Version 11.5.1 FRANCE 2.1 - Poll 4

Maps that may be nearing the end of production. Finalize maps here, while testing.

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4) Can adjacent territories attack Foreign Claim. Foreign claim could bombard Paris in return

Poll ended at Sun Jun 08, 2014 5:31 am

Yes
26
76%
No
8
24%
No opinion
0
No votes
 
Total votes : 34

Version 11.5.1 FRANCE 2.1 - Poll 4

Postby Lancelot du Lac on Thu Nov 17, 2011 8:41 am

ImageImage ImageImageImage
Map Name: France 2.1
Mapmaker(s): Lancelot du Lac and Mishalex
Number of Territories: 95 territories on 22 regions + 5 foreign's territories
Special Features:Starting neutrals, autodeploy, partial bonuses, victory condition
What Makes This Map Worthy of Being Made: This map contains the true geography of France while giving a fun gameplay. Combine business and pleasure ;)
--------------------------------
Neutral (19 territories)
    - territories starts 3 troops neutral : Savoie, Haut-Rhin, Pas de Calais, Corse du Sud, Eure, Vendée, Belfort
    - territories starts 2 troops neutral : Corrèze, Manche, Oise
    - Paris (1) starts 10 troops neutral.
    - Suburbus (2) (3) (4) starts 5 troops neutral
    - Foreign claims starts 3 troops neutral : Pays-Basque, Catalogne, Monaco, Jura Suisse, Wallonie
--------------------------------
Last update
VERSION 11.5.1
1. Map Name France 2.1
2. Version 11.5 [16 October 2013]
3. Dimension : 915 * 927
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Last edited by Lancelot du Lac on Mon May 19, 2014 5:37 am, edited 166 times in total.
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Re: MAP FRANCE

Postby betiko on Thu Nov 17, 2011 9:34 am

I ve got to say it s pretty ugly and regions are inacurate; but the regions must have been re-imagined for gameplay I guess.
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Re: MAP FRANCE

Postby Lancelot du Lac on Thu Nov 17, 2011 9:46 am

We must respect the gameplay while respecting French geography I suppose?
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Re: MAP FRANCE

Postby betiko on Thu Nov 17, 2011 10:02 am

Lancelot du Lac wrote:We must respect the gameplay while respecting French geography I suppose?


i beleive very few maps respect the actual real life geography in CC. I beleive that when hasbro created risk they didn t shape country/regions based on actual geographical realities. you are free to create a new french map based on it's actual regions.
The mountains are fake as well, this map has been created for a certain gameplay and strategy, if the real geography of a map makes a game unbalanced, gameplay will be more important than actual geography, we are just stating the obvious.
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Re: MAP FRANCE

Postby natty dread on Thu Nov 17, 2011 10:30 am

Yeah, actual geographical accuracy is subservient to gameplay balance. That's like the second rule of mapmaking or something.

So, two things:

1) the current France map won't be changed, other than possibly graphically if a revamp happens, but even that would require permission from the original mapmaker. If the original mapmaker is no longer on the site, then it simply won't be changed period.

2) if you want to make a new France map, it will have to be significantly different in gameplay and theme from the existing France maps. Other than that, there's nothing stopping you from making one.
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Re: MAP FRANCE

Postby Lancelot du Lac on Fri Nov 18, 2011 3:38 am

Great!

I am ready to redraw a map of France. Called me just what precautions should I take. Which format do you want this card is drawn?
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Re: MAP FRANCE

Postby thenobodies80 on Fri Nov 18, 2011 5:20 am

If you want to start with a new version of the map of france you can discuss your idea into this topic that I'm going to move into the Ideas Subforum so you don't have to start a new one. Once you have support for your map idea and a working draft, your topic will be moved into the drafting room by one of the Foundry Mods.
For some info about how to develope a map project and how it progress through the foundry process you can look our Handbook.

Instead, if you want to revamp the current france map, first of all you need the approval of the original mapmaker. When you have the approval please develope a quick draft and send it to me via PM explaining what you're going to change (gameplay, graphics?), so we can check the changes and decide what is the more appropriate "starting point" for that map.

Said that I strongly suggest you to develope a new project because revamps are usually a pain to complete, specially if this is your first attempt to produce a map.

Feel free to send me a PM if you need more info. ;)
Good Luck and welcome to the jungle Foundry!

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Re: MAP FRANCE

Postby Lancelot du Lac on Fri Nov 18, 2011 11:06 am

Ok, thank you for this information.

I'll try to explain my ideas in broken English. Sorry if I'm not very understandable. For me the English language is: Where is my umbrella. Bryan is in the kitchen. So please tell me if you do not understand.

First of all, I think redraw a map with the true French regions (there are 22) and departments within these regions (numbering around 93). I also think adding the "overseas territories" that correspond to regions overseas (Guadeloupe, Martinique ...).

I understand that for the game, we set up barriers so that all borders are not adjacent. There are of course natural barriers are easy to set up such as mountains, rivers and seas.

Here is one about the emergence of the idea.

What do you think?
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Re: MAP FRANCE

Postby Flapcake on Sat Nov 19, 2011 1:04 pm

I think that's cool that you want to create a map of your home country, it was also what got me started in my first draft, where my idea was that it would reflect my country as much as possible. I can now, when I look back see that it was hopeless, the gameplay and the country's natural geography did not go up in a right unit, and since gameplay is the most important for a map, that it may seem both exciting and within its limits (XML) then I found out (with lots of solid support from the Foundry) that one should start with gameplay, and then build his map / idea around.
Your obvious choice is to make the map france, start with how could an exciting gameplay look like, then Find out how should your map look like.
just throw yourself into the project, there are plenty of good advice and constructive criticism to get in the Foundry, if you're willing to listen and sometimes follow the advice / criticism, then you cant fail :)

P.S. dont mind your english, I sound like Arnold Schwarzenegger in hes first movie :shock:
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Re: MAP FRANCE

Postby Industrial Helix on Sun Nov 20, 2011 8:15 pm

I would like to see another map of France, so you have my support! The France map is kind of bland and incorrect imo... France 1789 doesn't really depict France in 1789 (because it shows Nice and Savoy as part of France, and they weren't until the 1860s, I believe, maybe 1870s)
Lancelot du Lac, I speak a little French, so I can perhaps help you out there. PM me if you're interested and maybe we can communicate over MSN or some other instant messenger. Also I can help with other map making queries. I think making a map works much better when you have someone there to answer questions quickly rather than waiting for a post to be answered.
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Re: MAP FRANCE

Postby thehippo8 on Mon Nov 21, 2011 3:47 am

Looking forward to this ... but heed Natty's words ... gameplay is the most important thing. Get a piece of paper and draw your map on it ... even try playing with tokens on it if you like ... but try and visualise what the players are doing and why. If you are going for geographical accuracy you may want to consider collecting landmarks or you may want to combine the geographical with historical or sociological features ... many ideas!
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Re: MAP FRANCE

Postby Lancelot du Lac on Mon Nov 21, 2011 10:47 am

Hi all,

Here is a first job can you give me your comments. Thank you.

Lancelot

UPDATE FIRST MESSAGE
Last edited by Lancelot du Lac on Mon Nov 21, 2011 6:13 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: MAP FRANCE

Postby Industrial Helix on Mon Nov 21, 2011 11:50 am

I smell a supersize stamp application.... do so here: viewtopic.php?f=583&t=151326

I would suggest using a vblock of color to indcate what regions are worth what. While you are completely familiar with the regions.. most CC people are not.

Check this out as well, it well tell you what the requirements are for a map. Also, you should post the latest map version on the first post and edit the title to say when the latest update was, use the edit button when you look at the first post, upper right side: viewtopic.php?f=649&t=150681

Ok, this might help...Every mapmaker needs to make two maps.. a large and small one
Small: 630x600 pixels
Large: 840x800pixels
Supersize Small:1000x800 pixels
Supersize Large:1400x1200 pixels

Since the level of detail you are attempting to make is going to require you to go more than the large map size, you will need to make sure your map fits within the supersize limits. Once it is in the supersize limits, apply for the supersize stamp.
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Re: MAP FRANCE

Postby Lancelot du Lac on Tue Nov 22, 2011 5:19 pm

Here is a latest update (first post), can you continue to give me your comments.
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Re: MAP FRANCE

Postby isaiah40 on Wed Nov 23, 2011 2:50 am

I have viewed your Supersize application and will review it next week when my Thanksgiving holiday and wedding anniversary is over with. So please have some patience and I will get to it.

J'ai vu votre application Supersize et l'examinera la semaine prochaine quand mes vacances de Thanksgiving et anniversaire de mariage est fini. Alors s'il vous plaît avoir de la patience et je vais y arriver.
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Re: MAP FRANCE

Postby Lancelot du Lac on Wed Nov 23, 2011 3:27 am

ok thanks you. Great holydays
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Re: MAP FRANCE

Postby pamoa on Thu Dec 01, 2011 11:18 am

Title suggestion
France 2.0
as it is larger than the actual one

gameplay
overlaping bonuses are fine to me
but Paris as killer neutral can't be overruled by a bonus as you want it to do
the "umbrella" effect is good (Paris as centre which can attack terrorist which can attack the border of the map)
maybe with a 10 neutral it will slow enough the game and be balanced enough
de gueules à la tour d'argent ouverte, crénelée de trois pièces, sommée d'un donjon ajouré, crénelé de deux pièces
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Re: MAP FRANCE

Postby isaiah40 on Wed Dec 07, 2011 12:38 am

Lancelot, before I approve your application for supersize I would like to see an update at the size requested so I can determine if it is needed. AS for going 1400x1200, I would suggest going 1400x1120, this way when you shrink the map down it will be at 1000x800 the max size for the supersize small.
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Re: MAP FRANCE

Postby Lancelot du Lac on Thu Dec 08, 2011 1:59 pm

Ok, here is the requested update on the first message. Dimensions in pixels: 990 x 1400
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Re: MAP FRANCE

Postby isaiah40 on Thu Dec 08, 2011 3:13 pm

Lancelot du Lac wrote:Ok, here is the requested update on the first message. Dimensions in pixels: 990 x 1400


Sorry but the max height is 1200 on the large. You can make the map 990x1200. Please use the BigImg tag to place your image in do that your medals and such do not cover the map.
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Re: MAP FRANCE

Postby Lancelot du Lac on Thu Dec 08, 2011 4:51 pm

Here are the requested changes:

height : 1200
width : 849

Is this correct?

Lancelot
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Re: MAP FRANCE

Postby isaiah40 on Thu Dec 08, 2011 11:28 pm

Lancelot du Lac wrote:Here are the requested changes:

height : 1200
width : 849

Is this correct?

Lancelot


Yes the height is correct.
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Re: MAP FRANCE

Postby Lancelot du Lac on Mon Dec 12, 2011 5:17 pm

Version 3 is available on the first topic.

Can you tell me what you think?

Thank you
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Re: MAP FRANCE

Postby Mishalex on Mon Dec 12, 2011 5:40 pm

Great job, i can't wait for testing it
Still missing, a winning condition like:
Hold Paris all the foreign claims + one regional claim for one turn to win the game

or

Hold Bretagne + Normandie + Corse + Savoie to win the game
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Re: MAP FRANCE

Postby Industrial Helix on Mon Dec 12, 2011 6:53 pm

i beleive very few maps respect the actual real life geography in CC. I beleive that when hasbro created risk they didn t shape country/regions based on actual geographical realities. you are free to create a new french map based on it's actual regions.
The mountains are fake as well, this map has been created for a certain gameplay and strategy, if the real geography of a map makes a game unbalanced, gameplay will be more important than actual geography, we are just stating the obvious.


Actually, the hasblo Risk map is based on the world at the time of Napoleon, hence all those general geographies. But yeah, geography needs to give way to gameplay... but that doesn't mean that you can't do a geographically accurate map, or at least be close.

Speaking of altering borders... where do you intend to put the army numbers for Paris, Haut-de-Seine, Val-de-marne and Seine-Saint-Denis? you're going to have to make some more room for them to fit. Your borders won't be 100% accurate then, but if you keep the general shape of the line, it won't be that bad, I think.
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