Select Amount of Starting Positions

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Would you Like to be able to Select Amount of Starting Positions?

Yes, 1 starting territory or normal drop only
4
33%
Yes, 1 starting territory, half drop, or normal drop only
2
17%
Yes, any number of territories
4
33%
Yes, but don't allow only 1 territory
0
No votes
No, no select # of starting positions
2
17%
 
Total votes : 12

Re: Select Amount of Starting Positions

Postby rishaed on Sun Jan 20, 2013 1:23 pm

chapcrap wrote:
Metsfanmax wrote:
Fazeem wrote:
Metsfanmax wrote:This is quite an interesting idea. The gameplay would be different enough to perhaps really warrant a new game option. You know some people would have all the players start with one territory though. Imagine what happens if, by chance, two of them are connected? Someone's going to be rather unhappy.

LOL nature of the beast no different then when someone starts off with a bonus or both drop a manual next to other.


It is different though. In manual, if you drop your stack right next to someone else, 1) that is at least partially your fault because you should be guessing where your opponents will drop when you make your deployment and 2) you're not immediately dead if someone autos your stack, and wins. Starting off with a bonus is also not necessarily game-breaking, even in 1v1, even though it's usually a big advantage. In this case, you simply lose straight out if someone goes 6v3 and wins without even getting to take a turn.

True.

A solution, which I think was already mentioned, is that each map have certain constraints. For example, in Classic, the count needs to be 3-17. If this is done, then there would be no issue of 1 territory games.

QFT.
Also it allows for actual growth and planning of strategy instead of being forced to go for Asia/Europe because your only territory is there and you have an army of Neutral territories around you.
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Re: Select Amount of Starting Positions

Postby Fazeem on Sun Jan 20, 2013 2:23 pm

Metsfanmax wrote:
Fazeem wrote:
Metsfanmax wrote:This is quite an interesting idea. The gameplay would be different enough to perhaps really warrant a new game option. You know some people would have all the players start with one territory though. Imagine what happens if, by chance, two of them are connected? Someone's going to be rather unhappy.

LOL nature of the beast no different then when someone starts off with a bonus or both drop a manual next to other.


It is different though. In manual, if you drop your stack right next to someone else, 1) that is at least partially your fault because you should be guessing where your opponents will drop when you make your deployment and 2) you're not immediately dead if someone autos your stack, and wins. Starting off with a bonus is also not necessarily game-breaking, even in 1v1, even though it's usually a big advantage. In this case, you simply lose straight out if someone goes 6v3 and wins without even getting to take a turn.

the drop is random though so the odds of being right next to someone and having only chosen 1 starting point on most maps is quite a large spread. Not saying it is impossible but unlikely this will ever be more of a factor. The odds are almost as likely for a manual drop and incredible dice to win in one turn to happen as this worst case scenario. Also on a map like doodle earth where this is a likely issue it could be made to not work like manual does not work on some maps.
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Re: Select Amount of Starting Positions

Postby Metsfanmax on Sun Jan 20, 2013 5:05 pm

chapcrap wrote:
Metsfanmax wrote:
Fazeem wrote:
Metsfanmax wrote:This is quite an interesting idea. The gameplay would be different enough to perhaps really warrant a new game option. You know some people would have all the players start with one territory though. Imagine what happens if, by chance, two of them are connected? Someone's going to be rather unhappy.

LOL nature of the beast no different then when someone starts off with a bonus or both drop a manual next to other.


It is different though. In manual, if you drop your stack right next to someone else, 1) that is at least partially your fault because you should be guessing where your opponents will drop when you make your deployment and 2) you're not immediately dead if someone autos your stack, and wins. Starting off with a bonus is also not necessarily game-breaking, even in 1v1, even though it's usually a big advantage. In this case, you simply lose straight out if someone goes 6v3 and wins without even getting to take a turn.

True.

A solution, which I think was already mentioned, is that each map have certain constraints. For example, in Classic, the count needs to be 3-17. If this is done, then there would be no issue of 1 territory games.


This is true, but the constraint would have to be hard-coded for every map, which would require a bit of manual effort. That is, unless we adjusted the constraint depending on how many territories are on the map or something.
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Re: Select Amount of Starting Positions

Postby greenoaks on Sun Jan 20, 2013 5:22 pm

i like the idea.

who's up for a 1 terit foggy game of Hive with trench
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Re: Select Amount of Starting Positions

Postby darth emperor on Sun Jan 20, 2013 7:01 pm

greenoaks wrote:i like the idea.

who's up for a 1 terit foggy game of Hive with trench

:lol: I'm in for that. This is kinda like the BR, so this apart of solving the problems of 1v1 also solves the problem of BR you can make a game where everyone starts, with 2 or 3 regions. And also I like the idea of having just one region even if in some games if I just lose because my opponent played first and was adjacent.
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Re: Select Amount of Starting Positions

Postby chapcrap on Mon Jan 21, 2013 12:44 am

Metsfanmax wrote:
chapcrap wrote:
Metsfanmax wrote:
Fazeem wrote:
Metsfanmax wrote:This is quite an interesting idea. The gameplay would be different enough to perhaps really warrant a new game option. You know some people would have all the players start with one territory though. Imagine what happens if, by chance, two of them are connected? Someone's going to be rather unhappy.

LOL nature of the beast no different then when someone starts off with a bonus or both drop a manual next to other.


It is different though. In manual, if you drop your stack right next to someone else, 1) that is at least partially your fault because you should be guessing where your opponents will drop when you make your deployment and 2) you're not immediately dead if someone autos your stack, and wins. Starting off with a bonus is also not necessarily game-breaking, even in 1v1, even though it's usually a big advantage. In this case, you simply lose straight out if someone goes 6v3 and wins without even getting to take a turn.

True.

A solution, which I think was already mentioned, is that each map have certain constraints. For example, in Classic, the count needs to be 3-17. If this is done, then there would be no issue of 1 territory games.


This is true, but the constraint would have to be hard-coded for every map, which would require a bit of manual effort. That is, unless we adjusted the constraint depending on how many territories are on the map or something.

Yes, I think a certain percentage of terts on each map would be fine. The issue I see with it is playing maps like Feudal War. It would need to be coded to be based on territories that don't automatically start neutral.
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Re: Select Amount of Starting Positions

Postby rishaed on Tue Jan 22, 2013 1:00 pm

^oooooh! strategy would change on that map, thats for sure! The first turn its Sir! There's an enemy in the gates!!
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Re: Select Amount of Starting Positions

Postby greenoaks on Tue Jan 22, 2013 4:22 pm

chapcrap wrote:
Metsfanmax wrote:
chapcrap wrote:
Metsfanmax wrote:
Fazeem wrote:
Metsfanmax wrote:This is quite an interesting idea. The gameplay would be different enough to perhaps really warrant a new game option. You know some people would have all the players start with one territory though. Imagine what happens if, by chance, two of them are connected? Someone's going to be rather unhappy.

LOL nature of the beast no different then when someone starts off with a bonus or both drop a manual next to other.


It is different though. In manual, if you drop your stack right next to someone else, 1) that is at least partially your fault because you should be guessing where your opponents will drop when you make your deployment and 2) you're not immediately dead if someone autos your stack, and wins. Starting off with a bonus is also not necessarily game-breaking, even in 1v1, even though it's usually a big advantage. In this case, you simply lose straight out if someone goes 6v3 and wins without even getting to take a turn.

True.

A solution, which I think was already mentioned, is that each map have certain constraints. For example, in Classic, the count needs to be 3-17. If this is done, then there would be no issue of 1 territory games.


This is true, but the constraint would have to be hard-coded for every map, which would require a bit of manual effort. That is, unless we adjusted the constraint depending on how many territories are on the map or something.

Yes, I think a certain percentage of terts on each map would be fine. The issue I see with it is playing maps like Feudal War. It would need to be coded to be based on territories that don't automatically start neutral.

i don't see why.

in 1v1 you get 2 terits now so you could choose to start the game normally or with just 1. in team games there would be no difference as you only start with one terit.
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Re: Select Amount of Starting Positions

Postby chapcrap on Tue Jan 22, 2013 8:10 pm

greenoaks wrote:
chapcrap wrote:Yes, I think a certain percentage of terts on each map would be fine. The issue I see with it is playing maps like Feudal War. It would need to be coded to be based on territories that don't automatically start neutral.

i don't see why.

in 1v1 you get 2 terits now so you could choose to start the game normally or with just 1. in team games there would be no difference as you only start with one terit.

So that you can't choose to start with 12.
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Re: Select Amount of Starting Positions

Postby greenoaks on Tue Jan 22, 2013 10:05 pm

chapcrap wrote:
greenoaks wrote:
chapcrap wrote:Yes, I think a certain percentage of terts on each map would be fine. The issue I see with it is playing maps like Feudal War. It would need to be coded to be based on territories that don't automatically start neutral.

i don't see why.

in 1v1 you get 2 terits now so you could choose to start the game normally or with just 1. in team games there would be no difference as you only start with one terit.

So that you can't choose to start with 12.

no

replacing with Neutrals spots that by default would have a player occupying.


if a map allowed 12 starting positions then you could choose between 1 & 12 but if it had 3 then you could only choose 1, 2 or 3.
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Re: Select Amount of Starting Positions

Postby chapcrap on Tue Jan 22, 2013 10:06 pm

greenoaks wrote:
chapcrap wrote:
greenoaks wrote:
chapcrap wrote:Yes, I think a certain percentage of terts on each map would be fine. The issue I see with it is playing maps like Feudal War. It would need to be coded to be based on territories that don't automatically start neutral.

i don't see why.

in 1v1 you get 2 terits now so you could choose to start the game normally or with just 1. in team games there would be no difference as you only start with one terit.

So that you can't choose to start with 12.

no

replacing with Neutrals spots that by default would have a player occupying.


if a map allowed 12 starting positions then you could choose between 1 & 12 but if it had 3 then you could only choose 1, 2 or 3.

Then it's already worked out. I'm just saying, it needs to be made sure.
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Re: Select Amount of Starting Positions

Postby greenoaks on Tue Jan 22, 2013 10:43 pm

my understanding of how this would work is you choose a map, the starting position dropdown would then allow you to select a number between 1 and the normal amount.

but how will this work for random?
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Re: Select Amount of Starting Positions

Postby chapcrap on Tue Jan 22, 2013 10:47 pm

greenoaks wrote:my understanding of how this would work is you choose a map, the starting position dropdown would then allow you to select a number between 1 and the normal amount.

but how will this work for random?

I think that 1 should not be a choice for classic style maps.

For random, you just pick the number you want and it would give you a map that would fit the criteria.
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Re: Select Amount of Starting Positions

Postby Metsfanmax on Tue Jan 22, 2013 11:25 pm

chapcrap wrote:
greenoaks wrote:my understanding of how this would work is you choose a map, the starting position dropdown would then allow you to select a number between 1 and the normal amount.

but how will this work for random?

I think that 1 should not be a choice for classic style maps.

For random, you just pick the number you want and it would give you a map that would fit the criteria.


But then it wouldn't really be random. You could use that to filter out maps that you're not good at. I think that random needs to stay fully random, and we find some other way around this. Such as, on Random, you can't diminish the number of starting territories.
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Re: Select Amount of Starting Positions

Postby greenoaks on Wed Jan 23, 2013 4:31 am

Metsfanmax wrote:
chapcrap wrote:
greenoaks wrote:my understanding of how this would work is you choose a map, the starting position dropdown would then allow you to select a number between 1 and the normal amount.

but how will this work for random?

I think that 1 should not be a choice for classic style maps.

For random, you just pick the number you want and it would give you a map that would fit the criteria.


But then it wouldn't really be random. You could use that to filter out maps that you're not good at. I think that random needs to stay fully random, and we find some other way around this. Such as, on Random, you can't diminish the number of starting territories.

yes, that was what i was thinking
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