Stop multis from playing (Merged) [Done]

[owenshooter]

and to OWENSHOOTER, stop repeatedly slagging me for my comment. I said:

i'm not slagging you. you admitted to strategic baby sitting in a thread where you declared someone else a cheater. you abuse baby sitting and one of your opponents even had his say about it. again, i hope the mods watch this pair closely, as they are the type of team you should be going after for gaining a strategic advantage (freestyle team play), and not after sequential team players. again, i invite you to watch my games too...-0

p.s.-yet another freestyle team that didn't come into the sticky about changing team rules, because they were too busy getting their "cheat fix" in for the points before a new rule was written... funny... all the abuse occurs in freestyle, and the mods/admins are just clueless as to how sequential and freestyle are such completely different animals.

[Tarzanchuck]

The best part about this thread is that it doesn't address my original complaint AT ALL. THREAD DERAILMENT AT IT'S FINEST!!!!

Frankly, I don't give a shit about multis anymore. If someone cares so much about winning that they feel they need to cheat, then fine. I don't care.

The only reason I play here is so that Chaka and I can have fun playing games together. I play some singles games, but I probably wouldn't play if it wasn't for doing games with him. If a multi joins our game, then I don't even care.

R-TARDS.

[wicked]

Both Sven and Player answered your question. That's why we don't cancel/delete games or force forfeits when someone is busted as a multi. Also, a person with multiple accounts doesn't always have more than one of his/her accounts in one game, so if the player decides to upgrade to premium to stay on, they can continue on as normal (with one account). Yet another reason we don't delete/cancel games or force forfeits.

[Twill]

jbrettlip, how you can jump from "we are shelfing this proposal at this time" to "we're scrapping all rules completely" is beyond me - You still are not allowed to strategically sit for another player...sitting for team mates (the proposal that was shelfed) is merely an extension of this.

And TarzanChuck,

We don't block or remove players from active games for several reasons. It has been discussed before and there are too many pot-holes with implementing it so we left it as is.

[Bruceswar]

I feel the opposite way. I think Conquerclub is too hard on multis. The best thing would be to send a warning and maybe a one week ban, then if they are caught using multiple accounts again they must upgrade to premium as I did.

This post is total BS! Too hard? LMAO. Cheaters should be banned the moment it happens! I cannot stand cheaters!

[hulmey]

I think Owen is messing with you a little bit... We are true believers in the ways of babysitting partners turns.

no i'm not. i just spent 20 days trying to make sure the new rule they were proposing for baby sitting accounts was fair to doubles players. one of the huge sticking points was the refusal to differentiate between sequential and freestyle team play by lack and twill... nobody could prove how sequential teams gained a "STRATEGIC" advantage in game play, by baby sitting. and now, in this thread, these guys just show how rampant it is in freestyle, by openly admitting it and declaring it standard in freestyle team play! now they are back tracking about a camping trip or whatever. like it or not, freestyle teams abuse baby sitting, and it is wrong. these two guys were just "smart" enough to admit it in a thread and declare it as no big deal. these two abuse the system, and i hope they are watched closely in their upcoming games. and to be fair, please monitor me in my team games, also...-0

p.s.-jbrettlip, there is no new rule... yet... stop drinking so early in the day if you are going to troll the forums bashing mods.

If you cant understand the strategic advantage of having the same player play all turns for its team then you need an IQ test. There is an advantage albiet alot smaller one than in freestyle games!!

[Timminz]

If you cant understand the strategic advantage of having the same player play all turns for its team then you need an IQ test. There is an advantage albiet alot smaller one than in freestyle games!!

It can only be an advantage if all but one player on the team are idiots, and the non-idiot is the one taking the turns.

[owenshooter]

question, when a person is busted for multiple accounts, why are they allowed to play out their games, possibly taking points off of members that are not cheats? would it be possible to turn an offenders armies into neutrals, as if they had deadbeated, when/if they are busted for multiple accounts? this would end the cries for points to be returned and/or games to be deleted. just an idea...

anyway, searched this forum, only found a thread about marking cheats, which is not what i'm suggesting. so, please resist the urge to merge this...
viewtopic.php?f=4&t=55097&st=0&sk=t&sd=a

thanks for your time!!!-0

[yeti_c]

I think the ruling should be a deadbeating as if in Terminator game... i.e. they're still there - and you can kill them for their cards...

Unless it's a team game - then the teammate should inherit their cards (If it's a full team then the team should get dropped like a terminator death).

Either way though - this topic will get merged.

C.

[lancehoch]

question, when a person is busted for multiple accounts, why are they allowed to play out their games, possibly taking points off of members that are not cheats?

This is because the busted player still has the right to appeal. If they are cleared after a second look and they have done nothing wrong, then why should they have been forced to lose all of their active games?

[yeti_c]

question, when a person is busted for multiple accounts, why are they allowed to play out their games, possibly taking points off of members that are not cheats?

This is because the busted player still has the right to appeal. If they are cleared after a second look and they have done nothing wrong, then why should they have been forced to lose all of their active games?

As stated before - the people who successfully appeal are far outweighed by the people in the games that are ruined by having multi's that are still alive...

In fact the number of multi's will be outweighed heavily by the number of people in the games that they are ruining.

So - My point is - take the punishment away from the many and give it to the few - especially as 90% of those few are cheaters.

C.

[owenshooter]

question, when a person is busted for multiple accounts, why are they allowed to play out their games, possibly taking points off of members that are not cheats?

This is because the busted player still has the right to appeal. If they are cleared after a second look and they have done nothing wrong, then why should they have been forced to lose all of their active games?

let me type clearer. when a person IS BUSTED (as in the process is complete and they are indeed a BUSTED MULTI CHEAT), why are they allowed to play out their games? is that now clear enough?-0

[InkL0sed]

This makes perfect sense.

[PepperJack]

Convicted inmates often appeal their decisions from inside the prison system. While this may be called a miscarriage of justice to the select few that are released on appeal, those numbers are vastly disproportionate to those that appeal and end up serving their term.

That's more or less a real life example of what Yeti said.

Add in the fact that one's score is weighted towards recently finished games for the bulk of the players on CC (higher ranks excluded) and an incorrectly accused multi can quickly recoup their points.

I support the cessation of activity on busted multis that are in the appeals process.

[Fruitcake]

question, when a person is busted for multiple accounts, why are they allowed to play out their games, possibly taking points off of members that are not cheats?

This is because the busted player still has the right to appeal. If they are cleared after a second look and they have done nothing wrong, then why should they have been forced to lose all of their active games?

let me type clearer. when a person IS BUSTED (as in the process is complete and they are indeed a BUSTED MULTI CHEAT), why are they allowed to play out their games? is that now clear enough?-0

Sounds good to me. It would certainly resove a lot of the emotive issues surrounding letting them continue after being busted.

[nagerous]

question, when a person is busted for multiple accounts, why are they allowed to play out their games, possibly taking points off of members that are not cheats?

This is because the busted player still has the right to appeal. If they are cleared after a second look and they have done nothing wrong, then why should they have been forced to lose all of their active games?

As stated before - the people who successfully appeal are far outweighed by the people in the games that are ruined by having multi's that are still alive...

In fact the number of multi's will be outweighed heavily by the number of people in the games that they are ruining.

So - My point is - take the punishment away from the many and give it to the few - especially as 90% of those few are cheaters.

C.

Very valid point there C.

[jbrettlip]

I voted to trun them neutral. And then I am going to sign in with my other account and do the same. I hate multis.

[Jeff Hardy]

question, when a person is busted for multiple accounts, why are they allowed to play out their games, possibly taking points off of members that are not cheats?

This is because the busted player still has the right to appeal. If they are cleared after a second look and they have done nothing wrong, then why should they have been forced to lose all of their active games?

dont bust them unless you are sure

[yeti_c]

I voted to trun them neutral. And then I am going to sign in with my other account and do the same. I hate multis.

I think your multi voted the wrong way!?

C.

[SirSebstar]

its a bad idea. really.
You want real world analogies that turn wrong or you want real reasons. A busted multi gets to make no new games. This saves time on the staff instead of wasting it from having to go through games and award or detract points in a meaningless fashionor turn their armies neutral.

As was stated before, being busted does not mean its sure you have been multi'ing (nor did he recieve a criminal trial with impartial judgement and evidence.) Since the verdict can be overturned, dispite how rare that is, its not really nice to just break in on those games and chance the game that way. Ofcourse there is also the terminator game where someone was eliminated by the multi, he is also not getting their point back, so the moment when it is appropriate to take action is also to late.
If you cant do it right, maybe you should not do it at all, and i feel thats the stance with cheaters / adjusting things ingame that CC takes. And rightly so!!
next time come up with a real suggestion that you have given some thought as to impact, severity andtry to see it from all sides.
Have a nice day.
Sirsebstar

[yeti_c]

Multi.

C.

[owenshooter]

Multi.

C.

ha!! i'm glad someone made it through that mess of a post. i gave up after the 53rd typo and grammatical error within the first few attempted sentences. i still think it is a great idea for people that are truly busted...-0

[shanksdigs]

OMG. Conquer Club is a database and gameserver, right? Why has every discussion I've read on this topic included some mention of the inability to delete users? If it is a database and a gameserver, deleting a user is completely functional, acceptable, and correct. This topic suggests turning the abuser into a neutral which is part of the way towards the right solution. Go all the way, delete abusers accounts and the games they entered. It MUST be easy to do considering that Conquer Club is a database and gameserver.

To continue to allow them to play only causes the following to happen:

-honest players get frustrated with Conquer Club and resort to playing heads up games or private games secluding themselves from competition against new players.
-same honest players may decide to bail on paying the annual fee as this kind of abuse continues to happen.
-the ranking and rating system of Conquer Club is null and void. Any system that allows for a cheater to improperly modify theirs or another player's ranking makes most rankings suspect. (Clearly some of the better players can be determined to be solid players based on years of winning and thousands of wins. That being said, how can any member know whether a brigadier got his ranking because of multis or other methods of cheating?)
-some players may resort to cheating to return themselves the points that they undeservedly lost...and chaos ensues. (I have read PMs and emails from fellow players who have decided to cheat to get their points back, so I know it happens.)
-good players get their points and ranking shot down for no good reason.

Essentially, I am saying that the only effective strategy for ending the cheating that is rampant on this system is to delete cheater's accounts. Send a message that says that "Conquer Club does not advocate cheating!"

[yeti_c]

Deleting data from a Database is generally considered a bad thing in the IT Trade...

In fact - it's one of the primary cornerstones of Database integrity.

C.

[Megadeth666]

So if a multi that got busted, and comes back and screws up games of the person that busted them, it is ok?

Because of some IT thing?...Don't know much how the program goes, but I have been screwed before from multis, and turning them neutral does seem like a logical answer.

Maybe not delete them, just postpone there moves till they lose....just like if your allowed to ban some one from chat , or playing some one, why can't you ban some one from doing a turn?