Page 1 of 2
[GP] Change FLAT RATE bonuses
Posted:
Sat Mar 07, 2009 5:14 pmby j35t3r.us
Concise description:Changing Flat Rate spoils bonus hand-in from 4/6/8/10 to 6/10
Specifics:Current flat rate spoils hand-in bonuses are:
3 Red Spoils = 4 bonus units
3 Green Spoils = 6 bonus units
3 Blue Spoils = 8 bonus units
1 of Each Spoil = 10 bonus units
My suggestion is to eliminate another huge chunk of LUCK from a SKILL-based game. How many times have you all been sitting on 3 red cards for 3 turns thinking... This sucks. Meanwhile someone has 3 blue cards, or 3 green cards. Both of which are just as common as the red cards you hold, and they get more guys for no reason except luck...
I say make ALL flat rate spoil hand-ins worth 6 troops unless you have 1 of each color spoil, which is worth 10 troops. This really makes a difference when it comes to 3rd turn handins, or saving your cards for the chance to get 1 of each color, etc etc...
This will improve the following aspects of the site:-Less luck when it comes to which cards you are dealt.
-No more "crap I have red cards - he has blue cards" stuff
[
MOD EDIT: For a related suggestion that would set spoils turn-ins of all types to a single value, see
here --
agentcom]
Re: Change FLAT RATE bonuses.
Posted:
Sat Mar 07, 2009 5:48 pmby Theguyoverthere
I actually kind of like this idea.
Re: Change FLAT RATE bonuses.
Posted:
Sat Mar 07, 2009 6:13 pmby lgoasklucyl
I like this as well, actually.
Nothing quite like having 2 red and a green as the opponent cashes for 13 then hitting 2 pair.....
Re: Change FLAT RATE bonuses.
Posted:
Sat Mar 07, 2009 6:42 pmby dhallmeyer
I like this too. I can never remember which is which, just hoping for a mixed set.
Re: Change FLAT RATE bonuses.
Posted:
Sat Mar 07, 2009 7:31 pmby e_i_pi
The chances of having a mixed is the same as the chances of having a coloured set you know
Re: Change FLAT RATE bonuses.
Posted:
Sat Mar 07, 2009 8:21 pmby Woodruff
e_i_pi wrote:The chances of having a mixed is the same as the chances of having a coloured set you know
Which precisely supports why they shouldn't be worth more.
Re: Change FLAT RATE bonuses.
Posted:
Sat Mar 07, 2009 9:00 pmby a.sub
i agree with this too, except i think instead of making it so that its all the same its just similar
like
Red 7
Blue 8
Green 9
Mixed 10
Re: Change FLAT RATE bonuses.
Posted:
Sat Mar 07, 2009 9:04 pmby Joodoo
e_i_pi wrote:The chances of having a mixed is the same as the chances of having a coloured set you know
then we should make all of the sets worth 10 armies / 8 armies
Re: Change FLAT RATE bonuses.
Posted:
Sat Mar 07, 2009 9:08 pmby e_i_pi
Joodoo wrote:e_i_pi wrote:The chances of having a mixed is the same as the chances of having a coloured set you know
then we should make all of the sets worth 10 armies / 8 armies
That's what I mean.
RRR: 6 armies
GGG: 6 armies
BBB: 6 armies
RGB: 10 armies
is exactly the same as
RRR: 10 armies
GGG: 6 armies
BBB: 6 armies
RGB: 6 armies
statistically
Re: Change FLAT RATE bonuses.
Posted:
Sat Mar 07, 2009 9:13 pmby Timminz
I was under the impression that mixed sets were actually more likely than any of the single-coloured ones. Maybe I just read someone wrong before.
Regardless, if you want to remove the luck aspect from flat rate, don't play it. That is to say that it is the most luck-oriented card setting, and there are 2 other options that remove that luck aspect from the game.
Re: Change FLAT RATE bonuses.
Posted:
Sat Mar 07, 2009 9:51 pmby owenshooter
if you want to remove the luck factor from flat rate, then don't play flat rate. there are other settings, as was stated by timminz above, that do this. i hate cards, and generally only play no card games... anyway, just change the type of game you play, and you'll maybe find yourself enjoying CC once again...-0
p.s.-one interesting thing about playing different types of settings is the different set of people you notice in those worlds...
Re: Change FLAT RATE bonuses.
Posted:
Sat Mar 07, 2009 10:01 pmby Kotaro
If you don't like luck, play a different game.
Re: Change FLAT RATE bonuses.
Posted:
Sat Mar 07, 2009 10:11 pmby Optimus Prime
I happen to like my flat rate spoils just the way they are to be honest. No need to go fixing something that isn't broken.
Re: Change FLAT RATE bonuses.
Posted:
Mon Mar 09, 2009 3:59 pmby j35t3r.us
Thats what? 7 for and 3 against. More replies please.
As stated above, cards have the same chances to be drawn but are worth different amounts. This is bad math. Make it more rare for the higher handins, makes no sense to have higher handins same probability as lower handins. I mean heck... Flat rate means FLAT RATE, not different rates!
Also noted above, "pick a different option" if you don't want luck. Ok, so there are two other options. NO CARDS, and ESCALATING.
No cards = all dice, no surprises.
Excalating = Fair, and Balanced. Cards are worth same amount because they all have the same probability to be drawn and are worth the same.
then:
Flat Rate = For those that don't want to play a game where it is STRICTLY about handins(aka escalating), but still want that early game(turns 1-15 or so) fun of cashing in or getting cashed in on.
All three versions should be equally as fun. And they are. Except Flat Rate is the only Spoils option that doesn't make sense.
This isn't about switching the way I play. I play them all. This is about making the site/system fair to all. If one version of what I play seems more skewed than the other versions I play, I might as well report it and see what others think. And so far (judging by the replies), others feel the same way.
This needs to be looked into more. There are multiple replies above stating flat rate should be changed, and different amount to consider. I want more replies to this, maybe even a poll, and have this idea/suggestion(or even BUG if you call it that) looked into more, and even considered for change.
I like the 8 units and 10 unit idea personally.
Re: Change FLAT RATE bonuses.
Posted:
Mon Mar 09, 2009 4:31 pmby a.sub
actually i wnaan change my vote to against as i like the luck aspect
Re: Change FLAT RATE bonuses.
Posted:
Mon Mar 09, 2009 4:41 pmby GenuineEarlGrey
owenshooter wrote:if you want to remove the luck factor from flat rate, then don't play flat rate.
....or even avoid playing flat rate on small maps
Re: Change FLAT RATE bonuses.
Posted:
Mon Mar 09, 2009 4:42 pmby cicero
Optimus Prime wrote:I happen to like my flat rate spoils just the way they are to be honest. No need to go fixing something that isn't broken.
My secretary already typed my response.
Re: Change FLAT RATE bonuses.
Posted:
Mon Mar 09, 2009 5:32 pmby KernowWarrior
I like the Flat Rate bonuses as they are. Could introduce another card selection option for players who dont. Flat rate Original (RRR=4/GGG=6/BBB=8/RGB=10) and Flat Rate lite (all sets of 3, RRR GGG BBB RGB = 10)
Re: Change FLAT RATE bonuses.
Posted:
Mon Mar 09, 2009 5:59 pmby iambligh
what about 20 for a full-house?
Re: Change FLAT RATE bonuses.
Posted:
Mon Mar 09, 2009 6:56 pmby Woodruff
j35t3r.us wrote:Thats what? 7 for and 3 against. More replies please.
As stated above, cards have the same chances to be drawn but are worth different amounts. This is bad math. Make it more rare for the higher handins, makes no sense to have higher handins same probability as lower handins. I mean heck... Flat rate means FLAT RATE, not different rates!
In...that game we all love that brought us here..."flat rate" doesn't even mean any of the above, you may recall. That's really how we should probably go for flat rate.
Re: Change FLAT RATE bonuses.
Posted:
Wed Mar 11, 2009 7:22 pmby oVo
iambligh wrote:what about 20 for a full-house?
Players with an upper case v in their name should probably get a fresh 20 armies for all sets cashed in.
I like the setup as it is too and feel that escalating set option is there to pick up the slack.
Re: Change FLAT RATE bonuses.
Posted:
Wed Mar 11, 2009 7:25 pmby Kotaro
Optimus Prime wrote:I happen to like my flat rate spoils just the way they are to be honest. No need to go fixing something that isn't broken.
Re: Change FLAT RATE bonuses.
Posted:
Wed Mar 11, 2009 8:00 pmby PLAYER57832
I like it just the way it is. That's why there are OPTIONS in CC... so you can play what you like.
If you don't like Flat Rate, don't play it!
That said, maybe there is room for a fourth option... without eliminated the current Flat rate?
Re: Change FLAT RATE bonuses.
Posted:
Thu Mar 12, 2009 9:37 pmby lancehoch
e_i_pi wrote:Joodoo wrote:e_i_pi wrote:The chances of having a mixed is the same as the chances of having a coloured set you know
then we should make all of the sets worth 10 armies / 8 armies
That's what I mean.
RRR: 6 armies
GGG: 6 armies
BBB: 6 armies
RGB: 10 armies
is exactly the same as
RRR: 10 armies
GGG: 6 armies
BBB: 6 armies
RGB: 6 armies
statistically
pi, that is not true.
Subject: 10 army sets... are these common to turn in repeatedly?lancehoch wrote:To answer the question from the thread title, actually mixed sets are more common than any single instance of a single colored set:
3 cards: 27 possibilities- 1/27 red, 1/27 green, 1/27 blue, 6/27 mixed, 18/27 no set
4 cards: 81 possibilities- 9/81 red, 9/81 green, 9/81 blue, 36/81 mixed, 18/81 no set
5 cards (note you can have a mixed set and a plain color set, I am counting these as mixed): 243 possibilities- 31/243 red, 31/243 green, 31/243 blue, 150/243 mixed, 0/243 no set
in percentages (mixed only):
3 cards: 22.22%
4 cards: 44.44%
5 cards: 61.73%
So to answer your question, yes it is very common to get a mixed set.
More in depth analysis for the 5 card situations:
only red: 31/243
only green: 31/243
only blue: 31/243
only mixed: 90/243
red and mixed: 20/243
green and mixed: 20/243
blue and mixed: 20/243
totals:
red: 51/243
green: 51/243
blue: 51/243
mixed: 150/243
What I would suggest is (if there is to be a change) actually changing the values to mixed = 4 and red/green/blue = 10.
Re: Change FLAT RATE bonuses.
Posted:
Fri Mar 13, 2009 6:41 amby ahunda
As we all know, CC is derived from a popular board game, and the cash rules for Flat Rate are taken 1:1 from the rules of this board game. Changing the cash values would certainly upset all Flat Rate fans, who have been playing the board game for a long time, before coming to CC.
Whilst the standard setting in the original rules of the board game in the USA was Escalating (with Flat Rate being introduced in later versions as an alternative option), in Europe the standard always was Flat Rate. So especially the Europeans are used to the 10,8,6,4 rule as it is.
Now I don´t mind much, since I rarely (almost never) play Flat Rate, but I think changing the cash values is a really bad idea, for the mentioned reasons. Maybe suggest an additional / new Game Type with different cash values. Then again ... I really don´t care ...