Perception of Top 10 Clans [Annually + Longevity]

[waseemalim]

Anderenfalls solltest du einfach mal ruhig sein und nicht alles und jeden sofort kritisieren und die Klappe aufreißen, sobald irgendwer keine Lust hat dir alles nachzuplappern und dabei zuzujubeln.
Letzte Woche hast du wer weiß wie rumgeflucht und meine Kameraden beleidigt, dann dich plötzlich entschuldigt und alles nicht so gemeint, jetzt machst du dich über meine Sprachkenntnisse lustig , ohne bewiesen zu haben, dass du die meine besser beherrscht als ich die deine. Dazu kommen zahllose andere Beiträge, die nicht gerade von deiner Wertschätzung anderen gegenüber zeugen. Manchmal mag es klug sein das Maul nicht soweit aufzureißen, wir wollen hier alle einfach nur eine nette Zeit verbringen und zusammen Spaß haben, aber was du hier manchmal von dir gibst ist nicht gerade das, was zur Unterhaltung vieler beizutragen in der Lage ist.

From Babelfish, which probably can do a better job of cracking the "secrets of the life" than Blitz can:

Otherwise you should be simply times calm and criticize immediately not everything and everyone and break the flap, as soon as possibly who does not have desire you everything nachzuplappern and zuzujubeln. Last week you who white as rum-swore and my comrades insulted, then you sudden excused and everything not in such a way meant, now make you you over my knowledge of a language merrily, without to have proven that you my better controls than I the yours. In addition come countless other contributions, which do not witness straight from your appreciation other one opposite. Sometimes it may be intelligent the muzzle not so far to break, we wants everything simply only a nice time here to spend and together fun have, but which you here sometimes do not give from you are straight what to the maintenance of many to contribute able is.

[waseemalim]

Also, I actually strongly agree with Seul's suggestion that it should read "Blitz's Top CC Clans by year". Just because you have graciously accepted suggestions to include some clans that you might have otherwise forgotten about doesn't mean that you are not in control of the list. You alone are able to pick and choose the suggestions, and therefore this makes it your list.

On an unrelated note, may be someone should lock and archive the thread. Its too divisive.

[Blitzaholic]

2006

1. Dragoons
2. Bushwackers
3. Stachewackers
4. CWC
5. Bounty Hunters
6. Legionaires of Chaos
7. Scion of Glory (holes)
8. Gridiron Gang


2007

1. Thota
2. Dragoons
3. Bushwackers
4. Lod
5. Untouchables
6. Regulators
7. Low



2008

1. Thota
2. Low
3. Tsm
4. Dragoons
5. Untouchables
6. Empire
7. Lod
8. ++The Legion++


2009

1. Thota
2. Tsm
3. Low
4. IA
5. Empire
6. ++The Legion++
7. Dragoons
8. BSS
9. BpB
10. AOD

arguably Tofu may be there?


2010 as of now-subject to change-voted on by 20 clans in the CUP clan tourney

1. Thota
2. Tsm
3. Tofu
4. Empire
5. IA
6. Low
7. Kort
8. Dragoons
9. Nemesis
10. BSS

good argument for O+H to be there?

this seems like a pretty reasonable list though, is there anything that warrants a real drastic change?

[nagerous]

Yes, THOTA aren't the number one clan of 2010.

[Blitzaholic]

Also, I actually strongly agree with Seul's suggestion that it should read "Blitz's Top CC Clans by year". Just because you have graciously accepted suggestions to include some clans that you might have otherwise forgotten about doesn't mean that you are not in control of the list. You alone are able to pick and choose the suggestions, and therefore this makes it your list.

I disagree, as I said before, all who were around know dragoons and bushwackers were the best clans in 2006, you do not need a system for that, all knew it. In 2007, when we beat them both, well, that speaks volumes of the new order now. In 2008, we continued our assault, never losing, and 2009 and 2010 Jp had records of stats to show there rankings. So, this is a very reasonable list of ranks of clans by years. Even with system in place that Jp used, there still was some argument and debate. There is NO perfect system wasee. This is a pretty reasonable reflection of the CC ages of where clans ranked and it is based on tons of experience by CC players. I myself played a ton of them players in clans, and have a good idea, I just needed others input as well to help ensure closer accuracy. I continue to get feedback from more players and will continue to make changes if needed with valid viewpoints.

[Fruitcake]

p.s. I have no idea what all that jibberish is above, lol, seems interesting though. Almost like I have to crack a secret code from the ancient world to decipher the deeper meanings in life.

You really know how to pile insult upon insult don't you Blitz....jeeeze, way to go in showing how to win friends and influence people.

[jpcloet]

Fruitcake, can you confirm that the BPB were the sexiest clans for all of those years?

(ok, gotta admit that Owen would have made this topic more fun....)

[Blitzaholic]

p.s. I have no idea what all that jibberish is above, lol, seems interesting though. Almost like I have to crack a secret code from the ancient world to decipher the deeper meanings in life.

You really know how to pile insult upon insult don't you Blitz....jeeeze, way to go in showing how to win friends and influence people.

you have no sense of humor do you m8?

[Chariot of Fire]

This thread is worth it purely for the translation that Waseem posted.

Last week you who white as rum-swore and my comrades insulted

That runs a close 2nd to HardAttack and his 'sharlote pumpkin' Game 5699910

[Fruitcake]

Fruitcake, can you confirm that the BPB were the sexiest clans for all of those years?

(ok, gotta admit that Owen would have made this topic more fun....)

In Owens absence I can confirm that the BpBs were the sexiest clan even when they didn't exist as a clan such is their elite sexiness

[waseemalim]

Also, I actually strongly agree with Seul's suggestion that it should read "Blitz's Top CC Clans by year". Just because you have graciously accepted suggestions to include some clans that you might have otherwise forgotten about doesn't mean that you are not in control of the list. You alone are able to pick and choose the suggestions, and therefore this makes it your list.

I disagree, as I said before, all who were around know dragoons and bushwackers were the best clans in 2006, you do not need a system for that, all knew it. In 2007, when we beat them both, well, that speaks volumes of the new order now. In 2008, we continued our assault, never losing, and 2009 and 2010 Jp had records of stats to show there rankings. So, this is a very reasonable list of ranks of clans by years. Even with system in place that Jp used, there still was some argument and debate. There is NO perfect system wasee. This is a pretty reasonable reflection of the CC ages of where clans ranked and it is based on tons of experience by CC players. I myself played a ton of them players in clans, and have a good idea, I just needed others input as well to help ensure closer accuracy. I continue to get feedback from more players and will continue to make changes if needed with valid viewpoints.

The question is not whether dragoon or bushwackers were good clans -- it is who was better. If you created a list of "All CC clans by year", rather than "TOP CC Clans by years" and ranking them, there would be no problem with the thread name. But when you are calling someone "top", in the absence of a neutral scoring system and without explaining your methodology in detail, your position becomes less tenable. I doubt that even you can define the logic that you are placing behind this ranking. You are, at the end of the day, adding your own judgement by being selective about suggestions.

The problem is that you are misleading the reader by touting opinions to be facts. Your opinion, while you can argue that it is neutral, and the opinions of other clan leaders, in the case of the 2010 rankings, should not hold the same value as the results from a challenge/tournament and should not be made to seem so.

Having said that, and since you seem to believe that your stance is well aligned with the stance of the general populace, I suggest you open up a poll: "What should be the name of this thread?"
"1. TOP CC Clans Clans by Years"
"2. Blitz's TOP CC Clans by Years"

Knowing you, I doubt that you will. But we can always hope for your redemption.

[Blitzaholic]

Also, I actually strongly agree with Seul's suggestion that it should read "Blitz's Top CC Clans by year". Just because you have graciously accepted suggestions to include some clans that you might have otherwise forgotten about doesn't mean that you are not in control of the list. You alone are able to pick and choose the suggestions, and therefore this makes it your list.

I disagree, as I said before, all who were around know dragoons and bushwackers were the best clans in 2006, you do not need a system for that, all knew it. In 2007, when we beat them both, well, that speaks volumes of the new order now. In 2008, we continued our assault, never losing, and 2009 and 2010 Jp had records of stats to show there rankings. So, this is a very reasonable list of ranks of clans by years. Even with system in place that Jp used, there still was some argument and debate. There is NO perfect system wasee. This is a pretty reasonable reflection of the CC ages of where clans ranked and it is based on tons of experience by CC players. I myself played a ton of them players in clans, and have a good idea, I just needed others input as well to help ensure closer accuracy. I continue to get feedback from more players and will continue to make changes if needed with valid viewpoints.

The question is not whether dragoon or bushwackers were good clans -- it is who was better. If you created a list of "All CC clans by year", rather than "TOP CC Clans by years" and ranking them, there would be no problem with the thread name. But when you are calling someone "top", in the absence of a neutral scoring system and without explaining your methodology in detail, your position becomes less tenable. I doubt that even you can define the logic that you are placing behind this ranking. You are, at the end of the day, adding your own judgement by being selective about suggestions.

The problem is that you are misleading the reader by touting opinions to be facts. Your opinion, while you can argue that it is neutral, and the opinions of other clan leaders, in the case of the 2010 rankings, should not hold the same value as the results from a challenge/tournament and should not be made to seem so.

Having said that, and since you seem to believe that your stance is well aligned with the stance of the general populace, I suggest you open up a poll: "What should be the name of this thread?"
"1. TOP CC Clans Clans by Years"
"2. Blitz's TOP CC Clans by Years"

Knowing you, I doubt that you will. But we can always hope for your redemption.

again, no system is perfect, and a scoring system still causes many to argue. I have talked with several players who have been around for years and they agree this is a pretty reasonable list. To me in your example of dragoons or bushwackers for 2006 is a good one, i would lean slightly towards the bushwackers, but the fact we beat them both in 2007, there is no argument about 2007, and there on forward with jp system in the others years, so, it seems like you hung up on year 2006, whether dragoons or bushwackers were 1 or 2, that is a hard one to say, maybe they were 1a and 1b, but they were the top 2 clans that year and they were the ones that made us want to form a clan. again, this is just good cc history to look back at clans, the fall the rise and the old and the new, etc.

[waseemalim]

again, no system is perfect, and a scoring system still causes many to argue. I have talked with several players who have been around for years and they agree this is a pretty reasonable list. To me in your example of dragoons or bushwackers for 2006 is a good one, i would lean slightly towards the bushwackers, but the fact we beat them both in 2007, there is no argument about 2007, and there on forward with jp system in the others years, so, it seems like you hung up on year 2006, whether dragoons or bushwackers were 1 or 2, that is a hard one to say, maybe they were 1a and 1b, but they were the top 2 clans that year and they were the ones that made us want to form a clan. again, this is just good cc history to look back at clans, the fall the rise and the old and the new, etc.

Not sure if you are missing the point or intentionally avoiding it. I accept that there is no perfect system, I accept that you have consulted all of your friends, and I accept that you are being as neutral as possible. That is not the point and you do not need to defend your rankings.

The point is why should this thread be called "TOP CC Clans by years" if there can be disagreements about it. It would be perfectly fine to call it "Blitz's xyz". Now, what about the poll? How about practicing the egalitarianism that you so staunchly claim to adhere to?

[Blitzaholic]

there does not seem to be much different disagreement about is wasee, it has about the same disagreement as jp's many ranking systems. many I have talked with thought this was pretty fair assessment.


The players I think that would know most if this is a true reflection are chuuuuck, chariot of fire, aafitz, incandenza, comic boy, reptile, hwhwrhett, fireside poet, jpcloet, bruceswar, scott-land, etc., several others too, Most of them have paid thorough attention to the clans thru the years and have longevity.

[waseemalim]

there does not seem to be much different disagreement about is wasee, it has about the same disagreement as jp's many ranking systems. many I have talked with thought this was pretty fair assessment.

so why not have the vote? Are you too tired to click and open it? I am just asking for a vote on the name of the topic.

[Seulessliathan]

again, no system is perfect, and a scoring system still causes many to argue. I have talked with several players who have been around for years and they agree this is a pretty reasonable list. To me in your example of dragoons or bushwackers for 2006 is a good one, i would lean slightly towards the bushwackers, but the fact we beat them both in 2007, there is no argument about 2007, and there on forward with jp system in the others years, so, it seems like you hung up on year 2006, whether dragoons or bushwackers were 1 or 2, that is a hard one to say, maybe they were 1a and 1b, but they were the top 2 clans that year and they were the ones that made us want to form a clan. again, this is just good cc history to look back at clans, the fall the rise and the old and the new, etc.

Not sure if you are missing the point or intentionally avoiding it. I accept that there is no perfect system, I accept that you have consulted all of your friends, and I accept that you are being as neutral as possible. That is not the point and you do not need to defend your rankings.

The point is why should this thread be called "TOP CC Clans by years" if there can be disagreements about it. It would be perfectly fine to call it "Blitz's xyz". Now, what about the poll? How about practicing the egalitarianism that you so staunchly claim to adhere to?

Blitz, i have to agree here with all what Wasee says.

can you please explain what is the problem to change the thread title? Why to you try to stay with the actual one? I´m pretty sure nobody would have any problem with the change. And obviously some people think the actual title doesn´t fit. Please explain to us why you still aren´t willing to make the vote wasee asks for.

[Blitzaholic]

I am not voting, I was asked by Jpcloet not to continue to massive pm players and have them vote, it is almost like spamming. So, out of respect to him, I won't. If you do not like the thread, stop reading and posting in here. I simply asked you several times to let me know which ranks you strongly disagreed with, you had none except who was top clan in 2006, and that was a good question, there is no way of really telling, but, it is good history, I could put the both down as #1 if that makes you feel better. Seul, if you can find good argument for any strong disagreements in the ranks, let me know?


I guess I could change the title some to fit your needs.

[Seulessliathan]

Seul, if you can find good argument for any strong disagreements in the ranks, let me know?

i don´t have a strong disagreements about ranks, but about your way to present it. good arguments for that? no problem, here you go:

The problem is that you are misleading the reader by touting opinions to be facts. Your opinion, while you can argue that it is neutral, and the opinions of other clan leaders, in the case of the 2010 rankings, should not hold the same value as the results from a challenge/tournament and should not be made to seem so.

Having said that, and since you seem to believe that your stance is well aligned with the stance of the general populace, I suggest you open up a poll: "What should be the name of this thread?"
"1. TOP CC Clans Clans by Years"
"2. Blitz's TOP CC Clans by Years"

[Blitzaholic]

Seul, if you can find good argument for any strong disagreements in the ranks, let me know?

i don´t have a strong disagreements about ranks, but about your way to present it. good arguments for that? no problem, here you go:

The problem is that you are misleading the reader by touting opinions to be facts. Your opinion, while you can argue that it is neutral, and the opinions of other clan leaders, in the case of the 2010 rankings, should not hold the same value as the results from a challenge/tournament and should not be made to seem so.

Having said that, and since you seem to believe that your stance is well aligned with the stance of the general populace, I suggest you open up a poll: "What should be the name of this thread?"
"1. TOP CC Clans Clans by Years"
"2. Blitz's TOP CC Clans by Years"

it is not mine, like I said I collected others input, and changed the title to PERCEPTION of top clans, feel better? Perhaps you missed that? Perception is not fact, but opinion of the facts, get it now? This was used to appease you and wasee.

[waseemalim]

I am not voting, I was asked by Jpcloet not to continue to massive pm players and have them vote, it is almost like spamming. So, out of respect to him, I won't. If you do not like the thread, stop reading and posting in here. I simply asked you several times to let me know which ranks you strongly disagreed with, you had none except who was top clan in 2006, and that was a good question, there is no way of really telling, but, it is good history, I could put the both down as #1 if that makes you feel better. Seul, if you can find good argument for any strong disagreements in the ranks, let me know?


I guess I could change the title some to fit your needs.

you do not have to PM people to open a vote. People can find their way into the poll.

[Blitzaholic]

reread the title, lol


you all blind?

[Georgerx7di]

2 cents. Err, going back a few pages. I want to comment on which top lists are better.


We should all know by now that there has been more than one ladder. Each was different and each had major flaws. It is really not JP's fault that none was perfect, seeing how complex it is to come up with a mathematical way to rank clans. (Please comment if you would like more explanation on this).

It is my opinion that the voting for the Conqueror's Cup has actually given the best list of top 10 clans, far better than any of the ladders. So if we ever get back to discussing who should be the top 5 or top 10 for 09' and 10', (not sure which year that one should apply to if any), then I think we should look more to this list (albeit it's missing some clans), then to the various ladders.

p.s. Everyone can find my top 10 list in issue 25 of CC news paper. Feel free to comment on it, feedback on stories is always appreciated. Ok, there's my plug

[Fruitcake]

I am not voting, I was asked by Jpcloet not to continue to massive pm players and have them vote, it is almost like spamming. So, out of respect to him, I won't. If you do not like the thread, stop reading and posting in here. I simply asked you several times to let me know which ranks you strongly disagreed with, you had none except who was top clan in 2006, and that was a good question, there is no way of really telling, but, it is good history, I could put the both down as #1 if that makes you feel better. Seul, if you can find good argument for any strong disagreements in the ranks, let me know?


I guess I could change the title some to fit your needs.

you do not have to PM people to open a vote. People can find their way into the poll.

I think this thread has gained enough attention from those interested to form a poll.

[Blitzaholic]

2 cents. Err, going back a few pages. I want to comment on which top lists are better.


We should all know by now that there has been more than one ladder. Each was different and each had major flaws. It is really not JP's fault that none was perfect, seeing how complex it is to come up with a mathematical way to rank clans. (Please comment if you would like more explanation on this).

It is my opinion that the voting for the Conqueror's Cup has actually given the best list of top 10 clans, far better than any of the ladders. So if we ever get back to discussing who should be the top 5 or top 10 for 09' and 10', (not sure which year that one should apply to if any), then I think we should look more to this list (albeit it's missing some clans), then to the various ladders.

p.s. Everyone can find my top 10 list in issue 25 of CC news paper. Feel free to comment on it, feedback on stories is always appreciated. Ok, there's my plug

thanks george, that is a pretty good list you got there of your rankings, hard to argue them, I will give my soon.

[Georgerx7di]

2 cents. Err, going back a few pages. I want to comment on which top lists are better.


We should all know by now that there has been more than one ladder. Each was different and each had major flaws. It is really not JP's fault that none was perfect, seeing how complex it is to come up with a mathematical way to rank clans. (Please comment if you would like more explanation on this).

It is my opinion that the voting for the Conqueror's Cup has actually given the best list of top 10 clans, far better than any of the ladders. So if we ever get back to discussing who should be the top 5 or top 10 for 09' and 10', (not sure which year that one should apply to if any), then I think we should look more to this list (albeit it's missing some clans), then to the various ladders.

p.s. Everyone can find my top 10 list in issue 25 of CC news paper. Feel free to comment on it, feedback on stories is always appreciated. Ok, there's my plug

thanks george, that is a pretty good list you got there of your rankings, hard to argue them, I will give my soon.

Thanks blitz. One thing that I kept going back and forth on was 4-6. I think you can take empire, low and IA and pretty throw them in any order 4 through 6 and you would have a good case. ID I'm still not sure about the placement I gave them.