idiots. Then we can bomb Syria back to the Stone Age and concrete over Iran and give it to the Iraqis so they'll shut up. :D I'd love that

BTW, every single NATO country has an obligation to be carpet bombing Syria. The Syrian Government was behind the torching of the Danish embassy in Syria, folks. And acts like that against any one of our brothers in NATO, according to the treaty, should result in us having the obligation to go to war with them, once we're done handling Iraq and giving a quick nuke to Pyongyang in a Trojan horse. Every single member of the North Atlantic Treaty Conference should be hacking away at the nation of Syria, reducing it to a large ruin of rubble, leaving a few signs that say, "NATO was here." Or does that rule not apply with the Liberals' precious Muslims?
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Postby reverend_kyle on Mon Dec 18, 2006 6:17 pm

happysadfun wrote:... We have bombs that could take out all of Manchuria. North Korea too. That'll rid us of quite a few idiots. Then we can bomb Syria back to the Stone Age and concrete over Iran and give it to the Iraqis so they'll shut up. :D I'd love that

BTW, every single NATO country has an obligation to be carpet bombing Syria. The Syrian Government was behind the torching of the Danish embassy in Syria, folks. And acts like that against any one of our brothers in NATO, according to the treaty, should result in us having the obligation to go to war with them, once we're done handling Iraq and giving a quick nuke to Pyongyang in a Trojan horse. Every single member of the North Atlantic Treaty Conference should be hacking away at the nation of Syria, reducing it to a large ruin of rubble, leaving a few signs that say, "NATO was here." Or does that rule not apply with the Liberals' precious Muslims?



And all this happened because the democrats might lose the senate?


What ever happened to your idea of staying on topic?
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Postby happysadfun on Mon Dec 18, 2006 6:20 pm

Stopper wrote:
vtmarik wrote:Which is why, before that happens, we need to regroup and get our military back up to spec.

I think the first step would be to take away the "Commander-In-Chief" power from the President and promote/appoint a General to that position. The President, regardless of his military background, is a civilian leader and he needs to focus on that. Congress would still have oversight over the C-in-C, so there needen't be much worry over the General taking over in a coup.


You people are making me nervous with this kind of talk. The only genuine war the US is in is one of its own making. Plus, shifting control of the military TO the military is always a bad idea - do you think men with lots of guns and bombs care about "oversight"? You just need to elect a half-decent president.

Give that Barack Obama fellow a pop, or failing that, Hillary Clinton - I've always fancied her.

Yes. We wanted to go to Iraq, and have no good reason to. Our president is a one-sided evil man. Hillary Clinton is a saving angel, and the Muslims are perfect people who practice a religion of peace, and America is the dumbest country to ever see the daylight. You are one twisted fellow, Stopper, if this is your delusional view of the world.

Yes, we made the war, Stopper, didn't we? I'll tell you who made the war! The terrorists. Not a good reason? Why, I'd say that people who destroyed of one of our national landmarks and killed 3000+ people purposely because Mohammed said so are people to go to war with. However much you may cringe in your hippie-painted peace-proclaiming turtle shell, there is evil in the world. And this evil destroys innocent lives. We have abortion to worry about, stem-cell research, and insane dictators who believe that their measly countries actually stand a chance against a united West. When a group of Holocaust-denying infidel-murdering woman-hating power-hungry Muslim extremists decides to hijack planes and crash them into some of the tallest, people-packed buildings to kill infidels and have sex with virgins in heaven, they WILL NOT go free. What did you propose, Stopper? Abandoning Iraq completely and making the government, which is shaping up decently, hate the West as much as the Iranian network of protegees? Not even going to war and letting the deliberate killing of 3000+ innocent people just minding their own business go unpunished, and the crazy terrorists run free. I bet if they flew jumbo-jets into some towers in London, you'd care a hell of a lot more. But America is evil, right Stopper? They're not perfect like you are, right Stopper?
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Postby reverend_kyle on Mon Dec 18, 2006 6:48 pm

happysadfun wrote:
Stopper wrote:
vtmarik wrote:Which is why, before that happens, we need to regroup and get our military back up to spec.

I think the first step would be to take away the "Commander-In-Chief" power from the President and promote/appoint a General to that position. The President, regardless of his military background, is a civilian leader and he needs to focus on that. Congress would still have oversight over the C-in-C, so there needen't be much worry over the General taking over in a coup.


You people are making me nervous with this kind of talk. The only genuine war the US is in is one of its own making. Plus, shifting control of the military TO the military is always a bad idea - do you think men with lots of guns and bombs care about "oversight"? You just need to elect a half-decent president.

Give that Barack Obama fellow a pop, or failing that, Hillary Clinton - I've always fancied her.

Yes. We wanted to go to Iraq, and have no good reason to. Our president is a one-sided evil man. Hillary Clinton is a saving angel, and the Muslims are perfect people who practice a religion of peace, and America is the dumbest country to ever see the daylight. You are one twisted fellow, Stopper, if this is your delusional view of the world.

Yes, we made the war, Stopper, didn't we? I'll tell you who made the war! The terrorists. Not a good reason? Why, I'd say that people who destroyed of one of our national landmarks and killed 3000+ people purposely because Mohammed said so are people to go to war with. However much you may cringe in your hippie-painted peace-proclaiming turtle shell, there is evil in the world. And this evil destroys innocent lives. We have abortion to worry about, stem-cell research, and insane dictators who believe that their measly countries actually stand a chance against a united West. When a group of Holocaust-denying infidel-murdering woman-hating power-hungry Muslim extremists decides to hijack planes and crash them into some of the tallest, people-packed buildings to kill infidels and have sex with virgins in heaven, they WILL NOT go free. What did you propose, Stopper? Abandoning Iraq completely and making the government, which is shaping up decently, hate the West as much as the Iranian network of protegees? Not even going to war and letting the deliberate killing of 3000+ innocent people just minding their own business go unpunished, and the crazy terrorists run free. I bet if they flew jumbo-jets into some towers in London, you'd care a hell of a lot more. But America is evil, right Stopper? They're not perfect like you are, right Stopper?


People have never died in the name of christianity..


I will stand by that.
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Postby AndyDufresne on Mon Dec 18, 2006 7:28 pm

vtmarik wrote:...It just seems to make sense to give control of the military to the military...

That sounds like giving prisoners control of the prison. :)


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Postby ksslemp on Mon Dec 18, 2006 8:25 pm

AndyDufresne wrote:
vtmarik wrote:...It just seems to make sense to give control of the military to the military...

That sounds like giving prisoners control of the prison. :)


--Andy


I agree. One of the Great things about America is the Civilian Controlled Military. Wouldn't have it any other way.
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Postby DogDoc on Mon Dec 18, 2006 9:19 pm

Stopper wrote:
vtmarik wrote:Which is why, before that happens, we need to regroup and get our military back up to spec.

I think the first step would be to take away the "Commander-In-Chief" power from the President and promote/appoint a General to that position. The President, regardless of his military background, is a civilian leader and he needs to focus on that. Congress would still have oversight over the C-in-C, so there needen't be much worry over the General taking over in a coup.


You people are making me nervous with this kind of talk. The only genuine war the US is in is one of its own making. Plus, shifting control of the military TO the military is always a bad idea - do you think men with lots of guns and bombs care about "oversight"? You just need to elect a half-decent president.

Give that Barack Obama fellow a pop, or failing that, Hillary Clinton - I've always fancied her.


I don't know enough about Obama to dislike him yet but, well, if Hillary by some fate of the gods gets elected, then I'll be moving to the dark cold border country between England and Scotland. :)
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Postby DogDoc on Mon Dec 18, 2006 9:24 pm

vtmarik wrote:It just seems to make sense to give control of the military to the military. That way we can avoid the thing we've got now with a president marching troops into Iraq on a personal vendetta.

That being said, if the current system continues, I'm hoping and praying for John McCain. Let's get someone in there who knows both the ups and the downs of being a soldier.


Very bad idea. The Founding Fathers created a separation of powers for good reason - primarily to prevent a ruling monarchy or military dictatorship. Best not to screw with that.

By any chance, have you ever seen the movie "Seven Days in May"? You may want to watch it and then see if you think having a general as the CIC would be a good idea (Yeah, I realize it's only a movie, but . . . )
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Postby vtmarik on Mon Dec 18, 2006 11:06 pm

DogDoc wrote:Very bad idea. The Founding Fathers created a separation of powers for good reason - primarily to prevent a ruling monarchy or military dictatorship. Best not to screw with that.

By any chance, have you ever seen the movie "Seven Days in May"? You may want to watch it and then see if you think having a general as the CIC would be a good idea (Yeah, I realize it's only a movie, but . . . )


*makes a note to watch the movie*

Honestly, I think that the military should be in control of the military. I don't mean that they should be autonomous, but that the Generals should be the ones who say what the military needs in terms of personnel, equipment, etc, and if the current levels of readiness are sufficient to start a war. It'd be the same chain of command, but the logistics would be in the hands of the people who know what's going on.

Make a fourth branch of government, the military branch with checks and balances to match.
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Postby reverend_kyle on Tue Dec 19, 2006 2:21 am

Seven seconds in may, is that related to the kent state massacre?
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Postby mightyal on Tue Dec 19, 2006 3:19 am

happysadfun wrote:
Stopper wrote:
vtmarik wrote:Which is why, before that happens, we need to regroup and get our military back up to spec.

I think the first step would be to take away the "Commander-In-Chief" power from the President and promote/appoint a General to that position. The President, regardless of his military background, is a civilian leader and he needs to focus on that. Congress would still have oversight over the C-in-C, so there needen't be much worry over the General taking over in a coup.


You people are making me nervous with this kind of talk. The only genuine war the US is in is one of its own making. Plus, shifting control of the military TO the military is always a bad idea - do you think men with lots of guns and bombs care about "oversight"? You just need to elect a half-decent president.

Give that Barack Obama fellow a pop, or failing that, Hillary Clinton - I've always fancied her.

Yes. We wanted to go to Iraq, and have no good reason to. Our president is a one-sided evil man. Hillary Clinton is a saving angel, and the Muslims are perfect people who practice a religion of peace, and America is the dumbest country to ever see the daylight. You are one twisted fellow, Stopper, if this is your delusional view of the world.

Yes, we made the war, Stopper, didn't we? I'll tell you who made the war! The terrorists. Not a good reason? Why, I'd say that people who destroyed of one of our national landmarks and killed 3000+ people purposely because Mohammed said so are people to go to war with. However much you may cringe in your hippie-painted peace-proclaiming turtle shell, there is evil in the world. And this evil destroys innocent lives. We have abortion to worry about, stem-cell research, and insane dictators who believe that their measly countries actually stand a chance against a united West. When a group of Holocaust-denying infidel-murdering woman-hating power-hungry Muslim extremists decides to hijack planes and crash them into some of the tallest, people-packed buildings to kill infidels and have sex with virgins in heaven, they WILL NOT go free. What did you propose, Stopper? Abandoning Iraq completely and making the government, which is shaping up decently, hate the West as much as the Iranian network of protegees? Not even going to war and letting the deliberate killing of 3000+ innocent people just minding their own business go unpunished, and the crazy terrorists run free. I bet if they flew jumbo-jets into some towers in London, you'd care a hell of a lot more. But America is evil, right Stopper? They're not perfect like you are, right Stopper?

You invaded Afghanistan (with good reason) in response to the Al-Qaeda atrocities. You invaded Iraq because the Bush dynasty had a score to settle with Saddam. It was common knowledge beforehand that there was no connection to 9/11, that Iraq was no threat to the west and that there were no WMDs.
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Postby reverend_kyle on Tue Dec 19, 2006 3:32 am

mightyal wrote:
happysadfun wrote:
Stopper wrote:
vtmarik wrote:Which is why, before that happens, we need to regroup and get our military back up to spec.

I think the first step would be to take away the "Commander-In-Chief" power from the President and promote/appoint a General to that position. The President, regardless of his military background, is a civilian leader and he needs to focus on that. Congress would still have oversight over the C-in-C, so there needen't be much worry over the General taking over in a coup.


You people are making me nervous with this kind of talk. The only genuine war the US is in is one of its own making. Plus, shifting control of the military TO the military is always a bad idea - do you think men with lots of guns and bombs care about "oversight"? You just need to elect a half-decent president.

Give that Barack Obama fellow a pop, or failing that, Hillary Clinton - I've always fancied her.

Image

You invaded Afghanistan (with good reason) in response to the Al-Qaeda atrocities. You invaded Iraq because the Bush dynasty had a score to settle with Saddam. It was common knowledge beforehand that there was no connection to 9/11, that Iraq was no threat to the west and that there were no WMDs.



Did you really need to respond.
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Postby Backglass on Tue Dec 19, 2006 10:42 am

happysadfun wrote:Yes, we made the war, Stopper, didn't we? I'll tell you who made the war! The terrorists. Not a good reason? Why, I'd say that people who destroyed of one of our national landmarks and killed 3000+ people purposely because Mohammed said so are people to go to war with.


So...exactly when DID the country of Iraq and Saddam Hussein attack us and our national landmarks? :roll:
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Postby vtmarik on Tue Dec 19, 2006 10:49 am

Backglass wrote:So...exactly when DID the country of Iraq and Saddam Hussein attack us and our national landmarks? :roll:


I think it was around the time that they started burying their nukes in the sand and deploying mobile bio-weapons labs.
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Postby MeDeFe on Tue Dec 19, 2006 10:58 am

And don't forget those laser guided missiles that can't be spotted by radar. They can fly around the earth twice before they finally strike with pin-point precision. Saddam only didn't fire them because the almost almighty US military was too quick and got there first, unfortunately they didn't get there before the missiles had been dissembled and hidden so well that noone will ever find them. But that doesn't matter since we all KNOW they are there. And anyone who doesn't know that isn't a patriot and his opinions don't count anyway.
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Postby vtmarik on Tue Dec 19, 2006 11:03 am

MeDeFe wrote:And don't forget those laser guided missiles that can't be spotted by radar. They can fly around the earth twice before they finally strike with pin-point precision. Saddam only didn't fire them because the almost almighty US military was too quick and got there first, unfortunately they didn't get there before the missiles had been dissembled and hidden so well that noone will ever find them. But that doesn't matter since we all KNOW they are there. And anyone who doesn't know that isn't a patriot and his opinions don't count anyway.


It wasn't too thorough, they found those tubes, you know the ones. The tubes that were hollow and could be used to make missiles? You know, evil WMD tubes.

Not like Internet tubes, which are good, but missile tubes (which are bad).
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Postby Backglass on Tue Dec 19, 2006 11:08 am

vtmarik wrote:Not like Internet tubes, which are good, but missile tubes (which are bad).


"The internet isnt a truck you can dump something on, it's a series of tubes!" :lol:
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Postby reverend_kyle on Tue Dec 19, 2006 5:19 pm

Backglass wrote:
happysadfun wrote:Yes, we made the war, Stopper, didn't we? I'll tell you who made the war! The terrorists. Not a good reason? Why, I'd say that people who destroyed of one of our national landmarks and killed 3000+ people purposely because Mohammed said so are people to go to war with.


So...exactly when DID the country of Iraq and Saddam Hussein attack us and our national landmarks? :roll:


1988...oh damn, that was us.
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