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Is opposing fascism a form of terrorism?

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Is opposing fascism a form of terrorism?

Yes, it is
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25%
Yes usually, but sometimes it's not
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No votes
I don't know
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No votes
No, but there are some crazies
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13%
Not at all
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Kittens are cute
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Total votes : 8

Is opposing fascism a form of terrorism?

Postby Symmetry on Sun Sep 03, 2017 8:49 pm

Is opposing fascism a form of of domestic terrorism? The Trump administration says yay.
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Re: Is opposing fascism a form of terrorism?

Postby Thorthoth on Sun Sep 03, 2017 9:09 pm

Another incredibly, stupidly snide & insincere thread, entirely stated in manipulo-idiotic Sym-speak...
Maybe, I'll swing by later and once again skewer it on it's one petard, ...but for now, I'm too tired and bored with his same ol' dreary schtick to even bother.
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Re: Is opposing fascism a form of terrorism?

Postby Symmetry on Sun Sep 03, 2017 9:17 pm

Thorthoth wrote:Another incredibly, stupidly snide & insincere thread, entirely stated in manipulo-idiotic Sym-speak...
Maybe, I'll swing by later and once again skewer it on it's one petard, ...but for now, I'm too tired and bored with his same ol' dreary schtick to even bother.


Rest up T, "skewer it on it's one petard" is pretty ridiculous already.
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Re: Is opposing fascism a form of terrorism?

Postby Thorthoth on Sun Sep 03, 2017 9:22 pm

Symmetry wrote:
Thorthoth wrote:Another incredibly, stupidly snide & insincere thread, entirely stated in manipulo-idiotic Sym-speak...
Maybe, I'll swing by later and once again skewer it on it's one petard, ...but for now, I'm too tired and bored with his same ol' dreary schtick to even bother.


Rest up T, "skewer it on it's one petard" is pretty ridiculous already.

You're lucky you even have one petard, you piss & petard-poor excuse for a human being.
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Re: Is opposing fascism a form of terrorism?

Postby Dukasaur on Sun Sep 03, 2017 9:25 pm

Very few people in modern society find it necessary to keep even one petard.
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Re: Is opposing fascism a form of terrorism?

Postby Symmetry on Sun Sep 03, 2017 9:31 pm

Thorthoth wrote:
Symmetry wrote:
Thorthoth wrote:Another incredibly, stupidly snide & insincere thread, entirely stated in manipulo-idiotic Sym-speak...
Maybe, I'll swing by later and once again skewer it on it's one petard, ...but for now, I'm too tired and bored with his same ol' dreary schtick to even bother.


Rest up T, "skewer it on it's one petard" is pretty ridiculous already.

You're lucky you even have one petard you piss & petard-poor excuse for a human being.


With insults like that, I am kinda lucky. Thanks T.
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Re: Is opposing fascism a form of terrorism?

Postby tzor on Mon Sep 04, 2017 11:49 am

Symmetry wrote:Is opposing fascism a form of of domestic terrorism? The Trump administration says yay.


No. No. and just in case no.

However Not Fascism does not equal Communism.
Fascism sucks
Communism sucks
EVERYTHING FUCKING FROM THE PROGRESSIVE LEFT SUCKS.

White NAZIS suck
Black NAZIS suck
Gay NAZIS suck
Female NAZIS suck

All NAZIS suck.

It's as stupid as the Endian Wars ... two idiots making a war over which end of the egg to crack.

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Re: Is opposing fascism a form of terrorism?

Postby Bernie Sanders on Mon Sep 04, 2017 2:04 pm

No thanks Tzor, you can get off your knees.
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Re: Is opposing fascism a form of terrorism?

Postby thegreekdog on Thu Sep 07, 2017 9:53 pm

It can be depending on the form it takes. If it takes the form of violent opposition, then yes. Let's say (and this is purely hypothetical), there is a group that is anti-fascist. This group is also anti-capitalist, anti-business, and takes great pains to commit violence in the name of those things (violence against both individuals and property). I know this is purely a hypothetical and there is not actually an organization like this that recently assaulted a number of non-fascists in Berkley recently. But I would call that group a form of domestic terrorists.

Kind of like how certain environmentalists blow up shit... those guys are also terrorists.
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Re: Is opposing fascism a form of terrorism?

Postby muy_thaiguy on Thu Sep 07, 2017 11:22 pm

thegreekdog wrote:It can be depending on the form it takes. If it takes the form of violent opposition, then yes. Let's say (and this is purely hypothetical), there is a group that is anti-fascist. This group is also anti-capitalist, anti-business, and takes great pains to commit violence in the name of those things (violence against both individuals and property). I know this is purely a hypothetical and there is not actually an organization like this that recently assaulted a number of non-fascists in Berkley recently. But I would call that group a form of domestic terrorists.

Kind of like how certain environmentalists blow up shit... those guys are also terrorists.

Here's one for you;
KKK=Terrorists.
True or False.

And no, marel/fake Norse/whoever else is in that group, I'm not lumping modern day Democrats with the KKK. Just asking opinion on how people view the vile group that traces its roots back to Confederates soldiers that terrorized non-WASPs after the Civil War, with blacks being the most targeted.
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Re: Is opposing fascism a form of terrorism?

Postby thegreekdog on Fri Sep 08, 2017 7:01 am

muy_thaiguy wrote:
thegreekdog wrote:It can be depending on the form it takes. If it takes the form of violent opposition, then yes. Let's say (and this is purely hypothetical), there is a group that is anti-fascist. This group is also anti-capitalist, anti-business, and takes great pains to commit violence in the name of those things (violence against both individuals and property). I know this is purely a hypothetical and there is not actually an organization like this that recently assaulted a number of non-fascists in Berkley recently. But I would call that group a form of domestic terrorists.

Kind of like how certain environmentalists blow up shit... those guys are also terrorists.

Here's one for you;
KKK=Terrorists.
True or False.

And no, marel/fake Norse/whoever else is in that group, I'm not lumping modern day Democrats with the KKK. Just asking opinion on how people view the vile group that traces its roots back to Confederates soldiers that terrorized non-WASPs after the Civil War, with blacks being the most targeted.


If they commit violence against people or property, they are terrorists.

Look, whatever you may think of the United States, we have the First Amendment. It is a near absolute protection of free speech. So even people with whom I vehemently disagree and would very much like to punch get to say pretty much whatever they want. If we start rolling that protection back because we don't like the content of what people are saying, we start going down a slippery slope that could result in Hitler's Germany or Stalin's Soviet Union. Frankly, I'm much more afraid of what the government will do to me than I am with 1,000 racists at Charleston or 500 Antifas at Berkley.
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Re: Is opposing fascism a form of terrorism?

Postby Symmetry on Fri Sep 08, 2017 8:46 pm

thegreekdog wrote:It can be depending on the form it takes. If it takes the form of violent opposition, then yes. Let's say (and this is purely hypothetical), there is a group that is anti-fascist. This group is also anti-capitalist, anti-business, and takes great pains to commit violence in the name of those things (violence against both individuals and property). I know this is purely a hypothetical and there is not actually an organization like this that recently assaulted a number of non-fascists in Berkley recently. But I would call that group a form of domestic terrorists.

Kind of like how certain environmentalists blow up shit... those guys are also terrorists.


It seems like terrorism is a pretty loose term. Violent opposition to fascism is sometimes seen as heroic- the easiest examples obviously being during the second World War-e.g. The Resistance movements in France, or the Warsaw ghetto uprising.

For me, I'd be very wary of how the phrase "domestic terrorists" is used as a label. If violence+ideology= terrorism is really the formula, then you either risk diluting the term "terrorism" into virtual meaninglessness, or quickly find yourself becoming a hypocrite.
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Re: Is opposing fascism a form of terrorism?

Postby Thorthoth on Fri Sep 08, 2017 8:49 pm

Symmetry wrote:
thegreekdog wrote:It can be depending on the form it takes. If it takes the form of violent opposition, then yes. Let's say (and this is purely hypothetical), there is a group that is anti-fascist. This group is also anti-capitalist, anti-business, and takes great pains to commit violence in the name of those things (violence against both individuals and property). I know this is purely a hypothetical and there is not actually an organization like this that recently assaulted a number of non-fascists in Berkley recently. But I would call that group a form of domestic terrorists.

Kind of like how certain environmentalists blow up shit... those guys are also terrorists.


It seems like terrorism is a pretty loose term. Violent opposition to fascism is sometimes seen as heroic- the easiest examples obviously being during the second World War-e.g. The Resistance movements in France, or the Warsaw ghetto uprising.

For me, I'd be very wary of how the phrase "domestic terrorists" is used as a label. If violence+ideology= terrorism is really the formula, then you either risk diluting the term "terrorism" into virtual meaninglessness, or quickly find yourself becoming a hypocrite.

Not a hypocrite*, merely one with a side in the conflict.
*Unless you claim pacifism, of course.
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Re: Is opposing fascism a form of terrorism?

Postby Symmetry on Fri Sep 08, 2017 8:56 pm

Thorthoth wrote:
Symmetry wrote:
thegreekdog wrote:It can be depending on the form it takes. If it takes the form of violent opposition, then yes. Let's say (and this is purely hypothetical), there is a group that is anti-fascist. This group is also anti-capitalist, anti-business, and takes great pains to commit violence in the name of those things (violence against both individuals and property). I know this is purely a hypothetical and there is not actually an organization like this that recently assaulted a number of non-fascists in Berkley recently. But I would call that group a form of domestic terrorists.

Kind of like how certain environmentalists blow up shit... those guys are also terrorists.


It seems like terrorism is a pretty loose term. Violent opposition to fascism is sometimes seen as heroic- the easiest examples obviously being during the second World War-e.g. The Resistance movements in France, or the Warsaw ghetto uprising.

For me, I'd be very wary of how the phrase "domestic terrorists" is used as a label. If violence+ideology= terrorism is really the formula, then you either risk diluting the term "terrorism" into virtual meaninglessness, or quickly find yourself becoming a hypocrite.

Not a hypocrite*, merely one with a side in the conflict.
*Unless you claim pacifism, of course.


Perhaps, but applying the "terrorism" along those lines tends to result in hypocrisy or irrelevance anyway. Either something your side did that fits that definition was not terrorism, hence a kind of hypocrisy; or every example that fits the definition is terrorism, hence bascically irrelevance.
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Re: Is opposing fascism a form of terrorism?

Postby thegreekdog on Fri Sep 08, 2017 9:58 pm

Symmetry wrote:
thegreekdog wrote:It can be depending on the form it takes. If it takes the form of violent opposition, then yes. Let's say (and this is purely hypothetical), there is a group that is anti-fascist. This group is also anti-capitalist, anti-business, and takes great pains to commit violence in the name of those things (violence against both individuals and property). I know this is purely a hypothetical and there is not actually an organization like this that recently assaulted a number of non-fascists in Berkley recently. But I would call that group a form of domestic terrorists.

Kind of like how certain environmentalists blow up shit... those guys are also terrorists.


It seems like terrorism is a pretty loose term. Violent opposition to fascism is sometimes seen as heroic- the easiest examples obviously being during the second World War-e.g. The Resistance movements in France, or the Warsaw ghetto uprising.

For me, I'd be very wary of how the phrase "domestic terrorists" is used as a label. If violence+ideology= terrorism is really the formula, then you either risk diluting the term "terrorism" into virtual meaninglessness, or quickly find yourself becoming a hypocrite.


Antifa is against Nazism (note - Antifa is not against fascism as they are also fascists). Anfita is also against capitalism and republicanism (i.e. a republican government). I would therefore not call Antifa heroic. But hey, if you are okay with a bunch of people beating up a teenager and his dad for their non-Nazi, non-fascist political views...
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Re: Is opposing fascism a form of terrorism?

Postby Symmetry on Fri Sep 08, 2017 10:51 pm

thegreekdog wrote:
Symmetry wrote:
thegreekdog wrote:It can be depending on the form it takes. If it takes the form of violent opposition, then yes. Let's say (and this is purely hypothetical), there is a group that is anti-fascist. This group is also anti-capitalist, anti-business, and takes great pains to commit violence in the name of those things (violence against both individuals and property). I know this is purely a hypothetical and there is not actually an organization like this that recently assaulted a number of non-fascists in Berkley recently. But I would call that group a form of domestic terrorists.

Kind of like how certain environmentalists blow up shit... those guys are also terrorists.


It seems like terrorism is a pretty loose term. Violent opposition to fascism is sometimes seen as heroic- the easiest examples obviously being during the second World War-e.g. The Resistance movements in France, or the Warsaw ghetto uprising.

For me, I'd be very wary of how the phrase "domestic terrorists" is used as a label. If violence+ideology= terrorism is really the formula, then you either risk diluting the term "terrorism" into virtual meaninglessness, or quickly find yourself becoming a hypocrite.


Antifa is against Nazism (note - Antifa is not against fascism as they are also fascists). Anfita is also against capitalism and republicanism (i.e. a republican government). I would therefore not call Antifa heroic. But hey, if you are okay with a bunch of people beating up a teenager and his dad for their non-Nazi, non-fascist political views...


I'm pretty sure I didn't say that, TGD.

Maybe, and I'm just going out on a limb here, you might want to rethink what opposing fascism is.
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Re: Is opposing fascism a form of terrorism?

Postby thegreekdog on Sat Sep 09, 2017 7:51 pm

Symmetry wrote:
thegreekdog wrote:
Symmetry wrote:
thegreekdog wrote:It can be depending on the form it takes. If it takes the form of violent opposition, then yes. Let's say (and this is purely hypothetical), there is a group that is anti-fascist. This group is also anti-capitalist, anti-business, and takes great pains to commit violence in the name of those things (violence against both individuals and property). I know this is purely a hypothetical and there is not actually an organization like this that recently assaulted a number of non-fascists in Berkley recently. But I would call that group a form of domestic terrorists.

Kind of like how certain environmentalists blow up shit... those guys are also terrorists.


It seems like terrorism is a pretty loose term. Violent opposition to fascism is sometimes seen as heroic- the easiest examples obviously being during the second World War-e.g. The Resistance movements in France, or the Warsaw ghetto uprising.

For me, I'd be very wary of how the phrase "domestic terrorists" is used as a label. If violence+ideology= terrorism is really the formula, then you either risk diluting the term "terrorism" into virtual meaninglessness, or quickly find yourself becoming a hypocrite.


Antifa is against Nazism (note - Antifa is not against fascism as they are also fascists). Anfita is also against capitalism and republicanism (i.e. a republican government). I would therefore not call Antifa heroic. But hey, if you are okay with a bunch of people beating up a teenager and his dad for their non-Nazi, non-fascist political views...


I'm pretty sure I didn't say that, TGD.

Maybe, and I'm just going out on a limb here, you might want to rethink what opposing fascism is.


The OP put it in the context of the Trump administration. The Trump administration has (I think) condemned Antifa. Antifa is a terrorist organization if it commits violence as part of its mission. So my initial response is on point. Violence+ideology does equal terrorism if the ideology is not merely "anti-fascism." I think you may want to rethink what Antifa does.
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Re: Is opposing fascism a form of terrorism?

Postby saxitoxin on Wed Sep 13, 2017 12:54 pm

BERKELEY, CA—Advising students to remain in their dormitories and classrooms until the situation was resolved, the University of California, Berkeley declared a campuswide lockdown Thursday after several loose pages from The Wall Street Journal were found on a park bench outside a school building. “At 11:15 this morning, several pages from two separate sections of today’s Wall Street Journal were discovered spread across a bench outside of Eshleman Hall in Lower Sproul Plaza,” read the urgent alert sent to all students and faculty, emphasizing that while campus security and local police had safely disposed of the pages, there was no way of knowing if others were strewn elsewhere on university grounds. “As of now, the perpetrator remains at large, so it is vital that you stay where you are until the all-clear is given. In the meantime, notify police immediately if you have any additional information at all regarding this incident.”

At press time, a black-clad group of 50 students were throwing bottles at the bench while chanting, “No Nazis, No KKK, No Fascist U.S.A!”

http://www.theonion.com/article/berkele ... l-st-55815
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Re: Is opposing fascism a form of terrorism?

Postby riskllama on Wed Sep 13, 2017 2:36 pm

wtf???
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Re: Is opposing fascism a form of terrorism?

Postby Thorthoth on Wed Sep 13, 2017 4:12 pm

riskllama wrote:wtf???

llama just got onion-rolled:
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Re: Is opposing fascism a form of terrorism?

Postby mrswdk on Thu Sep 14, 2017 3:51 am

thegreekdog wrote:Look, whatever you may think of the United States, we have the First Amendment. It is a near absolute protection of free speech. So even people with whom I vehemently disagree and would very much like to punch get to say pretty much whatever they want. If we start rolling that protection back because we don't like the content of what people are saying, we start going down a slippery slope that could result in Hitler's Germany or Stalin's Soviet Union.


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Re: Is opposing fascism a form of terrorism?

Postby Symmetry on Fri Sep 15, 2017 4:09 pm

thegreekdog wrote:
Symmetry wrote:
thegreekdog wrote:
Symmetry wrote:
thegreekdog wrote:It can be depending on the form it takes. If it takes the form of violent opposition, then yes. Let's say (and this is purely hypothetical), there is a group that is anti-fascist. This group is also anti-capitalist, anti-business, and takes great pains to commit violence in the name of those things (violence against both individuals and property). I know this is purely a hypothetical and there is not actually an organization like this that recently assaulted a number of non-fascists in Berkley recently. But I would call that group a form of domestic terrorists.

Kind of like how certain environmentalists blow up shit... those guys are also terrorists.


It seems like terrorism is a pretty loose term. Violent opposition to fascism is sometimes seen as heroic- the easiest examples obviously being during the second World War-e.g. The Resistance movements in France, or the Warsaw ghetto uprising.

For me, I'd be very wary of how the phrase "domestic terrorists" is used as a label. If violence+ideology= terrorism is really the formula, then you either risk diluting the term "terrorism" into virtual meaninglessness, or quickly find yourself becoming a hypocrite.


Antifa is against Nazism (note - Antifa is not against fascism as they are also fascists). Anfita is also against capitalism and republicanism (i.e. a republican government). I would therefore not call Antifa heroic. But hey, if you are okay with a bunch of people beating up a teenager and his dad for their non-Nazi, non-fascist political views...


I'm pretty sure I didn't say that, TGD.

Maybe, and I'm just going out on a limb here, you might want to rethink what opposing fascism is.


The OP put it in the context of the Trump administration. The Trump administration has (I think) condemned Antifa. Antifa is a terrorist organization if it commits violence as part of its mission. So my initial response is on point. Violence+ideology does equal terrorism if the ideology is not merely "anti-fascism." I think you may want to rethink what Antifa does.


So, any ideology that is not merely anti-fascism becomes terrorism if violence is involved? Or are you trying to make a special case for anti-fascist protesters who stray only primarily oppose fascism, but have other motives too? Isn't that like condemning vegetarianism "'Cause Hitler was a veggie"?

It's a little difficult to get a handle on what you're trying to say here, tbh.

I don't think your formula really stands up to scrutiny.
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