Northwest Passage [Quenched]

[shakeycat]

I'm finding this version is growing on me too. I do prefer the wider gameplay, though I'm still not sure if it in itself pulls attention from the objective. It's not as pretty as the colours, but I suppose that's all worked out in the next forum anyway. Still with some unmatching bits, here's today:

Click image to enlarge.

With Amund Ringnes neutral to bring it down to 47 starting. Trying different route colours as well.

And now I disappear for just over two weeks.

[iancanton]

looking good! a neutral on one region of the +3 south qikiktaaluk bonus ought to do it.

ian.

[ender516]

Aren't 47 or 46 poor numbers for starting territories? I thought the good numbers around this size were 42, 43, 44, and 52 and 53. With 47 or 46, in games with 2 or 3 players, everyone starts with 15 territories, which yields 5 troops for the first deployment, and then it is easy for the first player to take one territory from an opponent and bump that player down to 14 territories for 4 troops.

[Victor Sullivan]

Good insight, ender. Yes, this would definitely be problematic and probably abused to a certain extent. What is the current territory total?

[ender516]

Another aside: the box unearthed from the cairn up north last month had nothing of historic value in it.

[iancanton]

With 47 or 46, in games with 2 or 3 players, everyone starts with 15 territories, which yields 5 troops for the first deployment, and then it is easy for the first player to take one territory from an opponent and bump that player down to 14 territories for 4 troops.

that's true, ender. if we let one region of the +3 south qikiktaaluk start neutral, as i suggested above, then remove the starting neutral from yellowknife, then we have 47 starting regions. this, coupled with 4 start positions for northwest territories, will result in 16 starting regions per player in 1v1. this leaves 3-player games with 15 starting regions per player, but does have the advantage that we don't have to lose 2 or 3 regions from the map.

one thing i'm not seeing though: to which bonus does mansel island belong?

ian.

[Victor Sullivan]

You think you could tint the continents the color they are on the mini map? Just a tiny bit of color would be nice, as I find it a tad difficult to determine the boundaries of certain bonuses. I know you already tried a color one:

Click image to enlarge.

...but I was thinking of something less intense.

Cheers,
Sully

[shakeycat]

Okay, I'll be getting back on the horse soon. Back from holiday.

Sully - tinted but less intense, I will try it.
Ender - Was just discussing that case this morning! I hear the box was pretty much empty, since everything in it had been removed 30 years ago.
Ian - Mansel belongs with Melville, Igloolik, and Prince Charles.
Victor - 47/69 if I count correctly. 69 territories, 47 are open to start on (22 neutral).

[iancanton]

Ian - Mansel belongs with Melville, Igloolik, and Prince Charles.

in that case, ignore everything i said about moving the neutral from yellowknife to one of those three regions. the neutral can go to one of the sverdrup islands instead, since that's a 3-region bonus zone that's easier for someone to drop.

ian.

[shakeycat]

What if the land territories of the expeditions were available to start on? It wouldn't change things much. The biggest change is that 3/10 Franklins potentially start with someone on them: no advantage. And it would give us 52 territories open to start on. 52/3 = 17 each and 1 spare in a 1v1. And we can keep the neutrals on easy bonuses (neutrals start with 2).

Click image to enlarge.

ever changing .. but it's about gameplay at the moment.

What else am I forgetting?

[Victor Sullivan]

Looks good! I agree that you should include the land expedition territories as drops. That wouldn't increase the chances of someone dropping a bonus by anything significant, would it?

[shakeycat]

Oh wait .. that makes Greenland a possible drop with 3 open territories. Will remove neutral from Yellowknife and place on Disko Island or Ilulisat. All other bonuses appear safe.

[Victor Sullivan]

I just noticed: there aren't obvious connections between the islands and other territories...

[shakeycat]

What connections? Islands connect to water.

[Victor Sullivan]

Oh! I get it now. Are there any benefits/penalties for occupying a sea territory?

[ender516]

A sea territory with its troop counter in a coloured circle is part of one or more expedition routes, each of which can earn a bonus, if held completely.

[Victor Sullivan]

But nothing happens if you hold a sea that's not apart of an expedition route?

[ender516]

I think that non-route sea territories are just territories like any other ordinary territory. I suppose they contribute to the usual +1 deploy for every three territories.

[Victor Sullivan]

Ah, okay. It seems like they should do something, though.

[shakeycat]

None, unless they're part of the expedition route, then it's +1 for each 2 owned.

[ender516]

So is there a classic +1 for every three territories owned, with a minimum deployment of 3? If not, the map should clarify how its gameplay differs from this typical behaviour.

[shakeycat]

The default +1 for 3 territories is not changed.

[quote=MarshalNey] Under that scheme, the expeditions if all held would be worth the following:
Henry Hudson +2 (1 + 1), 2 regions
Franklin +10 (5 + 5), 10 regions
Parry +6 (3 + 3), 6 regions
McClure +4 (2 + 2), 4 regions [/quote]

If you add in the default bonus, you can earn more armies than regions you are holding. Is it too much? It actually all seems on par with other maps, which are roughly even (give or take 1 army) between territories held in a group and total bonus received. And it's not like the larger bonuses can be held by fortifying 2 or 3 territories either.

I realize now why I started all the expedition territories at neutral - the bonus. I can put starting positions on the remaining 4 land-expedition spots, but there would still be a chance of someone starting with +1, wouldn't there. And 3/4 are neutral-locked, protected. If I put spots on all 4, in a 1v1 there would be a chance of a player getting 2/3 locked territories and having a protected +1 to start. If I only put spots on the 3 locked ones, if anyone starts with a bonus, the 2nd territory will be Devon, which at least borders one other territory in the random drop.

..then match those up with (3 or 4) start positions for Northwest Territories to keep it from dropping to one person. Perhaps it has already been said that S. Qikiktaaluk (Melville Peninsula, Igloolik, Prince Charles Island, and Mansel Island) probably doesn't need start positions, considering the bonus will be so easy to break.

(with the neutral on Disko Island instead of Yellowknife)

Click image to enlarge.

[iancanton]

start positions for Northwest Territories to keep it from dropping to one person.

u're saying that u'll have 3 or 4 start positions for nwt only? if so, then 3 works, but 4 doesn't, since 3 results in 17 starting regions each in 1v1, while 4 positions gives 18 each.

is it a fact that franklin landed on king william island? if it's only conjecture, then it's better for gameplay that kwi belongs only to the yellow amundsen route because it makes up a red bonus when combined with devon island. if kwi belongs to both red and yellow, then it's possible to have 2 (and only 2) start positions on kwi and devon island instead of 2 or 3 on nwt.

u're correct that the level of bonuses is in line with that of many other maps and not excessively high.

ian.

[shakeycat]

Yeah. 3 and 3 starting positions.

I don't understand what you mean about making up a red bonus with Devon: Whether KWI is red/yellow or just yellow, if KWI and Devon are held, there is +1. Am I mistaken? Were were going under the idea that colours had to match to make a bonus?

[MarshalNey]

Yeah. 3 and 3 starting positions.

I don't understand what you mean about making up a red bonus with Devon: Whether KWI is red/yellow or just yellow, if KWI and Devon are held, there is +1. Am I mistaken? Were were going under the idea that colours had to match to make a bonus?

Um, yeah I'll think I was assuming at least that only expedition regions of the same color would give a bonus.

My how the time flies... has it really been over a month? Mea culpa.