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Closed Game 22996044 secret alliance. Pilager and Foxnews [ka]

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Game 22996044 secret alliance. Pilager and Foxnews [ka]

Postby centuori on Sun Jun 16, 2024 9:26 pm

Accused: Pilager
Foxnews




The accused are suspected of:


Conducting Secret Diplomacy




Game number(s):
22996044



Comments: Threse 2 players Pilager(red) and foxnews (yellow) I have noticed played 180 games together with many doubles in there too. In this particular game I referenced here both red and yellow started going for bonuses near eachother. They did not really attack eachother on that border once they established bonuses. Yellow didnt even leave anything on their borders to protect the bonus. The game got to a point where yellow became the clear leader and was expanding everywhere but in red's direction. Their borders continued being pretty thin and red ranked as a colonel still refused to attack yellow with the clear lead. At that point I said something and red became very defensive and rude in the chat, then attacked me of course. The game continues with them not fighting and people trying to stop yellow but getting crushed as he had the lead. Yellow still never attacked red and left his borders with red non exisatant. Finally red attacks yellow stealing his intiial bonus that yellow didnt have many troops in at that point anyway. Looking at the board I would say they agreed to give red that bonus to even out the deploy as yellow has now established other bonuses from expanding. Given what I just described here and the fact they play many games together including doubles I think its pretty evident they know eachother and communicate outside of conquer club public chat to agree on truces in free for all games.
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Re: Game 22996044 secret alliance. Pilager and Foxnews

Postby Murphalot on Mon Jun 17, 2024 4:31 am

...you're right, nice catch!!

....i've been burning through a lot of their game history & i've found other accounts linked to those 2 accounts as well. I'll update when i have enough.
(in the process of preparing a whopping 7 BAN reports of my own over the past 16 months, i'm close now to launching them. Cheating on CC is sadly rampant, i'm only happy to help crack down.)
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Re: Game 22996044 secret alliance. Pilager and Foxnews

Postby Murphalot on Mon Jun 17, 2024 6:26 am

the 3rd account is "TheRookThief". also Clearly engaged in Collusive game-play /Secret Diplomacy. A possible 4th account tied in is "King Nobles".

Not only did you identify blatant collusion, but Pilager & foxnews are the same person, as DETAILED in the close proximity of turns in tons of their games. However, i'm not seeing enough frequent repetition thus far, of turn-taking when comparing Pilager AND foxnews to TheRookThief.
King Nobles does share significant game quantities with them though.

Here are the games-played combinations:
Pilager + foxnews [TOTAL] = 179
Pilager + foxnews [non-team games] = *137 (this is unusual)
Pilager + TheRookThief [TOTAL] = 431
Pilager + TheRookThief [non-team games] = 107
Pilager + foxnews + TheRookThief [TOTAL] = 36
Pilager + foxnews + TheRookThief [non-team games] = 6
TheRookThief + foxnews [TOTAL] = 147
TheRookThief + foxnews [non-team games] = 10

Focus on the non-team games. Cowardly losers love stacking their alt accounts together in doubles, triples, & quads; i learned that eons ago, its why i almost never play those. Ergo, non-team games make it easier to catch them teaming up on others - its also helpful when the players are positioned in consecutive order, to spot the time shortage between turns.

TIME SEPARATION (or lack of) between sequential turns/freestyle turns.
Be mindful that finding cheaters is easier in Freemium accounts, because w/max of 4 games allowed, the alt accounts take turns quickly. Whereas w/Premiums, the cheater crunches out a lot of turns in many more games before logging into the next account to do the same = hence the gap between turns isn't the typical 0-5 minutes with freemiums... but its spread to 0-30 minutes-ish with Premiums.

Verdict: pick any couple of non-team games from each of the combinations i listed above ^. You'll see from snapshots that this cheater doesn't hold back from squeezing out opposition, along with harvesting cards from their alts once the weak alt is separated away from the other players.
The arrogant attitude is the giveaway EVERY-TIME. EVERY TIME.
Normal response from potential cheaters to game-chat accusations of collusion are usually an unprepared sense of incredulity with measured wording. When the person lashes out at first chance with name calling and slandering that includes 'paranoia', they are absolutely guilty. if they also get pompous, its 100% they are a spineless cheater.

....and check out the short breadth of time difference between Pilager & foxnews in any selection of their games when they are in sequential order. He just doesn't give a shit about hiding it.

Good luck, & i hope these accounts get axed.
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Re: Game 22996044 secret alliance. Pilager and Foxnews

Postby jfm10 on Mon Jun 17, 2024 4:48 pm

Murphalot wrote:the 3rd account is "TheRookThief". also Clearly engaged in Collusive game-play /Secret Diplomacy. A possible 4th account tied in is "King Nobles".

Not only did you identify blatant collusion, but Pilager & foxnews are the same person, as DETAILED in the close proximity of turns in tons of their games. However, i'm not seeing enough frequent repetition thus far, of turn-taking when comparing Pilager AND foxnews to TheRookThief.
King Nobles does share significant game quantities with them though.

Here are the games-played combinations:
Pilager + foxnews [TOTAL] = 179
Pilager + foxnews [non-team games] = *137 (this is unusual)
Pilager + TheRookThief [TOTAL] = 431
Pilager + TheRookThief [non-team games] = 107
Pilager + foxnews + TheRookThief [TOTAL] = 36
Pilager + foxnews + TheRookThief [non-team games] = 6
TheRookThief + foxnews [TOTAL] = 147
TheRookThief + foxnews [non-team games] = 10

Focus on the non-team games. Cowardly losers love stacking their alt accounts together in doubles, triples, & quads; i learned that eons ago, its why i almost never play those. Ergo, non-team games make it easier to catch them teaming up on others - its also helpful when the players are positioned in consecutive order, to spot the time shortage between turns.

TIME SEPARATION (or lack of) between sequential turns/freestyle turns.
Be mindful that finding cheaters is easier in Freemium accounts, because w/max of 4 games allowed, the alt accounts take turns quickly. Whereas w/Premiums, the cheater crunches out a lot of turns in many more games before logging into the next account to do the same = hence the gap between turns isn't the typical 0-5 minutes with freemiums... but its spread to 0-30 minutes-ish with Premiums.

Verdict: pick any couple of non-team games from each of the combinations i listed above ^. You'll see from snapshots that this cheater doesn't hold back from squeezing out opposition, along with harvesting cards from their alts once the weak alt is separated away from the other players.
The arrogant attitude is the giveaway EVERY-TIME. EVERY TIME.
Normal response from potential cheaters to game-chat accusations of collusion are usually an unprepared sense of incredulity with measured wording. When the person lashes out at first chance with name calling and slandering that includes 'paranoia', they are absolutely guilty. if they also get pompous, its 100% they are a spineless cheater.

....and check out the short breadth of time difference between Pilager & foxnews in any selection of their games when they are in sequential order. He just doesn't give a shit about hiding it.

Good luck, & i hope these accounts get axed.


RGV clan is where most of the team games took place a couple years ago . not likely any multi as they would have been checked entering the clan but perhaps Pillager being without a clan now could make another but highly unlikely. Just wanted to point that out. Game 22996044
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Re: Game 22996044 secret alliance. Pilager and Foxnews

Postby king achilles on Mon Jun 17, 2024 8:06 pm

They are cleared of being multis even the 3rd account mentioned here. Pilager and Foxnews have been blocked from playing games together moving forward.
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Re: Game 22996044 secret alliance. Pilager and Foxnews [ka]

Postby SoN!c on Tue Jun 18, 2024 11:45 am

Sorry, why cant 2 friends play games together? 2 ex clan mates crying out loud...If they are multis they should get axed, and punished if they commited secret diplomacy (based on facts). If they are not or there is no evidence strong enough they should get cleared 100%.

If i was Pilager and got any restrictions playing with my friends i say f♤ck it - im not paying subscribtion for this crap. And i would do the same if i was foxnews. And then the site loses another 2 paying members.

Cleared = should be 100% cleared (secret diplomacy is an infriction too, if they commit that they should be punished but clearly there is no evidence for secret diplomacy, let alone being multis), so they should be cleared 100% and not be 50% blocked

Im in some games with them and nothing fishy.. besides me not winning them :D but thats no evidence :D :D :D
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Re: Game 22996044 secret alliance. Pilager and Foxnews [ka]

Postby Murphalot on Tue Jun 18, 2024 8:20 pm

Absolute BS. god damn, there is ALWAYS someone crawling outa the woodwork to run interference on behalf of cheaters.

I spent more than 2 fuckin hours carving through DOZENS of the non-team games of the profiles mentioned above:
the shear frequency of repetitive turns being taken by Pilagar & foxnews when they are in sequential order in the games is ENOUGH to ban them. ---not even including the evidence from Screen Snaps of ALL those profiles hustling for each other to isolate their weaker alts for the cards and then nipping away at specific opponents to chop them down 1 by 1. Because that is NOT practical or realistic :roll: .
I can see how TheRookThief & KingNobles are diff accounts, but Pilager & foxnews ARE the same person whom logs into 1 account, crushes out their turn in all their games, then proceeds to log into the other account and do the same.

This is why i have such strong doubts regarding the reinforcement of ethical game-play now. Either the methodologies & tools available to Admins are piss-poor, or they shrug and turn a blind eye to this shit after half-assing the investigation.

it is 1 or the other.

....and lets examine Son!c's suggestion for 1 moment. Looking at the aforementioned game settings between those players, the snapshots show them in many of the games sniping away at specific opponents - even when not strategically feasible if they are on their own - and colluding to hand each other the wins.
There is no *risk* here in icing those accounts. Boo-hoo, 2 CHEATING premiums gone. That means they cannot victimize anyone else ever again! :!: Wouldn't that be the better pay-off? :!:

Genuinely speaking, you guys are very self-destructive. Dismissive, obstructive, and negligent.
You are allowing cheating on this website and you don't care, because you don't want to lose the income. Plain & Simple.

Straight up, if there was a magic trick to auto-wipe all cheaters, CC would instantly lose 15%-20% of all active players. I am angry on behalf of all the consistently honest players here. We abide the rules = we are punished.
Join 5 random Fog + Nuke games against all diff profiles, and watch yourself get miraculously destroyed from every angle. its a joke.
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Re: Game 22996044 secret alliance. Pilager and Foxnews [ka]

Postby WaRsNoOpY on Tue Jun 18, 2024 9:48 pm

Well I agree with Sonic, of course we shouldn’t set up a public post discrediting any players without any solid proof. I mean what if you’re wrong about them? The damages are done and I believe simple apology won’t cut it.

Should you have any doubts of possible foul play, please pm to the game moderators instead. If they also unable to find faults by themselves, who are we to speculate?

Peace guys ✌️
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Re: Game 22996044 secret alliance. Pilager and Foxnews [ka]

Postby SoN!c on Wed Jun 19, 2024 4:32 am

You spended "2 fuckin hours" to destroy somebody's rep but all i see is 1 game number that is presented here...

And i dont see anything so fishy in that one game. I only see experienced play on that map. I would not attack my neighbour in the beginning of that map eithee. That is stupid noob play that kills you both in the end.

Okay could be im wrong and the four of them are multis/secret partners..Multi: Not so hard to do logging in on different devices like cellphone, tablet or using other techniques like running a script in Linux to do that. You can change your IP address according to the prefix every srcond if you want. But gameplay reveals all if you are conducting secret diplomacy as multi or as henchmen. In multiple games.. over a long period. That is the point i wanna make here. There is just one game number presented here.. present 5 please...Should not be so hard to find 5 if you are right?

If Pillager has foxnews as his multi account then he is a real bad player as he has lost way too many games in that case. If you cant win with a extra account helping you then you just suck. And what i experienced is that Pillager knows the game and plays conquer rome very well.

The idea that Pilager pays for an extra account (foxnews) and does not win more is ridiculous.
Last edited by SoN!c on Wed Jun 19, 2024 9:39 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Game 22996044 secret alliance. Pilager and Foxnews [ka]

Postby j1mathman on Wed Jun 19, 2024 9:37 am

the lack of hyperlinks in this is annoying. I'd tend to agree with Sonic here, and i think centuori is a complaining unfun player. also- why would you attack your neighbor in a nospoil game? i'd think the deterrence of attacking someone with lots of troops is quite a consideration and that centuori is just sad nobody is handing him the game on a platter
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Re: Game 22996044 secret alliance. Pilager and Foxnews [ka]

Postby centuori on Thu Jun 20, 2024 6:17 am

Hey J1mathman you werent in the game so you dont know what you are talking about asswipe. I agree you dont need to go out of your way to attack your neighbor early, but this one got to a point where it was evident they had no intention of attacking eachother. Foxnews was dropping 16 and left nothing on his border with red without saying a word in the chat. Pilager too barely built on that border then expanded thr other way. At the point Foxnews had a clear lead in the game neither of them attacked eachother still. I am not claiming they are the same person but you would have to be stupid to not think they had a secret alliance here.
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Re: Game 22996044 secret alliance. Pilager and Foxnews [ka]

Postby SoN!c on Thu Jun 20, 2024 10:29 am

When you play 100+ games with the same oppponent (6 - 8 or even more player games) i can imagine you kinda "know" what they will do. And that they wont attack their neighbour early on in the game..(going into suicide clash).. is that realy "secret diplomacy"?.

Do we want overmoderated and controlled gameplay? Where your happy that you won but then need to think about VAR or complaints that roll in? Lets agree to have 3 cases as minimum? Yes cheaters need to be delt with but anything can look bad in just one game? Because gamechat and gameplay based on only one game can easily turn sour before you know it and then shit hits the fan?

I myself do not want to feed the players i thought were super annoying / total retards based on just one game... and thats probably vice versa.

Peace guys ✌️
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Re: Game 22996044 secret alliance. Pilager and Foxnews [ka]

Postby Pilager on Fri Jun 21, 2024 8:44 pm

Your the jagoff that jump on this for no reason. You are a sinister LIAR. Known in the world as a Jagoff. I am not Fox, I am not rook, I am not king or anyone else. No we don’t log in at same time as you say. You lied and harm the reputation of those men. The speed at which you postured is reminiscent of a boyfriend rushing to his girlfriend’s whimper. Is that what this is, a lovers quarrel. You on your way out and trying to show relevance? …. (Cricket's). Yep, bet it is.


You need to apologize to those men and get removed from conquer cloud. This is destructive behavior.

Or, apologize to them and setup up a couples dual and take it to the battlefiend. A man’s game not your beehive couple game tho. Mandy.


Pilager,



quote="Murphalot"]Absolute BS. god damn, there is ALWAYS someone crawling outa the woodwork to run interference on behalf of cheaters.

I spent more than 2 fuckin hours carving through DOZENS of the non-team games of the profiles mentioned above:
the shear frequency of repetitive turns being taken by Pilagar & foxnews when they are in sequential order in the games is ENOUGH to ban them. ---not even including the evidence from Screen Snaps of ALL those profiles hustling for each other to isolate their weaker alts for the cards and then nipping away at specific opponents to chop them down 1 by 1. Because that is NOT practical or realistic :roll: .
I can see how TheRookThief & KingNobles are diff accounts, but Pilager & foxnews ARE the same person whom logs into 1 account, crushes out their turn in all their games, then proceeds to log into the other account and do the same.

This is why i have such strong doubts regarding the reinforcement of ethical game-play now. Either the methodologies & tools available to Admins are piss-poor, or they shrug and turn a blind eye to this shit after half-assing the investigation.

it is 1 or the other.

....and lets examine Son!c's suggestion for 1 moment. Looking at the aforementioned game settings between those players, the snapshots show them in many of the games sniping away at specific opponents - even when not strategically feasible if they are on their own - and colluding to hand each other the wins.
There is no *risk* here in icing those accounts. Boo-hoo, 2 CHEATING premiums gone. That means they cannot victimize anyone else ever again! :!: Wouldn't that be the better pay-off? :!:

Genuinely speaking, you guys are very self-destructive. Dismissive, obstructive, and negligent.
You are allowing cheating on this website and you don't care, because you don't want to lose the income. Plain & Simple.

Straight up, if there was a magic trick to auto-wipe all cheaters, CC would instantly lose 15%-20% of all active players. I am angry on behalf of all the consistently honest players here. We abide the rules = we are punished.
Join 5 random Fog + Nuke games against all diff profiles, and watch yourself get miraculously destroyed from every angle. its a joke.[/quote]
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Re: Game 22996044 secret alliance. Pilager and Foxnews [ka]

Postby Pilager on Fri Jun 21, 2024 8:51 pm

I was there, and your the asswipe. You cried like a big pussy because you lost a dice role. Then I flipped you and popped the cherry. Aka, busted your bonus. And you cried, cried and cried and want to know why I didn’t attack anyone else. Sneed, You need to stand up, brush your self off and apologize to all the people you and Mandy accused here and king for wasting his time as a monitor.

Respectfully,

Pilager, Fox, rook, king, Sonic, mathman, Tom, dock, Harry, Jason, Mike, Michael, David, Tim, mark, Robert, Bruce and all the men of the Conquer Club men’s division.

centuori wrote:Hey J1mathman you werent in the game so you dont know what you are talking about asswipe. I agree you dont need to go out of your way to attack your neighbor early, but this one got to a point where it was evident they had no intention of attacking eachother. Foxnews was dropping 16 and left nothing on his border with red without saying a word in the chat. Pilager too barely built on that border then expanded thr other way. At the point Foxnews had a clear lead in the game neither of them attacked eachother still. I am not claiming they are the same person but you would have to be stupid to not think they had a secret alliance here.
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Re: Game 22996044 secret alliance. Pilager and Foxnews [ka]

Postby j1mathman on Sat Jun 22, 2024 12:59 am

Game 22996044- Pilager and foxnews reported by centuori

TLDR: centuori joins Pilager's game and reports him for secret diplomacy with foxnews. No specifics provided except they didn't attack each other's bonuses. Murphalot states the two accused have played 137 games together (over 15 years). KingAchilles bans them from playing together moving forward. This seems like a baseless decision. foxnews has quit playing new games moving forward.

When centuori made this post he did not include proper formatting and provided poor game analysis. He states the following to me in this forum:
you werent in the game so you dont know what you are talking about asswipe


However- I can see the whole game except for his self-chat as there are autosnaps enabled.

Gameplay:
In round 7 Game 22996044, Pilager and foxnews have established bonuses in East Cooper (2) and West Palms (3), respectively. This continues in round 8, and in fact, borders are defended. Pilager has a 21 stack on the interior threatening a retaliation after a border break. Attacking each other here seems like suicide. I didn't do the math but looks like Pilager #1 in troops, foxnews #2 in troops, cyan #3 in troops at this point.

Pink breaks foxnews round 8. This is May 4.

It looks like Pilager was clearly winning on May 12- he has 40 troops in the upper right, foxnews is spread quite thin, and centuori has just under 40 and a bonus on the top. The game state seems relatively even.

orange (centuori) cries foul May 14.

the observer
Murphalot declares that he will:
2024-06-17 03:28:08 - Murphalot: i am going to help you investigate those accounts. It seems i've already found a few collusive connections outside this match-up too. i fucking hate cheaters. Pilager & foxnews is same person, and may have 3rd & 4th accounts too. more to follow.


Is Murphalot a mod or am I missing something? Also, his two hours of work to uncover that they played 146 games together and offer no new evidence (telling us to look at timestamps and look at gameplay in previous games) is laughable.

Analysis
I can tell you from personally completing ~50 multiplayer nospoil games, and ~140 multiplayer nospoil and flat rate games combined that the borders here don't look like collusion to me. Usually I think in terms of who is #1 in troops, #2, etc, anyway, along with bonus. centuori was in 3rd early on in this nospoil game looking back at the gamestates. Which isn't bad. It falls on him to contribute and stop someone who is agressively expanding like foxnews as well as troop leader (who may or may not be incentivized if foxnews isn't deemed much of a threat anyway). BTW, I started looking up old gamestates of mine, and the singleton borders do pop up in some of my games. WHICH ISNT EVEN WHAT HAPPENED IN YOUR GAME.

Look at round 54 Game 22996056 (Current Snapshot Status: Round 54, Time: Apr 16, 15:48:53 CCT). Look at Game 22716970(Current Snapshot Status: Round 7, Time: Apr 24, 16:47:53 CCT). Look at round 9 Game 22903759 (Current Snapshot Status: Round 9, Time: Dec 27, 01:27:34 CCT).

Results and Conclusions
Then, KA has done some modding work and clears 3 players (including Rook) of being multies, and finds Pilager and fox guilty? of conducting secret diplomacy? (This was not explicitly stated). I'm concerned KA has made a ruling which is not based on the facts and instead on conjectures from centuori and murphalot (who is murphalot anyway in this all?)

From Murphalot:
Verdict: pick any couple of non-team games from each of the combinations i listed above ^. You'll see from snapshots that this cheater doesn't hold back from squeezing out opposition, along with harvesting cards from their alts once the weak alt is separated away from the other players.
The arrogant attitude is the giveaway EVERY-TIME. EVERY TIME.
Normal response from potential cheaters to game-chat accusations of collusion are usually an unprepared sense of incredulity with measured wording. When the person lashes out at first chance with name calling and slandering that includes 'paranoia', they are absolutely guilty. if they also get pompous, its 100% they are a spineless cheater.


I'm not sure if the mods have access to more complicated methods than your timestamp work (like IP's). Are we convicting people of multis and cheating due to attitudes now??

From centuori:
I agree you dont need to go out of your way to attack your neighbor early, but this one got to a point where it was evident they had no intention of attacking eachother. Foxnews was dropping 16 and left nothing on his border with red without saying a word in the chat. Pilager too barely built on that border then expanded thr other way. At the point Foxnews had a clear lead in the game neither of them attacked eachother still.


I constructed a timeline and reviewed from the time of the first accusation May 14. Also, I looked at this game after I saw this post earlier this month and the game still looked up in the air. You're not really providing an analysis that me or KA can follow and I've had to go back myself and analyze your game.

I can tell you the result of this is that foxnews told my clan he's not doing new games moving forward outside of Random League.

Is this really the result you want- driving away another player from our 3000 player, declining site?

I'm considering submitting this as a ticket because this ruling seems baseless (and confusing), and not sure if the mods as a whole are policing our gameplay to this amount. This post took 1 hour to review and write.

Respectfully,
j1

edit: formatting
Last edited by j1mathman on Sun Jun 23, 2024 7:01 am, edited 3 times in total.
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Re: Game 22996044 secret alliance. Pilager and Foxnews [ka]

Postby SoN!c on Sat Jun 22, 2024 2:09 am

I can tell you the result of this is that foxnews told my clan he's not doing new games moving forward outside of Random League.


This is what i was afraid of. But i understand it 100%. I would say bye bye too and be like ♤♤#@!%€^^!!!♤♤♤♤♤!!!

Feels like a halfbaked ruling based on what?? Murphalot being sure they are multi's?? Im sure DookieHowzit and Zippyzaplor are multis and i think im 100% sure but i dont make cases if there is no evidence and i can't present at least 5 game numbers. And im pretty sure foxnews is no multi at all.. but in the end only evidence on multiple games is all. It's just i cant stand injustice and that is what i feel Pilager and Foxnews got here. And rook and King Nobles..

This block should be made undone + getting 1 month credits for not being able to have full experience of your subscription (and compensation for the loss of reputation as a "half cheater" - after all that is the conclusion anybody will make if you get blocked playing games with your friend).
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Re: Game 22996044 secret alliance. Pilager and Foxnews [ka]

Postby Votanic on Tue Jun 25, 2024 7:14 am

SoN!c wrote:I would say bye bye too and be like ♤♤#@!%€^^!!!♤♤♤♤♤!!!

The longest goodbye...
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Re: Game 22996044 secret alliance. Pilager and Foxnews [ka]

Postby TheMissionary on Thu Jul 11, 2024 9:47 pm

This seems like a quick overlook at what was said and a swift judgement, without doing any homework. I bet I have players I have played over 200 games with, including non team games. I wonder if I should get banned from playing with them too.
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