Call to Quorum

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Call to Quorum

Postby oaktown on Fri Apr 18, 2008 12:14 am

The recent concern over the fact that maps may be getting through the Foundry with a minimum of support led me to this idea: the creation of a Foundry Call to Quorum system.

It would work something like this: a map gets through Ideas, is stamped for Graphics and Game Play, and is poised to move on. Before Andy will Forge the map, the mapmaker should make a Foundry Call to Quorum by posting a Quorum Call announcement and PMing those who have volunteered to be included in the Quorum. The Quorum will then visit the map and give feedback that is honest, constructive, and, if necessary, sobering. If the comments are largely positive, it is a clear sign to Andy that the map is Forge ready. If at this point the comments are negative - or if nobody shows up - it is a clear sign to Andy that the map lacks support.

This wouldn't necessarily have to be a formal part of the process, but more of a rite of passage (edited). We would begin by collecting the names of those Foundry regulars who would be willing to participate in future Quorum Calls by receiving a PM and visiting the map thread. If we get enough interested members, we could draft a standardized Call to Quorum announcement, and try it out on the next map that looks like it's on the verge of being Forged.

Edit: I've withdrawn this idea for a better one suggested below... read on! :)
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Re: Call to Quorum

Postby TaCktiX on Fri Apr 18, 2008 12:19 am

Quick edit: RITE of passage. I love the phrase so much I noticed that.

As for the idea, I think it could work for some maps. I personally wouldn't mind being on the list of Quorum folks to give my .02 for the map, and I generally try to give good constructive feedback.
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Re: Call to Quorum

Postby edbeard on Fri Apr 18, 2008 12:23 am

I don't like it

Haven't we said that foundry regulars aren't really representative of CC as a whole?

It seems like this would only turn things more into that direction.


I think things are going fine currently. We're sending along maps that deserve to be moved. The only exceptions are a few maps that have been in Final Forge for a couple months now with no end in sight. Those should be moved to the main foundry (or put on vacation). Any overhauling of those maps should mean a move to the main foundry so more people will see it.
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Re: Call to Quorum

Postby oaktown on Fri Apr 18, 2008 12:29 am

edbeard wrote:Haven't we said that foundry regulars aren't really representative of CC as a whole?

It seems like this would only turn things more into that direction.

Perhaps, but it seems more democratic than letting one person decide the fate of a map. Think of this as the mapmaker calling in a drive-by on his own maps. And the Quorum wouldn't have to include only Foundry regulars - anybody willing to participate can add his name to the list.

edbeard wrote:I think things are going fine currently. We're sending along maps that deserve to be moved.

I tend to agree with you here.
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Re: Call to Quorum

Postby wcaclimbing on Fri Apr 18, 2008 12:37 am

what if there was a special page that, along with the "map information page" that is yet to be released, this page would detail all of the final forge maps. It could pull up some more inerest in the late stages of map-making, and it would help bring in some non-foundry regulars to see a few maps.
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Re: Call to Quorum

Postby MrBenn on Fri Apr 18, 2008 4:20 am

I like the principle of the idea...
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Re: Call to Quorum

Postby Ruben Cassar on Fri Apr 18, 2008 4:34 am

edbeard wrote:I don't like it

Haven't we said that foundry regulars aren't really representative of CC as a whole?

It seems like this would only turn things more into that direction.


I think things are going fine currently. We're sending along maps that deserve to be moved. The only exceptions are a few maps that have been in Final Forge for a couple months now with no end in sight. Those should be moved to the main foundry (or put on vacation). Any overhauling of those maps should mean a move to the main foundry so more people will see it.


I agree with edbeard.
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Re: Call to Quorum

Postby bryguy on Fri Apr 18, 2008 7:14 am

im confused, whats a Quorum?
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Re: Call to Quorum

Postby DiM on Fri Apr 18, 2008 7:25 am

i agree with the idea of asking people to visit a certain map prior to final forge but i don't agree with selecting a few to come and give this map the right to pass. why? because it makes matters too personal and certain pressures will be put on those that are selected.

let's say my map is about to be forged. and ed bryguy and cairns are in the "passing group" they are called and i see a day passes and they don't show up. that would mean they have no interest in my map so i start pm-ing them asking then to be a good sport and stop by. out of courtesy and perhaps fear to hurt my feelings they will drop by and leave some neutral comments. map goes forward. that's bad.

what i would do is make an announcement at the top of the main foundry and there i would post maps that are about to be forged if support is proven. and ask people to stop by those maps and give their 2 cents. people show up map is improved and moves forward, people don't come map is abandoned.

right now if a map sits with no feedback it means it's either unpopular or it's ready for forge but that decision is sometimes very hard to take. by asking the general population of the foundry to come share their thoughts the decision would be very simple.


@bryguy: Quorum=The minimum number of members required for a group to officially conduct business and to cast binding votes, often but not necessarily a majority or supermajority.
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Re: Call to Quorum

Postby bryguy on Fri Apr 18, 2008 7:28 am

DiM wrote:i agree with the idea of asking people to visit a certain map prior to final forge but i don't agree with selecting a few to come and give this map the right to pass. why? because it makes matters too personal and certain pressures will be put on those that are selected.

let's say my map is about to be forged. and ed bryguy and cairns are in the "passing group" they are called and i see a day passes and they don't show up. that would mean they have no interest in my map so i start pm-ing them asking then to be a good sport and stop by. out of courtesy and perhaps fear to hurt my feelings they will drop by and leave some neutral comments. map goes forward. that's bad.


you sayin i dont show up? i try to comment on any map i can! (that is not the same as spamming)

DiM wrote:what i would do is make an announcement at the top of the main foundry and there i would post maps that are about to be forged if support is proven. and ask people to stop by those maps and give their 2 cents. people show up map is improved and moves forward, people don't come map is abandoned.

right now if a map sits with no feedback it means it's either unpopular or it's ready for forge but that decision is sometimes very hard to take. by asking the general population of the foundry to come share their thoughts the decision would be very simple.


I like that idea, but not the abandoned part

p.s edited 2 times for fixing the quotes, a third to add this in
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Re: Call to Quorum

Postby shadowsteel9 on Fri Apr 18, 2008 8:02 am

I like oaktown's idea, but another way you could look at it is, if the map's going to forge soon, then have them just stickify it for a few days, a week maybe, and if it gets enough support move it. much like the map ideas sticky
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Re: Call to Quorum

Postby yeti_c on Fri Apr 18, 2008 8:04 am

shadowsteel9 wrote:I like oaktown's idea, but another way you could look at it is, if the map's going to forge soon, then have them just stickify it for a few days, a week maybe, and if it gets enough support move it. much like the map ideas sticky


Sticky in the main foundry?

Hmmm - that works for me actually...

When a map has all it's stamps - then sticky it...

This helps
a) Founryites to see that it's almost ready.
b) Andy - to see what maps have achieved their stamps.

C.
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Re: Call to Quorum

Postby shadowsteel9 on Fri Apr 18, 2008 8:08 am

yeti_c wrote:
shadowsteel9 wrote:I like oaktown's idea, but another way you could look at it is, if the map's going to forge soon, then have them just stickify it for a few days, a week maybe, and if it gets enough support move it. much like the map ideas sticky


Sticky in the main foundry?

Hmmm - that works for me actually...

When a map has all it's stamps - then sticky it...

This helps
a) Founryites to see that it's almost ready.
b) Andy - to see what maps have achieved their stamps.

C.

all stamps i think except for XML
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Re: Call to Quorum

Postby yeti_c on Fri Apr 18, 2008 8:09 am

shadowsteel9 wrote:
yeti_c wrote:
shadowsteel9 wrote:I like oaktown's idea, but another way you could look at it is, if the map's going to forge soon, then have them just stickify it for a few days, a week maybe, and if it gets enough support move it. much like the map ideas sticky


Sticky in the main foundry?

Hmmm - that works for me actually...

When a map has all it's stamps - then sticky it...

This helps
a) Founryites to see that it's almost ready.
b) Andy - to see what maps have achieved their stamps.

C.

all stamps i think except for XML


XML is an FF stamp.

C.
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Re: Call to Quorum

Postby MrBenn on Fri Apr 18, 2008 8:15 am

I like the sticky idea a little more than the quorum one.

We might still haev the same problem though - what happens if the map gets no support while it's sticky? Does it stay a sticky forever (like Conqueropoly/Spaceness), or will it be 'unstickied' ?
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Re: Call to Quorum

Postby oaktown on Fri Apr 18, 2008 8:20 am

MrBenn wrote:I like the sticky idea a little more than the quorum one.

I agree. I withdraw my suggestion.

MrBenn wrote:We might still haev the same problem though - what happens if the map gets no support while it's sticky? Does it stay a sticky forever (like Conqueropoly/Spaceness), or will it be 'unstickied' ?

Gimil has begun un-stickying maps in Ideas that sit around for too long. We would do the same in the Main Foundry, and plan to do the same for the Forge.
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Re: Call to Quorum

Postby DiM on Fri Apr 18, 2008 10:43 am

MrBenn wrote:We might still haev the same problem though - what happens if the map gets no support while it's sticky? Does it stay a sticky forever (like Conqueropoly/Spaceness), or will it be 'unstickied' ?


i don't think that's a problem because the answer is pretty obvious.
1. map is abandoned
2. map is stripped of all stamps and moves back to ideas for a full make-over. graphics gameplay etc.
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Re: Call to Quorum

Postby DiM on Fri Apr 18, 2008 10:56 am

oaktown wrote:
MrBenn wrote:We might still haev the same problem though - what happens if the map gets no support while it's sticky? Does it stay a sticky forever (like Conqueropoly/Spaceness), or will it be 'unstickied' ?

Gimil has begun un-stickying maps in Ideas that sit around for too long. We would do the same in the Main Foundry, and plan to do the same for the Forge.


and how does unstickying help??

let's say a map is stickied in the main foundry prior to forging. a week or a month passes and nobody comments. the cartos decide the map has no support and the map starts falling down the foundry until it is forgotten. sure that's the theory, but what happens when you have a map maker like qwert that keeps posting to bump his map and keep it on top. in ardennes he has lots of such posts bumping the map even from page 2. sure it's understandable because it's his work and he doesn't want to let it die. but still what can be done in such situations?

that's why i suggest 2 options for the map maker:

1. map is abandoned
2. map is stripped of all stamps and moves back to ideas for a full make-over. graphics gameplay etc.
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Re: Call to Quorum

Postby RjBeals on Fri Apr 18, 2008 11:17 am

OOO.. Nice idea oaktown.
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Re: Call to Quorum

Postby Qwert on Fri Apr 18, 2008 2:46 pm

and how does unstickying help??

let's say a map is stickied in the main foundry prior to forging. a week or a month passes and nobody comments. the cartos decide the map has no support and the map starts falling down the foundry until it is forgotten. sure that's the theory, but what happens when you have a map maker like qwert that keeps posting to bump his map and keep it on top. in ardennes he has lots of such posts bumping the map even from page 2. sure it's understandable because it's his work and he doesn't want to let it die. but still what can be done in such situations?

that's why i suggest 2 options for the map maker:

1. map is abandoned
2. map is stripped of all stamps and moves back to ideas for a full make-over. graphics gameplay etc.

Again you mention mine name.Why i have some feeling that you taking some war against me.
Last topic who people open-Fans Stapm,and these you transform into yours topic-premature forging-.
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Re: Call to Quorum

Postby edbeard on Fri Apr 18, 2008 3:15 pm

it seems like the sticky idea would just make all the previous support a map has gotten go for naught.

I don't see anything wrong with the way things go now
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Re: Call to Quorum

Postby InkL0sed on Fri Apr 18, 2008 11:13 pm

qwert wrote:
and how does unstickying help??

let's say a map is stickied in the main foundry prior to forging. a week or a month passes and nobody comments. the cartos decide the map has no support and the map starts falling down the foundry until it is forgotten. sure that's the theory, but what happens when you have a map maker like qwert that keeps posting to bump his map and keep it on top. in ardennes he has lots of such posts bumping the map even from page 2. sure it's understandable because it's his work and he doesn't want to let it die. but still what can be done in such situations?

that's why i suggest 2 options for the map maker:

1. map is abandoned
2. map is stripped of all stamps and moves back to ideas for a full make-over. graphics gameplay etc.

Again you mention mine name.Why i have some feeling that you taking some war against me.
Last topic who people open-Fans Stapm,and these you transform into yours topic-premature forging-.


DiM has mentioned pretty much every well known map-maker in this thread, including you. I don't think he was attacking you in any way; actually, I think he was being rather complimentary and understanding.
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