Fighting cooks.

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Fighting cooks.

Postby skychaser on Thu Oct 04, 2012 4:48 pm

I've been noticing a lot of people argue about some actions from people with lesser experience or strategic skills someone attacks other with no clear intent and the they would tell "Goddamn it Leeroy, why did you attack my Kamchacka"?
Well, sometimes it may have happened to you that a cook or a cadet attacked your spoils and let you in a crazy desire to jump into the computer monitor and break that one's computer and all of his belongings. Then when it happens one's got a lot of things to do.

- Foe that one, "he won't ruin my game anymore".
- Try reasoning with him "so he will not do this to me anymore".
- Join only the games where lieutenants are the lesser ranked one and never join a game where there are cooks.
- Adjust your strategy to a way where cooks will not do this to me again. Image

And you may think about another options but I think the harder but more fun of all is my fourth option, adjusting your strategy to play against anyone, may he have a cook hat or any other hat or badge.
But it's hard 'cause cooks are unpredictable right? Well, Not so much, at least I think.

Well the first thing I think you need to know then playing with cooks is the way to think when playing with them. In fact the very first thing is that cooks got a lot of action, you should want that action being beneficial to you. In other words You want the cook working for your very own victory.
There's a high probability the cook will f*ck someone and ruin his game, You must not let it be you.

There goes some tricks to get this result.
- Don't get in the way for he's got a job to do.
Yeah, let him alone. In big maps, you may even sacrifice some stack to him and it's still better than losing all chances of winning.
If for example, you have a stack of 8 at some place and you notice him stacking you have only two options, retreat or all in attack him. Once he exchanges 15 or more he will attack you anyway if you're a "threat".
Also this is true for Australia as an example, if he's stacking some armies in some Austalian territory you should NEVER stack at the vicinity, he will surely attack your stack counting with luck and then trying to get the profitable continent.
If he's fighting over a continent you should invest at another continent and retreat. Let him weaken the other players for you.

- Don't do half a job.
That's critical. If you're going to get a continent from him, never let some of his armies near. Be even more serious if he feel you're taking his continent and he feels like being robbed. If you're going to attack you should be serious to attack him till he's got no means to attack you at that place. Otherwise we will just cash and attack you regardless of how many reinforcements you place for protection.
If you take from him a continent, you want him causing havoc at another side of the map, maybe near you but you don't want him causing havoc at your countries.

Learn to retreat.
Sometimes you may see him gathering armies. Let's see you have South America and some stack at the African border and you see him gathering some army at Europe in the Classic map. What do you think he will do? Then you just guess he wants Africa. Well Africa have a little stack of other player. I have had some interesting results by retreating and letting the one guy just "take" Africa for him.
The point here is that number only matter to cooks when it's an absolute number, when you have more than twice his armies, otherwise he may attack you no matter what. If you could retreat and let him attack other people then it's the best to you.

Concede.
Don't be furious about someone getting continents. He's rampaging a lot it means he's doing a good job. Even better if it's foggy game. In this case you know his not letting any hostage alive.

Be diplomatic if possible.
Diplomacy have many uses, some of them are not perceived by many people. One must think outside the box to get the true meaning of diplomacy. Playing with cooks you must think over a way of making him work for you. that's it. He needs to feel safe from you and that's all.
Let's see an example: You have Australia(Classic Map) and the cook is gathering some armies near. You can propose him Europe. Just saying "Truce me cook, I left Europe for you and you let Australia to me".
He will understand this as literal, most people will do but in truth you want him to kill people at Europe for you and you're telling to everyone at the board that you will not stop him. You're basically double dipping here. You not only get Australia's bonuses but some people will HAVE to stop him getting Europe since you proposed you can't break the truce.
Some people that maybe got instigated by this. If you see someone making a seemingly retarded truce. Think TRICE my friend.

Position yourself at the board.
If you can play AFTER the ones you think will make a mistake(as in letting cards for you to take) then do it.It's a lot better play AFTER two cooks than after two Colonels or something.
You know Colonels are not likely to make mistakes you could profit but cooks will likely do that mistakes.
If there are two high officials playing after two cooks then your chances of victory at given game are almost zero.

=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=|
Well this is my first "guide". I'm open for critics so don't spare me. Also if you have some information or technique you may want to let me know. By all means, tell me.
And let me know if you liked this topic. Thank you to the ones who had or didn't have the patience of reading this one.
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Re: Fighting cooks.

Postby Funkyterrance on Thu Oct 04, 2012 6:30 pm

Lol, nice OP. This is probably mostly sound advice for dealing with most cooks. I found it very entertaining.
The first thing I thought of after reading was that truly wildcard cook who, for instance, wants to own Australia because he is from Australia in rl. He may be across the board but dammit, he's going to have Australia if it kills him. You could be settling in very nicely, feeling safe, when BOOM, here comes the cook, slamming through the front door, dirty smock flapping in the wind, cleaver chopping haphazardly. You notice his eyes behind the huge bushy beard and floppy hat and realize... he is quite insane.

Btw, I liked this topic. ;)
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Re: Fighting cooks.

Postby Dukasaur on Thu Oct 04, 2012 6:47 pm

I liked it. Very logical presentation.
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Re: Fighting cooks.

Postby puppydog85 on Sun Oct 07, 2012 9:00 am

In classic, I always try to avoid the cook. In oc and sa, I will break the no forting until round 4 rule and just get away from him.
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Re: Fighting cooks.

Postby Funkyterrance on Sun Oct 07, 2012 6:19 pm

puppydog85 wrote:In classic, I always try to avoid the cook. In oc and sa, I will break the no forting until round 4 rule and just get away from him.


This is a very rank-ist thread lol.
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Re: Fighting cooks.

Postby 72o on Sun Oct 07, 2012 8:51 pm

no forting until round 4? what kind of rule is that?
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Re: Fighting cooks.

Postby skychaser on Mon Oct 08, 2012 7:33 am

Funkyterrance wrote:
puppydog85 wrote:In classic, I always try to avoid the cook. In oc and sa, I will break the no forting until round 4 rule and just get away from him.


This is a very rank-ist thread lol.


We should fight for cooks rights lol

But the thing is that cooks only needs to win about 5 games playing with higher levels and they will get heavilly promoted. Being a Cook is a hard thing and an exception.
People don't like such exceptions.
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Re: Fighting cooks.

Postby Funkyterrance on Mon Oct 08, 2012 6:28 pm

skychaser wrote:
We should fight for cooks rights lol

But the thing is that cooks only needs to win about 5 games playing with higher levels and they will get heavilly promoted. Being a Cook is a hard thing and an exception.
People don't like such exceptions.


Very true.

Cooks can become higher rank very quickly given their skill allow it.
But there has to be that kind of cook who really does deserve the rank. What if someone is just really bad at risk? People don't like these exceptions either, they turn their own strategies upside-down, rocking their risk worlds. :)
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Re: Fighting cooks.

Postby 72o on Tue Oct 09, 2012 3:03 pm

Nobody answered me about the "no forting until round 4" rule. Is that a page out of that one guy's rule book no one else has ever heard of? It sounds like a stupid rule to me.

I prefer to foe cooks instead of trying to predict how their idiocy will manifest itself in this particular game and prepare for it.

For instance, I just had a rocket surgeon cash for 8 in an escalating classic game and take out 2 of an opponent's 3 remaining territories in an effort to claim Oceania, leaving this opponent with a single 4 stack and 3 spoils. The next player has 4 spoils and a stack right next to that 4 stack, so he can eliminate him without cashing, so he'll cash twice with his 7, meaning he can now eliminate me, with 25 troops and 5 spoils.

I would've been perfectly positioned to go on a run this turn, given my 5 spoils and a couple weak players, if this idiot hadn't decided that 2 bonus was too attractive to ignore.
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Re: Fighting cooks.

Postby Chewie1 on Tue Oct 09, 2012 4:15 pm

72o wrote:no forting until round 4? what kind of rule is that?



A crap one :oops:
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Re: Fighting cooks.

Postby Chewie1 on Tue Oct 09, 2012 4:16 pm

skychaser wrote:
Funkyterrance wrote:
puppydog85 wrote:In classic, I always try to avoid the cook. In oc and sa, I will break the no forting until round 4 rule and just get away from him.


This is a very rank-ist thread lol.


We should fight for cooks rights lol

But the thing is that cooks only needs to win about 5 games playing with higher levels and they will get heavilly promoted. Being a Cook is a hard thing and an exception.
People don't like such exceptions.



We were all cooks once :-$
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Re: Fighting cooks.

Postby agentcom on Tue Oct 09, 2012 9:39 pm

Chewie1 wrote:

We were all cooks once :-$


Not true
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Re: Fighting cooks.

Postby skychaser on Tue Oct 09, 2012 10:41 pm

72o There's not such a rule. If someone invented it that only means this guy doesn't know how to play.

Also. You will not always win. But I guess my tips will get you better probability, never competing is one of them.


Also, to be a cook you need to have 800 points, you are born with 100 and you got a chance go get more points as you are not ranked before you get some matches. I've never been a cook, nor a cadet for example.
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Re: Fighting cooks.

Postby Viceroy63 on Wed Oct 10, 2012 8:37 pm

Skychaser; you made a type-o. You are "born" or come into CC with 1,000 points not 100. So if you win your first few games you enter CC with a rank of Corporal but no higher I think.

also I agree with your cooks assessment and strategy. I personally do not Foe people for not knowing how to play, just their attitude. I also try to use their unexpected plays and just stay out of their way and try to be in a position where I can benefit from their recklessness. It comes down to knowing your opponents. That is the first step in strategy.

As to that "No Forting Rule" I never heard of that. I have heard of the F4M, (First 4 Moves). perhaps some one is confusing the F4M with some thing else. In fact, in escalating games, forting or reinforcing your position with troops from an adjacent or nearby region, right from the start, is the best thing that you can do to avoid being removed from an area. Sometimes players, and not just necessarily cooks but even high ranking players will take their chances and go 6v3. And sometimes they get lucky and win. So reinforcing your position right from the start is always one's best bet.

Skychaser; I see that you are relatively new to the site just like I am but you have a deep understanding of principles of strategy. Have you ever thought of a clan? AQoH, (A Question Of Honour), is also a relatively new clan looking for players just like you. You can do well in a clan that is looking to be at the top of the food chain by turning good players into top players.

Check us out and let us know.
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Re: Fighting cooks.

Postby puppydog85 on Thu Oct 11, 2012 7:14 am

72o wrote:no forting until round 4? what kind of rule is that?



Well, when I was learning to play esc. the best place to learn was stringybeany's thread. I exaggerated slightly but the general idea was to not stack so early on in the game.
Here is the link. http://www.conquerclub.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=58&t=28523

Yes, this is a rankist thread. The problem with racism is extrapolating data from totally irrelevant data (color of skin). We are talking about the quality of play here and your ranking is most certainly relevant to the discussion.
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Re: Fighting cooks.

Postby 72o on Thu Oct 11, 2012 11:29 am

puppydog85 wrote:
72o wrote:no forting until round 4? what kind of rule is that?



Well, when I was learning to play esc. the best place to learn was stringybeany's thread. I exaggerated slightly but the general idea was to not stack so early on in the game.
Here is the link. http://www.conquerclub.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=58&t=28523

Yes, this is a rankist thread. The problem with racism is extrapolating data from totally irrelevant data (color of skin). We are talking about the quality of play here and your ranking is most certainly relevant to the discussion.


"DO NOT GATHER YOUR TROOPS INTO PILES"?!

WTF? That's what you're supposed to do. Maybe stringy should leave the strategy guides to the strategerists.
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Re: Fighting cooks.

Postby Funkyterrance on Thu Oct 11, 2012 11:50 am

agentcom wrote:
Chewie1 wrote:

We were all cooks once :-$


Not true


This is true, you could win enough of your "?" games to go boom straight over cook rank.
I was a cook once though. ;)
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Re: Fighting cooks.

Postby skychaser on Thu Oct 11, 2012 12:47 pm

Viceroy63 wrote:Skychaser; you made a type-o. You are "born" or come into CC with 1,000 points not 100. So if you win your first few games you enter CC with a rank of Corporal but no higher I think.

also I agree with your cooks assessment and strategy. I personally do not Foe people for not knowing how to play, just their attitude. I also try to use their unexpected plays and just stay out of their way and try to be in a position where I can benefit from their recklessness. It comes down to knowing your opponents. That is the first step in strategy.
Know thy enemy and know yourself and in a hundred battles you will never be in peril - Sun Tzu.
If The Greatest Strategist(aside from Zhuge Liang from the Romance) says so I can't say otherwise, that's it.


Skychaser; I see that you are relatively new to the site just like I am but you have a deep understanding of principles of strategy. Have you ever thought of a clan? AQoH, (A Question Of Honour), is also a relatively new clan looking for players just like you. You can do well in a clan that is looking to be at the top of the food chain by turning good players into top players.

Check us out and let us know.

I shall check it out.
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Re: Fighting cooks.

Postby skychaser on Thu Oct 11, 2012 5:02 pm

I think my first rank was corporal. Don't remember too well for I didn't understand ranking at that time.
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Re: Fighting cooks.

Postby spiesr on Fri Oct 12, 2012 12:12 am

skychaser wrote:I think my first rank was corporal. Don't remember too well for I didn't understand ranking at that time.
Not possible. To be of Corporal rank or higher you must have 10 completed games. Once a New Recruit has finished 5 games they become one of the following depending on points: Cook, Cadet, Private, Private 1st Class.
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Re: Fighting cooks.

Postby Viceroy63 on Sat Oct 13, 2012 5:59 pm

I left my comments in that other thread as pertaining to that strategy. Here is the link below...

viewtopic.php?f=58&t=28523&p=3923486#p3923486

But that guy, the OP, (Original Poster) did not know the best strategy to escalating spoils game. And since others called him on that then I felt no need to join in the pouncing. =)
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Re: Fighting cooks.

Postby puppydog85 on Mon Oct 15, 2012 9:30 pm

Viceroy63 wrote:I left my comments in that other thread as pertaining to that strategy. Here is the link below...

viewtopic.php?f=58&t=28523&p=3923486#p3923486


You do realize that the last post on that thread was made in 2008? I doubt anybody reads it anymore.
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Re: Fighting cooks.

Postby Viceroy63 on Tue Oct 16, 2012 3:19 pm

LOL. Oops; Did not see that part. :D

But as I understand it, when ever a comment is made, even on an old thread, it is surfaced to the top of the thread!? I could be wrong. But anyways' it was mentioned in this thread so I figured, why not address it in that one?

It is interesting to note that the SoC was in formation about that time and so the strategy that people had were not yet evolved to perfection. That explains the erroneous strategy that the OP had at the time. His rank now suggest that he learned his lesson well. =)
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Re: Fighting cooks.

Postby skychaser on Wed Oct 17, 2012 12:19 pm

When was this site launched?
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Re: Fighting cooks.

Postby agentcom on Wed Oct 17, 2012 9:31 pm

ca. 2006, I believe
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