MÉXICO [BETA] p1/18 --Sep 11th--

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Re: MÉXICO [BETA] p1/18 --Sep 11th--

Postby Commander62890 on Thu Sep 23, 2010 10:00 am

ender516 wrote:The ports give a bonus and quick access up and down the coasts. I think people will still take them.

Not in team games, my friend.


This completely ruined the map for team games. Really, no one agrees with me? The Sur bonus is way too good without some more small bonuses in play.
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Re: MÉXICO [BETA] p1/18 --Sep 11th--

Postby fumandomuerte on Thu Sep 23, 2010 2:42 pm

Commander62890 wrote:
ender516 wrote:The ports give a bonus and quick access up and down the coasts. I think people will still take them.

Not in team games, my friend.


This completely ruined the map for team games. Really, no one agrees with me? The Sur bonus is way too good without some more small bonuses in play.


Agree. Already suggested to change the bonus requirement for the ports from 3 for +2 to 5 for +3 (or a +4).
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Re: MÉXICO [BETA] p1/18 --Sep 11th--

Postby Commander62890 on Thu Sep 23, 2010 7:40 pm

fumandomuerte wrote:Agree. Already suggested to change the bonus requirement for the ports from 3 for +2 to 5 for +3 (or a +4).

I'm sorry, but no one's going to be taking out 10 neutrals for a +4 bonus on a medium-sized map.


If you don't scrap the neutral ports, ports will only be used in desperation by a losing team trying to break a bonus on the other side of the map. And, since the losing team will have to go through 4 neutrals to break the bonus, it will probably only hasten their defeat.


If you're fixed on neutral ports, changing the ports to 1 neutral each, and have 2 ports be worth 2 or more armies might be okay.


Though I think that just having them as regular territories would be best.


Sorry about all this criticism, but I'm not wrong in that having neutral ports will make them a total non-factor in team games and 1v1. If this is what you're going for, fine. I just think it would be a more complex and layered map if you made the ports important.
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Re: MÉXICO [BETA] p1/18 --Sep 11th--

Postby fumandomuerte on Fri Sep 24, 2010 9:35 am

Don't get me wrong. What I'm saying is that Ports should not be coded as neutrals and the bonus they give right now (+2 for any 3) must be adjusted to avoid drop advantages with a requirement of holding 5 to claim more troops, not 3.
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Re: MÉXICO [BETA] p1/18 --Sep 11th--

Postby Commander62890 on Fri Sep 24, 2010 12:26 pm

Sure, that would be fine.



Ports were overpowered with the previous coding, but now they're just plain useless.


I'm just saying we need to find something in between; useful but not overpowered.


Maybe hold 4 ports for +2 or +3? 5 seems like too many.


What was the thought process for changing the ports to neutral?
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Re: MÉXICO [BETA] p1/18 --Sep 11th--

Postby MrBenn on Fri Sep 24, 2010 2:16 pm

I'm not sure if there was any serious thoughts into making the ports start neutral - I;d sort of assumed it would be a sensible thing to do... Having said that, I would definitely prefer keeping them in normal play

The options I see are:

a) Leave it as it was before (with no designated neutrals). The downside of this, is that it leaves 37 starting terrs, meaning 2/3p games start with 12 terrs and an extra advantage to whoever starts

b) Make one port on each ocean start neutral (2 neutral armies), and leave the bonus as it is. (although this still means there's a 33% chance of dropping one of the bonuses.

c) Make one port on each ocean start neutral, but change the bonus to +2 for holding all the ports on the same sea

My favourite is probably option C, with the two central ports starting neutral.
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Re: MÉXICO [BETA] p1/18 --Sep 11th--

Postby Victor Sullivan on Fri Sep 24, 2010 2:22 pm

Definitely C, MrBenn ;)
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Re: MÉXICO [BETA] p1/18 --Sep 11th--

Postby fumandomuerte on Fri Sep 24, 2010 7:26 pm

I like option C too.
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Re: MÉXICO [BETA] p1/18 --Sep 11th--

Postby Commander62890 on Sat Sep 25, 2010 1:38 am

Hmmm not bad, but I don't like C.


It still forces you to hit a neutral, which make the bonus unusable for 1v1 and Team.


It seems like it will be hard to find the mid-way point between not being too drop-dependent on 1v1 and not being to boring on Team.


This is a tough decision, but I really think that C will result in players not going for the bonus, for the most part.
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Re: MÉXICO [BETA] p1/18 --Sep 11th--

Postby MrBenn on Sat Sep 25, 2010 2:40 am

We'd still need to put neutrals on the map to eliminate the 12-terr advantage to player 1 on 1v1s and 3p games...
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Re: MÉXICO [BETA] p1/18 --Sep 11th--

Postby rdsrds2120 on Sun Sep 26, 2010 2:39 am

I agree. Also, I'd like to ask others, just in case it's only me -
I was playing on this, and does anyone else think there isn't much of a contrast Golfo and Valle de Anahuac and the red color of the troops? I honestly had a hard time looking at it. Maybe a softer color?
Has this already been addressed?
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Re: MÉXICO [BETA] p1/18 --Sep 11th--

Postby Bruceswar on Sun Sep 26, 2010 5:06 am

Here is what I think. Leave all the ports neutral but make then only a 1 instead of 2. I was playing this map for the first time and team 2 got the Sur bonus pretty easy. I thought about break via a port(s) but the 4 plus the men there on the actually territory made it too much. So thus no ports were taken. If it was 1 on each instead of 2, then I think the ports would be of more use to most people.
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Re: MÉXICO [BETA] p1/18 --Sep 11th--

Postby Commander62890 on Sun Sep 26, 2010 5:18 am

I like.




In that case, though, I would think that holding 2 ports should give a bonus... either +1 or +2


Though, it could make for some rather interesting gameplay if it was hold 1 port for +1. That might really induce people to hit those neutrals!


Seriously, I think having 1 neutral on each port, and holding 1 port for +1 might be pretty cool.
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Re: MÉXICO [BETA] p1/18 --Sep 11th--

Postby iancanton on Sat Oct 02, 2010 10:43 am

i'm another advocate for option c.

Commander62890 wrote:This is a tough decision, but I really think that C will result in players not going for the bonus, for the most part.

in 1v1, most of the bonus zones will contain at least one neutral region, so the ports won't be too different from the other bonuses in that sense.

Bruceswar wrote:If it was 1 on each instead of 2, then I think the ports would be of more use to most people.

this could ruin the game for the second player in 1v1 unlimited forts. however, u could argue that 1v1 unlimited is heavily stacked against him anyway.

ian. :)
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Re: MÉXICO [BETA] p1/18 --Sep 11th--

Postby MrBenn on Sat Oct 02, 2010 5:13 pm

After a bit of thought, I've decided to drop the ports to neutral 1s, and see how things go. Hopefully this will bring the ports into play a little bit more easily; I'll consider amending the bonus to holding two ports for a +1 bonus, but for now I'll see how things go with lower neutrals.

http://www.fileden.com/files/2009/1/9/2259283/Mexico4.xml
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