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[Olympics] Did she cheat?
Posted:
Tue Jul 31, 2012 5:00 pmby Lootifer
The achievements of Chinese swimming sensation Ye Shiwen has come under question after she swam at a faster pace than male gold medallist Ryan Lochte in the final lap of her 400m individual medley victory yesterday.
Ye smashed the world record by more than a second and also surpassed her personal best by a remarkable five seconds.
After the race, BBC presenter Clare Balding asked former British Olympian Mark Foster, "How many questions will there be, Mark, about somebody who can suddenly swim so much faster than she has ever swum before?"
Immediately reporters peppered Arne Ljungqvist, the international Olympic Committee's medical commission chairman with questions about Ye.
Ljungqvist said "it is very sad that an unexpected performance be surrounded by suspicions."
"Suspicion is halfway an accusation that something is wrong," Ljungqvist said. "I don't like that. I would rather have facts."
Despite Mr Ljungqvist's best efforts It seems the greatest show on earth will again be dogged by the suspicion of performance enhancing drugs.
Top US swimming coach John Leonard, the executive director of the World Swimming Coaches Association, has branded Ye's performance as "unbelievable" and "disturbing" and her speed over the final 50-metres as "flat out impossible".
Leonard told The Guardian that the race brings back memories of Irish swimmer Michelle Smith's four medal win at the Atlanta Olympics in 1996; she was later given a four year ban after failing a drug test.
He added that because she is from China - which has been dogged by swimmers testing positive for performance enhancing drugs in recent years - adds even more suspicion.
He has even suggested that the Chinese could be using genetic manipulation to enhance performances.
China's past will always cause suspicion at the Olympics Games after a sports scientist at San Diego State tallied 32 Chinese swimmers caught for drug offences in the 1990s, two of them twice.
However there may be another explanation for Ye's phenomenal ability. Unlike the 1990s China has turned to some of the sharpest minds in swimming, foreign coaches have been called in to improve coaching programmes.
Ye has trained in Australia with two well-recognized coaches, Ken Wood and Denis Cotterell. Wood has had a coaching contract with the Chinese Swimming Assosation since 2008, he told the The Associated Press in a phone interview.
"I get paid per month, per swimmer four times more than I do with my home swimmers,"
"China is putting a lot of money into its program and I am only too happy to work with them," he said.
"The whole Chinese philosophy is that they want to be the best they can."
"In the 1990s, the reputation of Chinese swimming wasn't good. There were a lot of doping problems. But it really is very different now. A lot of attention is paid to training. And despite breaking the world record, Ye Shiwen didn't come out of nowhere. Her results have steadily been improving," he said. "So I think it is down to training, not other methods."
"What they are saying is: 'Where did this girl come from? She came from nowhere,'" Wood said. "That's absolutely rubbish."
- HERALD ONLINE/AP
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/sport/news/ar ... d=10823454
Re: [Olympics] Did she cheat?
Posted:
Tue Jul 31, 2012 5:02 pmby Army of GOD
It's unfair to assume she cheated, but honestly it wouldn't be surprising.
Re: [Olympics] Did she cheat?
Posted:
Tue Jul 31, 2012 5:04 pmby Symmetry
Probably not- she was cleared, plus a bunch of other swimmers came forward and said they'd achieved similar or better improvements in the same space of time.
It would be surprising if she had, given that so many other swimmers have improved their times in a similar fashion at around the same age.
Re: [Olympics] Did she cheat?
Posted:
Tue Jul 31, 2012 5:10 pmby bedub1
I demand a swim off between her and Ryan Lochte. I won't be satisfied until I see her whoop his ass.
Re: [Olympics] Did she cheat?
Posted:
Tue Jul 31, 2012 5:11 pmby Lootifer
My opinion:
This
is a long way away from
Re: [Olympics] Did she cheat?
Posted:
Tue Jul 31, 2012 5:15 pmby Lootifer
Though she could be using IPO, it would be dissapointing, but possible.
At this stage I personally think shes legit.
(Plus its impossible to know)
Re: [Olympics] Did she cheat?
Posted:
Tue Jul 31, 2012 5:36 pmby yang guize
ha ha ha. maybe the entire china team is on drugs, they are so much better than everyone else.
Re: [Olympics] Did she cheat?
Posted:
Tue Jul 31, 2012 5:42 pmby Haggis_McMutton
I want a different competition where it's ok to use any drugs and whatever else they can think of.
Yes, basically I want to see half human half fish mutants and such.
Re: [Olympics] Did she cheat?
Posted:
Tue Jul 31, 2012 5:43 pmby jimboston
Army of GOD wrote:It's unfair to assume she cheated, but honestly it wouldn't be surprising.
ditto
Re: [Olympics] Did she cheat?
Posted:
Tue Jul 31, 2012 5:46 pmby Symmetry
jimboston wrote:Army of GOD wrote:It's unfair to assume she cheated, but honestly it wouldn't be surprising.
ditto
To be fair, these accusations come from a coach who's swimmers just lost at the highest level. Wouldn't it be also fair to say that accusations of cheating were kind of predictable out of sour grapes too?
If this were football, the losing coach would be blaming the referee.
Re: [Olympics] Did she cheat?
Posted:
Tue Jul 31, 2012 5:48 pmby nietzsche
Whether she's taking performance-enhancing drugs or not it is for the tests to tell. She shouldn't have her accomplishment belittled by envious people.
I find this comment very low:
Top US swimming coach John Leonard, the executive director of the World Swimming Coaches Association, has branded Ye's performance as "unbelievable" and "disturbing" and her speed over the final 50-metres as "flat out impossible".
"Flat out impossible" ? I didn't know Americans were such poor losers.
Re: [Olympics] Did she cheat?
Posted:
Tue Jul 31, 2012 5:50 pmby yang guize
so fucking jealous. team usa is so sad. it thinks it is so amazing that it can only lose when someone else cheats against them.
they train about 50% as hard as china and when they lose pretend they are suffering a conspiracy. it is like a little child. but then this is the tone that their leaders set, so it is no surprise to see their citizens copy this.
Re: [Olympics] Did she cheat?
Posted:
Tue Jul 31, 2012 5:55 pmby Symmetry
yang guize wrote:so fucking jealous. team usa is so sad. it thinks it is so amazing that it can only lose when someone else cheats against them.
they train about 50% as hard as china and when they lose pretend they are suffering a conspiracy. it is like a little child. but then this is the tone that their leaders set, so it is no surprise to see their citizens copy this.
There's no need to push so hard for an argument. There will always be a few people who think that Chinese athletes are racially inferior and can only win through drug abuse, or, as the US coach suggested, "genetic manipulation".
The best response is dismissal, especially after tests cleared her, and to relegate criticism of her amazing achievement to the scrap heap of conspiracy theories.
Re: [Olympics] Did she cheat?
Posted:
Tue Jul 31, 2012 5:58 pmby Phatscotty
Where are the North Koreans at?
Re: [Olympics] Did she cheat?
Posted:
Tue Jul 31, 2012 6:00 pmby Symmetry
Phatscotty wrote:Where are the North Koreans at?
North Korea, mostly, but expect Michelle Bachmann to say that they've infiltrated the highest levels of the US government if they manage a medal at the games.
Re: [Olympics] Did she cheat?
Posted:
Tue Jul 31, 2012 6:06 pmby Woodruff
It's unfortunate that the question is being asked, yet at the same time, I think the question does have to be asked. I mean, that is an incredible personal time improvement.
Re: [Olympics] Did she cheat?
Posted:
Tue Jul 31, 2012 6:11 pmby saxitoxin
Phatscotty wrote:Where are the North Koreans at?
DPRK is doing extremely well for a nation of its size. It is currently tied in medal count in the Small Nations Division with UK, just one medal behind Romania and one medal ahead of Kazakhstan.
Re: [Olympics] Did she cheat?
Posted:
Tue Jul 31, 2012 6:12 pmby Phatscotty
Symmetry wrote:Phatscotty wrote:Where are the North Koreans at?
North Korea, mostly, but expect Michelle Bachmann to say that they've infiltrated the highest levels of the US government if they manage a medal at the games.
Actually, Michelle Bachmann has already adopted 2 North Koreans.
oh and btw, Neitz is gonna be mad at you
Re: [Olympics] Did she cheat?
Posted:
Tue Jul 31, 2012 6:19 pmby Symmetry
Phatscotty wrote:Symmetry wrote:Phatscotty wrote:Where are the North Koreans at?
North Korea, mostly, but expect Michelle Bachmann to say that they've infiltrated the highest levels of the US government if they manage a medal at the games.
Actually, Michelle Bachmann has already adopted 2 North Koreans.
oh and btw, Neitz is gonna be mad at you
He's always flaming me, what can a guy do? Bachmann, of course, has not adopted any children at all, let alone North Koreans.
Re: [Olympics] Did she cheat?
Posted:
Tue Jul 31, 2012 6:22 pmby saxitoxin
Based on some quick, back-of-napkin calculations, I figure the Democratic People's Republic of Korea is #3 overall for medals per capita (among the top 12 nations), trailing only Australia and Romania and leading US-occupied Korea.
1. AUS - 1 : 3,666,000
2. ROM - 1 : 4,000,000
3. PRK - 1 : 6,100,000
4. ROK - 1 : 6,250,000
5. FRA - 1 : 6,600,000
6. ITA - 1 : 9,750,000
7. USA - 1 : 14,300,000
8. GER - 1 : 13,300,000
9. JAP - 1 : 13,850,000
10. UKGBNI - 1: 17,000,000
11. RUS - 1 : 22,500,000
12. PRC - 1 : 52,000,000
Re: [Olympics] Did she cheat?
Posted:
Tue Jul 31, 2012 6:25 pmby Symmetry
saxitoxin wrote:Based on some quick, back-of-napkin calculations, I figure the Democratic People's Republic of Korea is #3 overall for medals per capita (among the top 12 nations), trailing only Australia and Romania and leading US-occupied Korea.
1. AUS - 1 : 3,666,000
2. ROM - 1 : 4,000,000
3. PRK - 1 : 6,100,000
4. ROK - 1 : 6,250,000
5. FRA - 1 : 6,600,000
6. ITA - 1 : 9,750,000
7. USA - 1 : 14,300,000
8. GER - 1 : 13,300,000
9. JAP - 1 : 13,850,000
10. UKGBNI - 1: 17,000,000
11. RUS - 1 : 22,500,000
12. PRC - 1 : 52,000,000
She's Chinese, not North Korean.
Re: [Olympics] Did she cheat?
Posted:
Tue Jul 31, 2012 6:26 pmby saxitoxin
Symmetry wrote:saxitoxin wrote:Based on some quick, back-of-napkin calculations, I figure the Democratic People's Republic of Korea is #3 overall for medals per capita (among the top 12 nations), trailing only Australia and Romania and leading US-occupied Korea.
1. AUS - 1 : 3,666,000
2. ROM - 1 : 4,000,000
3. PRK - 1 : 6,100,000
4. ROK - 1 : 6,250,000
5. FRA - 1 : 6,600,000
6. ITA - 1 : 9,750,000
7. USA - 1 : 14,300,000
8. GER - 1 : 13,300,000
9. JAP - 1 : 13,850,000
10. UKGBNI - 1: 17,000,000
11. RUS - 1 : 22,500,000
12. PRC - 1 : 52,000,000
She's Chinese, not North Korean.
Who's Chinese?
Re: [Olympics] Did she cheat?
Posted:
Tue Jul 31, 2012 6:27 pmby Symmetry
saxitoxin wrote:Symmetry wrote:saxitoxin wrote:Based on some quick, back-of-napkin calculations, I figure the Democratic People's Republic of Korea is #3 overall for medals per capita (among the top 12 nations), trailing only Australia and Romania and leading US-occupied Korea.
1. AUS - 1 : 3,666,000
2. ROM - 1 : 4,000,000
3. PRK - 1 : 6,100,000
4. ROK - 1 : 6,250,000
5. FRA - 1 : 6,600,000
6. ITA - 1 : 9,750,000
7. USA - 1 : 14,300,000
8. GER - 1 : 13,300,000
9. JAP - 1 : 13,850,000
10. UKGBNI - 1: 17,000,000
11. RUS - 1 : 22,500,000
12. PRC - 1 : 52,000,000
She's Chinese, not North Korean.
Who's Chinese?
The "she" of the OP, Ye Shiwen.
Re: [Olympics] Did she cheat?
Posted:
Tue Jul 31, 2012 6:27 pmby saxitoxin
Symmetry wrote:saxitoxin wrote:Symmetry wrote:saxitoxin wrote:Based on some quick, back-of-napkin calculations, I figure the Democratic People's Republic of Korea is #3 overall for medals per capita (among the top 12 nations), trailing only Australia and Romania and leading US-occupied Korea.
1. AUS - 1 : 3,666,000
2. ROM - 1 : 4,000,000
3. PRK - 1 : 6,100,000
4. ROK - 1 : 6,250,000
5. FRA - 1 : 6,600,000
6. ITA - 1 : 9,750,000
7. USA - 1 : 14,300,000
8. GER - 1 : 13,300,000
9. JAP - 1 : 13,850,000
10. UKGBNI - 1: 17,000,000
11. RUS - 1 : 22,500,000
12. PRC - 1 : 52,000,000
She's Chinese, not North Korean.
Who's Chinese?
The "she" of the OP, Ye Shiwen.
I don't know what that is.
Re: [Olympics] Did she cheat?
Posted:
Tue Jul 31, 2012 6:28 pmby bedub1
saxitoxin wrote:Symmetry wrote:saxitoxin wrote:Based on some quick, back-of-napkin calculations, I figure the Democratic People's Republic of Korea is #3 overall for medals per capita (among the top 12 nations), trailing only Australia and Romania and leading US-occupied Korea.
1. AUS - 1 : 3,666,000
2. ROM - 1 : 4,000,000
3. PRK - 1 : 6,100,000
4. ROK - 1 : 6,250,000
5. FRA - 1 : 6,600,000
6. ITA - 1 : 9,750,000
7. USA - 1 : 14,300,000
8. GER - 1 : 13,300,000
9. JAP - 1 : 13,850,000
10. UKGBNI - 1: 17,000,000
11. RUS - 1 : 22,500,000
12. PRC - 1 : 52,000,000
She's Chinese, not North Korean.
Who's Chinese?
how is usa in 7th? Isnt 14million more than 13million? Should usa be behind germany and japan?