Large Printable Maps

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Re: Large Printable Maps

Postby greenoaks on Sat Nov 24, 2012 4:32 am

agentcom wrote:
koontz1973 wrote:What would be the sites objections to map makers selling their work to the players through the site?


It sounds like a win-win to me. I can think of only one objection: The folks at Hasbro obviously had some influence on the direction of this site. This site can claim to be unique in many ways, which is why it is still up and running. Part of that reason is the unique maps ... no problem there. But when you take this off of the computer and replace the power squares (or whatever we call them) with dice and you replace the "spoils" with color-coded cards, and you remove the fog of war, and you start putting little counters on the board ... well this starts to look a lot more like the R-word.

Whether they have a winning claim or not, I can assure you that if we started to sell a bunch of these, someone would quickly receive a cease and desist order. Then we would have to decide whether or not to comply or risk going to court.

It's an unfortunate state of affairs, but even though that's the only reason I can think of that the site wouldn't go this direction, it is a pretty weighty reason.

all we need to do is buy a t-shirt and place that on the dining table
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Re: Large Printable Maps

Postby koontz1973 on Sat Nov 24, 2012 5:03 am

greenoaks wrote:
agentcom wrote:
koontz1973 wrote:What would be the sites objections to map makers selling their work to the players through the site?


It sounds like a win-win to me. I can think of only one objection: The folks at Hasbro obviously had some influence on the direction of this site. This site can claim to be unique in many ways, which is why it is still up and running. Part of that reason is the unique maps ... no problem there. But when you take this off of the computer and replace the power squares (or whatever we call them) with dice and you replace the "spoils" with color-coded cards, and you remove the fog of war, and you start putting little counters on the board ... well this starts to look a lot more like the R-word.

Whether they have a winning claim or not, I can assure you that if we started to sell a bunch of these, someone would quickly receive a cease and desist order. Then we would have to decide whether or not to comply or risk going to court.

It's an unfortunate state of affairs, but even though that's the only reason I can think of that the site wouldn't go this direction, it is a pretty weighty reason.

all we need to do is buy a t-shirt and place that on the dining table

To damn small unless you buy the baby elephant sized ones.
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Re: Large Printable Maps

Postby Dukasaur on Sat Nov 24, 2012 8:02 am

koontz1973 wrote:
greenoaks wrote:
agentcom wrote:
koontz1973 wrote:What would be the sites objections to map makers selling their work to the players through the site?


It sounds like a win-win to me. I can think of only one objection: The folks at Hasbro obviously had some influence on the direction of this site. This site can claim to be unique in many ways, which is why it is still up and running. Part of that reason is the unique maps ... no problem there. But when you take this off of the computer and replace the power squares (or whatever we call them) with dice and you replace the "spoils" with color-coded cards, and you remove the fog of war, and you start putting little counters on the board ... well this starts to look a lot more like the R-word.

Whether they have a winning claim or not, I can assure you that if we started to sell a bunch of these, someone would quickly receive a cease and desist order. Then we would have to decide whether or not to comply or risk going to court.

It's an unfortunate state of affairs, but even though that's the only reason I can think of that the site wouldn't go this direction, it is a pretty weighty reason.

all we need to do is buy a t-shirt and place that on the dining table

To damn small unless you buy the baby elephant sized ones.

Buy one for each player. The game begins with everybody taking their shirt off and placing it on the table in front of them...

:lol:
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Re: Large Printable Maps

Postby koontz1973 on Sat Nov 24, 2012 8:30 am

Dukasaur wrote:
koontz1973 wrote:
greenoaks wrote:
agentcom wrote:
koontz1973 wrote:What would be the sites objections to map makers selling their work to the players through the site?


It sounds like a win-win to me. I can think of only one objection: The folks at Hasbro obviously had some influence on the direction of this site. This site can claim to be unique in many ways, which is why it is still up and running. Part of that reason is the unique maps ... no problem there. But when you take this off of the computer and replace the power squares (or whatever we call them) with dice and you replace the "spoils" with color-coded cards, and you remove the fog of war, and you start putting little counters on the board ... well this starts to look a lot more like the R-word.

Whether they have a winning claim or not, I can assure you that if we started to sell a bunch of these, someone would quickly receive a cease and desist order. Then we would have to decide whether or not to comply or risk going to court.

It's an unfortunate state of affairs, but even though that's the only reason I can think of that the site wouldn't go this direction, it is a pretty weighty reason.

all we need to do is buy a t-shirt and place that on the dining table

To damn small unless you buy the baby elephant sized ones.

Buy one for each player. The game begins with everybody taking their shirt off and placing it on the table in front of them...

:lol:

Strip risk. ;)

Back to topic though. I am going to take one of my 1982 map to the printers Monday to see how large they will go without the image becoming too bad. After cropping of the legend that is.
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Re: Large Printable Maps

Postby Funkyterrance on Sat Nov 24, 2012 8:54 am

agentcom wrote:
koontz1973 wrote:What would be the sites objections to map makers selling their work to the players through the site?


It sounds like a win-win to me. I can think of only one objection: The folks at Hasbro obviously had some influence on the direction of this site. This site can claim to be unique in many ways, which is why it is still up and running. Part of that reason is the unique maps ... no problem there. But when you take this off of the computer and replace the power squares (or whatever we call them) with dice and you replace the "spoils" with color-coded cards, and you remove the fog of war, and you start putting little counters on the board ... well this starts to look a lot more like the R-word.

Whether they have a winning claim or not, I can assure you that if we started to sell a bunch of these, someone would quickly receive a cease and desist order. Then we would have to decide whether or not to comply or risk going to court.

It's an unfortunate state of affairs, but even though that's the only reason I can think of that the site wouldn't go this direction, it is a pretty weighty reason.


I agree that you couldn't go and try to sell the whole shebang (cards, dice, men, etc.) without possible difficulties but if you left all the pieces up to the players and just sold the map itself I can't see much legal ground to stand on as far as cease and desist orders are concerned.

koontz1973 wrote:
Back to topic though. I am going to take one of my 1982 map to the printers Monday to see how large they will go without the image becoming too bad. After cropping of the legend that is.


Please keep us posted on this, koontz!
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Re: Large Printable Maps

Postby chapcrap on Sat Nov 24, 2012 1:04 pm

This would be a win-win for everyone involved. Let me give you money for a map!!
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Re: Large Printable Maps

Postby agentcom on Sun Nov 25, 2012 9:57 am

Funkyterrance wrote:
I agree that you couldn't go and try to sell the whole shebang (cards, dice, men, etc.) without possible difficulties but if you left all the pieces up to the players and just sold the map itself I can't see much legal ground to stand on as far as cease and desist orders are concerned.



I'm not a lawyer (yet) but that's a good point. I'd think it would be a hardimpossible case to win if you CC was just helping artists sell their art. As for the pieces, I would suggest two things.

First, sell the pieces separately. This is actually better because who needs new pieces with every map. Plus you're kind of divorcing the one thing (the map) from the other (all the pieces). And I'm sure we could get some people to come up with some cool ideas for different types of pieces you could buy. And I want a set of CC dice with the little star logos on them (and the ace is a big CC logo taking up a whole side of the die). :D

The other way to go, I think, would be to do what koontz said and write down all the modified rules so that the work has truly been transformative (making it into a new/different game).

And/or do both.
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Re: Large Printable Maps

Postby Funkyterrance on Sun Nov 25, 2012 11:48 am

agentcom wrote:
Funkyterrance wrote:
I agree that you couldn't go and try to sell the whole shebang (cards, dice, men, etc.) without possible difficulties but if you left all the pieces up to the players and just sold the map itself I can't see much legal ground to stand on as far as cease and desist orders are concerned.



First, sell the pieces separately. This is actually better because who needs new pieces with every map. Plus you're kind of divorcing the one thing (the map) from the other (all the pieces). And I'm sure we could get some people to come up with some cool ideas for different types of pieces you could buy.


Totally good point, selling separately would solve the dilemma perfectly.
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Re: Large Printable Maps

Postby koontz1973 on Mon Nov 26, 2012 12:58 pm

Well, I promised to keep you all apprised of this one. Right now though it does not work for all maps.

Here are the reasons why.
Text even one the large map will become almost unreadable when the image is made large enough to play.
When printed on to an A3 paper, the territs are not quite big enough. A2 is a must for this to work.
Here is a photo for Jakarta (one of my maps) done at A3 using my original R**K pieces with the map underneath so you can compare the size.
The image quality printed at this size is not of a great quality.
Click image to enlarge.
image

What would needed to be done for this to work.
Maps without text (legend text that is).
Maps made far larger than we have now. Double would be ideal.
Less detail placed onto the maps.
Maps redrawn so small territs become bigger.
And then we get into the trouble of cards, rules and what not.

But right now, I am going to have fun, beating my son in 1v1 games. :mrgreen:

Right now I cannot see how this work without a lot of work on the map makers side. So CC, make me an offer. :D
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Re: Large Printable Maps

Postby Funkyterrance on Mon Nov 26, 2012 2:00 pm

koontz1973 wrote:Well, I promised to keep you all apprised of this one. Right now though it does not work for all maps.

Here are the reasons why.
Text even one the large map will become almost unreadable when the image is made large enough to play.
When printed on to an A3 paper, the territs are not quite big enough. A2 is a must for this to work.
Here is a photo for Jakarta (one of my maps) done at A3 using my original R**K pieces with the map underneath so you can compare the size.
The image quality printed at this size is not of a great quality.
Click image to enlarge.
image

What would needed to be done for this to work.
Maps without text (legend text that is).
Maps made far larger than we have now. Double would be ideal.
Less detail placed onto the maps.
Maps redrawn so small territs become bigger.
And then we get into the trouble of cards, rules and what not.

But right now, I am going to have fun, beating my son in 1v1 games. :mrgreen:

Right now I cannot see how this work without a lot of work on the map makers side. So CC, make me an offer. :D


Thanks for the update, koontz. :)
To me it seems that anyone who stood to get a little compensation for their map being printed might put in the time to make the changes needed to their map in order to make it viable for large printing?
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Re: Large Printable Maps

Postby AndyDufresne on Mon Nov 26, 2012 2:27 pm

Perhaps CC should focus not on boards, but simply high quality posters. Who wouldn't want to hang a poster of their favorite map over their bed? And then, when you feel like it, you could always take down the map for redecoration and relocation to your table for a while.


--Andy
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Re: Large Printable Maps

Postby Funkyterrance on Mon Nov 26, 2012 2:37 pm

AndyDufresne wrote:Perhaps CC should focus not on boards, but simply high quality posters. Who wouldn't want to hang a poster of their favorite map over their bed? And then, when you feel like it, you could always take down the map for redecoration and relocation to your table for a while.


--Andy


You won't hear me complain about a dual purpose map. :D
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Re: Large Printable Maps

Postby chapcrap on Mon Nov 26, 2012 2:49 pm

AndyDufresne wrote:Perhaps CC should focus not on boards, but simply high quality posters. Who wouldn't want to hang a poster of their favorite map over their bed? And then, when you feel like it, you could always take down the map for redecoration and relocation to your table for a while.


--Andy

Yes, I think there is always a way to get the map sold legally.

It sounds like the real issue is more of a graphics thing... Could the foundry ask the map makers to create a game board quality image along with the small and large?
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Re: Large Printable Maps

Postby thenobodies80 on Mon Nov 26, 2012 2:58 pm

For what is worth, if a player ask me if he can print one of my map to play on it with friends, I have zero problem to give him the permission. And i think it's the same for all the other mapmakers, i think.
I draw maps because I like to draw maps, it's not for money.

Rather, if the player has a bit of patience and he doesn't set a deadline, I would produce an high quality image to send to him. Then he is free to do what he wants with the image apart make profit or give it to someone else without ask.

Said that, I don't think people here is referring to one of my maps :mrgreen:

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Re: Large Printable Maps

Postby chapcrap on Mon Nov 26, 2012 3:00 pm

thenobodies80 wrote:For what is worth, if a player ask me if he can print one of my map to play on it with friends, I have zero problem to give him the permission. And i think it's the same for all the other mapmakers, i think.
I draw maps because I like to draw maps, it's not for money.

Rather, if the player has a bit of patience and he doesn't set a deadline, I would produce an high quality image to send to him. Then he is free to do what he wants with the image apart make profit or give it to someone else without ask.

Said that, I don't think people here is referring to one of my maps :mrgreen:

What do you think of asking mapmakers to provide such an image when their map is quenched?
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