[Rules/MED] Cheaters should be stripped of medals [Rejected]

[Finsfleet]

And the Drama Queen award goes to....
*drumroll*



Finsfleet!

you say it like it`s a bad thing.

[koontz1973]

Losing all your medals over one Secret Diplomacy case does seem incredibly harsh, yeah, particularly things like mapmaker medals and tournament contributions.

Things like this should be exempt. You cannot cheat with these ones.

This could be a level of punishment just before the bans. So you get:

• Warnings
• Medals stripped
• Ban

The C&A mods know what punishments they can hand out so it would be up to them where to slot this into their scale of things.

[Funkyterrance]

Losing all your medals over one Secret Diplomacy case does seem incredibly harsh, yeah, particularly things like mapmaker medals and tournament contributions.

Things like this should be exempt. You cannot cheat with these ones.

This could be a level of punishment just before the bans. So you get:

• Warnings
• Medals stripped
• Ban

The C&A mods know what punishments they can hand out so it would be up to them where to slot this into their scale of things.

I dunno guys, the whole stripping process is meant to be harsh. I don't think it's a matter of which medal you got for which; it's got to be all or nothing or else no one will take it seriously. There can't be any "safe" areas if this suggestion is going to be effective. It's all about humbling the person, not taking away their shiny bits.

[Symmetry]

Losing all your medals over one Secret Diplomacy case does seem incredibly harsh, yeah, particularly things like mapmaker medals and tournament contributions.

Things like this should be exempt. You cannot cheat with these ones.

This could be a level of punishment just before the bans. So you get:

• Warnings
• Medals stripped
• Ban

The C&A mods know what punishments they can hand out so it would be up to them where to slot this into their scale of things.

That's my take on it too. Medals awarded for gameplay.

[agentcom]

I know this thread is getting long, but I will clarify the reason why a point "reset" will not be used. A point reset (back to 1000) points does hurt the offending user. It will take them a while to get back even if they get more points per game initially. But the issue is that it hurts the people they play against. This "private" that suffered the point reset presumably has some skills beyond those of a private. So, the next several players who play against the "private" suffer higher losses and are awarded fewer points than otherwise would have happened. A better solution would be a point "penalty" which attempts to put the offending user back to the level s/he would have been at without the cheating. Of course, there are problems with that too, which pretty much boil down to a subjectivity/objectivity debate. Do we set a specific one-size-fits-all point penalty for certain infractions (objective penalties), which may punish users inequitably in specific instances? Or do we have the penalty decided on a case-by-case basis (subjective penalties), which increases workload for mods and opens the door for criticism in every case.

[koontz1973]

If you want a point penalty, just knock them down 1 rank in points or have a 10% reduction. Which ever one is the greater loss.

[Arama86n]

Who have been the most famous or most infmaous multi accounts and what were their user names?

We're talking about *manimal in another thread, but I remember duality (Mad Pineapples), Benjikat, Blitzaholic, and PInocheckio. JeffHardy, Fredviii

BexXx

I was reading the "infamous multies" thread by beckytheblondie in general discussions, when something caught my eye. Benjikat, here claimed to be the multi of Blitzaholic, has played 1700+ games, yet has ONE medal, a special contribution medal. Didn't they hand out medals for standard/dubs/trips/quads/ in 2008, or was he stripped of his medals?
in which case, this HAS been done before!?
(my point being that is is impossible to play 1700+ games, win 50%, and not have bronze medals in standard or whatever type of game he played)

[SirSebstar]

benjikat got kicked on 1st of june 2008
viewtopic.php?f=634&t=53112&hilit=medals+2008
medals were not instituted untill the 9th of june 2008. You only get medals for games when you end a game while the medal was instituted. So when the first time he would finish a game, he would automaticly also get al the associated medals he has earned thus far.

Blitz never was a multi.

fact are important, esp if they are searchable. Beckie should know better. no insult intended Arama86

Who have been the most famous or most infmaous multi accounts and what were their user names?

We're talking about *manimal in another thread, but I remember duality (Mad Pineapples), Benjikat, Blitzaholic, and PInocheckio. JeffHardy, Fredviii

BexXx

I was reading the "infamous multies" thread by beckytheblondie in general discussions, when something caught my eye. Benjikat, here claimed to be the multi of Blitzaholic, has played 1700+ games, yet has ONE medal, a special contribution medal. Didn't they hand out medals for standard/dubs/trips/quads/ in 2008, or was he stripped of his medals?
in which case, this HAS been done before!?
(my point being that is is impossible to play 1700+ games, win 50%, and not have bronze medals in standard or whatever type of game he played)

[Arama86n]

Edited (no longer relevant)

[SirSebstar]

edited arama,
no insult intended

[Arama86n]

edited arama,
no insult intended

Edited away my response as well, glad we sorted that out. Happy Holidays SirSebstar

[BigBallinStalin]

Quick questions:

(1) if the positions in here were succinctly summarized in one post, would that hasten the process of implementing this suggestion?

(2) is this thread the same as this thread?

[chapcrap]

Quick questions:

(1) if the positions in here were succinctly summarized in one post, would that hasten the process of implementing this suggestion?

I think the issue with this being implemented is the change in policy. I suppose that summarizing the positions can not hurt, but I think the issue is really whether or not the admin and owners want this to happen.

One small coding issue is that the bronze, silver, gold, and soon to come diamond medals are all issued automatically based on statistical information. So, as an example, if you strip a players team medals, currently they will all come back once he wins another game. So, it's actually not enough to strip a player of medals. You also have to strip him of victories or create a mechanism that causes the count to reset.

(2) is this thread the same as this thread?

I don't really know if they are the same. They are similar. We have the ability to strip medals.

[BigBallinStalin]

Got'cha. Thanks.

[agentcom]

Quick questions:

(1) if the positions in here were succinctly summarized in one post, would that hasten the process of implementing this suggestion?

I think the issue with this being implemented is the change in policy. I suppose that summarizing the positions can not hurt, but I think the issue is really whether or not the admin and owners want this to happen.

One small coding issue is that the bronze, silver, gold, and soon to come diamond medals are all issued automatically based on statistical information. So, as an example, if you strip a players team medals, currently they will all come back once he wins another game. So, it's actually not enough to strip a player of medals. You also have to strip him of victories or create a mechanism that causes the count to reset.

(2) is this thread the same as this thread?

I don't really know if they are the same. They are similar. We have the ability to strip medals.

The red part is actually what I think might have been part of Doom's suggestion in the other thread. Tbh, I'm not entirely sure what either of you were saying in that other thread.

[Symmetry]

stripping victories seems like a separate suggestion. If TPTb already have the power to strip medals, it should be employed.

[chapcrap]

stripping victories seems like a separate suggestion. If TPTb already have the power to strip medals, it should be employed.

Well, I'm not sure the admin agree.

In any case, it can't be employed separately. If you read what I wrote earlier, you would understand that if you wanted the bronze, silver, gold, and diamond medals stripped, something else must also be done in order for them to remain stripped. Otherwise, they will re-appear. Now, if you wanted other medals (GA, GC, TA, etc.) stripped, that is different. But those medals are (mostly) not really the medals achieved through cheating.

[Symmetry]

stripping victories seems like a separate suggestion. If TPTb already have the power to strip medals, it should be employed.

Well, I'm not sure the admin agree.

In any case, it can't be employed separately. If you read what I wrote earlier, you would understand that if you wanted the bronze, silver, gold, and diamond medals stripped, something else must also be done in order for them to remain stripped. Otherwise, they will re-appear. Now, if you wanted other medals (GA, GC, TA, etc.) stripped, that is different. But those medals are (mostly) not really the medals achieved through cheating.

Fair enough. Would it be fair to say that this is tied to a point reset then?

[patrickaa317]

stripping victories seems like a separate suggestion. If TPTb already have the power to strip medals, it should be employed.

Well, I'm not sure the admin agree.

In any case, it can't be employed separately. If you read what I wrote earlier, you would understand that if you wanted the bronze, silver, gold, and diamond medals stripped, something else must also be done in order for them to remain stripped. Otherwise, they will re-appear. Now, if you wanted other medals (GA, GC, TA, etc.) stripped, that is different. But those medals are (mostly) not really the medals achieved through cheating.

Fair enough. Would it be fair to say that this is tied to a point reset then?

Medals are derived from victories. You can't strip medals and not touch victory counts. Point reset is different subject.

[Symmetry]

stripping victories seems like a separate suggestion. If TPTb already have the power to strip medals, it should be employed.

Well, I'm not sure the admin agree.

In any case, it can't be employed separately. If you read what I wrote earlier, you would understand that if you wanted the bronze, silver, gold, and diamond medals stripped, something else must also be done in order for them to remain stripped. Otherwise, they will re-appear. Now, if you wanted other medals (GA, GC, TA, etc.) stripped, that is different. But those medals are (mostly) not really the medals achieved through cheating.

Fair enough. Would it be fair to say that this is tied to a point reset then?

Medals are derived from victories. You can't strip medals and not touch victory counts. Point reset is different subject.

Not all of them, obviously, but fair point. What do you suggest?

[patrickaa317]

stripping victories seems like a separate suggestion. If TPTb already have the power to strip medals, it should be employed.

Well, I'm not sure the admin agree.

In any case, it can't be employed separately. If you read what I wrote earlier, you would understand that if you wanted the bronze, silver, gold, and diamond medals stripped, something else must also be done in order for them to remain stripped. Otherwise, they will re-appear. Now, if you wanted other medals (GA, GC, TA, etc.) stripped, that is different. But those medals are (mostly) not really the medals achieved through cheating.

Fair enough. Would it be fair to say that this is tied to a point reset then?

Medals are derived from victories. You can't strip medals and not touch victory counts. Point reset is different subject.

Not all of them, obviously, but fair point. What do you suggest?

I suggest a giant asterisk next to their name or some other form of scarlet letter that will flag them out to everyone. Make it bigger with each offense.

[nicestash]

But have it go away after a period of time.

Sometimes cheating happens because of a misunderstanding of the rules.

[Symmetry]

But have it go away after a period of time.

Sometimes cheating happens because of a misunderstanding of the rules.

The mods are generally sympathetic to appeals. A time limit seems to me a poor idea. Ifs the medals are unearned fairly, why return them?

[patrickaa317]

But have it go away after a period of time.

Sometimes cheating happens because of a misunderstanding of the rules.

The mods are generally sympathetic to appeals. A time limit seems to me a poor idea. Ifs the medals are unearned fairly, why return them?

He was referring to my scarlet letter suggestion, not yours.

[nicestash]

Yep, I'm not sure why the 2 topics were merged...