Bush Administration is trying to be "Big Brother"

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Postby ksslemp on Mon Dec 18, 2006 9:35 pm

cowshrptrn wrote:the fact that this information could be an embarassment to the administration reallly makes the whole thing suspicious. Also, even the judges are questioning whether the government should be allowed to sieze the documents, so you know its not something that is blatantly dangerous.


Because a Judge is "Questioning" something, means squat! That's their job they question everything! Now if the Judge had a "Ruling" then it would mean something.

If the Document is "Classified" then it's a Crime to "Leak" it! pure & simple.

I had an argument with a NY times editor about something very similar to this recently. His reply was that the Gov't routinely "Over-Classifies" documents, yep thats right he said that, as if He has a Right to decide what is "Over-Classified" what a Pompous Ass He is!

The ACLU needs to change their name to the ICLU as in int'l civil liberties union because there's nothing American about them! They may have started out with good intentions, but they lost their way long ago.
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Postby Evil Semp on Mon Dec 18, 2006 10:24 pm

Ectomancer wrote:Why do you keep coming back to this same question?

Because you never answered my question.
Ectomancer wrote:You have to know about the existence of a document in order to request it. They became aware of it because it was leaked.


The person who leaked it could have told them about it and they could have gone with FOIA.

Ectomancer wrote:They have it now, so why do they need to request it?

I didn't say to request it now.

Ectomancer wrote:You couldnt get it from the government now according to the article because all other copies have been destroyed.


How do they know all copies have been destroyed?

This is from the article, it does not say all copies have been destroyed.

"Subpoenas are supposed to assist an investigation, but the government does not need access to the ACLU's document for an investigation since it already has its own copy."


Ectomancer wrote:Besides, that isnt even really the point the article was making.

The article is about free speech and prior restraint. It is also saying that they obtained what the government considers a classified document. Did they obtain it legaly?
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Postby Evil Semp on Mon Dec 18, 2006 10:33 pm

Skittlesandmnms wrote:Our country sort of sucks sometimes...

If I didn't want to be an F-22 pilot... I would move to Canada as soon as I'm 18... but the USAF beckons me...


Our country is that bad where you would move, but its not so bad that you will be willing to let our military of our country that sucks train you?

Aren't you glad you live in a country that lets you have those choices?

Skittles pleae tell me what is so bad in the good ole USA that you would want to move to another country?
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Postby vtmarik on Mon Dec 18, 2006 11:19 pm

Evil Semp wrote:Our country is that bad where you would move, but its not so bad that you will be willing to let our military of our country that sucks train you?

Aren't you glad you live in a country that lets you have those choices?

Skittles pleae tell me what is so bad in the good ole USA that you would want to move to another country?


The Netherlands are a good choice, Switzerland ain't bad.

It's not the country, it's the government. It went from a planned democracy to a representative republic to this cluster-fuck we've got now. It used to be that the Representatives did what the people told them to do, without worrying about political repercussions or soft money contributions. Nowadays anyone with the balls to stand up and say what needs to be said is left holding the bag. Take Murtha for example, he came out and said what every democrat voter wanted said, and then the Dems left him behind because he actually asked for change and for action.

The congress doesn't take action anymore, they don't do anything but attach nonsense to unrelated bills and increase their paygrades. Meanwhile they keep throwing money at the Military, hoping that it'll solve their recruiting and equipment problems while simultaneously slashing benefits for returning veterans. No one gets it up there, because they're all cynical functionaries who are so out of touch that I'm surprised they're still on this planet.

And I hate all of this "If you don't like this country, why don't you just leave" crap. People who say this have more in common with our enemies than they realize. This black-and-white, us-or-them, my-way-or-the-highway mentality is supposed to be reserved for zealots and fundamentalists. This used to be the country of pluralism, where the complainers were actually listened to rather than ignored and belittled. Nowadays it's all gung-ho, cowboy diplomacy and shit.

If you love this country so much, stop being so damn oppositionist. A mass exodus of people isn't going to solve the problems, it's only going to make them worse. Then all the moderates and the people with sense will be gone, and the only ones left are the psycho-nationalists who say 'Up with America and Down with everywhere else!' Then who's gonna be responsible for starting WWIII, hm? I'll give you a hint, it'll be a white guy with a cowboy hat and a shit-eating grin on his face.
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Postby Evil Semp on Mon Dec 18, 2006 11:47 pm

Just to clarify things nobody said love it or leave it. Gizzle gave him some suggestions and I asked where he would go.

If we are supporting this country why are we considered oppositionist?

I don't think anyone here was ignored or belittled, at least in this thread.
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Postby AndyDufresne on Tue Dec 19, 2006 12:19 am

vtmarik wrote: ...It used to be that the Representatives did what the people told them to do...

I think this was a very long time ago. Various things have popped up trying to sway representatives...political machines many years ago and now PACs. What is in store for the future? Democracy without people? :-\


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