Gaza-Israel Ceasefire: Prison Conditions on Gaza Lifted

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Gaza-Israel Ceasefire: Prison Conditions on Gaza Lifted

Postby GreecePwns on Wed Nov 14, 2012 4:55 pm

As if penning the Palestinians in the world's largest prison wasn't enough, the IDF decided they might as well repeatedly stomp on their throats while they're at it.

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/11/15/world/middleeast/israeli-strike-in-gaza-kills-the-military-leader-of-hamas.html?pagewanted=all

Voters for Obama and Romney, please submit your written apologies for your acceptance of worse-than-apartheid conditions in Palestine below.
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Re: Another Round of Israeli Attacks on Gaza

Postby Phatscotty on Wed Nov 14, 2012 4:57 pm

are those the attacks where buses of civilians are blown up and the explosives are packed with ball bearings and nails?
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Re: Another Round of Israeli Attacks on Gaza

Postby GreecePwns on Wed Nov 14, 2012 5:02 pm

They don't need to do that. They can rain death from above with drones and other aircraft.
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Re: Another Round of Israeli Attacks on Gaza

Postby Phatscotty on Wed Nov 14, 2012 5:02 pm

oops, jumped to conclusions. I see now that a military target was eliminated
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Re: Another Round of Israeli Attacks on Gaza

Postby thegreekdog on Wed Nov 14, 2012 5:03 pm

GreecePwns wrote:Voters for Obama and Romney, please submit your written apologies for your acceptance of worse-than-apartheid conditions in Palestine below.


I read this and I was all like "f*ck you GP" and then I realized I voted for Gary Johnson and can be sufficiently smug.

Carry on.
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Re: Another Round of Israeli Attacks on Gaza

Postby Phatscotty on Wed Nov 14, 2012 5:04 pm

Wasn't this a response to some rocket attacks or something?
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Re: Another Round of Israeli Attacks on Gaza

Postby GreecePwns on Wed Nov 14, 2012 5:20 pm

It kinda sorta works like this Scotty: Israel operates Gaza like an open-air prison. They control all materials and people moving in and out. The Palestinians, having had their land taken away and continually considered inmates and lesser human beings by the Jewish population, respond how any sensible population would: fighting to take their land back and remove Israel from it. This is usually done by Hamas through rocket attacks. Israel sees this as an act of war and responds accordingly.

Of course mainstream political discussions in America operate based on this: Israel operates Gaza. The Palestinians respond by fighting and try to remove Israel from it. This is usually done by Hamas through rocket attacks. Israel sees this as an act of war and responds accordingly.

Because if anyone in Congress dares point out the rest of the facts, the Israel lobby will ensure they don't see the light of day come the following election.

But this is all unimportant, because the very nature of the formation of Israel (through land forcibly taken from the Palestinians) makes the existence of Israel invalid. The belief that the Jews are a chosen people that deserve that specific land (Zionism) is an invalid belief as well. Heck, the Zionists even turned down offers to form their nation in Kenya or Uganda because apparently that land wasn't good enough for them.
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Re: Another Round of Israeli Attacks on Gaza

Postby saxitoxin on Wed Nov 14, 2012 5:35 pm

GreecePwns wrote:As if penning the Palestinians in the world's largest prison wasn't enough, the IDF decided they might as well repeatedly stomp on their throats while they're at it.

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/11/15/world/middleeast/israeli-strike-in-gaza-kills-the-military-leader-of-hamas.html?pagewanted=all

Voters for Obama and Romney, please submit your written apologies for your acceptance of worse-than-apartheid conditions in Palestine below.


A good post by GP. As I read the article, in response to a resistance attack that killed 0, Israel killed 5 non-combatants. IIRC, didn't the Nazis kill 10 civilians for every SS trooper that was killed by resistance fighters?

I'm not good at math so I don't know how to represent 0-5 vs. 1-10. Either Israel is only 50% as bad as the Nazis, or is 100% as bad as the Nazis, I think?
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Re: Another Round of Israeli Attacks on Gaza

Postby MegaProphet on Wed Nov 14, 2012 5:39 pm

GreecePwns wrote:It kinda sorta works like this Scotty: Israel operates Gaza like an open-air prison. They control all materials and people moving in and out. The Palestinians, having had their land taken away and continually considered inmates and lesser human beings by the Jewish population, respond how any sensible population would: fighting to take their land back and remove Israel from it. This is usually done by Hamas through rocket attacks. Israel sees this as an act of war and responds accordingly.

Of course mainstream political discussions in America operate based on this: Israel operates Gaza. The Palestinians respond by fighting and try to remove Israel from it. This is usually done by Hamas through rocket attacks. Israel sees this as an act of war and responds accordingly.

Because if anyone in Congress dares point out the rest of the facts, the Israel lobby will ensure they don't see the light of day come the following election.

But this is all unimportant, because the very nature of the formation of Israel (through land forcibly taken from the Palestinians) makes the existence of Israel invalid. The belief that the Jews are a chosen people that deserve that specific land (Zionism) is an invalid belief as well. Heck, the Zionists even turned down offers to form their nation in Kenya or Uganda because apparently that land wasn't good enough for them.

Why and how is the Isreal lobby so in control of our election results?
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Re: Another Round of Israeli Attacks on Gaza

Postby GreecePwns on Wed Nov 14, 2012 5:50 pm

Let's start with the fact that 99% of Congress is already Zionist, some vehemently so.

The Israel lobby includes the Jewish population in America, the entirety of the neo-conservative movement, Evangelical Christians, etc. etc. In other words, a group so awash with cash that they can easily influence any election they want to.

And let's say the token anti-Zionist is elected, will their opinions ever be heard when its 537 vs. 1?
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Re: Another Round of Israeli Attacks on Gaza

Postby Night Strike on Thu Nov 15, 2012 12:54 pm

Israel used a precision strike to take out the military leader of Hamas. Hamas responded by indiscriminately launching rockets into civilian neighborhoods (as they have done thousands of times before). Let's quit acting like these two groups of people are morally equivalent because they clearly are not!
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Re: Another Round of Israeli Attacks on Gaza

Postby bedub1 on Thu Nov 15, 2012 1:07 pm

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Re: Another Round of Israeli Attacks on Gaza

Postby _sabotage_ on Thu Nov 15, 2012 1:23 pm

1920 Israel population: 100,000 Jews, 600,000 Arabs
1948. 600,000. 1,200,000
Today. 6,000,000. 1,600,000
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Re: Another Round of Israeli Attacks on Gaza

Postby GreecePwns on Thu Nov 15, 2012 1:24 pm

Night Strike wrote:Israel used a precision strike to take out the military leader of Hamas. Hamas responded by indiscriminately launching rockets into civilian neighborhoods (as they have done thousands of times before). Let's quit acting like these two groups of people are morally equivalent because they clearly are not!


Of course they aren't, no one's pretending. The Palestinians are not the ones who took away Israeli land through the use of brute force.

The Israeli civilians, by their enthusiastic support of penning Arabs into a prison, their participation in the violent seizing of Palestinian land and their racist ravings of "demographic threats" - literally the fear of a growing Palestinian population - (which has led the IDF to destroy schools and basic infrastructure) are morally beneath Palestinians, who fight back in response to their land being taken away.

The stop just short outright slaughtering the Palestinians in order to not be condemned by the international community elite (namely the US), whose quite acceptance they depend on for their very salvation as a state just as apartheid South Africa did.

Israel's operates espionage targeting the US more frequently than any other country, and Israel has a history of killing American civilians. How many times has Hamas done either of these? How about Fatah or the rest of the PLO? Zero. And you want to call Israel our greatest ally?

They certainly aren't morally equivalent.
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Re: Another Round of Israeli Attacks on Gaza

Postby saxitoxin on Thu Nov 15, 2012 1:29 pm

GreecePwns wrote:
Night Strike wrote:Israel used a precision strike to take out the military leader of Hamas. Hamas responded by indiscriminately launching rockets into civilian neighborhoods (as they have done thousands of times before). Let's quit acting like these two groups of people are morally equivalent because they clearly are not!


Of course they aren't, no one's pretending. The Palestinians are not the ones who took away Israeli land through the use of brute force.

The Israeli civilians, by their enthusiastic support of penning Arabs into a prison, their participation in the violent seizing of Palestinian land and their racist ravings of "demographic threats" (which has led the IDF to destroy schools and basic infrastructure) are morally beneath Palestinians, who fight back in response to their land being taken away.

They certainly aren't morally equivalent.


+10,000 SxB

I always find it amazing that patriotic Americans are content with their country being relegated to nothing more than the obedient, barking dog of a tiny desert nation. Israel would throw the U.S. into a wood chipper without a second thought if they thought it would benefit them; but the U.S. is willing to lay in the middle of traffic for Israel --->

It is a sad but proven fact that the Israeli government also has obtained secret U.S. military technology which Israel has sold to other countries. For example, after the U.S. sent Patriot missile defense batteries on an emergency basis to help defend Israel during the Gulf War, the Israelis seem to have sold the Patriot missile technology to China, according to the U.S. State Department’s inspector general. As a result, the U.S. has been forced to develop a whole new generation of missile technology able to penetrate the defenses China has developed as a result of the Israeli treachery.

http://www.councilforthenationalinteres ... upthecosts
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Re: Another Round of Israeli Attacks on Gaza

Postby bedub1 on Thu Nov 15, 2012 1:32 pm

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Re: Another Round of Israeli Attacks on Gaza

Postby saxitoxin on Thu Nov 15, 2012 1:45 pm

bedub1 wrote:Can somebody make a chart of these most recent attacks? IE Israel killed 15 people, Palestine shot 150 rockets, 140 were shot down, 10 made it through , 3 people received minor injuries. (These numbers are fictitious)

I want to see a break down of attacks, casualties etc.


The Monitor had a good breakdown of the situation (http://www.csmonitor.com/World/Backchan ... -this-year) -

    November 8 - an Israeli terrorist cell illegally crosses the border into Gaza and is immediately repulsed by the Popular Committees for Resistance

    November 8 (later) - Israeli terrorists retaliate by killing 12 year-old Ahmed Abu Dagah

    November 10 - despite heightened tension, Israel sends another terrorist cell to the edge of the border, Palestinian self-defense forces engage

    November 10 (later) - Israeli terrorists retaliate by launching an artillery barrage that kills four people at a youth soccer game and one Palestinian soldier

    November 11 - Palestinian self-defense forces respond by firing 100 rockets at Israel (due to the U.S. sponsored arms ban on Gaza, Palestinian rockets do not have sophisticated guidance systems and aren't able to target Israeli terrorist training camps with pinpoint accuracy so some fall astray)

    November 14 - Israel launches a terror attack against Palestinian government leaders, killing the Minister of Defense and a dozen bystanders

    November 15 - Palestinian self-defense forces respond by firing 275 rockets at Israel
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Re: Another Round of Israeli Attacks on Gaza

Postby AndyDufresne on Thu Nov 15, 2012 1:45 pm

Wikipedia already has an article on this, yowza: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Pillar_of_Cloud

This is from the opening summary:

Palestinian militants fired 250 rockets into Israel killing three civilians and injuring over thirty. In response the IDF attacked Palestinian militants killing 11 militants, four civilians were killed in collateral damage. The hostilities marked the first time that rockets were launched from Gaza toward the Tel Aviv metropolitan area, Israel's largest.



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Re: Another Round of Israeli Attacks on Gaza

Postby _sabotage_ on Thu Nov 15, 2012 1:46 pm

Bedub, imagine you're 450 rounds into a game, you have 6 times the troops and all the bonuses and then 6 rounds later your opponent has 3 times the troops and all the bonuses. Those wouldn't have been a good 6 rounds for you.
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Re: Another Round of Israeli Attacks on Gaza

Postby saxitoxin on Thu Nov 15, 2012 1:54 pm

AndyDufresne wrote:Operation_Pillar_of_Cloud


Even the name of their attack is a reference to their religious zealotry. The Israelis are convinced they are implementing the will of God, like any run of the mill cult. See Exodus - http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?se ... ersion=NIV
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Re: Another Round of Israeli Attacks on Gaza

Postby smegal69 on Thu Nov 15, 2012 2:03 pm

saxitoxin wrote:
bedub1 wrote:Can somebody make a chart of these most recent attacks? IE Israel killed 15 people, Palestine shot 150 rockets, 140 were shot down, 10 made it through , 3 people received minor injuries. (These numbers are fictitious)

I want to see a break down of attacks, casualties etc.


The Monitor had a good breakdown of the situation (http://www.csmonitor.com/World/Backchan ... -this-year) -

    November 8 - an Israeli terrorist cell illegally crosses the border into Gaza and is immediately repulsed by the Popular Committees for Resistance

    November 8 (later) - Israeli terrorists retaliate by killing 12 year-old Ahmed Abu Dagah

    November 10 - despite heightened tension, Israel sends another terrorist cell to the edge of the border, Palestinian self-defense forces engage

    November 10 (later) - Israeli terrorists retaliate by launching an artillery barrage that kills four people at a youth soccer game and one Palestinian soldier

    November 11 - Palestinian self-defense forces respond by firing 100 rockets at Israel (due to the U.S. sponsored arms ban on Gaza, Palestinian rockets do not have sophisticated guidance systems and aren't able to target Israeli terrorist training camps with pinpoint accuracy so some fall astray)

    November 14 - Israel launches a terror attack against Palestinian government leaders, killing the Minister of Defense and a dozen bystanders

    November 15 - Palestinian self-defense forces respond by firing 275 rockets at Israel


+1 =D>

Palestinian self-defense forces have rearmed and ready to repel Israel terror attacks
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Re: Another Round of Israeli Attacks on Gaza

Postby Funkyterrance on Thu Nov 15, 2012 2:07 pm

saxitoxin wrote:
AndyDufresne wrote:Operation_Pillar_of_Cloud


Even the name of their attack is a reference to their religious zealotry. The Israelis are convinced they are implementing the will of God, like any run of the mill cult. See Exodus - http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?se ... ersion=NIV


I think it's a pretty cool name. :|
You've gotta give them points for style.
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Re: Another Round of Israeli Attacks on Gaza

Postby bedub1 on Thu Nov 15, 2012 2:34 pm

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Re: Another Round of Israeli Attacks on Gaza

Postby Dukasaur on Thu Nov 15, 2012 2:41 pm

If my neighbour was trying to kill me and I happened to have a rocket launcher available, I would use it. There's no keeping score when you're trying to survive and someone else is trying to kill you. You either succeed in saving yourself or you don't.
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Re: Another Round of Israeli Attacks on Gaza

Postby bedub1 on Thu Nov 15, 2012 3:03 pm

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Last edited by bedub1 on Tue Jun 25, 2013 10:51 am, edited 1 time in total.
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