[Site] Normalize Player Ratings (Average = 0)

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Should we change the rating system, or leave it as it is?

Yes, change it.
76
52%
No, leave it.
70
48%
 
Total votes : 146

Re: Normalize Player Ratings (Average = 0)

Postby macbone on Wed Dec 05, 2012 12:08 pm

Victor Sullivan wrote:Image

-Sully


QFT

If I see an Ebay seller at 94%, I'm not buying a thing they're selling.
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Re: Normalize Player Ratings (Average = 0)

Postby Funkyterrance on Wed Dec 12, 2012 2:38 am

I miss Sully. :(
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Re: Normalize Player Ratings (Average = 0)

Postby bigWham on Tue Sep 24, 2013 1:12 am

This Suggestion has been moved from Submitted with Questions:

- Setting a default rating of 0 will tend to penalize players that play more games. This needs resolution.
- Clarify the problem that this suggestion is solving and whether or not there are simpler solutions (For example, wording changes to the ratings)
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Re: Normalize Player Ratings (Average = 0)

Postby Metsfanmax on Sat Dec 14, 2013 5:59 pm

bigWham wrote:This Suggestion has been moved from Submitted with Questions:

- Setting a default rating of 0 will tend to penalize players that play more games. This needs resolution.


No, it will not, to zeroth order. If we assume that the rating rate is constant among all types of players, then people who play lots of games will receive the same percentage of ratings from their games as people who play few games. It is that percentage that matters in calculating the rating, not the absolute number of ratings the player receives.

I think the first order effect is not likely to penalize them either, since people who play lots of games are probably at least as likely to leave ratings on games as people who don't, and they may even leave ratings more often (due to, say, wanting to obtain the ratings medal, etc.).

- Clarify the problem that this suggestion is solving and whether or not there are simpler solutions (For example, wording changes to the ratings)


There are not simpler solutions because people will always rate other players too high if there is a negative incentive for rating players too low (peer pressure). The wording itself is accurate -- it's just that people ignore the wording.
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Re: Normalize Player Ratings (Average = 0)

Postby bigWham on Sat Dec 14, 2013 11:12 pm

Metsfanmax wrote:
bigWham wrote:This Suggestion has been moved from Submitted with Questions:

- Setting a default rating of 0 will tend to penalize players that play more games. This needs resolution.


No, it will not, to zeroth order. If we assume that the rating rate is constant among all types of players, then people who play lots of games will receive the same percentage of ratings from their games as people who play few games. It is that percentage that matters in calculating the rating, not the absolute number of ratings the player receives.

I think the first order effect is not likely to penalize them either, since people who play lots of games are probably at least as likely to leave ratings on games as people who don't, and they may even leave ratings more often (due to, say, wanting to obtain the ratings medal, etc.).

- Clarify the problem that this suggestion is solving and whether or not there are simpler solutions (For example, wording changes to the ratings)


There are not simpler solutions because people will always rate other players too high if there is a negative incentive for rating players too low (peer pressure). The wording itself is accurate -- it's just that people ignore the wording.


ok, this is fair enough and i do see the point. if i were implementing a rating system from scratch i would do it this way... however it is going to very difficult to prioritize the effort required to make this change. these types of 'inflated' rating systems are actually more the rule than the exception for better or worse.
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Re: Normalize Player Ratings (Average = 0)

Postby Metsfanmax on Sat Dec 14, 2013 11:21 pm

bigWham wrote:ok, this is fair enough and i do see the point. if i were implementing a rating system from scratch i would do it this way... however it is going to very difficult to prioritize the effort required to make this change.


I understand that this is not going to be high on the priority list, but I still think it's the right thing to do so I wanted to leave it in Submitted either way. I don't think saying 'we can never do this' is valid because it implies that we do not care that much about the meaningfulness of our rating system (so then why do we have one?). I'll let you decide if and when you think this fits in your development schedule. If you prefer to formally veto it on grounds that it is less important than other things, please say so and move it to Rejected.
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Re: Normalize Player Ratings (Average = 0)

Postby bigWham on Sat Dec 14, 2013 11:46 pm

Metsfanmax wrote:
bigWham wrote:ok, this is fair enough and i do see the point. if i were implementing a rating system from scratch i would do it this way... however it is going to very difficult to prioritize the effort required to make this change.


I understand that this is not going to be high on the priority list, but I still think it's the right thing to do so I wanted to leave it in Submitted either way. I don't think saying 'we can never do this' is valid because it implies that we do not care that much about the meaningfulness of our rating system (so then why do we have one?). I'll let you decide if and when you think this fits in your development schedule. If you prefer to formally veto it on grounds that it is less important than other things, please say so and move it to Rejected.


no that is fair and in keeping with our current system. environmental changes or strategic considerations may make this (or any other suggestion) take on greater importance at any point in time, so it is great to have them in submitted awaiting the tide to turn in their favor.
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Re: [Site] Normalize Player Ratings (Average = 0)

Postby Gweeedo on Sun Dec 15, 2013 5:48 pm

I have not played much, compared to some of you.

I never look at another players rating before a game...do you (honestly)?
The only time I view a players rating (score) is if they appear in chat.
Depending on the degree of their outburst, I can figure out what I should expect their Score to be...before I look at it.

It is crazy how Different a player with a 4.1 will act compared to a player with a score of say 3.9

I like the current system, It tells me what I need to know and how I should react to any given player (at just one glance)
You get asses 4.4 but you are able to (communicate) deal with them
Or you get just plain jerks 4.3 Not able to understand anything you have to say.
Suicidal or vindictive 4.0
Best to foe players with a 3.9 Just temporarily...so you don't have to listen to them in chat.

When somebody speaks of game play operations (while in game) you can use rating score to see if they are to be trusted (telling the truth).

I rather like this system.
Once I figured out its usefulness, My game play was much more enjoyable and my score has sky rocketed!
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Re: [Site] Normalize Player Ratings (Average = 0)

Postby degaston on Sun Dec 15, 2013 8:40 pm

I voted yes to bring the poll to a 67-67 tie. :twisted:

I think all you really need to ask is: "Would you play this person again (Yes or No)?". If you're not sure, then don't rate them and it won't affect their score. A person's rating would be their percent of "Yes" votes. This would keep the feel of the current system, as most good players will probably have a >97% approval rating. (How bad do you have to be to piss off more than 3 out of every 100 people you play?) You could still collect additional information, though I think that a lot of the explanatory tags are redundant. Another change might be to have the ratings be weighted so that recent ratings affect your score more than older ones.
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Re: [Site] Normalize Player Ratings (Average = 0)

Postby wrestler1ump on Tue Dec 17, 2013 7:32 pm

Go back to feedback but have it not moderated. This will mean some unfair feedbacks but it will be consistent for everyone.

Or allow people to give each person they play a negative, neutral, or positive. Then they can still use the words that are currently used.

Anything is better than this rating system where few people are using it the way it should be, with the majority only giving out 1's or 5's.
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Re: [Site] Normalize Player Ratings (Average = 0)

Postby Hobbit Lord on Thu Dec 19, 2013 1:08 pm

Agree with the idea, except that not rating should not count at all

The 'average' rating should be the average of... ratings... not the average including unrated games



'YES' is winning 69 vs 68
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Re: [Site] Normalize Player Ratings (Average = 0)

Postby wrestler1ump on Thu Dec 19, 2013 8:30 pm

I think you'll need a much bigger ratio of yes to nos to convince the moderators to change the rating system. I would look for an 80% in favour of change if any changes were to be made.
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Re: [Site] Normalize Player Ratings (Average = 0)

Postby JoshyBoy on Sun Dec 22, 2013 5:31 am

The way the current ratings system is used is fucking stupid. That's a fact.
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Re: [Site] Normalize Player Ratings (Average = 0)

Postby JoshyBoy on Sun Dec 22, 2013 5:34 am

wrestler1ump wrote:Or allow people to give each person they play a negative, neutral, or positive. Then they can still use the words that are currently used.


That is a much, much better idea than the stars system.
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Re: [Site] Normalize Player Ratings (Average = 0)

Postby thaddeas on Tue Jan 28, 2014 3:54 am

The ratings submitted by each individual should be normalized instead of normalizing the total cc community ratings. This way, regardless if an individual tends to give more above or below average ratings, all the ratings given by them will average the cc community's definition of "average". This method would also effectively normalize the total cc community ratings, since each contributors average rating would be the same. Also, each individual's submissions could be adjusted to fit a standard bell curve, making sure a person who gives predominantly 1s and 5s wouldn't skew the data more than a person who predominantly gives 2s and 4s. The average deviation between each grouping of three rating types could be calculated for each individual, then adjusted to match the average deviation between rating type groupings for the entire cc community. This third adjustment would magnify differences between the three rating types given for individuals that tend to give the same, or similar ratings for the three types. All said and done, people could fill in ratings intuitively without messing up the rating system.
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