Re: 2012-13 NCAA College Basketball [Rescued]

Tournaments completed in 2013

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Re: Re: 2012-13 NCAA College Basketball [Rescued]

Postby jon_snow on Mon Apr 15, 2013 1:38 pm

Fuzzy, the standings will load for me, but they can take a few minutes. Sometimes flipping from tab to tab will help them load for me.
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Re: Re: 2012-13 NCAA College Basketball [Rescued]

Postby Fuzzy316 on Tue Apr 16, 2013 2:40 am

seems to be working better now for some reason.

on another note... i think that there should be a Y in the Top 40 column for my team, for when i beat Oregon, unless the Top 40 column is not what I am taking it for (your opponent is a top 40 team)
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Re: Re: 2012-13 NCAA College Basketball [Rescued]

Postby Fuzzy316 on Tue Apr 16, 2013 2:44 am

on another note, i was just reviewing the standings... kinda gives me a warm fuzzy feeling to know I am one of only 2 people to provide a team with their single loss (Oregon), the other being cwinslow (Wichita St. over Bradley)
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Re: Re: 2012-13 NCAA College Basketball [Rescued]

Postby Wendt100 on Tue Apr 16, 2013 10:52 pm

Y does Nebraska have 10 straight away games? Are we not going by their actual schedules?
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Re: Re: 2012-13 NCAA College Basketball [Rescued]

Postby GeneralJestix on Thu Apr 18, 2013 11:38 am

Wendt100 wrote:Y does Nebraska have 10 straight away games? Are we not going by their actual schedules?


No, we are playing a round robin in our conferences. I started out league play with about 8 straight home games. Just the way the schedule was generated.
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Re: Re: 2012-13 NCAA College Basketball [Rescued]

Postby Wendt100 on Thu Apr 18, 2013 4:03 pm

Ok. So I should have like 6 or 7 more home games coming since I have only played 4 or 5?
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Re: Re: 2012-13 NCAA College Basketball [Rescued]

Postby Robespierre__ on Thu Apr 18, 2013 5:04 pm

Because the tournament got de-railed in the beginning, we are cutting short the 30-game regular season to a 24-game season. Because of that, there will not be perfect balance for any conference that has more than nine teams (Big 10 being one of them).

Remember that away games are weighted more than home games for RPI calculation so away wins help you more than home wins. We concluded that it was a big enough sample coupled with the conference tournament to make the final March Madness field. To go a full 30 games would have had us sending out the final games in late May and we thought it was just dragging on way too long if we did that.

We promise that next year will be more organized from the get go and that no such mild inequities will occur.
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Re: 2012-13 NCAA College Basketball [Rescued]

Postby ViperOverLord on Fri Apr 19, 2013 2:25 am

^^^
That's gonna make it even harder for my struggling team to make the tournament. But I support that.
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Re: Re: 2012-13 NCAA College Basketball [Rescued]

Postby chiefsfan4ever on Sat Apr 20, 2013 8:06 am

So how many more games until selection Sunday?
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Re: Re: 2012-13 NCAA College Basketball [Rescued]

Postby Wendt100 on Sat Apr 20, 2013 8:10 pm

What a bunch of BS! Doesn't mean much if you can't win the gimmick away boards! So you decided who will have the best records by deciding who gets 10 or 11 homes (such as Illinois and Michigan) and who get 5 or 6 home conference games and end up not making it. Thank you for wasting my time with this rigged season.

I would rather drag the season out and do it fairly then cut it short. What's your hurry?
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Re: Re: 2012-13 NCAA College Basketball [Rescued]

Postby mviola on Sun Apr 21, 2013 1:32 pm

Wendt100 wrote:What a bunch of BS! Doesn't mean much if you can't win the gimmick away boards! So you decided who will have the best records by deciding who gets 10 or 11 homes (such as Illinois and Michigan) and who get 5 or 6 home conference games and end up not making it. Thank you for wasting my time with this rigged season.

I would rather drag the season out and do it fairly then cut it short. What's your hurry?

I agree with this and I'm one of those teams with all of my home games.
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Re: 2012-13 NCAA College Basketball [Rescued]

Postby Fuzzy316 on Tue Apr 23, 2013 6:37 am

I myself would not mind completing the full season as well. perhaps it should be put to a vote?
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Re: Re: 2012-13 NCAA College Basketball [Rescued]

Postby jon_snow on Tue Apr 23, 2013 8:38 pm

Here's another unofficial update of the RPI as of 9:30PM EST 4/23/2013:
Rank Team RPI
1 Oregon 0.859556816
2 Georgia 0.787773048
3 Vanderbilt 0.777664392
4 Cornell 0.777198341
5 Bradley 0.772428571
6 Miami (FL) 0.757775343
7 GWU 0.75332628
8 North Carolina 0.722976576
9 Pepperdine 0.714315163
10 Florida 0.707133872
11 Yale 0.706585349
12 Cincinnati 0.704450844
13 Harvard 0.695687332
14 Michigan 0.693982325
15 Marquette 0.69002322
16 Brown 0.687319838
17 Illinois 0.683388359
18 Houston 0.675835502
19 Wake Forest 0.670621732
20 San Diego St 0.670013202
21 Columbia 0.664846132
22 South Carolina 0.656756824
23 Portland 0.652682099
24 USC 0.650125
25 UAB 0.649084382
26 Villanova 0.647887162
27 Georgia St 0.644724013
28 Indiana 0.644650956
29 Kent St 0.641441213
30 St. John's 0.63062797
31 Richmond 0.627748281
32 Virginia Tech 0.621526723
33 Northern Iowa 0.616809524
34 Hawaii 0.61312264
35 Texas A&M 0.607462687
36 Colorado St 0.607446852
37 Princeton 0.606678077
38 Connecticut 0.606148677
39 Clemson 0.605723526
40 Kentucky 0.604188814
41 Arizona 0.603941729
42 Northern Illinois 0.601181025
43 St. Joseph's 0.599268669
44 Buffalo 0.598189592
45 UCLA 0.595678286
46 Creighton 0.589490312
47 Syracuse 0.589438445
48 Tennessee 0.589154475
49 James Madison 0.580771605
50 Michigan St 0.579976921
51 Missouri St 0.579674001
52 Temple 0.57421402
53 Duquesne 0.568692071
54 Pittsburgh 0.560312421
55 Penn 0.559626652
56 South Florida 0.555686811
57 Arkansas 0.552936033
58 Elon 0.541551836
59 Notre Dame 0.536374817
60 Texas Tech 0.533343964
61 Seton Hall 0.532310684
62 Florida St 0.531865327
63 Wichita St 0.529264912
64 Boise St 0.528066434
65 Penn St 0.527272296
66 Kansas St 0.526868258
67 Arizona St 0.522448048
68 California 0.52127962
69 Washington 0.516056472
70 Maryland 0.513370218
71 Nebraska 0.512095062
72 Ohio 0.509443397
73 Duke 0.507299192
74 Boston College 0.507107842
75 Minnesota 0.502725406
76 Rutgers 0.501242017
77 Ohio St 0.498980718
78 Utah 0.498527778
79 LSU 0.490651222
80 Georgia Tech 0.479676982
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Re: Re: 2012-13 NCAA College Basketball [Rescued]

Postby denominator on Wed Apr 24, 2013 12:44 am

jon_snow wrote:Here's another unofficial update of the RPI as of 9:30PM EST 4/23/2013:
35 Texas A&M 0.607462687


Wow... how the hell am I in the Top-40?!
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Re: Re: 2012-13 NCAA College Basketball [Rescued]

Postby jon_snow on Wed Apr 24, 2013 1:09 pm

denominator wrote:
jon_snow wrote:Here's another unofficial update of the RPI as of 9:30PM EST 4/23/2013:
35 Texas A&M 0.607462687


Wow... how the hell am I in the Top-40?!


I haven't seen the RPI formula, but you've played a bunch of away games, and you play in a strong conference: the SEC. The SEC has 3 teams in the Top 10, so that is going to help your strength of schedule.
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Re: Re: 2012-13 NCAA College Basketball [Rescued]

Postby osujacket on Wed Apr 24, 2013 2:03 pm

Wendt100 wrote:What a bunch of BS! Doesn't mean much if you can't win the gimmick away boards! So you decided who will have the best records by deciding who gets 10 or 11 homes (such as Illinois and Michigan) and who get 5 or 6 home conference games and end up not making it. Thank you for wasting my time with this rigged season.

I would rather drag the season out and do it fairly then cut it short. What's your hurry?


So these guys take over a tourney that everyone wants to do...and spend hours figuring out how to make it work and make it run pretty well....not perfect but pretty good....

and you have the gaul to hammer them and whine....Really????

I think you should either try to organize something like this or be grateful that people worked hard to do this.

To hammer them like that is just so ----uncool
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Re: Re: 2012-13 NCAA College Basketball [Rescued]

Postby Wendt100 on Wed Apr 24, 2013 7:44 pm

I was not hammering them. They have done a good job with it.I would like them to finish this fairly!
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Re: 2012-13 NCAA College Basketball [Rescued]

Postby Fuzzy316 on Thu Apr 25, 2013 12:21 am

curious as to what week the RPI update that is in the post is relevant to, as currently mine is sitting at about .60
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Re: Re: 2012-13 NCAA College Basketball [Rescued]

Postby Robespierre__ on Thu Apr 25, 2013 7:09 pm

All,

I first would like to emphasize that the proposed 30 game schedule was not mimicking what the original TO was going to do. As a matter of fact, I have no idea what he was going to do since we were left ZERO records, ZERO schedule and only some spreadsheets from past years that revealed the previous TO did a TON of manual work instead of automating the results portion of the tourney. I spent a good chunk of my life creating that automation in the first weeks we took it over. I came up with that schedule to try to create some balance in a structure that is inherently imbalanced (8-team conferences and 15-team conferences all happening at the same time).

What I could not know when I did that, was how long it was going to take to get things truly organized and up and running such that we were only sending out one game a week for a while (after the weeks of no games) until finally we got going with 2 games a week as you no doubt have noticed. But it was too late. The tournament was going on too long what with the conference tournaments and March Madness looming behind it. And every two weeks later the tournament goes, I seem to lose a player that needs to be replaced. Yet more time and hassle. If I had a crystal ball back then, I would have had less regular season games and worked to balance the home/away games a little better. An automated round-robin generator was used and it seemed to have some teams with long streaks of home or away in the beginning and the opposite in the end. This affects those in the Big East and A-10/MW the most which have 15 teams in them.

So the bottom line is, I and the other TOs are doing the best we can. The decisions we make are not to screw anybody over. We don't spend as much time organizing this as we are because we are trying to piss anyone off. And it is impossible for you to know exactly how much of a timesuck a big tournament like this is unless you could really see all that has gone and is going into it. It frankly would be pretty easy for me to get angry over what feels like colossal insensitivity on your part to the reality of how we see things. But I won't let myself do so (and OSUJacket's post helped me do so tremendously -- thanks for that) because this really is a great tournament, and I enjoy playing in it and enjoying running it with McShanester, Hath, GenJestix, Shoop, and RobbieDub. There is no way this thing would have happened without their help.

So in conclusion, we did not change things from the way they were in the beginning because when we took over, there was no roadmap for us. We did our best to stay faithful to the way it had been done, but we have basically made it up as we went along. This continues in that vein. If any of you perceive it to be unfair, I really am sorry for that. But at the same time, having heard your complaints, we are not deviating. Tournaments begin to suck when they go too long, and our sense is that this one will be hitting that critical mass if we continue the extra 3-4 weeks it will take to complete the schedule as originally imagined. March Madness in August? Really? I will confess that this perception may be in part to my own management fatigue. But to that I can only tell you that I could not fully know what this tournament was going to require from me until I was knee deep in it. Next year, we will have the luxury of planning things in advance and creating a team of TOs robust enough to make running this tournament manageable for people who have busy lives outside of CC. I think we have done more than a passable job of running things this year. But that is just one man's opinion.

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Re: 2012-13 NCAA College Basketball [Rescued]

Postby denominator on Fri Apr 26, 2013 12:10 am

This is still one of my favourite tournaments here on ConquerClub and I see no issue with the way it is being run this year. The only issue I see is with the way RPI is calculated, but that is an issue with College Basketball, not this tournament. If anything, all of the complaints here show more the ridiculousness of College Basketball than with the tournament and its organizers.

Thanks for all the work you put into a tournament as massive as this.
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Re: Re: 2012-13 NCAA College Basketball [Rescued]

Postby Robespierre__ on Fri Apr 26, 2013 10:58 am

The RPI does create some weirdness because the quality of your opponents matters A LOT. I actually tweaked the formula to make that matter a little bit less, but I do think the fundamental logic of weighting your opponents does make sense. If you are in a conference with very strong players, it only makes sense that you will lose more often and should not necessarily be punished tremendously for it. All that said, the tournament committee will not go by the RPI solely. There will be a human touch.

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Re: Re: 2012-13 NCAA College Basketball [Rescued]

Postby osujacket on Fri Apr 26, 2013 12:08 pm

Robespierre__ wrote:All,

I first would like to emphasize that the proposed 30 game schedule was not mimicking what the original TO was going to do. As a matter of fact, I have no idea what he was going to do since we were left ZERO records, ZERO schedule and only some spreadsheets from past years that revealed the previous TO did a TON of manual work instead of automating the results portion of the tourney. I spent a good chunk of my life creating that automation in the first weeks we took it over. I came up with that schedule to try to create some balance in a structure that is inherently imbalanced (8-team conferences and 15-team conferences all happening at the same time).

What I could not know when I did that, was how long it was going to take to get things truly organized and up and running such that we were only sending out one game a week for a while (after the weeks of no games) until finally we got going with 2 games a week as you no doubt have noticed. But it was too late. The tournament was going on too long what with the conference tournaments and March Madness looming behind it. And every two weeks later the tournament goes, I seem to lose a player that needs to be replaced. Yet more time and hassle. If I had a crystal ball back then, I would have had less regular season games and worked to balance the home/away games a little better. An automated round-robin generator was used and it seemed to have some teams with long streaks of home or away in the beginning and the opposite in the end. This affects those in the Big East and A-10/MW the most which have 15 teams in them.

So the bottom line is, I and the other TOs are doing the best we can. The decisions we make are not to screw anybody over. We don't spend as much time organizing this as we are because we are trying to piss anyone off. And it is impossible for you to know exactly how much of a timesuck a big tournament like this is unless you could really see all that has gone and is going into it. It frankly would be pretty easy for me to get angry over what feels like colossal insensitivity on your part to the reality of how we see things. But I won't let myself do so (and OSUJacket's post helped me do so tremendously -- thanks for that) because this really is a great tournament, and I enjoy playing in it and enjoying running it with McShanester, Hath, GenJestix, Shoop, and RobbieDub. There is no way this thing would have happened without their help.

So in conclusion, we did not change things from the way they were in the beginning because when we took over, there was no roadmap for us. We did our best to stay faithful to the way it had been done, but we have basically made it up as we went along. This continues in that vein. If any of you perceive it to be unfair, I really am sorry for that. But at the same time, having heard your complaints, we are not deviating. Tournaments begin to suck when they go too long, and our sense is that this one will be hitting that critical mass if we continue the extra 3-4 weeks it will take to complete the schedule as originally imagined. March Madness in August? Really? I will confess that this perception may be in part to my own management fatigue. But to that I can only tell you that I could not fully know what this tournament was going to require from me until I was knee deep in it. Next year, we will have the luxury of planning things in advance and creating a team of TOs robust enough to make running this tournament manageable for people who have busy lives outside of CC. I think we have done more than a passable job of running things this year. But that is just one man's opinion.

Robes


Just want to say thanks and keep doing some good work... =D> =D> =D> =D>
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Re: 2012-13 NCAA College Basketball [Rescued]

Postby Night Strike on Fri Apr 26, 2013 12:43 pm

I just realized my Week 23 games are No Spoils when they are supposed to be Flat Rate. The games are in Round 3.
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Re: Re: 2012-13 NCAA College Basketball [Rescued]

Postby Fuzzy316 on Fri Apr 26, 2013 10:10 pm

Yes, i would also like to say that I am not complaining about the lack of a full season. I think it is great you guys all stepped up to host this one. I tried running a league tourney and i just couldn't do it. I may go with one in the future, but need to plan it out better. This is a great tourney to have in CC, and with what you guys were given to work with, I think that it's been run just fine. Keep up the good hard work.
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Re: Re: 2012-13 NCAA College Basketball [Rescued]

Postby chiefsfan4ever on Sun Apr 28, 2013 4:39 pm

Jeez no recognition for all the hard work I did helping you with the spreadsheet ;) Just kidding. You guys have done a lot to get this in better shape.
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