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INTO THE DEEP (Day 4)

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Re: INTO THE DEEP (Day 4)

Postby chapcrap on Mon Apr 15, 2019 1:13 pm

So, I'm not sure anyone can confirm my actions, but I'll lay them all out anyway and you can choose to trust me or not. I think I can do what I need to so that I am safe at night. I am Town Transporter. It's essentially an upgraded busdriver.

Initial ability - swap the actions that go to two people. So, I get to choose someone and the actions directed at that person will go to the other person I choose.

N1, I switched strike wolf and Ragian. No real reason why. Just wanted to switch someone so that I could advance up my role tree and get bonus abilities and whatnot. I was successful. This explains why blacky was poisoned. I switched him into Ragian.

N2, I wanted to do a night action for more ability reasons. I asked the mod that if going for food counted as a night action, I would do that. It did. I found food (insects) and upgraded!

New ability - swap the actions of 4 people. This happens in two sets of two. So, basically double the first action. In addition to the doubling, I also get told how many scum are involved with the 4 people I switch.

N3, I switched Ragian and strike wolf. I assumed no one would be targeting Ragian, and that would keep strike wolf safe. If someone targeted strike wolf, I assumed they would be poisoned or we would lose a claimed poisoner. I was ok with that. Additionally, I switched Skoffin and Tobi. I did that because I felt like they had scummy vibes and I was mostly going for a scum count. I was successful and I was told that there 1 scum in the group. My assumption is that scum is inclusive of mafia, third party, anyone not town. I'm guessing that sw is DEFINITELY town. Ragian is most likely town. I would say that Skoffin or Tobi is the scum between the 4 of them, but I'm not sure who I think is more scummy. Initially, I felt Skoffin heavily, but am unsure.

So, BuJ claimed to have been poisoned, but visited Skoffin. Unlikely, IMO. A THIRD poisoner? More likely, he attempted to visit sw and got bussed into a poison. Super scummy from blacky. Number 1, why would you visit sw? Number 2, why would you lie about it. I could be wrong and there is a third poisoner, but we've already heard from 2 other people with the ability to move people in the night and neither did anything with BuJ.

Anyway, my plain is with me, Skoffin, Ragian, Tobi, and sw, we have 5 people with only one being scum, if we add one of the other person, hopefully a townie, we have the majority of people left and can control the votes as long as I don't accidentally bus one of the 6 into Ragian and get that person poisoned. My suggestion for the 6th would be TX because of his role claim, but if others have a better option than TX, I'm willing to listen on that.

Actions to take - the 6 people in that group move forward in lynching one of the other 5. My suggestion for that right now is BuJ because of what happened last night. However, I do not think it matters if the 6 of us remain as a team. If one of the 6 speaks up and does not want to do that at some point, that person is leaning scummy to me. If we all make it until tomorrow, I should have new information on the investigative properties of my role. I will take and listen to suggestions on who to bus, but I will not speak about my thoughts on who should be bussed tonight because I do not want to give scum an edge on which way I will go. There are a lot of good bus options for protection, offense, and investigatory roles. Also options from the other side on scum hunting at night.

As far as why I claimed now, it's because I feel like this is a real crossroads. There could potentially be 5 scum. If we mislynch again and BuJ dies as town, then we're done... I felt like I needed to concentrate the scum hunting to a smaller group today and let town now that I will be able to bring more information tomorrow as well. Could be 4 completely new people. Could be the same people. That will depend on how I feel about the day once night is here.

So, I think BuJ is super scummy. He is my number one lynch target, but if he is poisoned, then just let the night take him. This is all assuming that there isn't a third poisoner. If anyone disagrees with the third poisoner being a lie, please speak up. For me, that leaves our lynchables as one of these 5:
  1. TX
  2. ZaB
  3. Pika
  4. Sirius
  5. blacky

Of those 5, I trust ZaB the most and Sirius/Pika/blacky the least. I would suggest TX not be lynched because of his priest claim. If you are town and one of the 5, that does not mean that I think you are necessarily scummy because you are on this list. But, if we play this correctly, town will win even if you die as town. It sucks to be a martyr. I've been there, but while you play these last couple days, think about what is best for the town group and not what is best for keeping yourself alive.
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Re: INTO THE DEEP (Day 4)

Postby TX AG 90 on Mon Apr 15, 2019 1:22 pm

blacky365 wrote:@TX
Firstly, although I shouldn’t say this because you have me in your crosshairs, don’t stop what you are doing!
Whether you are on the right track or not is irrelevant, it’s adding to discussion and I believe it’s the scum who are trying to make you feel guilty for posting... don’t let them get the better of you!


You say you were on your way to me and you were poisoned along the way... is it possible that the same person who poisoned you poisoned me?
And why wait until now to share this? It would have been mighty useful to have known this earlier when we were looking for a poisoner!


As I mentioned earlier, I've had very little sleep the last 10 days compounded with an extremely high amount of personal stress. I initially dismissed that info as irrelevant since I never made it to you, my protection target. However, when revisiting all my messages from Mod, it snapped that I should probably post this also, just in case it means something.
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Re: INTO THE DEEP (Day 4)

Postby TX AG 90 on Mon Apr 15, 2019 1:32 pm

chapcrap wrote:So, I'm not sure anyone can confirm my actions, but I'll lay them all out anyway and you can choose to trust me or not. I think I can do what I need to so that I am safe at night. I am Town Transporter. It's essentially an upgraded busdriver.

Initial ability - swap the actions that go to two people. So, I get to choose someone and the actions directed at that person will go to the other person I choose.

N1, I switched strike wolf and Ragian. No real reason why. Just wanted to switch someone so that I could advance up my role tree and get bonus abilities and whatnot. I was successful. This explains why blacky was poisoned. I switched him into Ragian.

N2, I wanted to do a night action for more ability reasons. I asked the mod that if going for food counted as a night action, I would do that. It did. I found food (insects) and upgraded!

New ability - swap the actions of 4 people. This happens in two sets of two. So, basically double the first action. In addition to the doubling, I also get told how many scum are involved with the 4 people I switch.

N3, I switched Ragian and strike wolf. I assumed no one would be targeting Ragian, and that would keep strike wolf safe. If someone targeted strike wolf, I assumed they would be poisoned or we would lose a claimed poisoner. I was ok with that. Additionally, I switched Skoffin and Tobi. I did that because I felt like they had scummy vibes and I was mostly going for a scum count. I was successful and I was told that there 1 scum in the group. My assumption is that scum is inclusive of mafia, third party, anyone not town. I'm guessing that sw is DEFINITELY town. Ragian is most likely town. I would say that Skoffin or Tobi is the scum between the 4 of them, but I'm not sure who I think is more scummy. Initially, I felt Skoffin heavily, but am unsure.

So, BuJ claimed to have been poisoned, but visited Skoffin. Unlikely, IMO. A THIRD poisoner? More likely, he attempted to visit sw and got bussed into a poison. Super scummy from blacky. Number 1, why would you visit sw? Number 2, why would you lie about it. I could be wrong and there is a third poisoner, but we've already heard from 2 other people with the ability to move people in the night and neither did anything with BuJ.

Anyway, my plain is with me, Skoffin, Ragian, Tobi, and sw, we have 5 people with only one being scum, if we add one of the other person, hopefully a townie, we have the majority of people left and can control the votes as long as I don't accidentally bus one of the 6 into Ragian and get that person poisoned. My suggestion for the 6th would be TX because of his role claim, but if others have a better option than TX, I'm willing to listen on that.

Actions to take - the 6 people in that group move forward in lynching one of the other 5. My suggestion for that right now is BuJ because of what happened last night. However, I do not think it matters if the 6 of us remain as a team. If one of the 6 speaks up and does not want to do that at some point, that person is leaning scummy to me. If we all make it until tomorrow, I should have new information on the investigative properties of my role. I will take and listen to suggestions on who to bus, but I will not speak about my thoughts on who should be bussed tonight because I do not want to give scum an edge on which way I will go. There are a lot of good bus options for protection, offense, and investigatory roles. Also options from the other side on scum hunting at night.

As far as why I claimed now, it's because I feel like this is a real crossroads. There could potentially be 5 scum. If we mislynch again and BuJ dies as town, then we're done... I felt like I needed to concentrate the scum hunting to a smaller group today and let town now that I will be able to bring more information tomorrow as well. Could be 4 completely new people. Could be the same people. That will depend on how I feel about the day once night is here.

So, I think BuJ is super scummy. He is my number one lynch target, but if he is poisoned, then just let the night take him. This is all assuming that there isn't a third poisoner. If anyone disagrees with the third poisoner being a lie, please speak up. For me, that leaves our lynchables as one of these 5:
  1. TX
  2. ZaB
  3. Pika
  4. Sirius
  5. blacky

Of those 5, I trust ZaB the most and Sirius/Pika/blacky the least. I would suggest TX not be lynched because of his priest claim. If you are town and one of the 5, that does not mean that I think you are necessarily scummy because you are on this list. But, if we play this correctly, town will win even if you die as town. It sucks to be a martyr. I've been there, but while you play these last couple days, think about what is best for the town group and not what is best for keeping yourself alive.


Chap,

Your assessment seems way to well laid out to be BS. So, I guess your plan is as good as any and I'll join your 6.

I hesitate on BuJ because of what aage told us before he died and I agree with with you on ZaBeast. I can be convinced to lynch any of the other 3.
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Re: INTO THE DEEP (Day 4)

Postby strike wolf on Mon Apr 15, 2019 2:39 pm

Okay. I'm officially confused and gonna have to revisit somethings.

I tend to believe you Chap but could you answer why you wouldn't be poisoned by Ragian?

Also for the sake of my sanity so I don't have to spend 2 hours looking into this. As briefly and to the point as possible could we have everyone who's already claimed post all the role information that they've already given out in one post please.

Stroke Wolf: axolotl-Doctor
NA Role: Healer
Ability: prevents all night kill attempts against my target. Heals target who was poisoned the preprevious night.

N1-Pika
N2-Blacky
N3-Zabeast
Iliad wrote:The upside of calling everyone scum and making 1000 predictions is that statistically you should get a few right.


Strike wolf need brain for smart making.
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Re: INTO THE DEEP (Day 4)

Postby strike wolf on Mon Apr 15, 2019 2:41 pm

those were my night actions of it wasn't clear.
Iliad wrote:The upside of calling everyone scum and making 1000 predictions is that statistically you should get a few right.


Strike wolf need brain for smart making.
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Re: INTO THE DEEP (Day 4)

Postby chapcrap on Mon Apr 15, 2019 3:36 pm

strike wolf wrote:I tend to believe you Chap but could you answer why you wouldn't be poisoned by Ragian?

I asked the mod whether or not passive/active night actions affected me if I did switching and was told that I just did the switching. Not sure how you want to explain that mechanically, but that's what Raz told me.
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Re: INTO THE DEEP (Day 4)

Postby Tobikera on Mon Apr 15, 2019 6:04 pm

TX said

"I don't know what to tell you Beast. I healed myself N2 and was told by Mod that I was feeling better.
Isn't N2 the night Tobi claimed to target Mets and was confirmed by Mets? Maybe you were blocked?

I redirected Mets on N1 and was successful.
I redirected BuJaber on N2 and was not successful (I was bumped).
I redirected Pika on N3 and was successful.

SW and Pika have asked for specific info from others. SW has been forthcoming on his role info. Has Pika volunteered anything? Just from memory, the following have been forthcoming: Tobi, Rage, TX, SW, blacky, ZB, Skoffin, chapcrap. Not forthcoming: Pika, SK. Not sure: BuJaber.

Seems like a lot of duplicate roles floating around. Wish I had ZB's enhanced abililties, however, and I have stated at least twice before that my role can be a benefit or detriment to town; as far as I know, I can't tell the mod who to redirect Player X into. If ZB redirected me N2, that explains my bump (stated at least twice), but why he thinks being redirected into TX would make it impossible for me to save myself leaves me puzzled?

I now have two confirmations of my successful redirections (Mets and Pika), and one confirmation of my bump on N2 (ZB). If I was scum, I could easily have redirected SW on N2 and prevented him from curing blacky, but I did not, instead failing to redirect BuJaber.

UNVOTE
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Re: INTO THE DEEP (Day 4)

Postby TX AG 90 on Mon Apr 15, 2019 6:07 pm

strike wolf wrote:Okay. I'm officially confused and gonna have to revisit somethings.

I tend to believe you Chap but could you answer why you wouldn't be poisoned by Ragian?

Also for the sake of my sanity so I don't have to spend 2 hours looking into this. As briefly and to the point as possible could we have everyone who's already claimed post all the role information that they've already given out in one post please.

Stroke Wolf: axolotl-Doctor
NA Role: Healer
Ability: prevents all night kill attempts against my target. Heals target who was poisoned the preprevious night.

N1-Pika
N2-Blacky
N3-Zabeast


TX AG 90: Clown Fish - Town Priest
NA Role: Healer
Ability: Can Protect from Night Actions OR Someone from the effects of poisoning

N1 - Protected Blacky - Not successful, was poisoned before I got there
N2 - healed myself - successful
N3 - Protected myself - was told I was successful (I don't know if this means I was someone's target and I protected myself from the, or if nobody targeted me - probably 1st one)

Bonus Action if I am successful going after food:

Protect myself and 2 others for 1 night; reflects any incoming night action back on the attackers
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Re: INTO THE DEEP (Day 4)

Postby chapcrap on Mon Apr 15, 2019 9:38 pm

@Tobi How did you feel about what I laid out? About the plan moving forward?

Feel like it's been quiet today (real day, not mafia day)...
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Re: INTO THE DEEP (Day 4)

Postby TX AG 90 on Mon Apr 15, 2019 11:13 pm

chapcrap wrote:@Tobi How did you feel about what I laid out? About the plan moving forward?

Feel like it's been quiet today (real day, not mafia day)...


Maybe they're afraid chap...
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Re: INTO THE DEEP (Day 4)

Postby chapcrap on Tue Apr 16, 2019 12:01 am

TX AG 90 wrote:
chapcrap wrote:@Tobi How did you feel about what I laid out? About the plan moving forward?

Feel like it's been quiet today (real day, not mafia day)...


Maybe they're afraid chap...

Perhaps...

Remember, if you are town and on the list of 5, new information could come after tonight. In the initial group of 5 (me, sw, Ragian, Tobi, and Skoff) there is one scum. So, we will need to switch at some point to be targeting one of them, but we can't really plan on changing the gameplan until we have more information. Most likely from N4, but perhaps from additional information that someone has today.
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Re: INTO THE DEEP (Day 4)

Postby TX AG 90 on Tue Apr 16, 2019 12:08 am

chapcrap wrote:
TX AG 90 wrote:
chapcrap wrote:@Tobi How did you feel about what I laid out? About the plan moving forward?

Feel like it's been quiet today (real day, not mafia day)...


Maybe they're afraid chap...

Perhaps...

Remember, if you are town and on the list of 5, new information could come after tonight. In the initial group of 5 (me, sw, Ragian, Tobi, and Skoff) there is one scum. So, we will need to switch at some po

If your plan works and we pull off a town win, you have my vote for MVP.

Then again, you 5 could all be scum and setting me up to lynch my teammates - you never know with this game! I guess I have to start trusting someone sometime.
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Re: INTO THE DEEP (Day 4)

Postby ZaBeast on Tue Apr 16, 2019 1:00 am

ZaBeast wrote:@rage tl:dr version
The important facts
-I bump my target so they get redirected, but I know who the redirection lands on
N1: I targeted skoff. No result from mod, blacky says he's been bumped (and poisoned)
N2: I target tobi. Redirect him into TX. Therefore he should have been redirected (and unable to save himself) unless bussed

My conclusions
- Someone "stole" my action N1. By that I mean I think my action has been redirected by someone else and (I assume) they'd get the result.
- Tobi's role is pretty similar to mine, but useless to town. Therefore it's one of the reasons I've come suspect him.
- It is unlikely TX could have healed himself on N2 based on what has been claimed so far. If bussed, tobi's redirection couldn't have landed on him, but he couldn't have auto-targeted himself either.

for SW
Misc.: N3 got confused and couldn't find my target
Role name: town drug addict
Ability: redirector
Bonus action (where my role name comes from): I don't think I'll go for food, but I don't see the point in disclosing it.

TX AG 90 wrote:Do you know who the redirection lands on post fact or do you choose who the redirection lands on?

The redirection is random. I know who it lands on when I get my night action results.
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Re: INTO THE DEEP (Day 4)

Postby ZaBeast on Tue Apr 16, 2019 2:07 am

blacky365 wrote:
chapcrap wrote:blacky and BuJ, who did you visit when you were poisoned? Maybe you were misdirected, maybe not. But that information is needed.

Chap and others keep going on about this despite me saying it is irrelevant... it appears that I did not reach my target, I was poisoned on my way. So me saying who my target was will only muddy the waters further, that being said, to keep you happy my target was Strike. Now, how does that help anyone?

You've been saying that for a while. Can you remind me how you knew you didn't reach your initial target? If there's a way to tell someone was bussed (because it seems that's what happened, see post below) from the flavor you get from your night action results it would be great.
chapcrap wrote:N1, I switched strike wolf and Ragian. No real reason why. Just wanted to switch someone so that I could advance up my role tree and get bonus abilities and whatnot. I was successful. This explains why blacky was poisoned. I switched him into Ragian.


Tobikera wrote:If ZB redirected me N2, that explains my bump (stated at least twice), but why he thinks being redirected into TX would make it impossible for me (him) to save myself (himself) leaves me puzzled?
Here's what I'm saying
- I targeted you, and you confirm the action (bump) landed on you. Therefore you can't have been bussed (I don't like using "driven", looks weird). If TX had been bussed, he couldn't target himself as that action would have been redirected to someone else because of the bussing. There's always the possibility that you are not a redirector but someone on your scum team is, but that would be a pretty stupid thing to do, mainly because 1) You wouldn't know if the redirection was actually succesful and 2) There's not much point in risking getting caught over a lie like that

chapcrap wrote:Remember, if you are town and on the list of 5, new information could come after tonight. In the initial group of 5 (me, sw, Ragian, Tobi, and Skoff) there is one scum. So, we will need to switch at some point to be targeting one of them, but we can't really plan on changing the gameplan until we have more information. Most likely from N4, but perhaps from additional information that someone has today.

The bonus night action is a 1-time use thing. Seriously people, read the rules

Tobikera wrote: If I was scum, I could easily have redirected SW on N2 and prevented him from curing blacky, but I did not, instead failing to redirect BuJaber.

1- If blacky had been passively poisoned (like it seems he was), it is not alignment indicative. And if he was actively poisoned, nothing tells us it wasn't from a serial killer (again not indicative of mafia-town alignment). Therefore scum could have an interest in keeping blacky alive.
2- Assuming you wanted blacky dead, you could have thought the trade-off of being more "exposed" to investigative roles (like a tracker for instance) was not worth it

chapcrap wrote:So, BuJ claimed to have been poisoned, but visited Skoffin. Unlikely, IMO. A THIRD poisoner? More likely, he attempted to visit sw and got bussed into a poison. Super scummy from blacky. Number 1, why would you visit sw? Number 2, why would you lie about it. I could be wrong and there is a third poisoner, but we've already heard from 2 other people with the ability to move people in the night and neither did anything with BuJ.

I get what you mean now. TX indeed seems to have been poisoned by jfm (would explain why he said at the end of D2 there waas a day doc. He knew he poisoned TX, and TX had no reason to keep quiet about it unless he was able to heal himself.) Since mets (as per his own claim) and blacky (as per chap's bussing claim) have targeted our passive poisoner, if TX has indeed been poisoned by jfm, it is unlikely BuJ has been. That's putting a lot of weight on jfm's claim (and deductions) given how all over the place with his claims he's been throughout the game though.
I don't think BuJ shouldn't be a lynch target today as Aage got "very conclusive evidence" he was town. Though, and that's probably just me being paranoid, I don't like when someone claims someone else is town, then suddenly dies. I for one would clearly kill someone who wrongly would have cleared a partner.
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Re: INTO THE DEEP (Day 4)

Postby Skoffin on Tue Apr 16, 2019 2:15 am

Very sick much medication no brian. more post tomorow

I think i only revealed that i claimed i was attacked n1 and that was by a bull shark. i have an ability that can protect myself from a kill/seee what species tries to hurt me

chaps claim seems so op dakky was porobably right this is a bastard game if its true
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Re: INTO THE DEEP (Day 4)

Postby ZaBeast on Tue Apr 16, 2019 2:24 am

ZaBeast wrote:I get what you mean now. TX indeed seems to have been poisoned by jfm (would explain why he said at the end of D2 there waas a day doc. He knew he poisoned TX, and TX had no reason to keep quiet about it unless he was able to heal himself.) Since mets (as per his own claim) and blacky (as per chap's bussing claim) have targeted our passive poisoner, if TX has indeed been poisoned by jfm, it is unlikely BuJ has been actively poisoned. That's putting a lot of weight on jfm's claim (and deductions) given how all over the place with his claims he's been throughout the game though.

If your reasoning is only based on the wording from the victims, I disagree with that, as what makes you believe TX isn't the one lying (assuming all active poisoning instances would carry the same flavor)? Only TX and BuJ claimed to having been targeted by an active poisoner so far.
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Re: INTO THE DEEP (Day 4)

Postby blacky365 on Tue Apr 16, 2019 3:25 am

ZaBeast wrote:
blacky365 wrote:
chapcrap wrote:blacky and BuJ, who did you visit when you were poisoned? Maybe you were misdirected, maybe not. But that information is needed.

Chap and others keep going on about this despite me saying it is irrelevant... it appears that I did not reach my target, I was poisoned on my way. So me saying who my target was will only muddy the waters further, that being said, to keep you happy my target was Strike. Now, how does that help anyone?

You've been saying that for a while. Can you remind me how you knew you didn't reach your initial target? If there's a way to tell someone was bussed (because it seems that's what happened, see post below) from the flavor you get from your night action results it would be great.


ok screw it... the wording from my night results pm;
It is dark.. you see your prey but he shows no interest in you. Closer you think... then you feel it.
A sharp burning pain down the side of your body... seems you messed with the wrong prey tonight
YOU HAVE BEEN POISONED
Without intervening medical attention, you will not last past night 2

So you can see from these words that there I have not been told conclusively that I was poisoned by an active or passive... initially I thought that i had been poisoned by my target, but then I thought it looks like its more of a passive poisoning... now i just dont know!
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Re: INTO THE DEEP (Day 4)

Postby Tobikera on Tue Apr 16, 2019 3:26 am

chapcrap wrote:@Tobi How did you feel about what I laid out? About the plan moving forward?
Feel like it's been quiet today (real day, not mafia day)...


Sorry, my wife and I have been working every day to get things in a separate apt. ready to move to our condo down here. I can't drive because of a totaled knee, and my research lab/apt. has become expensive storage. So, I'm in and out here.

I am fine with your plan. Of the five, my top picks to vote would be pika and blacky.

I feel a bit lost now that it appears that there are 2 misdirectors and a bus driver, two healers, and perhaps at least 2 poisoners. Never played in a game like this before. Of course, in most games I have played, town did little at night that was active....mostly passive like investigate, observe, etc. Here, everyone has a active role and there are no VTs. I have been playing one way based on my total role info, which would best benefit me and town. However, with the apparent multiplicity of similar roles, it is apparent to me that my strategy is in error. I was pressing buttons that didn't need pressed. So, lead on Chap, and we'll see what comes out the other end.
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Re: INTO THE DEEP (Day 4)

Postby Ragian on Tue Apr 16, 2019 3:38 am

ZaBeast wrote:@rage tl:dr version
The important facts
-I bump my target so they get redirected, but I know who the redirection lands on
N1: I targeted skoff. No result from mod, blacky says he's been bumped (and poisoned)
N2: I target tobi. Redirect him into TX. Therefore he should have been redirected (and unable to save himself) unless bussed

My conclusions
- Someone "stole" my action N1. By that I mean I think my action has been redirected by someone else and (I assume) they'd get the result.
- Tobi's role is pretty similar to mine, but useless to town. Therefore it's one of the reasons I've come suspect him.
- It is unlikely TX could have healed himself on N2 based on what has been claimed so far. If bussed, tobi's redirection couldn't have landed on him, but he couldn't have auto-targeted himself either.

Cheers. It's the last bit I'm struggling with here. What do you infer from the evidence that TX couldnae have healed himself N2?

---

Bear with me, I'm hung over...a little help, please.
chapcrap wrote:So, I'm not sure anyone can confirm my actions, but I'll lay them all out anyway and you can choose to trust me or not. I think I can do what I need to so that I am safe at night. I am Town Transporter. It's essentially an upgraded busdriver.

Initial ability - swap the actions that go to two people. So, I get to choose someone and the actions directed at that person will go to the other person I choose.

N1, I switched strike wolf and Ragian. No real reason why. Just wanted to switch someone so that I could advance up my role tree and get bonus abilities and whatnot. I was successful. This explains why blacky was poisoned. I switched him into Ragian. Did Blacky state that he visited SW N1?

N2, I wanted to do a night action for more ability reasons. I asked the mod that if going for food counted as a night action, I would do that. It did. I found food (insects) and upgraded!

New ability - swap the actions of 4 people. This happens in two sets of two. So, basically double the first action. In addition to the doubling, I also get told how many scum are involved with the 4 people I switch.

N3, I switched Ragian and strike wolf. I assumed no one would be targeting Ragian, and that would keep strike wolf safe. If someone targeted strike wolf, I assumed they would be poisoned or we would lose a claimed poisoner. I was ok with that. Additionally, I switched Skoffin and Tobi. I did that because I felt like they had scummy vibes and I was mostly going for a scum count. I was successful and I was told that there 1 scum in the group. My assumption is that scum is inclusive of mafia, third party, anyone not town. I'm guessing that sw is DEFINITELY town. Ragian is most likely town. I would say that Skoffin or Tobi is the scum between the 4 of them, but I'm not sure who I think is more scummy. Initially, I felt Skoffin heavily, but am unsure.

So, BuJ claimed to have been poisoned, but visited Skoffin. Unlikely, IMO. A THIRD poisoner? More likely, he attempted to visit sw and got bussed into a poison. Super scummy from blacky. Here's where you lose me. Why is Blacky scummy because of what BuJ does? Number 1, why would you visit sw? Number 2, why would you lie about it. I could be wrong and there is a third poisoner, but we've already heard from 2 other people with the ability to move people in the night and neither did anything with BuJ.

Anyway, my plain is with me, Skoffin, Ragian, Tobi, and sw, we have 5 people with only one being scum, if we add one of the other person, hopefully a townie, we have the majority of people left and can control the votes as long as I don't accidentally bus one of the 6 into Ragian and get that person poisoned. My suggestion for the 6th would be TX because of his role claim, but if others have a better option than TX, I'm willing to listen on that.

Actions to take - the 6 people in that group move forward in lynching one of the other 5. My suggestion for that right now is BuJ because of what happened last night. However, I do not think it matters if the 6 of us remain as a team. If one of the 6 speaks up and does not want to do that at some point, that person is leaning scummy to me. If we all make it until tomorrow, I should have new information on the investigative properties of my role. I will take and listen to suggestions on who to bus, but I will not speak about my thoughts on who should be bussed tonight because I do not want to give scum an edge on which way I will go. There are a lot of good bus options for protection, offense, and investigatory roles. Also options from the other side on scum hunting at night.

As far as why I claimed now, it's because I feel like this is a real crossroads. There could potentially be 5 scum. If we mislynch again and BuJ dies as town, then we're done... I felt like I needed to concentrate the scum hunting to a smaller group today and let town now that I will be able to bring more information tomorrow as well. Could be 4 completely new people. Could be the same people. That will depend on how I feel about the day once night is here.

So, I think BuJ is super scummy. He is my number one lynch target, but if he is poisoned, then just let the night take him. This is all assuming that there isn't a third poisoner. If anyone disagrees with the third poisoner being a lie, please speak up. For me, that leaves our lynchables as one of these 5:
  1. TX
  2. ZaB
  3. Pika
  4. Sirius
  5. blacky

Of those 5, I trust ZaB the most and Sirius/Pika/blacky the least. I would suggest TX not be lynched because of his priest claim. If you are town and one of the 5, that does not mean that I think you are necessarily scummy because you are on this list. But, if we play this correctly, town will win even if you die as town. It sucks to be a martyr. I've been there, but while you play these last couple days, think about what is best for the town group and not what is best for keeping yourself alive.

I'd prefer to lynch Pika or SK, I think.

FP'ed by Tobi investigative role are active roles, mate ;)
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Re: INTO THE DEEP (Day 4)

Postby Tobikera on Tue Apr 16, 2019 3:46 am

blacky365 wrote:
ok screw it... the wording from my night results pm;
It is dark.. you see your prey but he shows no interest in you. Closer you think... then you feel it.
A sharp burning pain down the side of your body... seems you messed with the wrong prey tonight
YOU HAVE BEEN POISONED
Without intervening medical attention, you will not last past night 2

So you can see from these words that there I have not been told conclusively that I was poisoned by an active or passive... initially I thought that i had been poisoned by my target, but then I thought it looks like its more of a passive poisoning... now i just dont know!


I do not understand, blacky, the mod's words seem pretty clear that your prey poisoned you. There are several things that could have happened, based on what happens in the real world. It does not appear that your prey attacked you aggressively, i.e., came after you or waited for a chance to strike. But, they could have attacked you as a defense action, much like a dog biting you when you try to pet it because it feels threatened. That could be construed as a defensive poisoning, versus a seek-and-find or ambush type active poisoning. The third type is when you bump into something or pick up something that has poisonous spines/chemicals like some plants, some caterpillars, etc. This would be a true passive type of poisoning. I would categorize your poisoning as the defensive type, based on the mod's words (disinterest on the part of your prey, plus no mention of a bump).
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Re: INTO THE DEEP (Day 4)

Postby Tobikera on Tue Apr 16, 2019 3:49 am

@ Ragian


FP'ed by Tobi investigative role are active roles, mate ;)

What do I know, as you can attest, I was a Vanilla Townie in 90% of the games I played in TNC.
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Re: INTO THE DEEP (Day 4)

Postby BuJaber on Tue Apr 16, 2019 4:02 am

There's a lot of stuff that neess rereading because that's just too many claims to really understand the whole thing.

But let's all thank chapcrap for outing himself as scum, I mean he must have taken pity on town, and I appreciate his efforts to make the game fair.
BUT basically since aage in his DYING BREATH told you all I was town, and he now flipped town, so you know he isn't lying, and none of the THREE redirector claims have targetted aage, you know damb well I'm town but you wanna lynch me?

Not on my watch you scummy morsel. Eat rope.
And FOS on everyone who saw that and went "hmm yeah maybe but maybe you're wrong". You guys know he's wrong about me, why are you being nice to scum and giving him a chance to backtrack and claim he made a mistake. It's too late for anyone to claim they redirected aage, the time for lies is over, none of the redirectors can change their story. So he's trying to lynch confirmed town. I'm disappoinred hy everyone's mild reaction.

We're about to go through every little claim and sniff out the liars. Because I think we've all just about had it with all the people essentially claiming the same damn roles. Anybody who wants to help list everything we know in the order of claims is welcome to. It's a big job that will take some time but we have to do it right.

And after we're done we're lynching chap.
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Re: INTO THE DEEP (Day 4)

Postby Pikanchion on Tue Apr 16, 2019 4:16 am

BuJaber wrote:There's a lot of stuff that neess rereading because that's just too many claims to really understand the whole thing.

We're about to go through every little claim and sniff out the liars. Because I think we've all just about had it with all the people essentially claiming the same damn roles. Anybody who wants to help list everything we know in the order of claims is welcome to. It's a big job that will take some time but we have to do it right.

I'm already an hour into a post doing precisely this (with links and all), it will take me several more hours to finish, potentially longer if I take a break to eat etc.
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Re: INTO THE DEEP (Day 4)

Postby blacky365 on Tue Apr 16, 2019 4:23 am

Tobikera wrote:
blacky365 wrote:
ok screw it... the wording from my night results pm;
It is dark.. you see your prey but he shows no interest in you. Closer you think... then you feel it.
A sharp burning pain down the side of your body... seems you messed with the wrong prey tonight
YOU HAVE BEEN POISONED
Without intervening medical attention, you will not last past night 2

So you can see from these words that there I have not been told conclusively that I was poisoned by an active or passive... initially I thought that i had been poisoned by my target, but then I thought it looks like its more of a passive poisoning... now i just dont know!


I do not understand, blacky, the mod's words seem pretty clear that your prey poisoned you. There are several things that could have happened, based on what happens in the real world. It does not appear that your prey attacked you aggressively, i.e., came after you or waited for a chance to strike. But, they could have attacked you as a defense action, much like a dog biting you when you try to pet it because it feels threatened. That could be construed as a defensive poisoning, versus a seek-and-find or ambush type active poisoning. The third type is when you bump into something or pick up something that has poisonous spines/chemicals like some plants, some caterpillars, etc. This would be a true passive type of poisoning. I would categorize your poisoning as the defensive type, based on the mod's words (disinterest on the part of your prey, plus no mention of a bump).


That was my first thought too... that it was my target who poisoned me. But then i looked again and its not conclusive that it was my target, because i did not reach the target, i could only see him.

Either way, hopefully now you understand my confusion!
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Re: INTO THE DEEP (Day 4)

Postby Tobikera on Tue Apr 16, 2019 4:50 am

@BuJaber
I believe Aage's comments were written on D2, BEFORE Dakky was lynched. I have to wonder what Aage would have concluded if he was aware of the multiplicity of similar roles. Could what he concluded about you and others be clouded by the fact that there is potentially two misdirectors and one bus driver, etc.? Also, Aage was wrong about several folks, I think, not least about dakky being scum. Given all the recent revelations, I don't feel Aage's comments are necessarily carved in stone.

That being said, only briefly did I hold the thought that you might be scum. You have not been high on my FOS list during D3 and now D4. And, also, there are easier ways for scum to avoid attention than coming up with complex ploys, like Chap or TX have. Perhaps I overestimate them.

Consistent with Chap's plan and based on choices above by several, including myself, I suggest we move forward by voting pika to L-2 to get a claim. Based on that, we either lynch or back off and try SK, who also hasn't been forthcoming. Either way, we need all the info possible to make sure we eliminate one scum on D4, else town could be ruined. Time to fish or cut bait.

VOTE PIKA
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