Moderator: Clan Directors
Leehar wrote:The weightings still feel somehow shoddy...
Army of GOD wrote:Is there a reason the Spelunkers of Hell aren't on here...?
danryan wrote:Looks pretty good actually, once the results of the CC are added in a lot of this is going to be turned on its head.
PACK is going to be interesting to watch as they stick out like a sore thumb in that grouping.
danryan wrote:Looks pretty good actually, once the results of the CC are added in a lot of this is going to be turned on its head.
danryan wrote:PACK is going to be interesting to watch as they stick out like a sore thumb in that grouping.
Sniper08 wrote:yea im kinda suprised we are ranked so high when i first when through the list i though we had been left out until i looked at the top . No losses so far with big % wins ofc after the NC finals are over we will see were we stand.
Army of GOD wrote:Is there a reason the Spelunkers of Hell aren't on here...?
Chuuuuck wrote:Let me first say I think you have done a great job and I am always happy to see people putting time in to try and make things better instead of just bitching about why other people's ideas are stupid.
In saying that, I will now put my time into bitch about how stupid this is.... just kidding!
I do have a small worry though and am curious for a talking point if there is anyway it can be improved on. Someone like The Pack being up there scares me because if the clan world ever decides to put a lot of weight on your rankings and everyone identifies it as the official pole, then it will change the clan world essentially for the worst (IMO). Instead of there being a TOFU/BotFM match, or a KoRT/THOTA match, then you would just have all of the clans at the top racing to sign up big wars against the 10 worst clans just so they can get staggering lop sided numbers which appears it would improve their rankings here.
No offense to The Pack, I don't really know much about them, but at a quick glance it seems that they have done little more than beaten up new clans that would probably get a brutally lop sided loss to anyone in the top 10-15.
I am also sorry if I just didn't take the time to understand this well enough and my concern has already been taken into consideration and I just didn't see it.
Anyway, like I said at the beginning. Great work and glad to see someone actually trying to do something about it as well.
A clan's rating is provisional if they have not beaten any clan 3 places below their current standing or better within the past 6 months.
A clan's rating is provisional if, within the past 6 months, they have neither beaten a clan the same rank as themselves NOR beaten two clans ranked within 3 ranks of themselves
Frederik Hendrik wrote:One point of advice you might want to try. I found out that intergrating the clan league results helped the ranking greatly. The matches theirselves have very small weight, but the total games played in the league are huge. And the beauty is that so many clans play eachother, that it really smoothes out the ranking perfectly.
Chuuuuck wrote:Let me first say I think you have done a great job and I am always happy to see people putting time in to try and make things better instead of just bitching about why other people's ideas are stupid.
In saying that, I will now put my time into bitch about how stupid this is.... just kidding!
I do have a small worry though and am curious for a talking point if there is anyway it can be improved on. Someone like The Pack being up there scares me because if the clan world ever decides to put a lot of weight on your rankings and everyone identifies it as the official pole, then it will change the clan world essentially for the worst (IMO). Instead of there being a TOFU/BotFM match, or a KoRT/THOTA match, then you would just have all of the clans at the top racing to sign up big wars against the 10 worst clans just so they can get staggering lop sided numbers which appears it would improve their rankings here.
No offense to The Pack, I don't really know much about them, but at a quick glance it seems that they have done little more than beaten up new clans that would probably get a brutally lop sided loss to anyone in the top 10-15.
I am also sorry if I just didn't take the time to understand this well enough and my concern has already been taken into consideration and I just didn't see it.
Anyway, like I said at the beginning. Great work and glad to see someone actually trying to do something about it as well.
Frederik Hendrik wrote:Clans (often new ones) that have gathered many points beating low-ranking clans remain the biggest problem in this system. A logic solution would be to never let a clan get to a higher position than the highest-ranked clan they have ever beaten (within the decay-time), regardless of their points. To add "provisional" to the ranking of a clan makes its "real" position unclear and to refuse a clan a higher position than just above the best clan they have ever beaten is both logical and makes them want to play the higher ranking clans.
tec805 wrote:The PACK may not be able to trounce THOTA or BotFM like we have every other clan to date, but I'd wager we would give any of them a run for their money. Would any of them play us? Not if we could only get to #15 or 20 by beating the clans we have played to date even if we had won by 99%. Even at the rate we are going it might be a year down the road before a "top" clan gives us a shot.
Hamanu wrote:tec805 wrote:The PACK may not be able to trounce THOTA or BotFM like we have every other clan to date, but I'd wager we would give any of them a run for their money. Would any of them play us? Not if we could only get to #15 or 20 by beating the clans we have played to date even if we had won by 99%. Even at the rate we are going it might be a year down the road before a "top" clan gives us a shot.
CC cup "forces" top clans to play lower ranked clans and IMO, CC cup is the best possible way for a new clan to prove their worth and gain entry to the upper echelons. Granted, the Pack is "too new" to have participated in this edition of CC cup, but CC cup 3 will be your golden opportunity to beat one or several top clans and thus validate your inclusion into the top ten.
FarangDemon wrote:I believe I've come up with a solution that prevents clans from rising too far to the top of the rankings from beating brand new clans. I've updated the rankings in the OP if you want to check it out.
I changed the way basis points were calculated for challenges where 1 or both clans had completed less than 2 wars. If this is the case, I divide the "delta" value in half. What is the delta value? The delta value is either added or subtracted to your opponent's score, depending on whether you win/lose, in order to determine your basis points for that challenge (which are then weight-averaged together to determine your overall rating).
Since I'm using 200 points as minimum delta and 600 points as maximum delta, this means that normally, if a clan beats another clan that is rated 1000, the basis points they'd get range between 1200-1600 depending on the margin of victory. However, if they lose, they'd have something between a 400-800.
With my update, if one clan has concluded less than 2 wars, the basis points one would get for beating them (if they are at 1000) would range between 1100-1300. Likewise, if one lost against this clan, one would have between 700-900 for that challenge.
Since we don't really know how strong a new clan is, I think it makes sense to set tighter upper and lower limits on the ratings obtained from them - they could be vastly overrated or underrated.
After implementing the change, nearly all ranks remained the same. The only effects were:
1) Pack drops from #7 to #10
2) KoRT's lead over TOFU shrinks from 31 to 3 points, essentially a dead-heat
3) TSM ties AOC for 7th (instead of trailing AOC 1235 to 1254)
*It says AOC is 8th but this should say 7th. When I wrote the script I didn't anticipate ties so I'll need to fix this.
josko.ri wrote:hmm, I dont understand this perfect. if you changed only scoring system for clans that played 1-2 wars, how then KORT can loose 28 points, and KORT never played vs a clan that had 1-2 completed wars, so practically that change should not have any effect to KORT.
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