Labyrinth [Quenched]

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Re: Labyrinth [7/8] Pages 1/10

Postby koontz1973 on Wed Aug 08, 2012 1:57 pm

AndyDufresne wrote:
nolefan5311 wrote:The spacing in the legend looks really good.

Yeah, I think so too.


--Andy

And here I am thinking how bad it looks.

Leaving it for tonight (fresh hands and eyes) and will pick his up tomorrow. Any more comments chaps, I will go over them then.
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Re: Labyrinth [8/8] Pages 1/12

Postby IcePack on Wed Aug 08, 2012 2:31 pm

Well at first glance there are a few things that don't seem clear as to what they actually do.
I'll read the thread tonight to get clarification as to what the intent is, so maybe I can give feedback as to how to word it better?

But this is definitely something I'm excited about :)
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Re: Labyrinth [8/8] Pages 1/12

Postby nolefan5311 on Wed Aug 08, 2012 2:41 pm

IcePack wrote:Well at first glance there are a few things that don't seem clear as to what they actually do.
I'll read the thread tonight to get clarification as to what the intent is, so maybe I can give feedback as to how to word it better?

But this is definitely something I'm excited about :)


You shouldn't have to read the thread to learn this information, it should be clearly explained in the legend, so if there is any confusion, let us know :)
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Re: Labyrinth [8/8] Pages 1/12

Postby AndyDufresne on Wed Aug 08, 2012 3:07 pm

nolefan5311 wrote:
IcePack wrote:Well at first glance there are a few things that don't seem clear as to what they actually do.
I'll read the thread tonight to get clarification as to what the intent is, so maybe I can give feedback as to how to word it better?

But this is definitely something I'm excited about :)


You shouldn't have to read the thread to learn this information, it should be clearly explained in the legend, so if there is any confusion, let us know :)

I think icepack understands that, that is why they are going to re-read it to possibly come up with a wording that would make it so you wouldn't have to research!


--Andy
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Re: Labyrinth [8/8] Pages 1/12

Postby nolefan5311 on Wed Aug 08, 2012 3:14 pm

AndyDufresne wrote:
nolefan5311 wrote:
IcePack wrote:Well at first glance there are a few things that don't seem clear as to what they actually do.
I'll read the thread tonight to get clarification as to what the intent is, so maybe I can give feedback as to how to word it better?

But this is definitely something I'm excited about :)


You shouldn't have to read the thread to learn this information, it should be clearly explained in the legend, so if there is any confusion, let us know :)

I think icepack understands that, that is why they are going to re-read it to possibly come up with a wording that would make it so you wouldn't have to research!


--Andy


Sounds good.
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Re: Labyrinth [8/8] Pages 1/12

Postby IcePack on Wed Aug 08, 2012 3:44 pm

Ok I took some time away and re read things. I think most of my earlier confusion is cleared up. Some things that would help / want to ensure I understand:

1) Siren call -1 per turn, is that -1 to the territory like Antarctica, or -1 to deploy?
2) same for traps.
3) It took a bit to understand the spears. I think one thing that made it take longer to click was medusa green gaze was noticeable. The white spear area was noticeable, but the beige blended so much in the legend I questioned it. Now I know what it is - I think the color should be altered to something that will show behind the spear in legend better. those borders on the map also tend to blend in with the (un)dead warriors.
4) Prom fire blocks all slave entrances, but you can't attack entrances without owning Prometheus first. Does this mean you must send ur troop stack thru Prometheus to hit an entrance? Or does be just unlock the ability to enter from the fire, where ur attack stack would need to be located? (or both?)
5) Dead warriors + "3" (three), the upper part of the top ring is so faint its actually hard to tell its a 3.

I think that's it for now, I'll do more when I get home (keep saying that but keep wanting to look now that I know this is here...)

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Re: Labyrinth [8/8] Pages 1/12

Postby isaiah40 on Wed Aug 08, 2012 8:12 pm

IcePack wrote:4) Prom fire blocks all slave entrances, but you can't attack entrances without owning Prometheus first. Does this mean you must send ur troop stack thru Prometheus to hit an entrance? Or does be just unlock the ability to enter from the fire, where ur attack stack would need to be located? (or both?)

This could be a good conditional border. Just thinking out loud.
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Re: Labyrinth [8/8] Pages 1/12

Postby IcePack on Wed Aug 08, 2012 8:52 pm

isaiah40 wrote:
IcePack wrote:4) Prom fire blocks all slave entrances, but you can't attack entrances without owning Prometheus first. Does this mean you must send ur troop stack thru Prometheus to hit an entrance? Or does be just unlock the ability to enter from the fire, where ur attack stack would need to be located? (or both?)

This could be a good conditional border. Just thinking out loud.


That's what I'm trying to clear up. Is the intent to unlock a conditional border, or just link prom to the slaves?
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Re: Labyrinth [8/8] Pages 1/12

Postby IcePack on Wed Aug 08, 2012 9:00 pm

Personally, i'd like to see the map shifted to the left. it looks like the ABCDEF line is centered to fill up crappily used space, and the right side with your names is packed in...while all the other borders are "thin" and nice looking, the left looks terrible.

Either that, or add a row of territories somewhere so the left side shifts over and narrows the rock border a bit so its thinner all around.

I realize you can't shrink because you need the room in the writing area, but that left side rock / impassible areas just looks like you didn't know what to do with it and centered the writing to fill in space...and it doesn't do the job (very well).

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Re: Labyrinth [8/8] Pages 1/12

Postby nolefan5311 on Wed Aug 08, 2012 9:13 pm

IcePack wrote:
isaiah40 wrote:
IcePack wrote:4) Prom fire blocks all slave entrances, but you can't attack entrances without owning Prometheus first. Does this mean you must send ur troop stack thru Prometheus to hit an entrance? Or does be just unlock the ability to enter from the fire, where ur attack stack would need to be located? (or both?)

This could be a good conditional border. Just thinking out loud.


That's what I'm trying to clear up. Is the intent to unlock a conditional border, or just link prom to the slaves?


It's to unlock a conditional border. Prometheus can't attack the slave entrances directly, but you have to hold it to attack the slave entrance from the adjacent region.
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Re: Labyrinth [8/8] Pages 1/12

Postby IcePack on Wed Aug 08, 2012 9:30 pm

nolefan5311 wrote:
IcePack wrote:
isaiah40 wrote:
IcePack wrote:4) Prom fire blocks all slave entrances, but you can't attack entrances without owning Prometheus first. Does this mean you must send ur troop stack thru Prometheus to hit an entrance? Or does be just unlock the ability to enter from the fire, where ur attack stack would need to be located? (or both?)

This could be a good conditional border. Just thinking out loud.


That's what I'm trying to clear up. Is the intent to unlock a conditional border, or just link prom to the slaves?


It's to unlock a conditional border. Prometheus can't attack the slave entrances directly, but you have to hold it to attack the slave entrance from the adjacent region.


The current wording that isn't very clear. It highlights prometheus more than prom fire, which makes it sound like my stack my be on Prom himself to hit the entrances. I wouldn't think that prom fire was "unlocked" with the current wording.

Slave entrances can only be attacked FROM PROM FIRE once prom is held, would be much clearer (but take up more space.)
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Re: Labyrinth [8/8] Pages 1/12

Postby koontz1973 on Thu Aug 09, 2012 12:35 am

See how this grabs you all.
1) Siren call -1 per turn, is that -1 to the territory like Antarctica, or -1 to deploy?

Changed wording to show this
2) same for traps.

Changed wording to show this
but the beige blended so much in the legend

Changed to a yellow. Should be easier to see and colour blind friendly.
4) Prom fire blocks all slave entrances, but you can't attack entrances without owning Prometheus first. Does this mean you must send ur troop stack thru Prometheus to hit an entrance? Or does be just unlock the ability to enter from the fire, where ur attack stack would need to be located? (or both?)

Changed wording. Should be clear now?
5) Dead warriors + "3" (three), the upper part of the top ring is so faint its actually hard to tell its a 3.

Not changed as missed it. Will be done today.
This could be a good conditional border. Just thinking out loud.

It is, is it now clear that it is?
Personally, i'd like to see the map shifted to the left. it looks like the ABCDEF line is centered to fill up crappily used space, and the right side with your names is packed in...while all the other borders are "thin" and nice looking, the left looks terrible.
Either that, or add a row of territories somewhere so the left side shifts over and narrows the rock border a bit so its thinner all around.

The left side was always going to be bigger as it had the letters in. Andy got me to shrink them to half size so as to get more room in the legend. This made the left look bigger than it really was. Adding the line of territs cannot be done as it then makes the columns become an uneven number and would throw out of whack everything. I am 20 pixels shy of having 2 columns added but would resist this as again it would force a rethink and redraw of everything.

Things done.
Spear glow colour change. As stated, colour blind friendly.
Changed legend wording for some parts to clear up IcePacks confusion and show the conditional border better.
Added 40 pixels to the right side of the map. This has given the room for the above legend changes. Map now at 840/800. Small will have to go to 630/600.
Legend icons now bigger.
Conditional border and losing condition have had an increase in font size to make them stand out better.
Changed the auto deploy for the slave entrances from +2 to +1. With the fire and conditional border now in effect, players will most likely stack troops here and not come out once out.
Click image to enlarge.
image


To do list.
Put monster graphic on the right side of the walls to mirror the warriors on the left.
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Re: Labyrinth [9/8] Pages 1/13

Postby IcePack on Thu Aug 09, 2012 11:47 am

Looks much better. The yellow shows up on my 100% better, still hard to see / notice on the parchment below. You've made darker spots / areas on parchment to age it, perhaps you can age the area beneath the spears to make the yellow stand out a bit?

On traps, I think I would prefer "Traps -1 deploy" on line 1 and "each turn" centered line 2?
It's strange seeing just traps on one line and the description on the other wedged in, when you did the opposite for Prometheus fire. There you added kills to its line, when you could have fit it below. I just think it would look better visually.

Maybe contrast / darken the warriors in rock (didn't notice them @ first) as it still looks visually blank, and I'd like to see a nicer / more creative way to display your names. The way it is now just seems tacky/sloppy, but I don't have any hard specific suggestions fr improvement.

But I really like the improvements :)
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Re: Labyrinth [9/8] Pages 1/13

Postby koontz1973 on Thu Aug 09, 2012 12:11 pm

IcePack wrote:Looks much better. The yellow shows up on my 100% better, still hard to see / notice on the parchment below. You've made darker spots / areas on parchment to age it, perhaps you can age the area beneath the spears to make the yellow stand out a bit?

Can do.

On traps, I think I would prefer "Traps -1 deploy" on line 1 and "each turn" centered line 2?
It's strange seeing just traps on one line and the description on the other wedged in, when you did the opposite for Prometheus fire. There you added kills to its line, when you could have fit it below. I just think it would look better visually.

Again, can do.

Maybe contrast / darken the warriors in rock (didn't notice them @ first) as it still looks visually blank, and I'd like to see a nicer / more creative way to display your names. The way it is now just seems tacky/sloppy, but I don't have any hard specific suggestions fr improvement.

But I really like the improvements :)
IcePack

The warriors in the rock are not really meant to be seen straight out. They have been on since version 2 or 3 and you are the first person to notice them, and that may of been because I mentioned them. I do not want them brought out more though. Names where just put on like this for the very reason that they need to go on. This will be changed as it was only a quick one for spacing terms.

Thanks for popping back in.
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Re: Labyrinth [9/8] Pages 1/13

Postby IcePack on Thu Aug 09, 2012 12:24 pm

I noticed them before just didn't have much comment. The more I look at them, the more I think the bottom one should stay and the top one should go. It looks just like a copy paste to fill space.

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Re: Labyrinth [9/8] Pages 1/13

Postby koontz1973 on Fri Aug 10, 2012 3:22 am

Legend concerning in the spears should now be super clear. ;)
Removed the top warrior and added the Medusa on the right.
Sorted out the threes in the legend.
Click image to enlarge.
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Re: Labyrinth [10/8] Pages 1/13

Postby nolefan5311 on Fri Aug 10, 2012 6:24 am

It should be "Gaia and Arolus spears bombard their colored regions".
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Re: Labyrinth [10/8] Pages 1/13

Postby koontz1973 on Fri Aug 10, 2012 7:36 am

nolefan5311 wrote:It should be "Gaia and Arolus spears bombard their colored regions".

Will get that changed. But before I do, is there anything else?
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Re: Labyrinth [10/8] Pages 1/13

Postby nolefan5311 on Fri Aug 10, 2012 7:44 am

My name is spelled wrong in the top corner :D

I will get with ian to see if we can go ahead and get this one stamped again.
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Re: Labyrinth [10/8] Pages 1/13

Postby koontz1973 on Fri Aug 10, 2012 8:01 am

I am sure it is the other way around with your sig. :-s

Changed both spellings.
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Re: Labyrinth [10/8] Pages 1/13

Postby IcePack on Fri Aug 10, 2012 5:15 pm

Is it possible to get rid of the tiny bit(s) of white on Prom fire?
If its intended that way...ok, but to me it looks like a bad edit job whether intended or not.
I think it'd look more polished if that was corrected.

IcePack
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12:11:16 ‹Swifte› good thing we have the beta program to weed all these problems out
12:15:00 * IcePack joins Social
12:15:35 ‹Swifte› well that's just bad timing
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Re: Labyrinth [10/8] Pages 1/13

Postby koontz1973 on Sat Aug 11, 2012 12:02 am

IcePack wrote:Is it possible to get rid of the tiny bit(s) of white on Prom fire?
If its intended that way...ok, but to me it looks like a bad edit job whether intended or not.
I think it'd look more polished if that was corrected.

IcePack

I see what you mean. Never noticed it before but I can see how that would become annoying (to me that I see it). Will get it removed with the graphic polish.
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Re: Labyrinth [10/8] Pages 1/13

Postby IcePack on Sat Aug 11, 2012 12:11 am

koontz1973 wrote:
IcePack wrote:Is it possible to get rid of the tiny bit(s) of white on Prom fire?
If its intended that way...ok, but to me it looks like a bad edit job whether intended or not.
I think it'd look more polished if that was corrected.

IcePack

I see what you mean. Never noticed it before but I can see how that would become annoying (to me that I see it). Will get it removed with the graphic polish.


Also, is there a way to make the swords look "crisper"? Everything else looks bright and clean, while the swords look faded.
Again, you don't have to make all the changes obviously, just giving more feedback.
IcePack
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12:11:16 ‹Swifte› good thing we have the beta program to weed all these problems out
12:15:00 * IcePack joins Social
12:15:35 ‹Swifte› well that's just bad timing
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Re: Labyrinth [10/8] Pages 1/13

Postby koontz1973 on Sat Aug 11, 2012 12:28 am

IcePack wrote:
koontz1973 wrote:
IcePack wrote:Is it possible to get rid of the tiny bit(s) of white on Prom fire?
If its intended that way...ok, but to me it looks like a bad edit job whether intended or not.
I think it'd look more polished if that was corrected.

IcePack

I see what you mean. Never noticed it before but I can see how that would become annoying (to me that I see it). Will get it removed with the graphic polish.


Also, is there a way to make the swords look "crisper"? Everything else looks bright and clean, while the swords look faded.
Again, you don't have to make all the changes obviously, just giving more feedback.
IcePack


Will be done.
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Re: Labyrinth [10/8] Pages 1/13

Postby iancanton on Wed Aug 15, 2012 2:25 am

looking excellent. the only thing i'd do is to move the corner dead warrior bonuses one square toward the middle slave entrances. this is because the corner entrances already have the big advantage of being remote from attack, so they should not also have the additional advantage of being closer to the nearest dead warrior bonus. otherwise, i regard it as good for the gameplay stamp in all respects. alternatively, if u don't want to move the dead warriors, then have each of the four corner foods start as n2.

i'm not sure that it's possible to arrange for only the 4 corner entrances and nothing else to be occupied for 4-player games. if the corners are the 4 start positions with a maximum of 1 position each, then the other 4 entrances are shared equally among the players (though there's nothing wrong with that).

ian. :)
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