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Periodic Table of Elements

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Re: Elements

Postby HitRed on Mon Feb 12, 2018 7:07 pm

what can 39-Y assault?

39 assaults 38, 40, 21 and 57 - HitRed

i strongly recommend splitting the transition metals into periods 4, 5, 6 and 7, as a single bonus of +13 for holding all 38 of them will be ignored in almost all games.

Agreed, they will be +3 each period in the transition metals. - HitRed

HitRed wrote:We could add all the radioactive elements. It can be done. If we also add all the flags, Ancients and other symbols. The map might become cluttered.

the map need not become cluttered, since flags and ancients are mutually exclusive, while we can denote radioactivity by an inner glow, for example, rather than by a radiation symbol.

I'll ask EBConquer to do a test square. - HitRed

HitRed wrote:The 6 radioactive elements were chosen because I needed to balance out certain areas.

We could add more but they would be worth less.
Currently there are 6. Each is +1
If we triple the number to 18 then every 3 is +1. This might be cool.
All 38. Every 6 is +1. These would be so worthless they might be a hindrance.

if we show all radioactive elements as being radioactive, then why would they be worth less than +1 for every 3?

there are 38 radioactive elements, of which 10 occur in nature and 28 are artificial. this forms a neat division into two bonus groups, which can be denoted visually by different glows. to represent radioactive decay, the radioelements can decay by -1 per turn.

Agreed - HitRed

ian. :)[/quote]
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Re: Elements

Postby EBConquer on Tue Feb 13, 2018 7:20 pm

the map need not become cluttered, since flags and ancients are mutually exclusive, while we can denote radioactivity by an inner glow, for example, rather than by a radiation symbol.


This shouldn't be an issue. :)
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Re: Elements

Postby HitRed on Mon Mar 19, 2018 10:25 am

Dukasaur wrote:Potential bonus, biologicals: Carbon+Oxygen+Hydrogen+Nitrogen+Sulfur+Selenium+Phosphorus


After spending the night in the ER and finding out my son was Potassium deficient the Biological Elements will be added to the map. Likely in two group of Major and Minor. Lots of choices for the symbol: tree of life, a leaf, The Ahnk, staff of Aesculapius or Biological (which is a hazard symbol so may not fit).

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Re: Elements

Postby Dukasaur on Mon Mar 19, 2018 10:40 am

HitRed wrote:
Dukasaur wrote:Potential bonus, biologicals: Carbon+Oxygen+Hydrogen+Nitrogen+Sulfur+Selenium+Phosphorus


After spending the night in the ER and finding out my son was Potassium deficient the Biological Elements will be added to the map. Likely in two group of Major and Minor. Lots of choices for the symbol: tree of life, a leaf, The Ahnk, staff of Aesculapius or Biological (which is a hazard symbol so may not fit).

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HitRed



Cool!

Staff of Aesculpius sounds the best from that list.
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Re: Elements

Postby HitRed on Mon Apr 09, 2018 4:47 pm

Looking forward to this :D still designing. Fe will not be included in the biologicals.

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Re: Periodic Table of Elements V.5

Postby HitRed on Mon Apr 16, 2018 9:44 am

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Updated for Biological (major and minor)

Transition metals are now 4 periods instead of 1 group.

Name is now Periodic Table of Elements

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Re: Periodic Table of Elements - MAGNETIC BONUS

Postby HitRed on Sun Apr 29, 2018 5:13 pm

Iron, cobalt, Nickel and Gadolinium are magnetic. Bonus 2. Symbol would be the horseshoe below in classic red and silver.

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Re: Elements

Postby iancanton on Tue May 01, 2018 4:38 pm

HitRed wrote:
iancanton wrote:what can 39-Y assault?

39 assaults 38, 40, 21 and 57 - HitRed

why can 39-Y assault 57-La but not 71-Lu? it's not intuitively obvious from the current image.

ian. :)
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Re: Elements

Postby HitRed on Tue May 01, 2018 6:44 pm

iancanton wrote:
HitRed wrote:
iancanton wrote:what can 39-Y assault?

39 assaults 38, 40, 21 and 57 - HitRed

why can 39-Y assault 57-La but not 71-Lu? it's not intuitively obvious from the current image.

ian. :)


A square split diagonally will help players. One side (the top triangle) would read 57 and the other (lower triangle) would read 71.

So 39 assaults 38, 40, 21 and visually 57. 71 would not visually connected and wouldn't be assaulted.

Similarly
So 71 would attack 57, 72,89 and 103
89 would attack 88, 90 and 71


Had to think on that one :lol:

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Re: Elements

Postby iancanton on Fri May 04, 2018 5:35 pm

the concept of the diagonally-split square can help.

however, why does 71-Lu attack 103-Lr, when 89-Ac does not attack 57-La?

ian. :)
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Re: Elements

Postby HitRed on Fri May 04, 2018 9:37 pm

iancanton wrote:the concept of the diagonally-split square can help.

however, why does 71-Lu attack 103-Lr, when 89-Ac does not attack 57-La?

ian. :)


A vertically split square would be better 57 | 71
Same for 89 | 103

Then visually
39 attacks 38, 40, 21, 57 AND 71
57 attacks 56, 58, 39 and 89
71 attacks 70, 72, 39, 57, 103
89 attacks 88, 90 and 57
103 attacks 102, 104, 71 and 89

HitRed

At some future point I would like to discus left to right attacks on the edge. Like 2 (He).
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Re: Periodic Table of Elements - MAGNETIC BONUS

Postby iancanton on Tue May 08, 2018 5:07 pm

HitRed wrote:Iron, cobalt, Nickel and Gadolinium are magnetic. Bonus 2. Symbol would be the horseshoe below in classic red and silver.

i rather like the magnetic bonus. it's a relatively easy bonus and the concept is clear too.

HitRed wrote:A vertically split square would be better 57 | 71
Same for 89 | 103

this appears to work, as u've demonstrated above.

HitRed wrote:I would like to discus left to right attacks on the edge. Like 2 (He).

2-He is obviously adjacent to 10-Ne, while it also attacks 1-H and 3-Li because of number order. however, the legend doesn't mention number order.

ian. :)
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Re: Periodic Table of Elements V.6

Postby HitRed on Wed May 16, 2018 7:13 pm

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PTE V.6 This was 15 hours of work. Just want to keep the ball rolling. EBConquer will still be the designer as the skill level needed is high.

There are 5 magnetic elements so I added Dysprosium to Gadolinium, Iron, Colbalt and Nickel. The Middle Ages elements As and Sb turned out to be ancients. Towers have been removed and turned into Ancients.
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Re: Periodic Table of Elements

Postby iancanton on Mon May 21, 2018 6:14 pm

it's starting to look good.

judging by the incipient illegibility of the names, u might end up having to remove the names from the boxes and have them appear only in the game log via the xml, with each box being made taller but thinner to accommodate troop counts on a different line from the chemical symbols.

incidentally, the discoverer of tellurium, franz-joseph müller von reichenstein was, as suggested by his strongly germanic name, in no way romanian. he was born in either vienna or transylvania, which were both part of the austrian habsburg monarchy. romania was a neighbouring country and had no involvement in the discovery, but gained transylvania after the empire was defeated in the first world war, well after his death.

ian. :)
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Re: Periodic Table of Elements

Postby Dukasaur on Mon May 21, 2018 8:05 pm

Eliminating the long names will also help with making more rooms for the flags and symbols. Copper and Mercury are touching their henges, while all the ones with flags look really cramped.
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Re: Periodic Table of Elements

Postby ZaBeast on Mon May 21, 2018 11:05 pm

Yup looks good. Are the flags starting neutrals though? I hate 1 country-bonuses that you can get directly from the drop (happens with multiple-region bonuses too but less often)
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Re: Periodic Table of Elements

Postby HitRed on Tue May 22, 2018 12:00 pm

ZaBeast wrote:Yup looks good. Are the flags starting neutrals though? I hate 1 country-bonuses that you can get directly from the drop (happens with multiple-region bonuses too but less often)


Flags and Ancients will start as neutrals. I plan to keep the number of player owned terr. low to avoid large troops bonuses the first round.

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Re: Periodic Table of Elements V.7

Postby HitRed on Tue May 22, 2018 2:08 pm

iancanton wrote:it's starting to look good.

judging by the incipient illegibility of the names, u might end up having to remove the names from the boxes and have them appear only in the game log via the xml, with each box being made taller but thinner to accommodate troop counts on a different line from the chemical symbols.

incidentally, the discoverer of tellurium, franz-joseph müller von reichenstein was, as suggested by his strongly germanic name, in no way romanian. he was born in either vienna or transylvania, which were both part of the austrian habsburg monarchy. romania was a neighbouring country and had no involvement in the discovery, but gained transylvania after the empire was defeated in the first world war, well after his death.

ian. :)


Element names can be removed. I think they add a lot to the flavor of the map though. It's a lot more fun to say "Take Strontium!" then "Take 38 SR". I used a screen capture likely 72 dpi but could save from Indesign a higher rez. Might save them?

The Flag of the Austrian Habsburg Monarchy will replace Romania. Without a flag the Metalloids would be a much harder bonus.
Image

Interestingly, Scotland has had a lot of notable scientists/chemists that were involved with the PTE. Would be nice to showcase this. Nitrogen 7 N was discovered and isolated by Scottish physician Daniel Rutherford in 1772. Even thought it's part of the UK I'm wondering if it's OK to add a Scottish flag? It would balance out the map as I could move France to 24 Cr. Then all the standard bonuses would have at least 1 flag. :)

HitRed

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PTE V.7
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Re: Periodic Table of Elements

Postby iancanton on Wed May 23, 2018 5:52 pm

HitRed wrote:t's a lot more fun to say "Take Strontium!" then "Take 38 SR". I used a screen capture likely 72 dpi but could save from Indesign a higher rez. Might save them?

u can try, although it'll be a real struggle to keep the full names readable at the same time as having decent-sized symbols for the special bonuses.

HitRed wrote:The Flag of the Austrian Habsburg Monarchy will replace Romania.

that's a neat solution and better than having two identical austrian flags.

HitRed wrote:Nitrogen was discovered and isolated by Scottish physician Daniel Rutherford in 1772. Even thought it's part of the UK I'm wondering if it's OK to add a Scottish flag?

this scot is in favour! to be consistent, use an england flag for calcium.

HitRed wrote:What map size should I use? I'm thinking boxes 1/2 X 3/4 tall. Maybe 9.5 X 10.5 tall in inches?

the apparent size in inches will depend on monitor size, though i'm surprised that the map's taller than it is wide. a 2:3 aspect ratio for each box sounds reasonable. the troop circles are probably best aligned to the left, as anyone using colour codes will have the troop count spill over to the right as soon as there are more than 9 troops on one element.

it'll be helpful to put the version number in the subject of the post, after the map name, so that it's easy to identify, at a single glance, the version to which the comments relate. doing the same in the subject of the first post also serves as a progress marker.

the latest update qualifies the map for a move to the main foundry workshop.

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onward and upward!

ian. :)
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Re: Periodic Table of Elements V.8

Postby HitRed on Wed May 23, 2018 8:00 pm

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PTE V.8 Moved France to element 24. Added Scotland to element 7. Changed the United Kingdom flag on element 20 to England flag.
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Re: Periodic Table of Elements BONUS CHART

Postby HitRed on Fri May 25, 2018 1:10 pm

***NO LONGER USED***

Clearly linear bonuses are not average. This will be reviewed

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The bottom Nobel Gases should read All gases.
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Re: Periodic Table of Elements

Postby Donelladan on Fri May 25, 2018 4:06 pm

How do you attack lanthanoids and actinoids ? Only from left and right or Ytrium can also attack all the lanthanoids ?
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Re: Periodic Table of Elements

Postby HitRed on Fri May 25, 2018 5:45 pm

Donelladan wrote:How do you attack lanthanoids and actinoids ? Only from left and right or Ytrium can also attack all the lanthanoids ?


Good question. This is covered in the thread but needs to be explained on the map. The same rules apply, an element attacks up, down, number preceding and number following. So 39 attacks 21 top, 57 and 71 bottom, 38 preceding, 40 following. So 39 would NOT attack 58 through 70.

A vertically split square would be better 57 | 71
Same for 89 | 103

I will make the line solid black and add text "barrier" or "no crossing"

Then visually
39 attacks 38, 40, 21, 57 AND 71
57 attacks 56, 58, 39 and 89
71 attacks 70, 72, 39, 57, 103
89 attacks 88, 90 and 57
103 attacks 102, 104, 71 and 89

I agree it will likely be a confusing spot.


HitRed
Last edited by HitRed on Sat May 26, 2018 5:42 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Periodic Table of Elements

Postby Donelladan on Sat May 26, 2018 8:27 am

I am bit surprised by your answer.

I understand why you do that way looking at image alone. But doesn't seem very logical to me.

I would have said, below 39 there is either only 57, or everything from 57 to 71, but this 2nd option would make 39 too interesting and important I think.
Same, I find it very surprising that 103 attacks 89, because they are not next to each other in reality. I guess no one would figure that out the first time.

Whatever you finally decide, I think you should add an extra legend for those territory.
Maybe in the blank space above lanthanoids.



iancanton wrote:
HitRed wrote:t's a lot more fun to say "Take Strontium!" then "Take 38 SR". I used a screen capture likely 72 dpi but could save from Indesign a higher rez. Might save them?

u can try, although it'll be a real struggle to keep the full names readable at the same time as having decent-sized symbols for the special bonuses.


You could make the table with Sr only, but you name the terriory Strontium.
So that in the log and the attack box we have the full name as well as when the mouse is hovering above the territory, but you save space on the maps. Many maps works like that ( like Rail South america for example).


On the legend, what means " Red nuclear 1:3 " ? For each 3 red nuclear you got +1 deploy ? I guess I can find the answer in the thread I know - but my point is that it isn't that obvious.



Concerning the bonus, if you compare metalloids and actinoids. Actinoids are so much better than metaloids, and you put a +8 on Actinoids and only +4 on metaloids.

Actinoids can't be attacked from below, neither from right and left because if you hold them it means you have the whole line.
Also actinoids give you extra +1 for the nuclear between 93 and 103, so you can start by grabing the +1 for 3 nuc, then slowly work your way to have all the actinoids.

While the metaloids are so difficult to hold because they have borders everywhere ( top/bottom/right/left)!

Only pb of the actinoids is that you need to have lanthanoids as well to be sure to hold the bonus, but if you can clear both you have super strong defensive positions and huge bonus. Game over.
Have to be tested ofc ( can't wait you send it to beta) but I think you should reduce it, also because of the presense of many nuclear site on actinoids.


Will it be +1 for 3 regions like in most maps ?
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