[GL] Game Log 2.0

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Re: The log should list all attacks

Postby fumandomuerte on Wed Mar 10, 2010 3:20 pm

You can take snapshots of the map with BOB...
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Re: The log should list all attacks

Postby ic on Wed Mar 10, 2010 3:50 pm

pmchugh wrote:Im pretty sure this is on the to-do list.


I didn't see it on the list but I could have missed it if the title/description was different enough from what I was expecting.

nagerous wrote:I don't think this should be implemented as it takes away some of the strategy of memorising what the map looked like - taking away from some of the gameplay.

However, this would be good in freestyle speed games, when reviewing cheating and abuse cases. Back in the day and I'm sure this still takes place, a lot of the top players were rigging eight player escalating games so that certain players would win and 'break records' and this was partly done by slyly attacking enemy stacks so that the user could then sweep and kill everyone and if this feature was implemented, this would prevent this abuse from continuing.. or at least catch the culprits in action.


Even if you consider memorizing the map a strategy, this is still an issue.

The simplest example I can think of right now: Someone has three troops on a territory. They reinforce with three troops on that territory. Surrounding this territory are territories containing one army from all other players. The log says they ended their turn. Your turn is next. You see they have three troops on that territory. The log indicates nothing. They obviously lost three troops attacking. Who did they attack?

The problem becomes progressively worse the more players there are and the more events are separated by turn order.
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EDIT: I checked the todo list again and it is discussed viewtopic.php?p=19837 although I'm unclear as to what the final result will be.
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Re: The log should list all attacks

Postby iamkoolerthanu on Sat Mar 13, 2010 2:58 am

nagerous wrote:I don't think this should be implemented as it takes away some of the strategy of memorising what the map looked like - taking away from some of the gameplay.


If it is a non-fog game, who ever said that players had to memorize an entire map, times however many games they are playing... I do not really agree with you when you say its part of the game play, and I think this idea should be implemented... CC games are basically interpreting the act of war. You have armies or troops attack and defending against the other 'generals' armies. In a real war, you would know that yellow had attacked you, didn't take the territory, but did take a few troops. It would be properly documented, and you would without a doubt know that you have been under attack, and by whom you were under attack by.

fumandomuerte wrote:You can take snapshots of the map with BOB...


Taking a snapshot of each game every round and for every game, and then having to review those shots each turn for every game... that would increase the time taken for each game by at least 5 minutes, and most player (including myself) does not have the time or the patience to take that much time on each game... which is why having the log updated would be a great option in my opinion
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more game log

Postby caymanmew on Fri May 21, 2010 9:43 pm

Concise description:
add in defended territory into game log

Specifics:
when red attacks blue but does not take the territory game log would say
(blue defended reds assaulted on Vancouver) or something along those lines

This will improve the following aspects of the site:
make game log more informing and able you to see who attacked you if your stack goes down to a lower number
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FOW alteration

Postby Halmir on Fri Sep 24, 2010 5:18 pm

Concise description:
  • Don't know if it's just me but it really bugs me that when an enemy conqurs one of my territories in a Fog Of War game, the Log only records it as: "Asshat assaulted ? from ? and conquered it from Halmir

Specifics/Details:
  • It was my territory at the start of the round then I lost it fair enough. My suggestion though is that the log shows who has conquered which of my lands. I'm not too bothered to know precisely where the attack came from (it could be nice, but not vital). However on an 8 player map I could come back to find I've lost a dozen lands and I won't be certain who has taken which ones, if I can no longer see that region/continent etc

How this will benefit the site and/or other comments:
  • Knowing who has taken which land helps me know where enemies are strongest - and most of all this just makes plain sense! My troops would get off a last radio message telling me that the Green army is attacking them, I'm sure!
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Re: FOW alteration

Postby Woodruff on Sat Sep 25, 2010 8:55 am

Halmir wrote:Concise description:
  • Don't know if it's just me but it really bugs me that when an enemy conqurs one of my territories in a Fog Of War game, the Log only records it as: "Asshat assaulted ? from ? and conquered it from Halmir

Specifics/Details:
  • It was my territory at the start of the round then I lost it fair enough. My suggestion though is that the log shows who has conquered which of my lands. I'm not too bothered to know precisely where the attack came from (it could be nice, but not vital). However on an 8 player map I could come back to find I've lost a dozen lands and I won't be certain who has taken which ones, if I can no longer see that region/continent etc

How this will benefit the site and/or other comments:
  • Knowing who has taken which land helps me know where enemies are strongest - and most of all this just makes plain sense! My troops would get off a last radio message telling me that the Green army is attacking them, I'm sure!


Amen!
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Re: FOW alteration

Postby greenoaks on Sat Sep 25, 2010 9:12 am

this was discussed over 2 years ago.

remember, the search function is your friend.
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Re: FOW alteration

Postby jefjef on Sat Sep 25, 2010 10:55 am

The mystery is part of FOG. You don't want mystery than play sunny games.
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Re: FOW alteration

Postby Woodruff on Sat Sep 25, 2010 10:57 am

jefjef wrote:The mystery is part of FOG. You don't want mystery than play sunny games.


Sure, but there's "mystery"...and then there's "silly and illogical". The current implementation is "silly and illogical" because it doesn't make any sense that an army would have no idea at all who attacked them or, even more likely, what direction they were attacked from.
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Re: FOW alteration

Postby greenoaks on Sat Sep 25, 2010 11:01 am

Woodruff wrote:
jefjef wrote:The mystery is part of FOG. You don't want mystery than play sunny games.


Sure, but there's "mystery"...and then there's "silly and illogical". The current implementation is "silly and illogical" because it doesn't make any sense that an army would have no idea at all who attacked them or, even more likely, what direction they were attacked from.

try to understand it with your human side
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Re: FOW alteration

Postby jefjef on Sat Sep 25, 2010 11:08 am

Woodruff wrote:
jefjef wrote:The mystery is part of FOG. You don't want mystery than play sunny games.


Sure, but there's "mystery"...and then there's "silly and illogical". The current implementation is "silly and illogical" because it doesn't make any sense that an army would have no idea at all who attacked them or, even more likely, what direction they were attacked from.


The whole art of war consists of guessing at what is on the other side of the hill.
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Re: FOW alteration

Postby Woodruff on Sat Sep 25, 2010 11:57 am

jefjef wrote:
Woodruff wrote:
jefjef wrote:The mystery is part of FOG. You don't want mystery than play sunny games.


Sure, but there's "mystery"...and then there's "silly and illogical". The current implementation is "silly and illogical" because it doesn't make any sense that an army would have no idea at all who attacked them or, even more likely, what direction they were attacked from.


The whole art of war consists of guessing at what is on the other side of the hill.
- Duke of Wellington


An army (ANY army) that consistently uses this as their plan cannot possibly avoid utter defeat.
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Re: FOW alteration

Postby jefjef on Sat Sep 25, 2010 12:13 pm

Woodruff wrote:
jefjef wrote:
Woodruff wrote:
jefjef wrote:The mystery is part of FOG. You don't want mystery than play sunny games.


Sure, but there's "mystery"...and then there's "silly and illogical". The current implementation is "silly and illogical" because it doesn't make any sense that an army would have no idea at all who attacked them or, even more likely, what direction they were attacked from.


The whole art of war consists of guessing at what is on the other side of the hill.
- Duke of Wellington


An army (ANY army) that consistently uses this as their plan cannot possibly avoid utter defeat.


No true. Custer guessed wrong once. Stonewall guessed right many times. FOG of war. If ya can't handle it play sunny.
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Re: FOW alteration

Postby Crazyirishman on Sat Sep 25, 2010 12:23 pm

If you know FOW then you'll be able to tell where your enemies have attacked you from a lot of the time if you pay close attention to the log.
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Re: FOW alteration

Postby Woodruff on Sat Sep 25, 2010 12:57 pm

Crazyirishman wrote:If you know FOW then you'll be able to tell where your enemies have attacked you from a lot of the time if you pay close attention to the log.


Perhaps if you have a perfect memory or take snapshots of your games each turn you play. Otherwise...no, it isn't possible to tell from paying close attention to the log.
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Re: FOW alteration

Postby Woodruff on Sat Sep 25, 2010 12:59 pm

jefjef wrote:
Woodruff wrote:
jefjef wrote:
Woodruff wrote:
jefjef wrote:The mystery is part of FOG. You don't want mystery than play sunny games.


Sure, but there's "mystery"...and then there's "silly and illogical". The current implementation is "silly and illogical" because it doesn't make any sense that an army would have no idea at all who attacked them or, even more likely, what direction they were attacked from.


The whole art of war consists of guessing at what is on the other side of the hill.
- Duke of Wellington


An army (ANY army) that consistently uses this as their plan cannot possibly avoid utter defeat.


No true. Custer guessed wrong once. Stonewall guessed right many times. FOG of war. If ya can't handle it play sunny.


Said like a true pretend-strategist.
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Re: FOW alteration

Postby jefjef on Sat Sep 25, 2010 2:05 pm

25% wrote:Said like a true pretend-strategist.


But any way. No reduction to fog is necessary. It works well as it is intended.

Personally I'd like to see even more fog as far as the game log is concerned.
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Re: FOW alteration

Postby Queen_Herpes on Sat Sep 25, 2010 7:10 pm

I agree with fejfej. The more fog, the better.
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More info in the Game Log please

Postby scotchleaf on Sun Feb 20, 2011 4:01 pm

This was probably requested before, but why not have:

"Player X attacked Player Y in Siam from Indonesia with 30 armies. X lost 20, defeated Y's 10 armies..."

instead all we get is
"Choswolf assaulted Danzig from Herzogtum Preußen and conquered it from Scotchleaf" - at least when it is your own place that was attacked you should know what the # of attackers and Defenders was.

It kinda is a bummer when you have 30 armies somewhere, and Poof, they just disappear, and you dont know if they were defeated by a hoard or just by 10 lucky guys.
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Re: More info in the Game Log please

Postby Mr_Adams on Sun Feb 20, 2011 7:55 pm

I like this. you can see these things in an rt or speed, but that element is missing in the standard game that makes up 90% of CC.
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Re: More info in the Game Log please

Postby TheForgivenOne on Mon Feb 21, 2011 2:24 am

Suggested before. I'll merge it in a bit.
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Bonuses in game log

Postby Super Nova on Thu Mar 03, 2011 12:56 pm

Concise description:
  • Have the game chat record when players lose or gain bonuses.

Specifics/Details:
  • Say in classic someone took Australia, and the last place in Australia they took was Perth. The game log would read something like this:

    "Super Nova conquered Perth and advanced two troops.
    Super Nova gained continental bonus of two troops from Australia."

    When a player loses a bonus, the game chat would read something like this:
    Cookconquered Jakarta and advanced one troops.
    Super Nova lost two troop continental bonus from Australia.

How this will benefit the site and/or other comments:
  • Although for a map such as classic this would not really be necessary, on more complicated maps it would save people the trouble of trying to figure out where on earth the bonus that is going to give the opposing player a ton of troops is. I know on my current game on Waterloo I find myself constantly trying to figure out what bonuses the opposing players do or don't have, so that I can deploy accordingly.
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Re: Bonuses in game log

Postby MaTaMa on Thu Mar 03, 2011 3:04 pm

I think it is a great idea, but when you play a game with fog of war then it would remove the fun.
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Re: Game Log 2.0

Postby Queen_Herpes on Fri Mar 04, 2011 10:11 am

Is this original suggestion simply to add a game log? Or is it about increasing the definitions within the game log? I think more definition is better, but can the system track the number of armies? Should this one be merged with the suggs about the game log in fog? Seems like they talk about basically the same thing. I support both: more definition in the game log overall, additional information in the fog log (no more "assaulted ? from ?".)
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Re: Game Log 2.0

Postby blakebowling on Fri Mar 04, 2011 10:42 am

Queen_Herpes wrote:Is this original suggestion simply to add a game log? Or is it about increasing the definitions within the game log? I think more definition is better, but can the system track the number of armies? Should this one be merged with the suggs about the game log in fog? Seems like they talk about basically the same thing. I support both: more definition in the game log overall, additional information in the fog log (no more "assaulted ? from ?".)

This suggestion is about a complete reworking of the game log system. Everything to do with logging should be re-coded from scratch.
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Medals: 41
Standard Achievement (3) Doubles Achievement (1) Triples Achievement (1) Quadruples Achievement (1) Terminator Achievement (1)
Assassin Achievement (2) Manual Troops Achievement (1) Freestyle Achievement (3) Fog of War Achievement (3) Speed Achievement (3)
Teammate Achievement (1) Random Map Achievement (1) Ratings Achievement (3) Tournament Achievement (1) General Achievement (3)
Tournament Contribution (3) General Contribution (10)

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