Baseball: King of Diamonds (v15 p.27)

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Baseball: King of Diamonds (v15 p.27)

Postby Evil DIMwit on Thu Jul 22, 2010 10:57 am

A few people have tried putting out baseball field map ideas, but none really panned out. This is my take on the game. It's a conquest style map, with the pitchers as starting positions and every other territory starting neutral. I tried to design the gameplay in a way that mimics the basic elements of baseball: Every player has to go through the bat and land somewhere on the field to start conquering.

Click image to enlarge.
image

Click image to enlarge.
image

XML: http://rassyndrome.webs.com/CC/Baseball.xml

82 territories
8 are pitchers -- starting positions (12 troops each)
1 is the batter -- killer neutral (2)
7 are balls on the field -- killer neutral (1)
1 is the mound -- killer neutral (15)
4 are bases -- victory conditions and start neutral (4)
8 are defenders and start neutral (2)
2 are home runs and start neutral (7)
50 are standard territories, divided into 10 bonus regions. They start neutral (1).



Last gameplay sketch:
Image

Old versions:
http://img171.imageshack.us/img171/8640/baseball15b.png
http://img97.imageshack.us/img97/2100/baseball14.png
http://img135.imageshack.us/img135/2073/baseball9.png
http://img834.imageshack.us/img834/8498/baseball8b.png
http://img820.imageshack.us/img820/2056/baseball1.png
http://img80.imageshack.us/img80/1630/baseball0.png
http://i1011.photobucket.com/albums/af239/RASSyndrome/Baseball/BMap_92.png
http://i1011.photobucket.com/albums/af239/RASSyndrome/Baseball/BMap_8.png
http://i1011.photobucket.com/albums/af239/RASSyndrome/Baseball/BMap_72.png
http://i1011.photobucket.com/albums/af239/RASSyndrome/Baseball/BMap_71.png
http://i1011.photobucket.com/albums/af239/RASSyndrome/Baseball/BMap_6-1.png
http://i1011.photobucket.com/albums/af239/RASSyndrome/Baseball/BMap_5.png
http://i1011.photobucket.com/albums/af239/RASSyndrome/Baseball/BMap_4.png
http://i1011.photobucket.com/albums/af239/RASSyndrome/Baseball/BMap_3.png
http://i1011.photobucket.com/albums/af239/RASSyndrome/Baseball/BMap_2.png
http://i1011.photobucket.com/albums/af239/RASSyndrome/Baseball/BMap_1.png

Original Post
A few people have tried putting out baseball field map ideas, but none really panned out. This is my take on the game. It's a conquest style map, with the pitchers as starting positions and every other territory starting neutral. I tried to design the gameplay in a way that mimics the basic elements of baseball: Every player has to go through the bat and land somewhere on the field to start conquering.

Image

Other gameplay ideas:
Each base assaults the next, counterclockwise.
Defensive players grant a minor bonus -- perhaps +1.
Balls have different killer neutral values depending on advantage of position.
Defensive players are also starting positions.

Also, I need to think of a snappier map title. Any ideas?
Last edited by Evil DIMwit on Sun Mar 06, 2011 5:27 pm, edited 9 times in total.
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Re: A Baseball Map, But Not Like That Last One

Postby AndyDufresne on Thu Jul 22, 2010 11:18 am

I'd like to see foul balls incorporated into this somehow...perhaps as something you want to avoid!

As for a snappy title, hm, I've got nothing. Pitcher, Belly Itcher? Haha, no, that's no good. Hm, Batter's Up? Now Batting. I'm trying to think of things an announcer/manager would say, or children on a playground would call out (like your batter batter).


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Re: A Baseball Map, But Not Like That Last One

Postby Evil DIMwit on Thu Jul 22, 2010 11:24 am

AndyDufresne wrote:I'd like to see foul balls incorporated into this somehow...perhaps as something you want to avoid!

I considered that but couldn't see any practical gameplay use for that. Possibly as just non-bonus destinations connecting to the periphery of the play area, though they wouldn't be very different form regular balls then.

As for a snappy title, hm, I've got nothing. Pitcher, Belly Itcher? Haha, no, that's no good. Hm, Batter's Up? Now Batting. I'm trying to think of things an announcer/manager would say, or children on a playground would call out (like your batter batter).

So maybe what I'm looking for is not so much "snappy title" as "title that contains an O so that I can cleverly make that home run territory one of the title letters. Maybe.
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Re: A Baseball Map, But Not Like That Last One

Postby AndyDufresne on Thu Jul 22, 2010 11:48 am

Right, in regards to foul. Perhaps just non-bonus destintiations works, I like that.

Now Batting has your O. Hm, Home Run Derby? Not quite sure that really fits the theme/gameplay, but it'd be a great title for a baseball map.


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Re: A Baseball Map, But Not Like That Last One

Postby Evil DIMwit on Mon Jul 26, 2010 3:11 pm

A little more filled in:
Click image to enlarge.
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Red numbers are killer, grey are regular neutrals, and other colors are starting positions
The batter's territory is also killer; I'm not sure how many to put there. 1 should be enough, no?
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Re: A Baseball Map, But Not Like That Last One

Postby carlpgoodrich on Tue Jul 27, 2010 2:34 pm

I tried this a while back and failed miserably, this is much better =D> . How about just "Play Ball!" for the title? It has the "little kid" feel to it, and the home run can be in the "a".

If the objective is to hold the 4 bases, then I think the defenders should be able to bombard the bases instead of two over. This can be done according to usual plays (infield can attack closest base plus first base, outfield can attack home, etc.).

Oh, and don't forget the red number on the bat ;)
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Re: A Baseball Map, But Not Like That Last One

Postby Army of GOD on Thu Jul 29, 2010 12:03 am

Well, first off, you best change "plates" in the bottom right to "bases". =P
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Re: A Baseball Map, But Not Like That Last One

Postby Evil DIMwit on Mon Aug 02, 2010 8:10 pm

Reconfiguring things around a bit, changing how the defense players work, fixing lexical errors:

Click image to enlarge.
image


carlpgoodrich wrote:If the objective is to hold the 4 bases, then I think the defenders should be able to bombard the bases instead of two over. This can be done according to usual plays (infield can attack closest base plus first base, outfield can attack home, etc.).

Bombarding the victory condition from all over the map would mean you'd either have to stack way more troops on the bases than anyone else has on the map, or control the majority of the field. Either way, you might as well be the winner anyway. So I think limiting where attacks can come from is a good idea.
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Re: A Baseball Map, But Not Like That Last One

Postby carlpgoodrich on Mon Aug 02, 2010 8:24 pm

Evil DIMwit wrote:
carlpgoodrich wrote:If the objective is to hold the 4 bases, then I think the defenders should be able to bombard the bases instead of two over. This can be done according to usual plays (infield can attack closest base plus first base, outfield can attack home, etc.).

Bombarding the victory condition from all over the map would mean you'd either have to stack way more troops on the bases than anyone else has on the map, or control the majority of the field. Either way, you might as well be the winner anyway. So I think limiting where attacks can come from is a good idea.

Good point. What you have is basically what I had in mind but with the defenders connected to other defenders, which actually makes a lot more sense ;) ... Though I do think the shortstop should be able to assault the first baseman.

For clarification, the defenders still attack two territories away?
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Re: A Baseball Map, But Not Like That Last One

Postby MarshalNey on Mon Aug 02, 2010 8:29 pm

The map takes a bit of reading to figure out, but this is actually quite compact and clever. I mean, really, it is. I really get a sense of a baseball game from the gameplay, all of the major elements are present. Congratulations =D>

I guess my only critique would be... well, all the reading needed to figure it out. The neutral values might need adjustment too, but that's the case with any conquest map I think- even then, sometimes only Beta reveals problems. No, I think your major difficulty with this map will be organizing and clarifying the legend. The gameplay mechanisms themselves look really nice.
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Re: A Baseball Map, But Not Like That Last One

Postby Evil DIMwit on Mon Aug 02, 2010 9:27 pm

Well, first let's see if we can simplify... Would it be any loss to the gameplay if defenders couldn't assault up to two away? The worst thing I see about that is that the shortstop and second baseman couldn't directly assault the base.

Also, do I really need "Balls and defenders connect with neighboring areas" or does that seem obvious?
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Re: A Baseball Map, But Not Like That Last One

Postby MarshalNey on Mon Aug 02, 2010 10:36 pm

Evil DIMwit wrote:Well, first let's see if we can simplify... Would it be any loss to the gameplay if defenders couldn't assault up to two away? The worst thing I see about that is that the shortstop and second baseman couldn't directly assault the base.


Hmmm... I have to say that I like the defenders being able to extend outward 2... they are still handy without it, but perhaps not enough.

Also, though, I was looking at the separate diagram for the defender attack routes... could you perhaps just make it so that every defender can attack any other defender? After all, defenders technically have the ability to throw across the field- and a throw from deep center to home plate can be a beautiful (or terrible) thing.

Evil DIMwit wrote:Also, do I really need "Balls and defenders connect with neighboring areas" or does that seem obvious?


It seems obvious to me.

One thing that isn't in the legend but looks like a part of the legend is the Batter and Pitchers. They sort of exist 'outside' the map right now, which is initially confusing. Some graphical way to make them look more 'attached' to the field would help.

The Home Runs are a bit like that too, but in their case that makes perfect sense and they really are an extra gimme and not an essential part of the map. Plus it's kind of quirky and cool.
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Re: A Baseball Map, But Not Like That Last One

Postby Evil DIMwit on Mon Aug 02, 2010 11:02 pm

Having all the defenders connect makes real-world sense, but I fear it might open up the map too much. Then again, players can already get all over the place with the balls, and opening up the defenders would save legend space. I'll consider it.

As for the batters and pitchers -- I do intend to divide up the areas outside the map proper more distinctly as the development goes. Maybe eventually I'll even add actual graphics.
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Re: A Baseball Map, But Not Like That Last One

Postby Army of GOD on Tue Aug 03, 2010 7:34 pm

I don't think ALL of the defenders should connect. Maybe we should do it like in real baseball. All the infielders connect, the right fielder connects to the secondbaseman/firstbaseman, center fielder connects to shortstop/secondbaseman and the right fielder connects to thirdbaseman/shortstop. Or maybe that'd be too much clutter to explain?
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Re: A Baseball Map, But Not Like That Last One

Postby Evil DIMwit on Tue Aug 03, 2010 8:46 pm

Army of GOD wrote:I don't think ALL of the defenders should connect. Maybe we should do it like in real baseball. All the infielders connect, the right fielder connects to the secondbaseman/firstbaseman, center fielder connects to shortstop/secondbaseman and the right fielder connects to thirdbaseman/shortstop. Or maybe that'd be too much clutter to explain?


Let's try it out:

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This map is getting less and less tilted by the update. By the time it's quenched it'll practically be upside-down...
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Re: A Baseball Map, But Not Like That Last One

Postby carlpgoodrich on Wed Aug 04, 2010 6:06 am

I don't think thats too much to explain, the diagram is still very clear. For the pitchers' names, why not use names of actual hall of fame pitchers? Young, Ruth, Ryan, Seaver, Niekro, Koufax, Eckersley, Maddux. There can't be any copyright issues with names, right?
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Re: A Baseball Map, But Not Like That Last One

Postby Evil DIMwit on Wed Aug 04, 2010 10:07 am

Well, the case could be made that personality rights are violated, and I don't know if that extends to names. There are a few in-jokes in the pitchers' names I'd have to see go, but I suppose I could use actual historic people.

I'll note that the players on the field, possibly the batter, would also get their own names.
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Re: A Baseball Map, But Not Like That Last One

Postby carlpgoodrich on Wed Aug 04, 2010 10:15 am

You could also use first names. Many of the great players can be recognized by their first names and certainly no personality rights would be violated. Cy, Phil, Pedro, Nolan, Sandy, etc. Same for the fielders. Probably would want to have Babe be the batter (as a Sox fan, that hurt :( , I like to remember him as a pitcher ;) ).
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Re: A Baseball Map, But Not Like That Last One

Postby Army of GOD on Wed Aug 04, 2010 11:51 am

Yea, first names should work and Babe as the batter is good. Should the defenders be given names too?
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Re: A Baseball Map, But Not Like That Last One

Postby Evil DIMwit on Wed Aug 04, 2010 1:26 pm

Army of GOD wrote:Yea, first names should work and Babe as the batter is good. Should the defenders be given names too?


If they fit.
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Re: A Baseball Map, But Not Like That Last One

Postby carlpgoodrich on Wed Aug 04, 2010 1:56 pm

Something like: Yogi at catcher, Lou at first, Jackie at second, Cal at short, Wade at third, Ted in left, Willie in center, Hank in right... it could work ;)

Edit: Ohhh, you mean if the names fit in the space, haha... :lol:
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Re: A Baseball Map, But Not Like That Last One

Postby isaiah40 on Wed Aug 04, 2010 2:17 pm

Who's on first, What's on second, I Don't Know is on third, why in left, because in center, tomorrow is pitching, today is catching, I don't give a damn is the shortstop!! The others you'll have to make up :D
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Re: A Baseball Map, But Not Like That Last One

Postby Army of GOD on Wed Aug 04, 2010 2:29 pm

Woah woah woah woah. Cal at short? We definitely need Ozzie there.
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Re: A Baseball Map, But Not Like That Last One

Postby carlpgoodrich on Wed Aug 04, 2010 3:45 pm

Army of GOD wrote:Woah woah woah woah. Cal at short? We definitely need Ozzie there.

Yup. I agree. Don't know what I was thinking... :oops:
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Re: A Baseball Map, But Not Like That Last One

Postby Evil DIMwit on Fri Aug 06, 2010 5:24 pm

I'll freely admit, I'm not that big into baseball. Normally I'd pepper the player names with jokes and subtle references, but it looks like putting the names of historic players on the field would have more impact on people who actually are fans of the game, and it does kind of fit with the whole history lesson theme CC has going on. However, I've got little feel for which name should go where so I'll let the fans argue it out.
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Location: Philadelphia, NJ
Medals: 20
Standard Achievement (3) Doubles Achievement (2) Triples Achievement (1) Quadruples Achievement (1) Terminator Achievement (1)
Manual Troops Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (2) Cross-Map Achievement (2) Map Contribution (4) General Contribution (3)

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