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Spiking The Ball = Intentional Grounding?
Posted:
Mon Sep 21, 2009 10:46 pmby HapSmo19
Tackling the tough issues.....
"Intentional Grounding of Forward Pass
Intentional grounding of a forward pass is a foul: loss of down and 10 yards from previous spot if passer is in the field of play or loss of down at the spot of the foul if it occurs more than 10 yards behind the line or safety if passer is in his own end zone when ball is released.
Intentional grounding will be called when a passer, facing an imminent loss of yardage due to pressure from the defense, throws a forward pass without a realistic chance of completion.
Intentional grounding will not be called when a passer, while out of the pocket and facing an imminent loss of yardage, throws a pass that lands at or beyond the line of scrimmage, even if no offensive player(s) have a realistic chance to catch the ball (including if the ball lands out of bounds over the sideline or end line)."
It's always bothered me since the grounding rule came in. How can you have an intentional grounding rule and not call it against the spike?
It's stupid. I vote to change it.
Re: Spiking The Ball = Intentional Grounding?
Posted:
Mon Sep 21, 2009 10:53 pmby Frigidus
I believe that it doesn't count because the ball lands within a reasonable distance of a receiver (maybe a RB or TE).
Re: Spiking The Ball = Intentional Grounding?
Posted:
Mon Sep 21, 2009 10:59 pmby spurgistan
For one thing, yeah, it's usually at the feet of the RB. For another thing, the QB is generally not "facing an imminent loss of yardage"
Re: Spiking The Ball = Intentional Grounding?
Posted:
Mon Sep 21, 2009 11:01 pmby HapSmo19
Frigidus wrote:I believe that it doesn't count because the ball lands within a reasonable distance of a receiver (maybe a RB or TE).
Hmmm....
"Intentional grounding will be called when a passer, facing an imminent loss of yardage due to pressure from the defense, throws a forward pass without a realistic chance of completion."I'd say there's no realistic chance of it being caught.
Re: Spiking The Ball = Intentional Grounding?
Posted:
Mon Sep 21, 2009 11:05 pmby HapSmo19
spurgistan wrote:For one thing, yeah, it's usually at the feet of the RB.
The RB is behind the QB.
Re: Spiking The Ball = Intentional Grounding?
Posted:
Mon Sep 21, 2009 11:10 pmby oVo
As a rule, spiking the ball and sacrificing a down to stop the clock is a part of the game like anything else. Similar to the College rule that doesn't allow a quarterback to "fake" taking a knee and pretend that a play is over. Don't like it? Change the rule.
Intentional grounding is when the passer is caught "in the pocket" and throws a pass to an open part of the field --with no receiver in the area-- to avoid a sack. New rules allow a passer who has escaped the pocket and gotten outside the offensive tackle position to legally throw the ball away, as long as the forward pass crosses the line of scrimmage.
Spiking the ball and intentional grounding are completely unrelated.
Re: Spiking The Ball = Intentional Grounding?
Posted:
Mon Sep 21, 2009 11:12 pmby strike wolf
The Spiked ball is used as a quick way to stop the clock. you can't say there is an imminent loss of yards because there is no proof that they will lose yards. Second, even when it should intentional grounding does not get called that often. And when they say there's no realistic chance, I believe they actually go by how far it is from the nearest possible receiver.
Re: Spiking The Ball = Intentional Grounding?
Posted:
Mon Sep 21, 2009 11:19 pmby HapSmo19
strike wolf wrote:you can't say there is an imminent loss of yards because there is no proof that they will lose yards...
Then why do they spike the ball and opt to lose a down? Why don't they just run another play and save the down and the two seconds it takes to spike the ball if they're not in danger of losing yards?
Re: Spiking The Drink = Intentional Scoring?
Posted:
Mon Sep 21, 2009 11:40 pmby jonka
I would like to see it become intentional grounding, teams would need more discipline to pull off a big play quickly.
Re: Spiking The Drink = Intentional Scoring?
Posted:
Mon Sep 21, 2009 11:41 pmby jonka
I would like to see it become intentional grounding, teams would need more discipline to pull off a big play quickly, and I'd love anything to make football players have to practice harder.
Edit: Why did I quote myself
Re: Spiking The Ball = Intentional Grounding?
Posted:
Mon Sep 21, 2009 11:43 pmby Night Strike
HapSmo19 wrote:strike wolf wrote:you can't say there is an imminent loss of yards because there is no proof that they will lose yards...
Then why do they spike the ball and opt to lose a down? Why don't they just run another play and save the down and the two seconds it takes to spike the ball if they're not in danger of losing yards?
Because it's much quicker to set your offense to just hike and spike, then to call out the next play as your running. It's only used late in each half, and even then only while you're using, so it's not
that common of an occurrence.
Re: Spiking The Ball = Intentional Grounding?
Posted:
Mon Sep 21, 2009 11:47 pmby HapSmo19
Night Strike wrote:Because it's much quicker to set your offense to just hike and spike, then to call out the next play as your running. It's only used late in each half, and even then only while you're using, so it's not that common of an occurrence.
What are time-outs for again?
Re: Spiking The Ball = Intentional Grounding?
Posted:
Mon Sep 21, 2009 11:50 pmby strike wolf
HapSmo19 wrote:strike wolf wrote:you can't say there is an imminent loss of yards because there is no proof that they will lose yards...
Then why do they spike the ball and opt to lose a down? Why don't they just run another play and save the down and the two seconds it takes to spike the ball if they're not in danger of losing yards?
because a play takes longer than spiking the ball. You spike the ball when you are running out of time have no time outs but don't have enouhg time to set up and run a play. So you spike the ball to buy time.
Re: Spiking The Ball = Intentional Grounding?
Posted:
Mon Sep 21, 2009 11:53 pmby whitestazn88
its not intentional grounding because the pass doesn't cross the line of scrimmage
at least thats my take on it from reading the rules
Re: Spiking The Ball = Intentional Grounding?
Posted:
Mon Sep 21, 2009 11:59 pmby HapSmo19
whitestazn88 wrote:its not intentional grounding because the pass doesn't cross the line of scrimmage
at least thats my take on it from reading the rules
Intentional grounding will not be called when a passer, while out of the pocket and facing an imminent loss of yardage, throws a pass that lands at or beyond the line of scrimmage
Re: Spiking The Ball = Intentional Grounding?
Posted:
Tue Sep 22, 2009 12:04 amby oVo
Each team has 3 time outs per half. Once those are gone only an incomplete pass, running out of bounds or spiking the ball can stop the clock. There are injury time outs (called by the referee) but the affected players have to sit out for a play.
In college ball... the clock also stops with every first down made,
until the down markers are reset.
Spiking the ball is all about saving clock time at the end of each half.
It's not intentional grounding because it is a rule and part of the game.
Another recent rule change... when a player with the ball is driven backwards out of bounds,
he is given the forward progress on the field and the clock keeps running.
Re: Spiking The Ball = Intentional Grounding?
Posted:
Tue Sep 22, 2009 12:36 amby Army of GOD
Alls I remember is playing every Madden game, about to get sacked and pressing triangle sin hope to some sort of greater being that intentional grounding will not be called.
It always was.
Re: Spiking The Ball = Intentional Grounding?
Posted:
Tue Sep 22, 2009 8:30 amby jay_a2j
A "spike" does not go past the line of scrimmage. Intentional grounding is a forward pass (beyond the line of scrimmage) with no receiver in the area, while inside the pocket.
Re: Spiking The Ball = Intentional Grounding?
Posted:
Tue Sep 22, 2009 8:33 amby thegreekdog
Here's your answer my man:
"Intentional grounding will be called when a passer, facing an imminent loss of yardage due to pressure from the defense throws a forward pass without a realistic chance of completion."
In a situation where a QB is trying to stop the clock, he is not facing an imminent loss of yardage due to pressure from the defense.
Re: Spiking The Ball = Intentional Grounding?
Posted:
Tue Sep 22, 2009 12:29 pmby HapSmo19
thegreekdog wrote:Here's your answer my man:
"Intentional grounding will be called when a passer, facing an imminent loss of yardage due to pressure from the defense throws a forward pass without a realistic chance of completion."
In a situation where a QB is trying to stop the clock, he is not facing an imminent loss of yardage due to pressure from the defense.
Yeah, there's just something about it that I dont like though. If I was commisioner, I'd give em two more time-outs and make spiking it intentional grounding(loss of down and a five(?) yard penalty).
Re: Spiking The Ball = Intentional Grounding?
Posted:
Tue Sep 22, 2009 12:30 pmby thegreekdog
Not me. The ability to spike the ball provides some drama to the end of the game. Further, the ability to FAKE spiking the ball is also a good thing for football.
Re: Spiking The Ball = Intentional Grounding?
Posted:
Tue Sep 22, 2009 5:33 pmby oVo
The fake spike (or faking taking a knee) only occurs in pro games.
Showing the intent to do either ends the play in college ball.
Re: Spiking The Ball = Intentional Grounding?
Posted:
Tue Sep 22, 2009 7:35 pmby spurgistan
HapSmo19 wrote:thegreekdog wrote:Here's your answer my man:
"Intentional grounding will be called when a passer, facing an imminent loss of yardage due to pressure from the defense throws a forward pass without a realistic chance of completion."
In a situation where a QB is trying to stop the clock, he is not facing an imminent loss of yardage due to pressure from the defense.
Yeah, there's just something about it that I dont like though. If I was commisioner, I'd give em two more time-outs and make spiking it intentional grounding(loss of down and a five(?) yard penalty).
But what's wrong with it? Good call on the RB thing, though.
Re: Spiking The Ball = Intentional Grounding?
Posted:
Tue Sep 22, 2009 7:50 pmby AgentSmith88
spurgistan wrote:For one thing, yeah, it's usually at the feet of the RB. For another thing, the QB is generally not "facing an imminent loss of yardage"
Re: Spiking The Ball = Intentional Grounding?
Posted:
Tue Sep 22, 2009 8:01 pmby HapSmo19
spurgistan wrote:But what's wrong with it?
Well, the QB can throw the ball away to stop the clock and give his team a chance to win the game but he can't throw it away to avoid the sack. It's just kinda stupid.
I need to check if they put an asterisk next to defensive player sack-stats since the intentional grounding rule came in. Because they should've.