rdsrds2120 wrote: BigBallinStalin wrote: rdsrds2120 wrote:
GreecePwns wrote:"XXXXXXXXXX takes it up the ass."
If XXXXXXXXXX is an individual person, is this a homophobic insult? Why or why not?
If XXXXXXXXXX is not an individual person but a group or organization of some sort, is this a homophobic insult? Why or why not?
Kind of. For the statement to be truly homophobic, it'd have to assume this premise: The people who have anal sex are almost exclusively gay men.
If that's so, then the negative connotation of "XXXXX takes it up the ass" becomes perpetuated with respect to the gay male community and is just as bad as using 'gay' as 'stupid', etc.
Look. This whole homophobic claim is a load of shit.
Here you are, projecting your interpretation of "taking it up the ass" onto all other individuals' interpretations. I've already addressed this weak claim earlier ITT.
The connotation is negative because the user of this phrase considers "taking it up the ass" to be undesirable. If anyone who finds anal sex into their person to be disagreeable, then they cannot justifiably be labeled as homophobic. All we can say is "they find that anal sex into their own persons is undesirable." It doesn't follow that their interpration means that intrusive anal sex, itself, is wrong. All that "getting fucked in the ass" means is "they got wronged."
C'mon, rds. Put up your intellectual dukes, and we can homophobically settle this issue right here right now.
Shoot, son. I was saying if that premise was assumed. You still got that sand in your eyes
I don't think it's homophobic, and use the saying myself.
Dukes you say? Alright, but my David Bowie punch can send you flying in a hellstorm of glitter. Be prepared.
Okay, glitter boy. It's on, and not in any homosexual way. I mean in a brotherly love kind of way, but not in any wincest way.
Let's say that your premise is true: For the statement to be truly homophobic, it'd have to assume this premise: The people who have anal sex are almost exclusively gay men.
I'm still not convinced that your conclusion would follow: ("then the negative connotation of "XXXXX takes it up the ass" becomes perpetuated with respect to the gay male community and is just as bad as using 'gay' as 'stupid', etc."
My position is that the individual's estimate on the amount of men who are gay and have anal sex compared to "hetero-anal sexers" bears no relevance on your conclusion because the accuracy of that estimate doesn't matter. Instead, what matters is (a) the speaker's attitude toward taking it personally up the ass, and (b) his attitude on homosexuality.
 If the speaker (a) dislikes taking it up the ass, but (b) doesn't care what gay men do in dark alleys, then whenever he uses that phrase, he's not being homophobic.
 However, if the speaker (a) dislikes taking it up the ass, and (b) dislikes gays, then whenever he uses that phrase, I might concede that he's being homophobic.
 If the speaker (a) likes taking it up the ass, and (b) dislikes gays, then whenever he uses that phrase, he most likely is being homophobic.
 And of course, (a) likes, (b) likes, then most likely not being homophobic.
Note: Their estimate of the proportion of gay anal sexers to total anal sexers could be accurate or inaccurate, but that's not the main cause of why their use of that phrase is or is not homophobic.
To get to the bottom of this matter, the negative connotation toward gay men--with the use of that phrase--only originates from the speaker's attitude toward homosexuals and the listener's attitude toward the speaker (e.g. fitting words/meaning in someone's mouth where they don't belong). The phrase might be homophobic, but only in relation to the meaning
of the phrase. The phrase itself is never homophobic because it depends on (X) the speaker's attitude, and (Y) the listener's attitude, which is an entirely different matter and is a source of confusion on matters of homophobic words. Their attitudes provide meaning to the words, and then these words can either be homophobic or not.
Words themselves aren't bad, homophobic, or hateful. It depends on the meaning of those words, and the meaning is shaped by the speaker and the listener. A homophobic speaker can render his words as homophobic, and a listener can correctly interpret those "words" as homophobic (ex: 3, and maybe 2). A listener can also incorrectly
interpret another speaker's words as homophobic, assuming that the speaker is not actually homophobic (ex: 1 and 4).