WWII Pearl Harbor - [Quenched]

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Re: WWII Pearl Harbor - [Quenched]

Postby Victor Sullivan on Mon Dec 13, 2010 8:14 pm

cairnswk wrote:
Victor Sullivan wrote:Can this be fixed? Surely you can't agree this is fair...
-Sully

What do you want fixed Sully? I can't tell a damned thing from your graphic :roll:

Gee, cairns, you take criticism so lightly, don't you? :roll: Don't worry, cairns, you'll find that spring in your step soon enough. ;)

carlpgoodrich wrote:I think Sully is referring to the uneven "troops due" to begin the game. I had the same reaction the first time I played the map. But Sully, the map works... its actually a bit brilliant. Just let the game play out.

Thanks, carl, for clearing that up, I suppose I wasn't clear. I'll play it out, but I honestly don't have high hopes...

-Sully
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Re: WWII Pearl Harbor - [Quenched]

Postby ironsij0287 on Mon Dec 13, 2010 8:20 pm

We just played this with escalating spoils. The folks that started with more troops certainly didn't keep the upper hand for very long.
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Re: WWII Pearl Harbor - [Quenched]

Postby cairnswk on Mon Dec 13, 2010 9:55 pm

Victor Sullivan wrote:
cairnswk wrote:
Victor Sullivan wrote:Can this be fixed? Surely you can't agree this is fair...
-Sully

What do you want fixed Sully? I can't tell a damned thing from your graphic :roll:

Gee, cairns, you take criticism so lightly, don't you? :roll: Don't worry, cairns, you'll find that spring in your step soon enough. ;)
...
-Sully

Sully, I didn't take it as criticism. It's just what i suspected.
This issue just happens to have been round the world several times for people like yourself who don't bother to read some of the thread to see if it has been mentioned before.
For your info, we even changed the map so that the bonuses weren't so uneven, end eventually most (including myself) wanted the original back, which is exactly what you have now.
Good luck with your games, and keep your hopes high....you never know!! :)
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Re: WWII Pearl Harbor - [Quenched]

Postby InsomniaRed on Mon Dec 13, 2010 9:59 pm

In Sully's defense, I doubt someone who had a screenshot and a quick question wanted to read 60 pages just to most likely still be adamant on asking said question/posting said screenshot.
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Re: WWII Pearl Harbor - [Quenched]

Postby Victor Sullivan on Mon Dec 13, 2010 10:01 pm

InsomniaRed wrote:In Sully's defense, I doubt someone who had a screenshot and a quick question wanted to read 60 pages just to most likely still be adamant on asking said question/posting said screenshot.

You couldn't be further from the opposite of truth. ;)
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Re: WWII Pearl Harbor - [Quenched]

Postby DiM on Thu Dec 08, 2011 5:36 am

i had the impression that this map was screwy when it first came out but then it was fixed. it turns out it's not fixed at all.
just started a 2v2 game where the other team got a bonus of 28 from the start while my team got just 18.
seeing how each player starts with 18 terits it was very easy for the other team (cause they went first) to break some of our terits (3) and now before even taking a turn we have a cumulative bonus of 15 (9+6) while they have a bonus of 33 (15+18).

this is messed up in a huge way.
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Re: WWII Pearl Harbor - [Quenched]

Postby cairnswk on Thu Dec 08, 2011 6:03 am

DiM wrote:i had the impression that this map was screwy when it first came out but then it was fixed. it turns out it's not fixed at all.
....
this is messed up in a huge way.

This is not messed up in a huge way.
Yes it was altered previously when there was a call to see what an altered situation would make...however after time, it was decided to return to the original play which reflected the way the battle was.
As has been said before, not all maps on CC are totally balanced.
And look Dim, scream all you like about it being unbalanced and srewed up, but you will only be wating your time if you decide to persue this.
The map is what it is. The planes had the advantage in the real situation.
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Re: WWII Pearl Harbor - [Quenched]

Postby DiM on Thu Dec 08, 2011 6:59 am

cairnswk wrote:
DiM wrote:i had the impression that this map was screwy when it first came out but then it was fixed. it turns out it's not fixed at all.
....
this is messed up in a huge way.

This is not messed up in a huge way.
Yes it was altered previously when there was a call to see what an altered situation would make...however after time, it was decided to return to the original play which reflected the way the battle was.
As has been said before, not all maps on CC are totally balanced.
And look Dim, scream all you like about it being unbalanced and srewed up, but you will only be wating your time if you decide to persue this.
The map is what it is. The planes had the advantage in the real situation.



the bonuses are whack (+3 for 2 planes WTF) and the terit distribution is the worst possible (24 terits per player in 2,3p games, 18 per player in 4 p games, 12 per player in 6p games)
basically except the 5 and 7p games all others are messed up because of the terit distribution.
and that's before you see the huge bonuses for the planes and realise you have no chance if the other person/team starts first and gets some planes.


yeah i know i'm wasting my breath here cause you probably won't change it but still, you messed up on this one. messed up big time.


the fact that the planes had an advantage is totally irrelevant if it screws up the gameplay. it's like making a ww2 map and giving USA a 999 bonus just because they had the nuke in real life.
you should know better than this cairns.
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Re: WWII Pearl Harbor - [Quenched]

Postby cairnswk on Thu Dec 08, 2011 10:27 am

DiM wrote:...yeah i know i'm wasting my breath here cause you probably won't change it but still, you messed up on this one. messed up big time.
...

What short memory you have when you yourself contributed to the map (congratulating me on Final Forge on P30) and had many opportunities to contribute to gameplay discussion which you did (one such ocassion was the llink between the harbour and the oil refinery)...so don't sit there and tell me i messed up and should know better...i'd say it was more a case of everyone messed up although i was the guiding hand that wanted the map to be in favour of the planes having the advantage.
I'd say this was more a case of in the days when this map was developed, there was no such total principle that every map should be a balanced as possible and that no golden numbers existed otherwise we would have gone through that process.
You too Dim can do better than that ! ;)
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Re: WWII Pearl Harbor - [Quenched]

Postby DiM on Thu Dec 08, 2011 10:31 am

cairnswk wrote:
DiM wrote:...yeah i know i'm wasting my breath here cause you probably won't change it but still, you messed up on this one. messed up big time.
...

What short memory you have when you yourself contributed to the map (congratulating me on Final Forge on P30) and had many opportunities to contribute to gameplay discussion which you did (one such ocassion was the llink between the harbour and the oil refinery)...so don't sit there and tell me i messed up and should know better...i'd say it was more a case of everyone messed up although i was the guiding hand that wanted the map to be in favour of the planes having the advantage.
I'd say this was more a case of in the days when this map was developed, there was no such total principle that every map should be a balanced as possible and that no golden numbers existed otherwise we would have gone through that process.
You too Dim can do better than that ! ;)


change is possible and it's never too late to right a wrong. all it takes is willpower. :roll:
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Re: WWII Pearl Harbor - [Quenched]

Postby MrBenn on Mon Dec 26, 2011 10:16 am

As cairns has already explained, the map was changed a while back and the bonuses balanced out a bit from the drop. However, there was massive outcry from the rest of CC that changes had been made (despite a number of announcements, and discussion in GD) and the CC community decided to revert to the original version.

If you want it changed, then you'll have to convince everybody who wanted it switched back - you can search through the announcements to see what people had to say about it; I cannot be bothered to search for all the links myself.
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Re: WWII Pearl Harbor - [Quenched]

Postby DiM on Mon Dec 26, 2011 12:08 pm

MrBenn wrote:If you want it changed, then you'll have to convince everybody who wanted it switched back - you can search through the announcements to see what people had to say about it; I cannot be bothered to search for all the links myself.



nah, i'm good. if the community wanted an imbalanced map then they should have it, who am i to say otherwise.

there are at least 4 types of player on CC:
1. people that have no idea about strategy and adore screwed up maps and settings
2. farmers/abusers that want any map that's hard to understand for a nood, whether it's because of bad graphics that don't clearly show connections, poorly explained instructions or gimmicky gameplay
3. traditional strategists - the classic type of risk player
4. avantgarde strategists - the ones that want maps which involve non traditional strategies.

depending on which side your on this map is either great or crap.
for me, at least on certain settings (1v1/2v2/3p) it's all about lucky drop and regardless of strategy the initial drop decides the winner.
probably an 8p game with escalating cards would be a bit more balanced.
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Re: WWII Pearl Harbor - [Quenched]

Postby Silly Knig-it on Sun Feb 17, 2013 7:13 pm

Game 12339654 Round 5

I cannot attack from Dewey to Phelps, even though it shows that I should be able to.
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Re: WWII Pearl Harbor - [Quenched]

Postby nolefan5311 on Sun Feb 17, 2013 7:26 pm

Silly Knig-it wrote:Game 12339654 Round 5

I cannot attack from Dewey to Phelps, even though it shows that I should be able to.


You are in a trench game. Could that be your problem?
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Re: WWII Pearl Harbor - [Quenched]

Postby HardAttack on Sat Jul 20, 2013 8:04 am

current bonusing of such an amazing looking map is truely disaster.
just little touch wud made this amazing map to be great game play i believe.

i love graphics, the game play, the feeling and spirit of this map a lot but the bonusing gets me that everytime i play i end up i ll never going to play this map anymore...

well, give it a minute and think,
having 2 planes is nothing but very easy.

giving it +3 bonus for having 2 planes is not any good balance and many of us here are in agreement.

what about we set it as follows ?

+1 bonus for having 2 planes,
+2 bonus for having 3 planes
+3 bonus for having 4 planes ?

Also, having one AA gun means +1 bonus...I am not liking this as well.
Maybe lets make it as follows ?
Have
1 AA 0 bonus
2 AA +1 bonus
3 AA +2 bonus (might be +3 as well.)

in general

n bonus for n+1 planes...

this wud brought a real interesting and new dimension into the game play for such a cute map i strongly believe.

DIM brought up a point here but i disagree. Yes, keep it this way he says for those who like it this way of imbalanced fashion...But why ? Majority will not like it this way, and the logic is clear...Imbalance can not be defended it is why we call it im-balance...Not good, not optimum. Why do we, should we support something no good ?

I am ok, if nothing to be done and kept this way, i will be ok, but such a great map and it is why i am not playing to be due imbalanced bonusing, i am going to be sad, but i ll keep going playing no more P.H. and sadly.

If you means to bring the map under re-view i am gladly help and i will be giving every supportive idea...
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