Supermax: Prison Riot! [Quenched]

[DiM]

why the f*ck is this is the map ideas sub forum? this is clearly a map in development.

it's a verry verry rough draft.

...the Map Ideas Sub-Forum will be where maps get the start on development. To move into general Foundry Discussion, there needs be some sort of plan, and a working image (other than MS Paint or pencil/paper). Once we see those, we'll move it into 'production', essentially.

The point of moving some threads was to try and set an example. I'm trying to encourage people to actually post their initial drafts in the appropriate forum.

Mibi and DiM, I guess you two think you're above the new process. Just because you two have maps on the site/in development doesn't mean you get to skip the first step.

I realise that this map will be developed, but if anybody else had of posted those draft images there would've been no complaints about the thread being in the ideas forum. Get off your high-horse and set an example for other cartographers to follow.

no keyogi we're not above the system but look at the bolded part of what andy said.

tell me i don't have a working image. i've spent hours creating my 3d image. isn't that enough?

yes exactly. we both have spent hours on our maps. i have spent hours going over the gmaeplay and having om discussions with coleman, samus and others about this map. the only thing that isnt flushed out is the graphics. its ridiculous that my map is in the ideas forum, since it is OBVIOUSLY a map in development.

the only one on their high horse is you, keyogi, who feels the needs to superfluously exercise your mod powers.

what is this new process you speak of? when will this thread be moved to the regularly foundry? where are the guide lines? when does something go from an idea to a real map? it seems the answer to that is "whenever the mods feel like it" which is a joke, as are these sub forums.

whos bright idea was this anyways.

they just posted an announcement for the foundry process. it says you need 2 graphic updates to prove you're in development.
i posted something like 10 updates but still nothing. now i was requested severat angles. i posted 9 angles. let's see what happens.

[Wisse]

you 2 need to calm down a bit...
i don't think you saw the new sticky

keyogi isn't overpowering his mod power:
first of all in the new stickey they posted the guidelines

The Map Ideas forum will be place where all new map ideas, new maps, and REVAMPS start. A map will start in this ‘Heating’ phase. When map production starts we will be looking for a few things:

a. the map, first and for most, must have some sort of clear plan of how production will go. Most of the time, this is pretty self-explanatory for basic maps, but as we are stepping into realms all the time in the Foundry with more and more complicated maps, it’s best to find a plan and make it work early, rather than trying to find one mid-way through production.

b. the map must have a working image (either of the small or large map). This working image must be beyond the ‘rough draft’ state. I.E. the working image can’t be a pencil/paper drawing or an MS paint image. We’d like to see at least two graphical updates while the map spends it’s time in this early stage of the Map Ideas forum. And from the ‘How to Make a Map Thread’ the image must follow these guidelines:



Include a working legend with speculative bonuses, tentative border divisions, names, barriers, colors and textures, aesthetic images (I.E. compasses, picture designs, etc), and background image (I.E. ocean or something to discriminate the playing field).

A map should be ‘inherently unique either in game play, location, or style’ . Maps that aren't just the same tried and true formula from the Classic Map disguised will be more successful.

Every effort should be made to acquire express written consent for a map based on Copyrighted works. In the event that no response is given by the Copyright holders, the map can still be made, but must consist of completely original artwork.

Host the image using Photobucket.com or something similar. The type of image file must be PNG, GIF, or JPEG. You must design two versions (eventually) of the map: a small (up to 600 px wide), and a large (up to 800 px wide). Height is flexible, but it is recommended that you do not exceed 350 px on small maps and 600 px on large maps so that users will not need to scroll down to attack.


c. the map (or the post) must also include a few basic things for easy reference such as: number of countries currently on the map, the number of continents, descriptions of any unique features or areas, and the title of the map must indicate the page with the latest development of production (I.E. ‘Update – Pg 3, and please, no use of [brackets]: use (parentheses), --dashes--, or “quotes”).

d. the map must have some honest and interested discussion. If no one seems to support your idea or it lacks much appeal, it most likely won’t make it to the next stage.

Once a map has met these early guidelines it will be moved out of ‘Heating’ stage into the next and main stage of development into the Foundry.

secondly yours is just a raw draft isn't it mibi?
and dim's map doesn't even have countries yet,
so i don't think they are ready to go to the normal foundry yet

[mibi]

you 2 need to calm down a bit...
i don't think you saw the new sticky

keyogi isn't overpowering his mod power:
first of all in the new stickey they posted the guidelines

The Map Ideas forum will be place where all new map ideas, new maps, and REVAMPS start. A map will start in this ‘Heating’ phase. When map production starts we will be looking for a few things:

a. the map, first and for most, must have some sort of clear plan of how production will go. Most of the time, this is pretty self-explanatory for basic maps, but as we are stepping into realms all the time in the Foundry with more and more complicated maps, it’s best to find a plan and make it work early, rather than trying to find one mid-way through production.

b. the map must have a working image (either of the small or large map). This working image must be beyond the ‘rough draft’ state. I.E. the working image can’t be a pencil/paper drawing or an MS paint image. We’d like to see at least two graphical updates while the map spends it’s time in this early stage of the Map Ideas forum. And from the ‘How to Make a Map Thread’ the image must follow these guidelines:



Include a working legend with speculative bonuses, tentative border divisions, names, barriers, colors and textures, aesthetic images (I.E. compasses, picture designs, etc), and background image (I.E. ocean or something to discriminate the playing field).

A map should be ‘inherently unique either in game play, location, or style’ . Maps that aren't just the same tried and true formula from the Classic Map disguised will be more successful.

Every effort should be made to acquire express written consent for a map based on Copyrighted works. In the event that no response is given by the Copyright holders, the map can still be made, but must consist of completely original artwork.

Host the image using Photobucket.com or something similar. The type of image file must be PNG, GIF, or JPEG. You must design two versions (eventually) of the map: a small (up to 600 px wide), and a large (up to 800 px wide). Height is flexible, but it is recommended that you do not exceed 350 px on small maps and 600 px on large maps so that users will not need to scroll down to attack.


c. the map (or the post) must also include a few basic things for easy reference such as: number of countries currently on the map, the number of continents, descriptions of any unique features or areas, and the title of the map must indicate the page with the latest development of production (I.E. ‘Update – Pg 3, and please, no use of [brackets]: use (parentheses), --dashes--, or “quotes”).

d. the map must have some honest and interested discussion. If no one seems to support your idea or it lacks much appeal, it most likely won’t make it to the next stage.

Once a map has met these early guidelines it will be moved out of ‘Heating’ stage into the next and main stage of development into the Foundry.

secondly yours is just a raw draft isn't it mibi?
and dim's map doesn't even have countries yet,
so i don't think they are ready to go to the normal foundry yet

yeah i didn't read the sticky. but i still think its lame. was there some problem with the foundry that i was unaware of? now it just seems that the maps in the ideas thread just get less views and feedback than before. I guess it will be a while before supermax makes into the 'development' stage, since i have a few more game play updates to do before i even attempt to put some final graphics on it. and i guess i have to do 2 graphic updates for some reason so yeah, this map will be 80% done before it's considered 'in development'.

[Wisse]

if it will be 80% ready before it goes to the next stage, then it will be ff in no time, so don't worry
but i think that if you are out of your draft form it isn't 80% done, and that this will be moved to the main foundry

[DiM]

if it will be 80% ready before it goes to the next stage, then it will be ff in no time, so don't worry
but i think that if you are out of your draft form it isn't 80% done, and that this will be moved to the main foundry

the main part of a map is the gameplay. right now mibi is working on that. after the gameplay is 100% done he will tackle the graphics. and as we saw he has great skill and his first gfx image is usually very close to the final stage. it's not like other map makers where they do dozens of graphic updates. he nails it from the first few tries. so basically the map will have a 100% set gameplay and 99% gfx and then it will be moved to development. it might seem ok, but actually it's not because the ideas sub-forum is rarely visited because it's full of crappy threads and junk. so this means the map will get very few comments. after it goes to the main forum with a 100% set gameplay and 99% gfx, lots of people will notice the map and other feedback will start coming, feedback that might request total gameplay and/or gfx changes. this is crappy because the map maker would either refuse the suggestions because the requests are about already discussed issues and hence the map will be of a lower quality, or if the map maker decides to listen to the new suggestions he'll then work a lot more because he has to redo a lot of things. as a result tension and frustration will appear.

if i wouldn't have my prison thread here i wouldn't even bother to enter this subforum and i bet a lot of people don't bother either. as a result the maps get less views and less feedback.

[DiM]

you 2 need to calm down a bit...
i don't think you saw the new sticky

keyogi isn't overpowering his mod power:
first of all in the new stickey they posted the guidelines

the threads were moved before the sticky appeared so we sort of had the right to be pissed.

secondly yours is just a raw draft isn't it mibi?

read the above post for this one.

and dim's map doesn't even have countries yet,
so i don't think they are ready to go to the normal foundry yet

i do have countries. look at the map. the buildings are countries, the yards are connections....

[Wisse]

and dim's map doesn't even have countries yet,
so i don't think they are ready to go to the normal foundry yet

i do have countries. look at the map. the buildings are countries, the yards are connections....

but yet you can't see that that are the countries...

and i will look in both of them every time now

[DiM]

and dim's map doesn't even have countries yet,
so i don't think they are ready to go to the normal foundry yet

i do have countries. look at the map. the buildings are countries, the yards are connections....

but yet you can't see that that are the countries...

and i will look in both of them every time now

when i put army circles and legend it will be clear

[Teya]

I agree with Wisse, you do need to calm down. If anyone else posted graphics like this they'd be shot down very fast. Mibi can do alot better than that and every other first draft of his has had ALOT better graphics than this.

Face it, a map with a few boxes and circles on it is NOT a map in development. Its a very rough draft. Just because you've spent hours talking to people doesnt mean your map should avoid this forum. And if these are not the graphics that are going to be in the final version, do some work on them to show what the map is actually going to be like.

As for people not visiting the sub-forum, Im sure when people actually use them how they are meant to be used people WILL visit them. And if people dont visit them I guess we wont be getting anymore maps. But hey, at least that will give you guys more to complain about. Since that is all you seem to be doing lately.

[mibi]

But hey, at least that will give you guys more to complain about. Since that is all you seem to be doing lately.

Teya, what exactly are your bringing to the table here?

[hulmey]

Teya never brings anything to the table mate.....All you hear is her backing Keyogi up on nearly every aspect ( an we all know it)....

I think in prinicple the idea implemented by Andy and Keyogi is good however it is flawed. The main aim of it is to keep out of the main forum ideas that are just ideas and arent going to go anywhere either through the map makers lake of will, general feedback and soon on.

However in reality it will prolong the map making process and as DIM said stuff that has already been discussed will be brought up again.

Mibi and DIM arent above the law but we can all see through their other works the determination and dedication they put into their work and that the job will be finished (although i dont know what happened to TROY and D-DAY).

Maybe this is where the confusion has come in because you havent fionished your other maps???

[KEYOGI]

All I will say is that I expect people like mibi and DiM to be setting good examples for other cartographers to follow.

Anyway guys, we have a dedicated thread for this sort of discussion. Lets keep this thread on topic from now on.

[mibi]

so i have been thinking about the cell block configuration and i thought that in the original way, there would be unessary buildup in the cells because the first thing you would do is conquer your cell mate, and then you would have to kill the neutral guard. but killing the guard also effectively lets out the other two people across from you. so you would end up in a situation where people build up in the cell and dont want to waste THEIR armies taking out a neutral when it could help their enemy. so the way it is setup now is that there is a guard for each cell, so you can kill your cellmate, then take out the guard and it still leaves the opposite people stuck in their cell.

now this way has many more guards, but ti alleviate this balance issue, i will have one "warden" space that has maybe 6 neutrals on it. you need to have the warden in order to have the +1 for every two guards bonus. i think this will work.

also the cellblocks are a bit bigger and wont fit in the old configuration.

here are 3 sample configurations, which one do you like best? showers and the hole and other stuff will be included in all, just trying to see which general layout is best.

1. similar to old style, but not much space for other things. showers and the hold will be inlcuded.


2. similar to old style but with a bit more room. the yard will be split into 2 halfs, each with 10-15 inmates


3 most compact but least like original. split yard too.

[mibi]

whats it take to get some feedback in this place these days?

anyways, i've already gone with option 1.

[gimil]

can there be a bonus for holding the soap in the shower?

i think the new layout has to many guards in a single cell block.

how about something similar to the old version with one guard in each cell but have hum have less nurtal (1 or 2) and a stronger guard outsie the cell door?

[DiM]

how did you manage to get it out of the ideas forum??


btw. option 1 is fine by me

[Keredrex]

Option one works well... I like the style of the original sketch.....Is it possible to have different types of "Guards".... lets say you have Certain guard spaces that give you the guards bonus ... and other guard spaces that are Neutral ALWAYS.... that way you could minimize the Amount of actual GUARDS

You could say that the RIOT broke out and killed some of the guards

[mibi]

can there be a bonus for holding the soap in the shower?

i think the new layout has to many guards in a single cell block.

how about something similar to the old version with one guard in each cell but have hum have less nurtal (1 or 2) and a stronger guard outsie the cell door?

yeah im not too much of a fan of the increased guards but its better than the alternative, which is cell buildup as i explained before. I think it will be fine.

[mibi]

Option one works well... I like the style of the original sketch.....Is it possible to have different types of "Guards".... lets say you have Certain guard spaces that give you the guards bonus ... and other guard spaces that are Neutral ALWAYS.... that way you could minimize the Amount of actual GUARDS

You could say that the RIOT broke out and killed some of the guards

uh.. im not sure you can make a space always neutral... how would that work?

all the guards will start neutral... i could have different strength guards tho.

[mibi]

ok, an extension of option one.

i have added some more space in there. the showers are in and the hole is in (reduced to 4 cells because the new fish dont go to the hole). but i have this left over space. it cant be a cafeteria because its a supermax prison. so come up with some ideas people.

and the two circle spaces are for the sniper guards.

[hulmey]

u got a few questions marks in the map. Might i just making one of them a meeting room were inmates get to meet their vistiors

[mibi]

[quote="hulmey"]u got a few questions marks in the map. Might i just making one of them a meeting room were inmates get to meet their vistiors[/quote

yeah i was thinking about that, but the visitors would have to go through the yard and that wont work.

so what i did was create a 5th cell block thats like a medium security general population, a bunch of inmates and few guards.

so this creates manny more spaces which gives me room to put in another gang of 15.

so i got the white supremcist, the black brothers, latinos, italians, and the new inmates... what else?

here is the finished floor plan for now.

[hulmey]

what about a gym?????

Every prison has a gym with all the inmates pumping the iron lol

[gimil]

And u also need to put in the chair

oh AND THE GOD DAMN BONUS FOR HOLDING THE SOAP IN THE SHOWER

[yeti_c]

Infirmary/Hospital?

C.