[Abandoned] - Divine Meteo Condition

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[Abandoned] - Divine Meteo Condition

Postby Evil DIMwit on Tue Nov 24, 2009 2:14 am

Latest incarnation:

Click image to enlarge.
image


8 neutral-coded starting positions, each consisting of a pantheon and a sky god. Limit of two starting positions per player.
Other deities start at 2 neutrals each
8 Temples start at 2 neutrals; other earthly territories are random drop
Underworld territories all start at 1 except for altars which start at 3

40 Heavenly territories (8 pantheons, 32 deities)
57 Earthly territories (8 temples, 49 random drop)
24 Underworld territories (5 portals, 8 crypts, 3 altars, 8 empty)

Starting territory count:
2p: 20; | 3p: 20; | 4p: 16 | 5p: 11 | 6p: 10 | 7p: 9 | 8p: 8

Original post (first version of gameplay idea):

As I'm certain many of us are aware, some genius decided to take the idea behind Conquer Club and make a board game out of it. As expected, it was pretty crappy: There were at most six players, no fog of war, and worst of all, there was only one map to play. But it sold! It sold like crazy. It sold so well they decided to make more. They even went above and beyond with game mechanics that Conquer Club just doesn't have: Special cards, special pieces, special rules.
I've been playing around with the idea of a map inspires by Risk Godstorm. Much as I hate the idea of another Europe map, I've clocked in a lot of good hours on Godstorm and I think the mechanism of calling down the gods (and goddesses) themselves to help you smite your foes could work fairly well for Conquer Club.

For the uninitiated: Risk Godstorm is a variant of Risk, published by Avalon Hill, that takes place on "Ancient Earth," a fantasy version of Europe divided into archaic and mythical territories:

Image

In addition to regular units, players gain faith tokens that they can use to build temples, buy and use special cards, and summon god units that add specific bonuses to your army (I'm glossing over a lot of information; look up more specific rules if you'd like). When troops die, instead of being removed from play, they go to the Underworld:

Click image to enlarge.
image


Here they can fight over certain bonuses and make their way to crypts from which they can be re-summoned to temples on the surface.

Translating gameplay elements into Conquer Club terms is no mean feat, but I've a few mechanisms in mind. First of all, each player gets a temple territory that acts as a capital (the temple is not a separate territory from the ground it's on). Each temple is marked on this map with its civilization's name:

Image
Note that this is only a sketch to show the configuration; it's drawn on the (very copyrighted) Godstorm map itself and ours will obviously have to look at least somewhat different.

A temple can assault that civilization's four gods, which in turn can assault each other and the temple. The gods are as follows:
==] Sky: Provides 2 deployable troops, assaults any territory within your home region. Everyone starts with their sky god.
==] War: Provides an extra troop for every 4 territories you own on earth.
==] Death: Has 5-troop auto-deploy; can one-way assault any underworld portal.
==] Trickster: Bombards other players' gods.
The list of gods I'm planning to use:
show

The gods are demanding and their favor decays by 1 troop per turn (except for the Death god because that's silly).

The underworld looks something like this:
Image
It starts entirely neutral. The red rectangles are doorways that any Death God can attack. The stars are crypts, each of which give you 1 troop to deploy (they probably connect back to the surface by some method I haven't decided yet, like having exit territories at certain points; maybe if we're lucky conditional borders will get implemented by the time we're done and they'll just connect to any temple you own). The circles are altars; owning two gives you +4 and all three give you +10. The underworld does not give you troops (if possible -- depends on whether the 3-troop deployment minimum can be breached by negative bonuses).

In the real Godstorm, you collect victory points and the game ends after five turns (and five turns is really a long time). In our case, it suffices only to conquer the whole of Earth for the glory of your gods.

In any case, that's my proposal unless I've forgotten anything. I'd appreciate any thoughts, and I'd really appreciate any artists willing to help in that department.
Last edited by Evil DIMwit on Fri Jun 24, 2011 4:45 pm, edited 10 times in total.
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Re: Conquer Club Generic-Brand Divine Meteorological Condition

Postby natty dread on Tue Nov 24, 2009 6:13 am

The gods are demanding and their favor decays by 1 troop per turn (except for the Death god because that's silly).


Yeah, you couldn't even have autodeploy and decay on the same territory, since decay is just a negative autodeploy...

The underworld does not give you troops (if possible -- depends on whether the 3-troop deployment minimum can be breached by negative bonuses).


The 3 troop deployment minimum can be modified in the XML. I think the smallest possible troops you can get is 1 troop. You can modify it so that owning territories doesn't give you 1 troop for every 3, but instead 1 troop for every 10 or 1 troop for every 20... And the minimum can be set with another variable.

I'd appreciate any thoughts, and I'd really appreciate any artists willing to help in that department.


I love the gameplay on this. I would love to help with the graphics, but I have too many projects going on at the moment... I'm just too busy with them at the moment. :/
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Re: Conquer Club Generic-Brand Divine Meteorological Condition

Postby Industrial Helix on Tue Nov 24, 2009 6:38 am

The gameplay sounds pretty unique and worth pursuing. I've never played godstorm but I think I want to now.

On thing to consider is making it not Europe. Throw some aztecs and incas in there, the Hindus, ect. It might help to make the map more non-European and escape from some of that darned copyright. Or, you could just roll with the map you've got and then after it becomes a hit everyone could beg you to make a sequel revolving around other religions. Hell, now that I think about it... this might be a really cool idea for an India map.

As for artist duty... I'm kind of tied up atm.
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Re: Conquer Club Generic-Brand Divine Meteorological Condition

Postby Evil DIMwit on Tue Nov 24, 2009 12:28 pm

natty_dread wrote:
The underworld does not give you troops (if possible -- depends on whether the 3-troop deployment minimum can be breached by negative bonuses).


The 3 troop deployment minimum can be modified in the XML. I think the smallest possible troops you can get is 1 troop. You can modify it so that owning territories doesn't give you 1 troop for every 3, but instead 1 troop for every 10 or 1 troop for every 20... And the minimum can be set with another variable.


The question is, if I have a total of -1 deployment bonus, will I deploy 2 at the start of my turn? If I have -3, will I not be able to deploy at all? If that's not the case, it's just a question of having -1 troop for every 3 underworld territories you own. If there's a danger that a player can get stuck in the underworld with nine territories and can't deploy anything at all then I'd like to avoid that solution.
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Re: Conquer Club Generic-Brand Divine Meteorological Condition

Postby ender516 on Tue Nov 24, 2009 1:54 pm

Industrial Helix wrote:The gameplay sounds pretty unique and worth pursuing. I've never played godstorm but I think I want to now.

On thing to consider is making it not Europe. Throw some aztecs and incas in there, the Hindus, ect. It might help to make the map more non-European and escape from some of that darned copyright. Or, you could just roll with the map you've got and then after it becomes a hit everyone could beg you to make a sequel revolving around other religions. Hell, now that I think about it... this might be a really cool idea for an India map.

As for artist duty... I'm kind of tied up atm.

I agree avoiding Europe might be a good idea. Once Industrial Helix mentioned India, my mind went to Alexander's Empire, but broader than the existing CC map, and perhaps even broader than Alexander covered (since you have Slavic, Celtic, and Norse gods on deck). The Hindu gods might be a nice addition here. I guess by the time you put all of these in, it will be too big to fit the map limits. Planning for a sequel may be the way to go.
Sadly, I'm no artist. Maybe someday, but for now I'm just an XML dude. I hope to get more time to ponder the gameplay and make some more suggestions, but natty_dread has made a good start.
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Re: Conquer Club Generic-Brand Divine Meteorological Condition

Postby natty dread on Tue Nov 24, 2009 3:05 pm

The question is, if I have a total of -1 deployment bonus, will I deploy 2 at the start of my turn? If I have -3, will I not be able to deploy at all? If that's not the case, it's just a question of having -1 troop for every 3 underworld territories you own. If there's a danger that a player can get stuck in the underworld with nine territories and can't deploy anything at all then I'd like to avoid that solution.


I believe the minimum deployable troops comes in effect here. If you set the minimum to 3 (as is in most maps), then your deployment can't go below 3, no matter if your total bonus is -9. You will still always get those 3 troops. But, I'm not sure about this, and you should consult an XML Xpert about the issue... ;)
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Re: Conquer Club Generic-Brand Divine Meteorological Condition

Postby Evil DIMwit on Tue Nov 24, 2009 6:20 pm

ender516 wrote:
Industrial Helix wrote:The gameplay sounds pretty unique and worth pursuing. I've never played godstorm but I think I want to now.

On thing to consider is making it not Europe. Throw some aztecs and incas in there, the Hindus, ect. It might help to make the map more non-European and escape from some of that darned copyright. Or, you could just roll with the map you've got and then after it becomes a hit everyone could beg you to make a sequel revolving around other religions. Hell, now that I think about it... this might be a really cool idea for an India map.

As for artist duty... I'm kind of tied up atm.

I agree avoiding Europe might be a good idea. Once Industrial Helix mentioned India, my mind went to Alexander's Empire, but broader than the existing CC map, and perhaps even broader than Alexander covered (since you have Slavic, Celtic, and Norse gods on deck). The Hindu gods might be a nice addition here. I guess by the time you put all of these in, it will be too big to fit the map limits. Planning for a sequel may be the way to go.


I'm not pleased to do a Europe map but there are few other areas of the world that I can really get a good number of pantheons for. For the Americas there might be a good variety but most of them wouldn't be recognizable and it's end up being a lot like the First Nations maps. Africa would be nice but, again, not many recognizable pantheons. I did try to sketch out what an Asia map might look like:

Image

Question marked names mean either I don't have a good list of deities for that culture, or I'm not sure the list I've come up with is appropriate. Question marks mean another civilization could possibly fit there but I don't have one handy.
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Re: Conquer Club Generic-Brand Divine Meteorological Condition

Postby MrBenn on Fri Nov 27, 2009 8:04 am

Hmmm.... reminds me of mibi's Trojan War map, that got bogged down in the map-size mire :x
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Re: Conquer Club Generic-Brand Divine Meteorological Condition

Postby Evil DIMwit on Fri Nov 27, 2009 7:04 pm

MrBenn wrote:Hmmm.... reminds me of mibi's Trojan War map, that got bogged down in the map-size mire :x

Ohhhhh yeahhhhh, I remember that one. Shame it never got anywhere. Still, I'm convinced 630x600 is plenty of room for an epic.
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Re: Conquer Club Generic-Brand Divine Meteorological Condition

Postby ender516 on Fri Nov 27, 2009 11:22 pm

Evil DIMwit wrote:
MrBenn wrote:Hmmm.... reminds me of mibi's Trojan War map, that got bogged down in the map-size mire :x

Ohhhhh yeahhhhh, I remember that one. Shame it never got anywhere. Still, I'm convinced 630x600 is plenty of room for an epic.

Wow, that is a dense map. Not much room for graphics to show through, but agreed, that is epic in scale (though I think I would have rearranged it to avoid putting half the text sideways). It does demonstrate that a great deal of information can be packed into the limits as they stand.
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Re: Conquer Club Generic-Brand Divine Meteorological Condition

Postby b00kw0rm on Sun Mar 28, 2010 6:23 pm

Lower Africa under Egypt should be Nubia.
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Re: Conquer Club Generic-Brand Divine Meteorological Condition

Postby Evil DIMwit on Sun Mar 28, 2010 7:30 pm

Oh, I strangely forgot about this. Yes, Nubia is correct for that region.

Also, this map is actually kind of on hold pending the next XML update, whatever it is.
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Re: Conquer Club Generic-Brand Divine Meteorological Condition

Postby b00kw0rm on Mon Mar 29, 2010 1:30 pm

Haha, I just noticed the date on that last post.

I got to this discussion from your sig.
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Re: Conquer Club Generic-Brand Divine Meteorological Condition

Postby captainwalrus on Mon Apr 05, 2010 2:58 pm

I could see this being a combination of research and conquer and arms race. If you pray a bunch you can eventually bombard, but then also you could pray for other things. I don't really know but I think that a more mystical element could definitely make a good map.
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Re: Conquer Club Generic-Brand Divine Meteorological Condition

Postby natty dread on Mon Apr 05, 2010 4:29 pm

Perhaps we should wait for a couple more XML updates. The way lack hinted at future updates, who knows what updates are coming... if we get conditional borders, this map could really be made amazing.
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