There is no proof Homer wrote the Illiad

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There is no proof Homer wrote the Illiad

Postby premio53 on Tue Jan 22, 2013 8:40 am

Is this the greatest fraud ever thrusted upon mankind? What evidence exists to believe with reasonable certainty that he was the author of that work?
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Re: There is no proof Homer wrote the Illiad

Postby thegreekdog on Tue Jan 22, 2013 8:58 am

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Re: There is no proof Homer wrote the Illiad

Postby Haggis_McMutton on Tue Jan 22, 2013 9:10 am

Homer was his/her/their/its pen-name.

Controversy solved.
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Re: There is no proof Homer wrote the Illiad

Postby chang50 on Tue Jan 22, 2013 9:17 am

premio53 wrote:Is this the greatest fraud ever thrusted upon mankind? What evidence exists to believe with reasonable certainty that he was the author of that work?


Well it was written a long time ago,probably about events even longer ago,so yes there is some doubt.Socrates never wrote down any of his philosophy,all we know of his ideas comes from others,mainly Plato,did Socrates even exist?Is this topic leading up to some other point you want to make?
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Re: There is no proof Homer wrote the Illiad

Postby Timminz on Tue Jan 22, 2013 9:21 am

chang50 wrote:Is this topic leading up to some other point you want to make?


Isn't it clear? He's trying to prove that the Bible is only the second biggest hoax ever perpetuated, because "Homer's" works of fiction may have been written by someone not named Homer.
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Re: There is no proof Homer wrote the Illiad

Postby chang50 on Tue Jan 22, 2013 9:25 am

Timminz wrote:
chang50 wrote:Is this topic leading up to some other point you want to make?


Isn't it clear? He's trying to prove that the Bible is only the second biggest hoax ever perpetuated, because "Homer's" works of fiction may have been written by someone not named Homer.


Shucks,should have seen that one coming :roll:
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Re: There is no proof Homer wrote the Illiad

Postby Haggis_McMutton on Tue Jan 22, 2013 9:34 am

Well, my theory is that he was expecting us to be all up in arms and adamant that Homer did write the Iliad and then he would deliver the devastating final blow "see I'm just as rational as you guys in believing god wrote the bible".

This would also fit with his notion that atheism and scientific literacy is some kind of "religion" which presumably implies we should view Socrates and Homer as some kind of prophets and therefore we should be willing to fight to the death over their existence/nonexistence.

The more general point the fundies seem to miss is that the person doesn't matter, only the idea matters. I really don't give a shit if, for instance, Darwin converted on his death bed and said evolution is all a lie. It really doesn't matter at all. But that point would be hard to grasp for someone who thinks all knowledge is some kind of revealed truth.
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Re: There is no proof Homer wrote the Illiad

Postby thegreekdog on Tue Jan 22, 2013 9:42 am

Just so you guys know, I no longer believe in the Illiad.
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Re: There is no proof Homer wrote the Illiad

Postby chang50 on Tue Jan 22, 2013 9:45 am

Haggis_McMutton wrote:Well, my theory is that he was expecting us to be all up in arms and adamant that Homer did write the Iliad and then he would deliver the devastating final blow "see I'm just as rational as you guys in believing god wrote the bible".

This would also fit with his notion that atheism and scientific literacy is some kind of "religion" which presumably implies we should view Socrates and Homer as some kind of prophets and therefore we should be willing to fight to the death over their existence/nonexistence.

The more general point the fundies seem to miss is that the person doesn't matter, only the idea matters. I really don't give a shit if, for instance, Darwin converted on his death bed and said evolution is all a lie. It really doesn't matter at all. But that point would be hard to grasp for someone who thinks all knowledge is some kind of revealed truth.


Personally I'm a tad insulted,if your theory is correct and I have no reason to doubt it,that premio so underestimates the community of posters on cc.
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Re: There is no proof Homer wrote the Illiad

Postby thegreekdog on Tue Jan 22, 2013 9:51 am

chang50 wrote:
Haggis_McMutton wrote:Well, my theory is that he was expecting us to be all up in arms and adamant that Homer did write the Iliad and then he would deliver the devastating final blow "see I'm just as rational as you guys in believing god wrote the bible".

This would also fit with his notion that atheism and scientific literacy is some kind of "religion" which presumably implies we should view Socrates and Homer as some kind of prophets and therefore we should be willing to fight to the death over their existence/nonexistence.

The more general point the fundies seem to miss is that the person doesn't matter, only the idea matters. I really don't give a shit if, for instance, Darwin converted on his death bed and said evolution is all a lie. It really doesn't matter at all. But that point would be hard to grasp for someone who thinks all knowledge is some kind of revealed truth.


Personally I'm a tad insulted,if your theory is correct and I have no reason to doubt it,that premio so underestimates the community of posters on cc.


He seems new to off topics. I think we've adequately let him know that some forumgoers are not gullible idiots. I remain shocked he did not reply to the clear evidence included in the Youtube video above.
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Re: There is no proof Homer wrote the Illiad

Postby premio53 on Tue Jan 22, 2013 10:42 am

I must admit you guys are brilliant. Yes I was making a point. Ancient books are available today because someone took the time to write them down. The original writings of Julius Caesar are no longer around but we know he wrote only by 10 copies made 1,000 years after he died. There are only 600 copies of Homer's Illiad that exist which are 1,300 years after the originals were written. There are 24,000 copies of the New Testament manuscripts, some written within 35 years of the writer's death.

If just 10 people today were born around the same time, spoke the same language, and made the same amount of money, and were asked to write on just one controversial subject, they would have trouble agreeing with each other. But the Bible was written over a period of 1,600 years by more than 40 writers from all walks of life. Some were fishermen, politicians, kings, shepherds, historians etc. They were from three different continents and wrote in three different languages. They wrote on hundreds of controversial subjects with agreement and harmony. The Bible is unique.

The greatest physical proof of Bible inspiration is the Jew. For 2500 years they had no nation to call their own. The have been scattered around the earth and persecuted in practically every nation to which they were scattered and yet have maintained their racial identity and culture. The prophecies concerning the restoration of the Jews to their land go back to the prophet Ezekiel and others and found literal fulfillment on May 14, 1948.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oairG6bbQ5U
Last edited by premio53 on Tue Jan 22, 2013 10:50 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: There is no proof Homer wrote the Illiad

Postby DoomYoshi on Tue Jan 22, 2013 10:45 am

Haggis_McMutton wrote:Well, my theory is that he was expecting us to be all up in arms and adamant that Homer did write the Iliad and then he would deliver the devastating final blow "see I'm just as rational as you guys in believing god wrote the bible".

This would also fit with his notion that atheism and scientific literacy is some kind of "religion" which presumably implies we should view Socrates and Homer as some kind of prophets and therefore we should be willing to fight to the death over their existence/nonexistence.

The more general point the fundies seem to miss is that the person doesn't matter, only the idea matters. I really don't give a shit if, for instance, Darwin converted on his death bed and said evolution is all a lie. It really doesn't matter at all. But that point would be hard to grasp for someone who thinks all knowledge is some kind of revealed truth.


Good call.

Premio, you can stop posting any time now.
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Re: There is no proof Homer wrote the Illiad

Postby comic boy on Tue Jan 22, 2013 10:46 am

Dont be too hard on the OP , having shown himself to be a gullible idiot of the first magnitude it is hardly surprising that he regards it as normality.
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Re: There is no proof Homer wrote the Illiad

Postby AAFitz on Tue Jan 22, 2013 11:02 am

premio53 wrote:I must admit you guys are brilliant. Yes I was making a point. Ancient books are available today because someone took the time to write them down. The original writings of Julius Caesar are no longer around but we know he wrote only by 10 copies made 1,000 years after he died. There are only 600 copies of Homer's Illiad that exist which are 1,300 years after the originals were written. There are 24,000 copies of the New Testament manuscripts, some written within 35 years of the writer's death.

If just 10 people today were born around the same time, spoke the same language, and made the same amount of money, and were asked to write on just one controversial subject, they would have trouble agreeing with each other. But the Bible was written over a period of 1,600 years by more than 40 writers from all walks of life. Some were fishermen, politicians, kings, shepherds, historians etc. They were from three different continents and wrote in three different languages. They wrote on hundreds of controversial subjects with agreement and harmony. The Bible is unique.

The greatest physical proof of Bible inspiration is the Jew. For 2500 years they had no nation to call their own. The have been scattered around the earth and persecuted in practically every nation to which they were scattered and yet have maintained their racial identity and culture. The prophecies concerning the restoration of the Jews to their land go back to the prophet Ezekiel and others and found literal fulfillment on May 14, 1948.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oairG6bbQ5U


I do not think those words mean what you think they mean.

In any case, you already made the same point in your other posts: You make incorrect assumptions based on incomplete information. No more examples are necessary. We believe you.
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Re: There is no proof Homer wrote the Illiad

Postby Army of GOD on Tue Jan 22, 2013 12:04 pm

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