Conquer Club

Posted: **Sun Jul 20, 2008 11:10 am**

multis and points

Specifics:

if a player gets caught for being a multi and the multi player wins, why should I or any other player lose points in score?
should we not get our points or score refunded?

Posted: **Sun Jul 20, 2008 12:21 pm**

I am not a mod, but this topic has come up many times before. The short answer is that it would screw up too many aspects of the site and just be too much work overall.

Bottom line, sometimes you lose, sometimes you win. Keep playing and you will wind up where you "belong" point -wise.

Posted: **Sun Jul 20, 2008 1:09 pm**

If it was so, then the multi accusations would triple because of sour losers trying to get points back. I agree that in a perfect world, you would not lose points to cheats, but it opens up a lot of abuse, would waste the milti-hunters' time

Posted: **Sun Jul 20, 2008 3:12 pm**

Apparently it's too much strain on the servers, or it would be done.

Posted: **Wed Jul 23, 2008 4:49 am**

I have to say that multi's should NOT be allowed to complete games. This would go a part of the way to resolving this issue. However, those in charge say that it is unfair to those that have successful appeals. I say what about the rest of us that play fair but are penalized?

I was in a 3 player multi game. I got them busted but they were allowed to finish the game and beat me. Where IP's are confirmed and clear evidence of cheating is confirmed then the users should be stopped fromplaying with immediate effect.

Posted: **Wed Jul 23, 2008 5:37 am**

Yeah - a good solution would be a busted multi should be "deadbeated" out of the game...

C.

Posted: **Wed Jul 23, 2008 5:58 am**

yeti_c wrote:Yeah - a good solution would be a busted multi should be "deadbeated" out of the game...

C.

And if the busted multi is subsequently cleared, then could the games be deleted, so that nobody loses those points?

Posted: **Wed Jul 23, 2008 6:26 am**

MrBenn wrote:
yeti_c wrote:Yeah - a good solution would be a busted multi should be "deadbeated" out of the game...

C.

And if the busted multi is subsequently cleared, then could the games be deleted, so that nobody loses those points?

Deletion of games can only occur whilst it is still rolling... otherwise it puts things out of whack!

C.

Posted: **Wed Jul 23, 2008 7:21 am**

There are two issues;
1. Somebody who cheats (and who deserves to lose their points)
2. Somebody who is wrongly accussed of cheating

So, if somebody cheats, then as the suggestion goes, they should be 'deadbeated' from their active games:

"xxxx is kicked out for being a multi"
This way, that player would lose points, rather than be allowed to continue to scam the innocent party.

"xxxx loses 20 points"
For a perpetual cheater, a score reset happens, which doesn't affect the scores of any previous opponents.

If it transpires that the accused is innocent, then presumably they would be able to have points added on in a similar manner to the points reset? If this is the case, then it should be possible to do a search for games where the accused was 'kicked out for being a multi' and add on the total lost..?

Posted: **Wed Jul 23, 2008 10:26 am**

MrBenn wrote:If it transpires that the accused is innocent, then presumably they would be able to have points added on in a similar manner to the points reset? If this is the case, then it should be possible to do a search for games where the accused was 'kicked out for being a multi' and add on the total lost..?

Except that the game has already been changed. There is no way of knowing, had the kicked 'multi' been left in the game, whether they would have won or not. And so no way of knowing whether there are any points to be returned or not.

Posted: **Wed Jul 23, 2008 7:17 pm**

They definetly shouldn't reset the score in the middle of a game so you lose even more points.

Posted: **Wed Jul 23, 2008 8:52 pm**

MrBenn wrote:There are two issues;
1. Somebody who cheats (and who deserves to lose their points)
2. Somebody who is wrongly accussed of cheating

Item #2 needs to be dealt with at the front end ... through better investigations, perhaps a delay in implementing more draconian penalties (until an appeal process is ended).

I suggested in another thread that the multi-punishment be an automated turn. That is, the person would play as soon as their turn is up and do nothing. Perhaps normal turn time could even be shortened? This way they would lose their points, but not hold up the game as if they were simply locked out.

Teams with innocent teammates would be an issue, but probably not an unsolveable one.

Posted: **Thu Jul 24, 2008 3:42 am**

cicero wrote:
MrBenn wrote:If it transpires that the accused is innocent, then presumably they would be able to have points added on in a similar manner to the points reset? If this is the case, then it should be possible to do a search for games where the accused was 'kicked out for being a multi' and add on the total lost..?

Except that the game has already been changed. There is no way of knowing, had the kicked 'multi' been left in the game, whether they would have won or not. And so no way of knowing whether there are any points to be returned or not.

You are right.
However, having the points 'returned' to the wrongly accused would at least mean thay weren't out-of-pocket, and would seem fair.
If the innocent parties(ie other people in the games) are allowed to keep the points won then that would also seem fair.

PLAYER57832 wrote:
MrBenn wrote:There are two issues;
1. Somebody who cheats (and who deserves to lose their points)
2. Somebody who is wrongly accussed of cheating

Item #2 needs to be dealt with at the front end ... through better investigations, perhaps a delay in implementing more draconian penalties (until an appeal process is ended).

Agreed. Out of interest, is there any indication of the number of 'wrongfully convicted' multis?

Posted: **Thu Jul 24, 2008 3:54 am**

At the moment - honest players lose points to busted multis...

I think that needs to change - if a few "non" multis are docked points - then so be it - this is surely a better system than the current?

C.

Posted: **Thu Jul 24, 2008 4:17 am**

Well, one way to look at it (and I don't necessarily believe this):

You did lose a game. The multi doesn't get to keep those points, so they're not benefiting. It's not too much of a travesty that you lost points in a game that you lost; if you had won, you would have gained points.

Posted: **Thu Jul 24, 2008 10:50 am**

MrBenn wrote:
PLAYER57832 wrote:
MrBenn wrote:There are two issues;
1. Somebody who cheats (and who deserves to lose their points)
2. Somebody who is wrongly accussed of cheating

Item #2 needs to be dealt with at the front end ... through better investigations, perhaps a delay in implementing more draconian penalties (until an appeal process is ended).

Agreed. Out of interest, is there any indication of the number of 'wrongfully convicted' multis?

More importantly ... how many convictions (not just accusations) have been repealed?

If this number is high, then that means there is a problem in the conviction process. If it is very low, then we, the public can't worry too much about it. I would say the best bet, if draconian measures are taken, is for CC to apologize and perhaps offer some sort of compensation (free month of membership or something similar).

Conquer Club

MULTIS and POINTS

MULTIS and POINTS

Re: MULTIS and POINTS

Re: MULTIS and POINTS

Re: MULTIS and POINTS

Re: MULTIS and POINTS

Re: MULTIS and POINTS

Re: MULTIS and POINTS

Re: MULTIS and POINTS

Re: MULTIS and POINTS

Re: MULTIS and POINTS

Re: MULTIS and POINTS

Re: MULTIS and POINTS

Re: MULTIS and POINTS

Re: MULTIS and POINTS

Re: MULTIS and POINTS

Re: MULTIS and POINTS