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Colorado passes legalization of recreational pot,

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Re: Colorado passes legalization of recreational pot,

Postby MegaProphet on Sat Dec 08, 2012 6:27 pm

Phatscotty wrote:
crispybits wrote:Also, cigarettes aren't easy for people to grow in their basement or cupboard. Pot is. The existing black market will regulate the emerging white market in terms of price to start with and that effect wasnt present for cigarettes to the same extent (illegal smuggled ones from Mexico or wherever notwithstanding, there weren't growers in every town)


Forgive me I do not recall the proper terminology I am trying to describe, but it's the kind of market where it doesn't matter how much something cost to produce/distribute, it mostly matters how much you can get for it/how much people are willing to pay, or more specifically how much you need for it.

Think of a passport, or a drivers license. Does it really cost 135$/28$ to produce? Or even a Louis Vuitton bag...

Smoking/buying/growing marijuana, even after legalization, will be considered a privilege/luxury Prices can get pretty blurry in this area. If I can make a summary/comparison, the same thing that happened to the price of tobacco and cigarettes will happen to marijuana.

Why would marijuana be considered a luxury product? It isn't an established brand like Louis Vuitton and it doesn't require being authorized by the government like a passport or drivers license. I'm having difficulty finding examples of cigarette prices doubling or tripling. The most I can find is the fact that prices increased due to trusts early in the 20th century. Can you point me to your source?
Again I'm curious what you suggest to keep prices from rising? I think the possibility of going to jail is a much heftier price than any tax
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Re: Colorado passes legalization of recreational pot,

Postby Phatscotty on Sat Dec 08, 2012 6:30 pm

The source is a pack of cigarettes costed 2$ a few year ago, and now they are 5-7$ In New York, they are 10$.
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Re: Colorado passes legalization of recreational pot,

Postby MegaProphet on Sat Dec 08, 2012 6:51 pm

Phatscotty wrote:The source is a pack of cigarettes costed 2$ a few year ago, and now they are 5-7$ In New York, they are 10$.

Ah, I didn't realize you meant recently. I don't have much experience with cigarettes
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Re: Colorado passes legalization of recreational pot,

Postby Phatscotty on Sat Dec 08, 2012 7:00 pm

MegaProphet wrote:
Phatscotty wrote:The source is a pack of cigarettes costed 2$ a few year ago, and now they are 5-7$ In New York, they are 10$.

Ah, I didn't realize you meant recently. I don't have much experience with cigarettes


It's a key example that my opinions are based on. I'm gonna go bag me some poon in a bit here, but I'll try to bring up some links tomorrow.
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Re: Colorado passes legalization of recreational pot,

Postby Nola_Lifer on Sat Dec 08, 2012 7:46 pm

Phatscotty wrote:
Nola_Lifer wrote:What scientist would you call in that cost 200k a year? This is a plant like any other crop that can be grown. Marijuana growers are as serious about their plants as tomato growers. There isn't that much regulation on growing a farm unless your trying to get certified organic. So scientist, laboratories and warehouses are out of the question unless you see marijuana grown on a large more corporate/industrial scale. Transportation won't be a problem either because of the proximity of growers to urban areas. Lets face it you can grow this shit in you back yard or in a closet at a very low cost. The people who will reap the most reward will be the hemp growers but this isn't what we are talking about. :D

The prices will most likely be the same, if anything they will drop. You will have lots of people treating this as a gold rush so more people will grow weed who weren't before, regardless of whether they smoke it or not. You will also see more dispensaries which probably won't be as regulated as most tobacco shops. You'll probably find that most tobacco shops will be ahead of the games due to the similar products.


Beer brewers are serious about their beer too. It doesn't make them competitors in the marketplace


Marijuana is a crop. Beer is a mix of crops. Even if you have to buy those items it is pretty cheap to brew your own beer. The prices won't change that much. Even if they do people will still buy it. You'd be surprised on how easy it is to grow. Also the curing process isn't that difficult either.
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Re: Colorado passes legalization of recreational pot,

Postby Funkyterrance on Sat Dec 08, 2012 7:50 pm

Nola_Lifer wrote:
Phatscotty wrote:
Nola_Lifer wrote:What scientist would you call in that cost 200k a year? This is a plant like any other crop that can be grown. Marijuana growers are as serious about their plants as tomato growers. There isn't that much regulation on growing a farm unless your trying to get certified organic. So scientist, laboratories and warehouses are out of the question unless you see marijuana grown on a large more corporate/industrial scale. Transportation won't be a problem either because of the proximity of growers to urban areas. Lets face it you can grow this shit in you back yard or in a closet at a very low cost. The people who will reap the most reward will be the hemp growers but this isn't what we are talking about. :D

The prices will most likely be the same, if anything they will drop. You will have lots of people treating this as a gold rush so more people will grow weed who weren't before, regardless of whether they smoke it or not. You will also see more dispensaries which probably won't be as regulated as most tobacco shops. You'll probably find that most tobacco shops will be ahead of the games due to the similar products.


Beer brewers are serious about their beer too. It doesn't make them competitors in the marketplace


Marijuana is a crop. Beer is a mix of crops. Even if you have to buy those items it is pretty cheap to brew your own beer. The prices won't change that much. Even if they do people will still buy it. You'd be surprised on how easy it is to grow. Also the curing process isn't that difficult either.


No one is questioning your expertise in the matter but we are talking about economics here. I've been thinking on this and the price will actually most likely stay pretty high, regardless of the ease of production. It's going to be regulated so the red tape will prevail.
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Postby 2dimes on Sat Dec 08, 2012 7:53 pm

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Re: Colorado passes legalization of recreational pot,

Postby Phatscotty on Sat Dec 08, 2012 8:48 pm

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Re: Colorado passes legalization of recreational pot,

Postby Nola_Lifer on Sat Dec 08, 2012 9:17 pm

Phatscotty wrote:Image


Point of this is?????

I just don't seem the prices going up unless they price fix or allocate a random number of distributes.
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Re: Colorado passes legalization of recreational pot,

Postby patches70 on Sat Dec 08, 2012 10:36 pm

I don't know about the current prices of weed through the illegal drug trade. Thing is, since it's illegal, the drug dealers have the monopoly on the prices. Weed was pretty dang expensive back in the day (unless you were buying rag weed), but I don't know about current prices as it's been many years since I've bothered with weed.

Whatever the price of weed will be when it's legally cultivated and taxed, will be far less than what drug dealers charge. The drug dealers won't be able to compete.

Maybe someone can enlighten me on the new laws, as I'm too lazy to look them up. Is it legal (in said states) for a person to grow their own weed in their own home for their personal consumption? I mean, if one is doing that what taxes would one have to pay, if any?
If one were growing and selling it (legally) then yeah, one would have to pay taxes on the sale of said weed.
Is it that if you want to grow your own for yourself, one must get a license from the State? Even for just strictly personal consumption?
Is so, how much does that cost?

I'm just curious. Once large scale producers get online and are growing large quantities (legally) and selling it legally, as more and more companies get into this competition will drive the prices down and raise the quality very quickly. If allowed to operated even semi freely. I'd think.

When it comes to weed, and if it were legal, I still wouldn't buy it. I'd sure as hell grow my own though, as long as I knew I wouldn't get busted. I wouldn't sell it, it'd be for myself.
I've never agreed with the marijuana laws, not one bit. But I've grown wise enough to comply regardless. Less problems that way. But if it were legal, hell yeah, I'd fire up in a heartbeat. But until then, when I can grow my own legally, I'll have to avoid potheads and not partake. Catching a buzz just ain't worth breaking the law, to me at least. All kinds of messy problems end up arising, not to mention I hate dealing with drug dealers. :twisted: Greedy, scumbag fuckers every single one of them, without exception.
(If you sell drugs and are reading this, yeah, that means you to, ya rat bastard).
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Re: Colorado passes legalization of recreational pot,

Postby MegaProphet on Sat Dec 08, 2012 11:41 pm

I'm not sure about Washington, but in Colorado medical marijuana patients can grow up to 6 plants this privilege will be extended to everyone. You will not need a license to grow for your own consumption. The current regulations for medical marijuana dispensaries are quite extensive. One regulation that stands out, to me, is you have to have been a Colorado resident for at least 2 years to start up a dispensary and you can't receive investments from out of state. The regulations for recreational marijuana have not been decided on yet, but they will likely be similar to those for medical marijuana. We will know more by July 1, 2013 as it's the date the regulations must be passed.
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Re: Colorado passes legalization of recreational pot,

Postby patches70 on Sun Dec 09, 2012 12:22 am

MegaProphet wrote: but in Colorado medical marijuana patients can grow up to 6 plants this privilege will be extended to everyone. You will not need a license to grow for your own consumption.


See, now that's how it should be.

Ty, sir.
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Re: Colorado passes legalization of recreational pot,

Postby Funkyterrance on Sun Dec 09, 2012 12:45 am

MegaProphet wrote: but in Colorado medical marijuana patients can grow up to 6 plants this privilege will be extended to everyone. You will not need a license to grow for your own consumption.


This won't work, Nolalifer smokes 6 plants worth in one doobie. :lol:
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Re: Colorado passes legalization of recreational pot,

Postby Nola_Lifer on Sun Dec 09, 2012 3:08 pm

Funkyterrance wrote:
MegaProphet wrote: but in Colorado medical marijuana patients can grow up to 6 plants this privilege will be extended to everyone. You will not need a license to grow for your own consumption.


This won't work, Nolalifer smokes 6 plants worth in one doobie. :lol:



:D :P A pound for breakfast
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Re: Colorado passes legalization of recreational pot,

Postby Funkyterrance on Sun Dec 09, 2012 3:14 pm

Nola_Lifer wrote:
:D :P A pound for breakfast


Part of Nola_Lifers complete breakfast:

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Re: Colorado passes legalization of recreational pot,

Postby Phatscotty on Sun Dec 09, 2012 5:12 pm

MegaProphet wrote:I'm not sure about Washington, but in Colorado medical marijuana patients can grow up to 6 plants this privilege will be extended to everyone. You will not need a license to grow for your own consumption. The current regulations for medical marijuana dispensaries are quite extensive. One regulation that stands out, to me, is you have to have been a Colorado resident for at least 2 years to start up a dispensary and you can't receive investments from out of state. The regulations for recreational marijuana have not been decided on yet, but they will likely be similar to those for medical marijuana. We will know more by July 1, 2013 as it's the date the regulations must be passed.


You won't need a license.....yet

Thanks for the info
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Re: Colorado passes legalization of recreational pot,

Postby Phatscotty on Sun Dec 09, 2012 6:09 pm

Phatscotty wrote:can't wait until the state becomes dependent on the tax revenues from pot. The money raised through taxation will most likely get linked to funding children's health or children's education, something that will guarantee little resistance to outrageous tax increases on the pot in the future.

"The tax is only getting raised on the pot heads. we don't give a shit about the stoners! raise the taxes!" Marijuana users will be repeatedly pitted against whatever cause the money funds, and the burnouts aren't going to get many sympathy votes from the legislature.

...and then they will really crack down on "unauthorized sales", because the state does not like competition. And then of course you will only be able to get it on certain days, during certain hours. Don't forget to factor in the cost of all the new regulation into the price of the product. The price stability you have known all your life will double in about 36 months,

Government legalization is the last thing you guys should want. What's the big problem with the way pot is treated now anyways? The price has went down, you can get the shit anywhere, there are no taxes.....sure, you can go to jail or get a ticket, but seriously, does anyone here know someone who is in jail for smoking a joint?

WTF????

The better answer, IMO, is to decriminalize marijuana. Get the government OUT of it. Basically, the exact same argument I have been making about marriage.



More "ignorance" in my posts.....

Though the hearing Friday dealt primarily with the DUI provisions, West's lawsuit also asserts that the initiative wrongly earmarks tax money raised by regulating marijuana for unrelated services such as primary health and dental care, and that state legislators improperly advocated its passage.


The new rules, which for most marijuana smokers would put them over the legal driving limit for a couple hours after taking two or three hits from a joint, took effect on Thursday.


But....now, finally, we can smoke pot! WOOHOO!!
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Re: Colorado passes legalization of recreational pot,

Postby Phatscotty on Sun Dec 09, 2012 6:33 pm

MegaProphet wrote:
Phatscotty wrote:
crispybits wrote:Also, cigarettes aren't easy for people to grow in their basement or cupboard. Pot is. The existing black market will regulate the emerging white market in terms of price to start with and that effect wasnt present for cigarettes to the same extent (illegal smuggled ones from Mexico or wherever notwithstanding, there weren't growers in every town)


Forgive me I do not recall the proper terminology I am trying to describe, but it's the kind of market where it doesn't matter how much something cost to produce/distribute, it mostly matters how much you can get for it/how much people are willing to pay, or more specifically how much you need for it.

Think of a passport, or a drivers license. Does it really cost 135$/28$ to produce? Or even a Louis Vuitton bag...

Smoking/buying/growing marijuana, even after legalization, will be considered a privilege/luxury Prices can get pretty blurry in this area. If I can make a summary/comparison, the same thing that happened to the price of tobacco and cigarettes will happen to marijuana.

Why would marijuana be considered a luxury product? It isn't an established brand like Louis Vuitton and it doesn't require being authorized by the government like a passport or drivers license. I'm having difficulty finding examples of cigarette prices doubling or tripling. The most I can find is the fact that prices increased due to trusts early in the 20th century. Can you point me to your source?
Again I'm curious what you suggest to keep prices from rising? I think the possibility of going to jail is a much heftier price than any tax


Perhaps recreational is a better word than luxury, but the implication for the word luxury is that people who buy weed have "extra" money. Suppose recreational does also.

That's where the charging "what you can get for it/how much is needed" comes into my theory of why prices will be higher. Sure, they will be cheaper or the same in the beginning, but just you watch.

I predict by the third year there will be all kinds of "emergency" government funding shortfalls....
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Re: Colorado passes legalization of recreational pot,

Postby Phatscotty on Sun Dec 09, 2012 6:38 pm

Another thing I want to talk about on this topic: The slippery slope. People like to blow it off constantly with little to no thought, but weren't there a bunch of warnings (from opponents) at the time medical marijuana was passed, that it was just a slippery slope/stepping stone to recreational marijuana legalization?

Would be sweet if there was a medical marijuana thread here from years ago...
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Re: Colorado passes legalization of recreational pot,

Postby Funkyterrance on Sun Dec 09, 2012 6:41 pm

Phatscotty wrote:
But....now, finally, we can smoke pot! WOOHOO!!


:lol:
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Re: Colorado passes legalization of recreational pot,

Postby Phatscotty on Tue Nov 05, 2013 5:15 pm

Nola_Lifer wrote:
Phatscotty wrote:can't wait until the state becomes dependent on the tax revenues from pot. The money raised through taxation will most likely get linked to funding children's health or children's education, something that will guarantee little resistance to outrageous tax increases on the pot in the future.

"The tax is only getting raised on the pot heads. we don't give a shit about the stoners! raise the taxes!" Marijuana users will be repeatedly pitted against whatever cause the money funds, and the burnouts aren't going to get many sympathy votes from the legislature.

...and then they will really crack down on "unauthorized sales", because the state does not like competition. And then of course you will only be able to get it on certain days, during certain hours. Don't forget to factor in the cost of all the new regulation into the price of the product. The price stability you have known all your life will double in about 36 months,

Government legalization is the last thing you guys should want. What's the big problem with the way pot is treated now anyways? The price has went down, you can get the shit anywhere, there are no taxes.....sure, you can go to jail or get a ticket, but seriously, does anyone here know someone who is in jail for smoking a joint?

WTF????

The better answer, IMO, is to decriminalize marijuana. Get the government OUT of it.
Do you have to post your ignorant comments in ever thread?


I think this is about the third time we get to see who is ignorant. :D Hopefully one of these times you will finally ask yourself "why am I always so wrong, and why do I make such an ass of myself when I do it" Seriously, why did you call me ignorant? Those predictions were SPOT on. What is it about you that makes you ridicule things that turn out to be spot on? You might want to get that looked at.

Feast on this

Marijuana Vote in Colorado Weighs 25% Tax for Recreation

Just two months before Colorado retailers begin selling marijuana for the first time in the U.S., voters will weigh in today on a 25 percent tax to help fund enforcement efforts intended to forestall federal intervention.


.....A nonpartisan voter guide compiled by the state’s legislative council estimates the taxes will bring in $67 million per year. About $27.5 million of this would go to school construction and $6 million to local governments, leaving $33.5 million for state regulators.


The 25 percent tax burden will come on top of local levies and a 2.9 percent state sales tax. A dozen municipalities are asking residents to vote on additional taxes on retail marijuana sales. If voters approve them, levies on cannabis could climb to as high as 35 percent in some areas.

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-11-0 ... ation.html

The price is already almost half way to being doubled, and sales haven't even started yet...

Get it through your head. EVERYTHING THE GOVERNMENT TOUCHES EXPLODES IN PRICE!
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Re: Colorado passes legalization of recreational pot,

Postby muy_thaiguy on Tue Nov 05, 2013 6:58 pm

And the State Patrolmen on all sides of Colorado are cracking down on people who try and come across the border with it.
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Re: Colorado passes legalization of recreational pot,

Postby Phatscotty on Tue Nov 04, 2014 5:13 am

Nola_Lifer wrote:What scientist would you call in that cost 200k a year? This is a plant like any other crop that can be grown. Marijuana growers are as serious about their plants as tomato growers. There isn't that much regulation on growing a farm unless your trying to get certified organic. So scientist, laboratories and warehouses are out of the question unless you see marijuana grown on a large more corporate/industrial scale. Transportation won't be a problem either because of the proximity of growers to urban areas. Lets face it you can grow this shit in you back yard or in a closet at a very low cost. The people who will reap the most reward will be the hemp growers but this isn't what we are talking about. :D

The prices will most likely be the same, if anything they will drop. You will have lots of people treating this as a gold rush so more people will grow weed who weren't before, regardless of whether they smoke it or not. You will also see more dispensaries which probably won't be as regulated as most tobacco shops. You'll probably find that most tobacco shops will be ahead of the games due to the similar products.

At times it is better to say nothing at all then to make yourself look foolish over and over again. :mrgreen:


mm hmmm, mm hmmm, oh? mm hmm, 1 year later, HI! Still here! Love it right? Hey, how about an update. Hope you have noticed, A LOT can change in a year, no? I'm still sticking with 'keep the government out of it', let's see how things look nowadays, shall we?

It's so real
It's How I Feel
I'm just straight ill
Ridin' my motorcycle down the streets
While the government is soundin' like strippers to me
They keep sayin' but I don't wanna hear it...

Oooh baby you want me?
Oooh baby you want me?
Oooh baby you want me?
Well you can get this lap dance here for free
Now you can get this lap dance here for free
Well you can get this lap dance here for free
Oooh baby you want me?
Now you can get this lap dance here for free
N.E.R.D. - Lapdance

See Nola, you may be right in the most simplistic ways, but you never accounted for the government. Yes, lot's of people came in and it was indeed a green rush. Yes, more people grow, mm hmm. more dispensaries, certainly! yup, it's just a plant, with ya there. Grow it in your backyard? sure (can't help but wonder what all the fuss is about when people could just grow it in their backyard?) So, hey, being the generous guy that I am, I will grant ALL your points. Cool? Kewl!

So, now let's get to the governments cut, which don't ya know, they need more money now! So...... where were we on taxes at the local level and the state level? Taxes around 35%? Yeah, my eyes are getting red just thinking about how much cheaper pot will be now!

price impact right out of the gate, day 1
Marijuana Vote in Colorado Weighs 25% Tax for Recreation

Just two months before Colorado retailers begin selling marijuana for the first time in the U.S., voters will weigh in today on a 25 percent tax to help fund enforcement efforts intended to forestall federal intervention.


.....A nonpartisan voter guide compiled by the state’s legislative council estimates the taxes will bring in $67 million per year. About $27.5 million of this would go to school construction and $6 million to local governments, leaving $33.5 million for state regulators.


The 25 percent tax burden will come on top of local levies and a 2.9 percent state sales tax. A dozen municipalities are asking residents to vote on additional taxes on retail marijuana sales. If voters approve them, levies on cannabis could climb to as high as 35 percent in some areas.

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-11-0 ... ation.html[/quote]

So according to your points, weed would have to drop considerably in net price just to stay at the same shelf price at the store to account for the tax, right? Well, now it look's like weed will have to be totally free, because the IRS is taking the other 70% in taxes, sometimes more. Yeah, actually, can't grant you the one point about the hemp growers reaping the greatest rewards. But you can grant my point that the government would be the one reaping the most rewards, and that despite all your valid points, they don't amount to a hill of beans. Like I said and keep sayin, but nobody is hearin, decriminalization is the way to go. Legalization simply means weed will be taxed and taxed and taxed, regulated then regulated some more, and when any government anything needs more money (rare, i know...) the potheads will be the first one's stomped on every time, and the price of weed has virtually stayed the same and even decreased in many ways in many places, and that's true for at least a few decades I have been on this earth. Because what is rule #1 boys n girls? WHATEVER THE GOVERNMENT TOUCHES EXPLODES IN PRICE! Note how the power to tax can be the power to destroy, and feast baby, feeeeaaaasssst! All you can eat, for free! woohoo!

"A lot of people think that the marijuana industry is just a license to print money," said Taylor West, deputy director of the National Cannabis Industry Association. "And it's just not the case."


8-[

West works for an association of more than 750 cannabis-related businesses across the United States, and says that 280E results in her clients paying more than 70% of their profits in taxes to the federal government.

Sometimes, the rates are far higher than that.

"A lot of times, instead of paying a tax rate that should be 30 to 40%, they are paying rates between 80 or 90%," Cornelius, the accountant, said. "I even have a client right now that is paying more than 100% effective tax rate."

Woolhiser is hoping that increased sales this year will make up for the loss he took last year — but he is still paying off his debt to the IRS.

"The problem is that we have passed laws that allowed these medical marijuana and recreational marijuana companies to do business," said Mac Clouse, a University of Denver finance professor who studies the industry. "But we have all these other laws, tax laws, federal laws that make it incredibly difficult if not utterly impossible to survive."

More states may legalize marijuana this year, but state laws don't change federal laws.

Voters in Oregon, Alaska, and Washington, D.C., will decide Tuesday whether to legalize the sale of recreational marijuana. But any new pot shops that voters approve may not be able to survive a drug war-era tax code that already threatens many businesses in Colorado and Washington state.

Under this tax code the federal government stands to make more money from the sale of marijuana than those legally selling it. And that could be enough to shut down many shops.

"It's almost like they want us to fail," said Mitch Woolhiser, while walking through his store called Northern Lights Cannabis Co. in Edgewater, Colo. "Everything I do is aimed at keeping us in business because if I don't, then (the feds) win.

Woolhiser first opened shop in 2010, selling medical marijuana. He started selling recreational pot when it became legal in Colorado at the start of this year. Last year, his business didn't earn a profit. Had he been selling anything but cannabis, he would not have owed federal income tax, as he ended up with a loss.

Instead, he ended up paying close to $20,000 to the IRS because of a 1980's tax code called 280E.

"I believe that the feds extend the drug war through 280E," said Jordan Cornelius, a Denver accountant who has worked with Woolhiser and many other marijuana companies in Colorado. "If (the federal government) can't put them out of business legally when voters are mandating these businesses to move forward, it's very easy to put them out of business financially."

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nati ... /18165033/

Okay enough Foolishness from me. I mean, I guess that the reality pot shops can't make a profit and can't stay in business doesn't mean it's 100% certain they would do the most common sense thing and 'raise prices' of what their shops feature for sale, right? Hey maybe you have a bunch of great input here on how they can thrive like a gold rush whilst also consumers enjoying decreasing prices, like you said a year ago? Thanks in advance
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Re: Colorado passes legalization of recreational pot,

Postby mrswdk on Tue Nov 04, 2014 6:28 am

>marijuana industry legalized in some American states by democratic mandate
>American authorities continue trying to destroy it anyway
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Re: Colorado passes legalization of recreational pot,

Postby notyou2 on Tue Nov 04, 2014 8:49 am

Phatscotty wrote:
Nola_Lifer wrote:What scientist would you call in that cost 200k a year? This is a plant like any other crop that can be grown. Marijuana growers are as serious about their plants as tomato growers. There isn't that much regulation on growing a farm unless your trying to get certified organic. So scientist, laboratories and warehouses are out of the question unless you see marijuana grown on a large more corporate/industrial scale. Transportation won't be a problem either because of the proximity of growers to urban areas. Lets face it you can grow this shit in you back yard or in a closet at a very low cost. The people who will reap the most reward will be the hemp growers but this isn't what we are talking about. :D

The prices will most likely be the same, if anything they will drop. You will have lots of people treating this as a gold rush so more people will grow weed who weren't before, regardless of whether they smoke it or not. You will also see more dispensaries which probably won't be as regulated as most tobacco shops. You'll probably find that most tobacco shops will be ahead of the games due to the similar products.

At times it is better to say nothing at all then to make yourself look foolish over and over again. :mrgreen:


mm hmmm, mm hmmm, oh? mm hmm, 1 year later, HI! Still here! Love it right? Hey, how about an update. Hope you have noticed, A LOT can change in a year, no? I'm still sticking with 'keep the government out of it', let's see how things look nowadays, shall we?

It's so real
It's How I Feel
I'm just straight ill
Ridin' my motorcycle down the streets
While the government is soundin' like strippers to me
They keep sayin' but I don't wanna hear it...

Oooh baby you want me?
Oooh baby you want me?
Oooh baby you want me?
Well you can get this lap dance here for free
Now you can get this lap dance here for free
Well you can get this lap dance here for free
Oooh baby you want me?
Now you can get this lap dance here for free
N.E.R.D. - Lapdance

See Nola, you may be right in the most simplistic ways, but you never accounted for the government. Yes, lot's of people came in and it was indeed a green rush. Yes, more people grow, mm hmm. more dispensaries, certainly! yup, it's just a plant, with ya there. Grow it in your backyard? sure (can't help but wonder what all the fuss is about when people could just grow it in their backyard?) So, hey, being the generous guy that I am, I will grant ALL your points. Cool? Kewl!

So, now let's get to the governments cut, which don't ya know, they need more money now! So...... where were we on taxes at the local level and the state level? Taxes around 35%? Yeah, my eyes are getting red just thinking about how much cheaper pot will be now!

price impact right out of the gate, day 1
Marijuana Vote in Colorado Weighs 25% Tax for Recreation

Just two months before Colorado retailers begin selling marijuana for the first time in the U.S., voters will weigh in today on a 25 percent tax to help fund enforcement efforts intended to forestall federal intervention.


.....A nonpartisan voter guide compiled by the state’s legislative council estimates the taxes will bring in $67 million per year. About $27.5 million of this would go to school construction and $6 million to local governments, leaving $33.5 million for state regulators.


The 25 percent tax burden will come on top of local levies and a 2.9 percent state sales tax. A dozen municipalities are asking residents to vote on additional taxes on retail marijuana sales. If voters approve them, levies on cannabis could climb to as high as 35 percent in some areas.

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-11-0 ... ation.html


So according to your points, weed would have to drop considerably in net price just to stay at the same shelf price at the store to account for the tax, right? Well, now it look's like weed will have to be totally free, because the IRS is taking the other 70% in taxes, sometimes more. Yeah, actually, can't grant you the one point about the hemp growers reaping the greatest rewards. But you can grant my point that the government would be the one reaping the most rewards, and that despite all your valid points, they don't amount to a hill of beans. Like I said and keep sayin, but nobody is hearin, decriminalization is the way to go. Legalization simply means weed will be taxed and taxed and taxed, regulated then regulated some more, and when any government anything needs more money (rare, i know...) the potheads will be the first one's stomped on every time, and the price of weed has virtually stayed the same and even decreased in many ways in many places, and that's true for at least a few decades I have been on this earth. Because what is rule #1 boys n girls? WHATEVER THE GOVERNMENT TOUCHES EXPLODES IN PRICE! Note how the power to tax can be the power to destroy, and feast baby, feeeeaaaasssst! All you can eat, for free! woohoo!

"A lot of people think that the marijuana industry is just a license to print money," said Taylor West, deputy director of the National Cannabis Industry Association. "And it's just not the case."


8-[

West works for an association of more than 750 cannabis-related businesses across the United States, and says that 280E results in her clients paying more than 70% of their profits in taxes to the federal government.

Sometimes, the rates are far higher than that.

"A lot of times, instead of paying a tax rate that should be 30 to 40%, they are paying rates between 80 or 90%," Cornelius, the accountant, said. "I even have a client right now that is paying more than 100% effective tax rate."

Woolhiser is hoping that increased sales this year will make up for the loss he took last year — but he is still paying off his debt to the IRS.

"The problem is that we have passed laws that allowed these medical marijuana and recreational marijuana companies to do business," said Mac Clouse, a University of Denver finance professor who studies the industry. "But we have all these other laws, tax laws, federal laws that make it incredibly difficult if not utterly impossible to survive."

More states may legalize marijuana this year, but state laws don't change federal laws.

Voters in Oregon, Alaska, and Washington, D.C., will decide Tuesday whether to legalize the sale of recreational marijuana. But any new pot shops that voters approve may not be able to survive a drug war-era tax code that already threatens many businesses in Colorado and Washington state.

Under this tax code the federal government stands to make more money from the sale of marijuana than those legally selling it. And that could be enough to shut down many shops.

"It's almost like they want us to fail," said Mitch Woolhiser, while walking through his store called Northern Lights Cannabis Co. in Edgewater, Colo. "Everything I do is aimed at keeping us in business because if I don't, then (the feds) win.

Woolhiser first opened shop in 2010, selling medical marijuana. He started selling recreational pot when it became legal in Colorado at the start of this year. Last year, his business didn't earn a profit. Had he been selling anything but cannabis, he would not have owed federal income tax, as he ended up with a loss.

Instead, he ended up paying close to $20,000 to the IRS because of a 1980's tax code called 280E.

"I believe that the feds extend the drug war through 280E," said Jordan Cornelius, a Denver accountant who has worked with Woolhiser and many other marijuana companies in Colorado. "If (the federal government) can't put them out of business legally when voters are mandating these businesses to move forward, it's very easy to put them out of business financially."

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nati ... /18165033/

Okay enough Foolishness from me. I mean, I guess that the reality pot shops can't make a profit and can't stay in business doesn't mean it's 100% certain they would do the most common sense thing and 'raise prices' of what their shops feature for sale, right? Hey maybe you have a bunch of great input here on how they can thrive like a gold rush whilst also consumers enjoying decreasing prices, like you said a year ago? Thanks in advance

Thus Spoke the Ghost of Minnesota Phats, reminding yall to keep fighting the good fight against the evil, fatcat, elitist, 1%, capitalist, greedy, pig oil companies and multinationals! Stay sharp my fellow countrymen!!

Image[/quote]

Thanks for the Exxon propaganda. You can't compare a tax versus a profit. The tax has an administration cost, but the profit has removed that.

It's like comparing a walrus and an apple.
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