The Village of Secrets [GAME OVER] Werewolves Win!

[superkeener]

Official Vote Count 3.4

Anarkistsdream (0):
jak111 (0):
Jmac1026 (3): jak111, virus90, Anarkistsdream
kgb007 (0):
pancakemix (0):
MudPuppy (0):
spiesr (1): Whatsausage
virus90 (0):
L-2 Whatsausage (4): MudPuppy, pancakemix, kgb007, StorrZerg
StorrZerg (0):

No Lynch (0):

Not Voting (2): spiesr, Jmac1026

With 10 alive, it takes 6 votes to lynch.

Deadline for DAY 3 is: Tuesday, April 29, 2014, 10:00am CC Time.

[MudPuppy]

You missed jmac's vote, superkeener... it should be:

Official Vote Count 3.4

Anarkistsdream (0):
jak111 (0):
Jmac1026 (3): jak111, virus90, Anarkistsdream
kgb007 (0):
pancakemix (0):
MudPuppy (0):
spiesr (1): Whatsausage
virus90 (0):
L-1 Whatsausage (4): MudPuppy, pancakemix, kgb007, Jmac1026, StorrZerg
StorrZerg (0):

No Lynch (0):

Not Voting (2): spiesr

With 10 alive, it takes 6 votes to lynch.

Deadline for DAY 3 is: Tuesday, April 29, 2014, 10:00am CC Time.

[MudPuppy]

Nevermind... I missed his unvote. You're good. Sorry.

[MudPuppy]

MP you think there is a connection with sausage and jmac?

If jmac is anti-town there is.
I haven't noticed a connection up to this point but the next time I re-read I'll be on the lookout. Are you suggesting you've noticed one?

What does everyone think of jak's reaction to my claim? I'm trying to be objective in my analysis that his read on me has seemingly taken a big swing for what I think is a trivial reason... but it is very possible I'm a bit biased despite my efforts not to be. I've been working off the premise that jak truly is a pro-town 3P... but I'm becoming less and less sure of that.

[jak111]

Once Sausage flips town, I'll gladly do what needs to be done.

It's scummy MP, because you are constantly pushing on Jmac and say you would like to vote him, but then out of no where you claim to have a guilty on Sausage. That's not holding your cards close, that's completely flipping your choice in a matter of hours that just so happens to be on a roleblocker claim.

For the town, think about it, with a roleblocker gone, one that may have STOPPED a kill from N1. Now a claim to get him killed.

Heck the roleblocker may of even stopped a recruiting N1 or N2.

But no, lets trust the scummy cop claim that just so happens to be on one of our PR claims that may have found a vampire/scum.

pcm is voting Sausage because why not, the "cop" cleared him.

Oh and then everyone is forgetting that Iron Butterfly was trying to constantly lynch Sausage. Hmmm, but let's throw that out the window that a scum was voting him and neither of the scum really ever voted MP. Oh yeah, that bit of detail is quickly cast away, oops.

Finally @pcm. LOL, I even said why I made it a different colour, to tell apart from the list -.- Read what you want will you? If I die I'll just appear orange like regular 3rd parties do.

But no, this quick bandwagon on Sausage with no real thought into it is saddening to see my towniest reads all on him. Then the guy I think is fake claiming VT is the only one that stops it from being a speed hammer. It's a sad day for my reads.

FP'd by MP. You're less and less sure? You know I'm pro-town if you're with the other faction MP. That's why it's hard for you to think else wise. Everyone forgets that Iron Butterfly wanted to lynch Sausage and he was pretty concrete on it as well. My reaction to your poor claim is because you did not think it through. No one has cc'd you yet which I am surprised. But it does not mean it's not a fake claim as well.

[StorrZerg]

MP you think there is a connection with sausage and jmac?

If jmac is anti-town there is.
I haven't noticed a connection up to this point but the next time I re-read I'll be on the lookout. Are you suggesting you've noticed one?

What does everyone think of jak's reaction to my claim? I'm trying to be objective in my analysis that his read on me has seemingly taken a big swing for what I think is a trivial reason... but it is very possible I'm a bit biased despite my efforts not to be. I've been working off the premise that jak truly is a pro-town 3P... but I'm becoming less and less sure of that.

I'm saying jmac was close to going over when that claim was made. So yes I find it worth looking into more so after a flip.

[Jmac1026]

Jak, you pointing that IB wanted to lynch Sausage misses one crucial bit: Mudpuppy said (if I read everything correctly) that Sausage came up "anti-town," not as mafia. IB could have wanted a lynch of him not knowing he was a different third party. He could be one of your "vampires."

Alternatively, he could have been trying to set up a late game play when he could have said "well I was on X scummy player all along, I must not be scum." Unfortunately, there is no way to know now that IB is dead.

[StorrZerg]

Any counter claims to cop? if not....

[Jmac1026]

We should still wait until Whatsausage posts. If anyone sees him browsing the forums and he doesn't post, maybe then.

I'll gladly hammer him he doesn't post in the next 30 hours or so. Its not like I'd lose anything anyway if he flips town, most of town wanting my lynch and all.

[jak111]

Unvote, Vote Spiesr

^ Let me explain.

If I am right, we kill a scum in the day and I can kill MP at night.

If I'm wrong, spiesr said he's something that would not notice being blocked, so I doubt we'd lose much. But then I can kill Sausage in the night.

Either way either our Roleblocker or Cop survives (whichever one is telling the truth).

I in no way condone the lynch of someone this easily with a scummy claim. That's like some random person claiming tracker near the day's end and saying they followed MP to HotShot N2. You guys are believing the claim without question.

FP'd twice. Again, there's a better alternative than lynching our claimed roleblocker. If he dies and flips town, we could be at LYLO and then I have to make every bloody shot count with no misses.

FP'd by Jmac, that's where you're wrong, if he's town, that's a powerful role to lose. A roleblocker can be much more effective than a cop in a potential cult game.

[spiesr]

Oh and then everyone is forgetting that Iron Butterfly was trying to constantly lynch Sausage. Hmmm, but let's throw that out the window that a scum was voting him and neither of the scum really ever voted MP.

With multiple anti-town groups this means even less than usual.

We should still wait until Whatsausage posts. If anyone sees him browsing the forums and he doesn't post, maybe then.

I'll gladly hammer him he doesn't post in the next 30 hours or so. Its not like I'd lose anything anyway if he flips town, most of town wanting my lynch and all.

I wouldn't expect him to post again within that time frame.

Jak, you are linking things up too tightly. As things stand it remains totally possible for both whatsausage and myself to be town and telling the truth. (If you think MudPuppy is really lying that is.) I am not claiming that what whatsausage did not block me, just that he didn't prevent a kill by doing so. Me flipping Town doesn't prove anything beyond that.

[jak111]

Too tightly? Don't you find it odd how NO ONE ELSE is questioning MP's claim? They all hop aboard without a second thought.

spiesr, what is your role worth to town right now? Us losing a roleblocker on a potential cult scenario is devastating at the very least. If this is a cult scenario the cop is basically worthless as each time he clears someone the next night the cult could recruit them.

Perhaps I am wrong, but I find people willing to lynch the claimed roleblocker so quickly and easily to be odd. Roleblockers are powerful roles. Any anti-town would want one dead so they cannot be blocked which is much more effective than even a doc save because no matter who they pick they can't attack/recruit.

As where a doc much find the one they're attacking. Roleblocker is pretty much like a doc that hunts for the killer instead of the target of the killers.

So effectively it's like we're lynching a bloody doc over a scummy cop claim.

[MudPuppy]

I'm saying jmac was close to going over when that claim was made. So yes I find it worth looking into more so after a flip.

Ah, I got you now... Yes, I certainly considered that whatsausage's claim to set up spiesr may have been designed to take pressure off jmac. However, the more jak talks, the more I think jmac may be telling the truth. I am still suspicious of jmac but, again, that is largely based on 1) his push on RD; and 2) jak's "90%" positive scum read on him. The longer jak goes without explaining what it is about jmac that generated that 90% scum read... and the more jak talks about how scummy I am (not from an OMGUS perspective... but from a "wow, that was a big flip-flop you just made" perspective), the more I'm beginning to believe jmac. So, I need to re-read everything from a different viewpoint and see if I can figure out what makes most sense.

Jak, if we lynch sausage tonight AND if he flips anti-town... how do expect town to trust you going forward? If you are not anti-town, you are betting a lot on your newfound scum read of me... a read I can assure you is incorrect. If your theory of me is disproved with an anti-town sausage lynch, what do you intend to do with your action tonight? How do you intend to prove to town that your read of me was just a really bad mistake and not something more sinister??? I know I'll need something more than an "oops, my bad" apology.

We should still wait until Whatsausage posts. If anyone sees him browsing the forums and he doesn't post, maybe then.

I'll gladly hammer him he doesn't post in the next 30 hours or so. Its not like I'd lose anything anyway if he flips town, most of town wanting my lynch and all.

I wouldn't expect him to post again within that time frame.

Sausage's profile shows he was on CC just over an hour ago:

I also know he was on shortly after midnight (after I posted my claim). It doesn't mean he checked the Mafia forum but I bet he did.

[jak111]

You're reading too much into the 90% MP. It's a figure of speech. It's like if I was to say now I am 90% sure this is a bloody wrong lynch. Percentages really do not matter. That's you reading too much into that one thing back on D2 when we had next to nothing.

I can accept being wrong if I am proven so. But I believe I am not. Your claim came JUST in time to save Jmac and/or spiesr from the noose and put another claimed town PR in it.

Perhaps even spiesr AND Jmac are town and you see Sausage as a threat and just want him gone to give your buddies a chance.

I hope pcm comes back in here, saying I am thinking highly of myself. A "cop" that claimed today and has one late "guilty" report on a claimed town PR expects me to bow down to him and apologise for his scummy timing claim? I shot 2 baddies without town's help or input. For all we know you're misdirecting town to a town PR.

Again, I accept I MAY be wrong, but your timing that saves both Jmac and spiesr from the noose is too fishy to completely ignore and sheep in like the others have.

But you want to know how do I expect town to trust me if he flips anti-town? Because I could be making an honest mistake, unlike you. You're either being truthful and made the claim at a point and time I find extremely scummy or you're lying. Unlike you, I am not sure. You already know if you're town or vampire or mafia. I do not. Do not expect me to trust you off your claim alone. Yes, I town-read you up until your claim, but I was completely wrong in how I read you. I read you as a doc. Not as a cop, you claiming cop already messes up the read I originally had on you.

If Sausage, by some miracle does flip town, I wont be shooting at you or spiesr. But, if he does flip town like I believe he will, I will put an arrow right between your eyes before you can flinch and no doc will stop me if Sausage flips what he claims.

If he flips mafia/vampire, I'll have my choice of 6 guys to pick from (well 5 since I 100% believe Anark) ((Oh and 4 if pcm really is town I guess, could be Godfather type role but I'd leave him alone for tonight if Sausage flips mafia)).

virus
Storr
Jmac
kgb

So, if you all believe Sausage is mafia, the 4 of them better make me believe they're town. Because they'll be the litter I choose from.

So before you 4 leave your vote on Sausage, tell me why I shouldn't kill you tonight if Sausage DOES flip mafia?

[jak111]

If Sausage, by some miracle does flip mafia, I wont be shooting at you or spiesr. But, if he does flip town like I believe he will, I will put an arrow right between your eyes before you can flinch and no doc will stop me if Sausage flips what he claims.

EBWOP (Accidentally typed town where I meant to say mafia)

[MudPuppy]

You're reading too much into the 90% MP. It's a figure of speech. It's like if I was to say now I am 90% sure this is a bloody wrong lynch. Percentages really do not matter. That's you reading too much into that one thing back on D2 when we had next to nothing.

Sounds like backtracking to me. Perhaps I'm being too literal but I do not in any way interpret 90% as a mere figure of speech. I work in finance with numbers and percentages and I do take them quite literally. Perhaps you truly didn't mean 90%... but, if that's the case then you most certainly shouldn't have said it.

[StorrZerg]

easy jak. i didnt hammer jmac to end the day. I was clearly on at the time, and was clearly looking for more discussion. + Check my voting and reasoning for this day. I'm pretty straight forward.

Also i'm town you donkey


FP

[MudPuppy]

Yes, I town-read you up until your claim, but I was completely wrong in how I read you. I read you as a doc. Not as a cop, you claiming cop already messes up the read I originally had on you.

What did I say that gave you a doc read on me as opposed to some other member of town? Did you already have someone else pegged as a cop?

[jak111]

You're reading too much into the 90% MP. It's a figure of speech. It's like if I was to say now I am 90% sure this is a bloody wrong lynch. Percentages really do not matter. That's you reading too much into that one thing back on D2 when we had next to nothing.

Sounds like backtracking to me. Perhaps I'm being too literal but I do not in any way interpret 90% as a mere figure of speech. I work in finance with numbers and percentages and I do take them quite literally. Perhaps you truly didn't mean 90%... but, if that's the case then you most certainly shouldn't have said it.

Again, you read way too much into it. This is a game of mafia, either you're 100% sure or you're not. It all comes down to WIFOM. It comes down to whether people believe Sausage stopped a kill/recruitment, it comes down to whether people believe Anark's VT claim, it all comes down to believing other people.

Right now, I do not believe you. I wont until we see what you or sausage flips.

So Storr? Others didn't hammer Jmac as well, heck, if Jmac is scum why would scum hammer? Now you claim you wanted more discussion, Sausage was nearly lynched until Jmac pulled his vote off to allow him some time to speak, there was no discussion there. It was MP claims cop, everyone sheeps him immediately without questioning the claim its self.

FP's by MP. For all I know there is no cop in the game. I just always assume there to be a cop and a doc at least in each game. It is not mandatory for them to be in it.

I had you pegged for doc in the way you cared if Storr was accidentally lynched D1, with your reaction to Anark I believed no way you could be a VT and you just didn't play scummy for the majority of the game. Though all it takes is this one bad claim and my read on you fell apart. To me, you're scum trying to get the town roleblocker lynched. I would not be surprised if there's 1-2 other scum on that bandwagon.

[spiesr]

You're reading too much into the 90% MP. It's a figure of speech. It's like if I was to say now I am 90% sure this is a bloody wrong lynch. Percentages really do not matter. That's you reading too much into that one thing back on D2 when we had next to nothing.

I believe he wants to know why you were so confident when you appear to have not really had anything.

I hope pcm comes back in here, saying I am thinking highly of myself. A "cop" that claimed today and has one late "guilty" report on a claimed town PR expects me to bow down to him and apologise for his scummy timing claim? I shot 2 baddies without town's help or input. For all we know you're misdirecting town to a town PR.

You're non-town, stop acting so high and mighty about it. If your claim is true then you haven't even done a very good job working on claim claimed win condition.

[jak111]

You're reading too much into the 90% MP. It's a figure of speech. It's like if I was to say now I am 90% sure this is a bloody wrong lynch. Percentages really do not matter. That's you reading too much into that one thing back on D2 when we had next to nothing.

I believe he wants to know why you were so confident when you appear to have not really had anything.

It was a gut read. Though then slips the question as to why he put faith into it with nothing else and completely sheeped it so much so he now thinks it's scummy because I'm saying it is not to be taken literally.

Funny how when others do something scummy, you and a few decide to ignore it, but if I say something in a matter of figure of speech it's like holy damn guys we need to keep bringing it up after he answers it about 100 times (again, 100 times, figure of speech).

[MudPuppy]

This is a game of mafia, either you're 100% sure or you're not.

That's not at all the way I play. This is a game of mafia... you can't be 100% sure of anything... there are just varying levels of certainty... and 90% is about as high as it gets.

[StorrZerg]

You're reading too much into the 90% MP. It's a figure of speech. It's like if I was to say now I am 90% sure this is a bloody wrong lynch. Percentages really do not matter. That's you reading too much into that one thing back on D2 when we had next to nothing.

Sounds like backtracking to me. Perhaps I'm being too literal but I do not in any way interpret 90% as a mere figure of speech. I work in finance with numbers and percentages and I do take them quite literally. Perhaps you truly didn't mean 90%... but, if that's the case then you most certainly shouldn't have said it.

Again, you read way too much into it. This is a game of mafia, either you're 100% sure or you're not. It all comes down to WIFOM. It comes down to whether people believe Sausage stopped a kill/recruitment, it comes down to whether people believe Anark's VT claim, it all comes down to believing other people.

Right now, I do not believe you. I wont until we see what you or sausage flips.

So Storr? Others didn't hammer Jmac as well, heck, if Jmac is scum why would scum hammer? Now you claim you wanted more discussion, Sausage was nearly lynched until Jmac pulled his vote off to allow him some time to speak, there was no discussion there. It was MP claims cop, everyone sheeps him immediately without questioning the claim its self.

FP's by MP. For all I know there is no cop in the game. I just always assume there to be a cop and a doc at least in each game. It is not mandatory for them to be in it.

I had you pegged for doc in the way you cared if Storr was accidentally lynched D1, with your reaction to Anark I believed no way you could be a VT and you just didn't play scummy for the majority of the game. Though all it takes is this one bad claim and my read on you fell apart. To me, you're scum trying to get the town roleblocker lynched. I would not be surprised if there's 1-2 other scum on that bandwagon.

Others had not been online when the time was at L-1. There is a reason i pushed onto spiesr, when i did. I felt this lynch was going to be going over a bit to easy, with lack of information in the day + with too many people saying nothing about the lynch.


As far as Jmac vs MP its clearly VERY different. We have a cop claim. If the claim proves to be false, it is easily fixed (lynch MP). This is all very logical and makes it very easy to read the situation. The only reason lynching the red check in this situation would be sketchy would be if it was lylo. I seriously doubt we are at anyway close to lylo with 2 scum dead. There is no claim onto jmac which makes him look bad. There is just people pushing and voicing opinions. (well plenty with lack of opinion) How ever, i pushed onto spiesr when the RB claim, because that makes sense. + at the time i was the second person pushing, and i felt it was a case wroth discussing more, i really found it odd that once that happened, there was no one else willing to look at hat situation, instead it took a cop to claim for something to happen.

Now with the Cop claim, its just logical at this point. He claims the person is anti town, this could be a cult, this could be mafia. We will learn a lot from this lynch. It will tell ALOT about people involved within these circles.

FP.

[jak111]

This is a game of mafia, either you're 100% sure or you're not.

That's not at all the way I play. This is a game of mafia... you can't be 100% sure of anything... there are just varying levels of certainty... and 90% is about as high as it gets.

You can be 100% sure of many things, just never about what others claim. You can be sure if you're a tracker player x visited player y. You can be sure if you're a roleblocker player x cannot visit any player. You can be sure if you're a watcher players x and y visited player z. You can be sure if you attempt a kill and it does not hit the right person or does not kill anyone that you are busdroven or roleblocked.

You can be 100% sure of quite a bit. But again, either you know 100% or you do not know. 10%, 50%, 90% is in the not knowing, but feeling.

Also, you do not answer my new question at you, why did you sheep me with NO other reason and felt confident right up until your off timing claim? You were willing to literally kill Jmac based on something I said D2 in which was a gut feeling and figure of speech.

So why should I trust you MP? What have you done besides sheep me for the majority of D2 and today that makes your claim even remotely believable?

FP'd by Storr

You sheep MP's claim who has been sheeping me for D2 and most of D3. Do you not find the timing of his claim odd? In the midst of two people being up for the noose, over the course of a few REAL days and he's posted many times. He could of called Sausage out the second he claimed roleblocker. He did not. He procrastinated until he could make up a story to take him out.

Again, I might even be wrong about this. But I am the only one willing to look at both possibilities. No one else is bothering what so ever.

We might be at LYLO or MYLO. If they're a cult they could have 3-4 players. Tonight they could grow to 4-5 players (which my kill will put them back down to 3-4 hopefully). But we'll go into the next day with 8 players... if they have 4, it's game over, if they have 3 we have to get every single lynch correct after that with no room for error Including my night kills as well.

Because if they are at 3 tomorrow with 8 alive, we lynch one and I kill one but they recruit one, so we go into D5 with 2v4, again, we must get both kills right and then it would be 1v3, again we must get the kill RIGHT.

If we lynch the wrong person either way today we could go right up to the final 4 in LYLO mode.

[StorrZerg]

In all honesty, unless someone counter claims MP in some way to enlighten the anti town check This lynch is going to happen.
It makes the most logical sense. Again the only way it could be "bad" is if its Lylo. Which i seriously doubt.

If he flips town, then imo Jak shoots MP. Solves that problem.

If he flips Mafia, then there are a few people jak can shoot, but probably not anyone that the anti town role blocker blocked...

The cop will have his options of checks as well.

fp