DoomYoshi wrote:But BBS, you haven't declared an intended level/qulaity of education. So there is no way to know if we have reached that level until you define the intended level. Secondly, because the level is undefined, we could assume it to be impossible. If my goal is to cease material existence and will myself into mathematical reality, and I end up walking to shanghai, have I been inefficient? There is no contradiction. You are saying the same thing I am saying but denying it.
"but but but but but but but but, as Founder of this High School my goal is to create cars."
(I agree that I didn't declare exactly what the goal was. It could've been "X-amount of students must get a HS degree by undergoing our rigorous process. Quality will be measured by grade letters per course, which will then be magically compiled into a GPA---MAGIC!! Other measurements will be used to test our performance like SAT scores, placement in particular colleges, etc." Therefore, education isn't a continuous variable--as you stated earlier, but so far in this thread, we have yet to narrow down what the goal of public education is, so we'll be here for the next few weeks spinning our wheels.
Hmm... I think I spotted an arbitrage opportunity. I'ma roll up mah sleeves and see if we can figure this out...
--------------->> Okay, Gangstas. Let's get some terms straight, so we can stop this back-and-forth.
<<--------------------------------Yesterday we were an army with no efficiency, tomorrow, we have to decide which efficiency we want to use!Numero Uno
Definition of 'Efficiency'
A level of performance that describes a process that uses the lowest amount of inputs to create the greatest amount of outputs. Efficiency relates to the use of all inputs in producing any given output, including personal time and energy.
Investopedia explains 'Efficiency'
Efficiency is an important attribute because all inputs are scarce. Time, money and raw materials are limited, so it makes sense to try to conserve them while maintaining an acceptable level of output or a general production level.
Being efficient simply means reducing the amount of wasted inputs.
So, we got inputs ----> [production process]-----> outputs. Numero Dos:
Efficiency = (outputs/inputs)
wiki wrote:"In economics, the term economic efficiency refers to the use of resources so as to maximize the production of goods and services"
"Production proceeds at the lowest possible per-unit cost."
(KINDA LIKE the efficiency used in business, but not exactly what I'm talking about). (inb4 LOOTIFER: "Pareto-efficiency FTW!!!")Numero Tres
EconLib.org wrote:To economists, efficiency is a relationship between ends and means. When we call a situation inefficient, we are claiming that we could achieve the desired ends with less means, or that the means employed could produce more of the ends desired. “Less” and “more” in this context necessarily refer to less and more value. Thus, economic efficiency is measured not by the relationship between the physical quantities of ends and means, but by the relationship between the value of the ends and the value of the means.
The inescapably evaluative nature of the concept raises a fundamental question for every attempt to talk about the efficiency of any process or institution: Whose valuations do we use, and how shall they be weighted? Economic efficiency makes use of monetary evaluations.
From this perspective a parcel of land is used with maximum economic efficiency when it comes under the control of the party who is willing (which implies able) to pay the largest amount of money to obtain that control. The proof that a particular resource is being used efficiently is that no one is willing to pay more in order to divert it to some other use.
Since public education is not based on voluntary exchange, thus free pricing, free competition, etc., then Numero Tres and its use of monetary values will present problems. Numero Dos o Uno may be best.Wait a minute, G! What about effectiveness?
Never really distinguished efficiency (#3) from effectiveness. This is probably why our fingers are cramping at this point, so let's peruse the following definitions and see which effectiveness we want to use!Numero A
wiki wrote:Effectiveness is the capability of producing a desired result. When something is deemed effective, it means it has an intended or expected outcome,
Can you do it? Numero B
Yup, I can and I did it.
SUPER EFFECTIVE HIGH FIVE!!!
wiki wrote:In medicine, effectiveness relates to how well a treatment works in practice
Was that medicine effective? Numero C
Yes, doctor, it obliterated the disease, but it killed 95% of the patients.
SUPER EFFECTIVE HIGH FIVE!!!
wiki wrote:In management, effectiveness relates to getting the right things done. Peter Drucker reminds us that “effectiveness can and must be learned.”
Yeah, thanks Drucker. "Getting shit done. QED."
(Note, this sounds somewhat like Numero Tres).
------> Okay, this next one is gonna make this more complicated. YAY!
wiki wrote:Efficacy, efficiency, and effectivity are terms that can, in some cases, be interchangeable with the term effectiveness. The word effective is sometimes used in a quantitative way, "being very effective or not very effective". However, neither effectiveness, nor effectively, inform about the direction (positive or negative) and the comparison to a standard of the given effect. Efficacy, on the other hand, is the extent to which a desired affect is achieved; the ability to produce a desired amount of the desired effect, or the success in achieving a given goal. Contrary to the term efficiency, the focus of efficacy is the achievement as such, not the resources spent in achieving the desired effect. Therefore, what is effective is not necessarily efficacious, and what is efficacious is not necessarily efficient
 Longman, Pearson. "Effective - Definition from Longman English Dictionary Online." Longman English Dictionary Online. 2011
Longman, Pearson ain't no economist.You decide.
At this point, we're gonna have to state the means, goals, and the standards of measure.
ORRRR, we can have a great time shouting and throwing out our opinions---buff that rhetoric reeaall good into our posts.