Change FLAT RATE bonuses.

Suggestions that have been inactive for a long period of time.

Moderators: Suggestions Team, Global Moderators

Change FLAT RATE bonuses.

Postby j35t3r.us on Sat Mar 07, 2009 5:14 pm

Concise description:
Changing Flat Rate spoils bonus hand-in from 4/6/8/10 to 6/10

Specifics:
Current flat rate spoils hand-in bonuses are:
3 Red Spoils = 4 bonus units
3 Green Spoils = 6 bonus units
3 Blue Spoils = 8 bonus units
1 of Each Spoil = 10 bonus units

My suggestion is to eliminate another huge chunk of LUCK from a SKILL-based game. How many times have you all been sitting on 3 red cards for 3 turns thinking... This sucks. Meanwhile someone has 3 blue cards, or 3 green cards. Both of which are just as common as the red cards you hold, and they get more guys for no reason except luck...

I say make ALL flat rate spoil hand-ins worth 6 troops unless you have 1 of each color spoil, which is worth 10 troops. This really makes a difference when it comes to 3rd turn handins, or saving your cards for the chance to get 1 of each color, etc etc...


This will improve the following aspects of the site:
-Less luck when it comes to which cards you are dealt.
-No more "crap I have red cards - he has blue cards" stuff

[MOD EDIT: For a related suggestion that would set spoils turn-ins of all types to a single value, see here --agentcom]
Lieutenant j35t3r.us
 
Posts: 66
Joined: Tue Nov 18, 2008 8:32 pm
Medals: 12
Standard Achievement (2) Terminator Achievement (3) Assassin Achievement (1) Manual Troops Achievement (2) Fog of War Achievement (2)
Cross-Map Achievement (2)

Re: Change FLAT RATE bonuses.

Postby Theguyoverthere on Sat Mar 07, 2009 5:48 pm

I actually kind of like this idea.
User avatar
Captain Theguyoverthere
 
Posts: 62
Joined: Sun Nov 18, 2007 2:35 pm
Location: Washington state, USA
Medals: 15
Standard Achievement (3) Doubles Achievement (1) Assassin Achievement (2) Freestyle Achievement (3) Fog of War Achievement (2)
Speed Achievement (3) Ratings Achievement (1)

Re: Change FLAT RATE bonuses.

Postby lgoasklucyl on Sat Mar 07, 2009 6:13 pm

I like this as well, actually.

Nothing quite like having 2 red and a green as the opponent cashes for 13 then hitting 2 pair.....
Image
User avatar
Sergeant 1st Class lgoasklucyl
 
Posts: 526
Joined: Mon Apr 07, 2008 8:49 pm
Location: Somewhere in the 20th century.
Medals: 49
Standard Achievement (2) Doubles Achievement (3) Triples Achievement (3) Quadruples Achievement (3) Terminator Achievement (2)
Manual Troops Achievement (1) Freestyle Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (3) Speed Achievement (2) Teammate Achievement (2)
Random Map Achievement (1) Cross-Map Achievement (3) Ratings Achievement (3) Tournament Achievement (3) General Achievement (6)
Clan Achievement (7) Training Achievement (3) Map Contribution (1)

Re: Change FLAT RATE bonuses.

Postby dhallmeyer on Sat Mar 07, 2009 6:42 pm

I like this too. I can never remember which is which, just hoping for a mixed set.
User avatar
Major dhallmeyer
Senior SoC Training Instructor
Senior SoC Training Instructor
 
Posts: 5700
Joined: Thu Sep 04, 2008 2:47 pm
Location: the un-nutty part of CA
Medals: 45
Standard Achievement (4) Doubles Achievement (1) Triples Achievement (1) Quadruples Achievement (1) Terminator Achievement (4)
Manual Troops Achievement (2) Freestyle Achievement (2) Polymorphic Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (3) Trench Warfare Achievement (1)
Speed Achievement (3) Teammate Achievement (1) Random Map Achievement (1) Cross-Map Achievement (3) Ratings Achievement (4)
Training Achievement (4) General Contribution (9)

Re: Change FLAT RATE bonuses.

Postby e_i_pi on Sat Mar 07, 2009 7:31 pm

The chances of having a mixed is the same as the chances of having a coloured set you know
User avatar
Captain e_i_pi
 
Posts: 1773
Joined: Tue Feb 12, 2008 2:19 pm
Location: Corruption Capital of the world
Medals: 36
Standard Achievement (2) Doubles Achievement (3) Triples Achievement (3) Quadruples Achievement (3) Terminator Achievement (2)
Assassin Achievement (1) Freestyle Achievement (2) Fog of War Achievement (3) Speed Achievement (1) Cross-Map Achievement (3)
Ratings Achievement (3) Tournament Achievement (5) Clan Achievement (3) General Contribution (2)

Re: Change FLAT RATE bonuses.

Postby Woodruff on Sat Mar 07, 2009 8:21 pm

e_i_pi wrote:The chances of having a mixed is the same as the chances of having a coloured set you know


Which precisely supports why they shouldn't be worth more.
User avatar
Corporal 1st Class Woodruff
 
Posts: 4973
Joined: Sat Jan 05, 2008 9:15 am
Medals: 27
Standard Achievement (4) Quadruples Achievement (1) Terminator Achievement (2) Manual Troops Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (3)
Speed Achievement (3) Teammate Achievement (1) Random Map Achievement (1) Cross-Map Achievement (3) Ratings Achievement (4)
Tournament Contribution (4)

Re: Change FLAT RATE bonuses.

Postby a.sub on Sat Mar 07, 2009 9:00 pm

i agree with this too, except i think instead of making it so that its all the same its just similar
like
Red 7
Blue 8
Green 9
Mixed 10
User avatar
Cadet a.sub
 
Posts: 1834
Joined: Thu Jun 14, 2007 2:07 am
Medals: 26
Standard Achievement (2) Doubles Achievement (2) Triples Achievement (1) Quadruples Achievement (1) Terminator Achievement (1)
Assassin Achievement (2) Manual Troops Achievement (1) Freestyle Achievement (2) Fog of War Achievement (1) Speed Achievement (2)
Cross-Map Achievement (1) Ratings Achievement (3) General Achievement (1) Tournament Contribution (6)

Re: Change FLAT RATE bonuses.

Postby Joodoo on Sat Mar 07, 2009 9:04 pm

e_i_pi wrote:The chances of having a mixed is the same as the chances of having a coloured set you know


then we should make all of the sets worth 10 armies / 8 armies
TheSaxlad wrote:The Dice suck a lot of the time.

And if they dont suck then they blow.

:D
User avatar
Lieutenant Joodoo
 
Posts: 1639
Joined: Fri Mar 21, 2008 12:19 am
Location: Greater Toronto, Canada
Medals: 18
Standard Achievement (2) Doubles Achievement (1) Triples Achievement (1) Quadruples Achievement (1) Terminator Achievement (1)
Assassin Achievement (1) Manual Troops Achievement (1) Freestyle Achievement (2) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (2)
Cross-Map Achievement (1) Ratings Achievement (3) General Achievement (1)

Re: Change FLAT RATE bonuses.

Postby e_i_pi on Sat Mar 07, 2009 9:08 pm

Joodoo wrote:
e_i_pi wrote:The chances of having a mixed is the same as the chances of having a coloured set you know


then we should make all of the sets worth 10 armies / 8 armies

That's what I mean.

RRR: 6 armies
GGG: 6 armies
BBB: 6 armies
RGB: 10 armies

is exactly the same as

RRR: 10 armies
GGG: 6 armies
BBB: 6 armies
RGB: 6 armies

statistically
User avatar
Captain e_i_pi
 
Posts: 1773
Joined: Tue Feb 12, 2008 2:19 pm
Location: Corruption Capital of the world
Medals: 36
Standard Achievement (2) Doubles Achievement (3) Triples Achievement (3) Quadruples Achievement (3) Terminator Achievement (2)
Assassin Achievement (1) Freestyle Achievement (2) Fog of War Achievement (3) Speed Achievement (1) Cross-Map Achievement (3)
Ratings Achievement (3) Tournament Achievement (5) Clan Achievement (3) General Contribution (2)

Re: Change FLAT RATE bonuses.

Postby Timminz on Sat Mar 07, 2009 9:13 pm

I was under the impression that mixed sets were actually more likely than any of the single-coloured ones. Maybe I just read someone wrong before.

Regardless, if you want to remove the luck aspect from flat rate, don't play it. That is to say that it is the most luck-oriented card setting, and there are 2 other options that remove that luck aspect from the game.
jay_a2j wrote:lets not be so quick to judge Hitler
User avatar
Major Timminz
 
Posts: 5567
Joined: Tue Feb 27, 2007 1:05 pm
Location: At the store
Medals: 56
Standard Achievement (4) Doubles Achievement (3) Triples Achievement (3) Quadruples Achievement (2) Terminator Achievement (2)
Assassin Achievement (1) Manual Troops Achievement (2) Polymorphic Achievement (1) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (3)
Speed Achievement (4) Teammate Achievement (2) Random Map Achievement (1) Cross-Map Achievement (3) Ratings Achievement (4)
Tournament Achievement (6) General Achievement (2) Clan Achievement (10) Tournament Contribution (1) General Contribution (1)

Re: Change FLAT RATE bonuses.

Postby owenshooter on Sat Mar 07, 2009 9:51 pm

if you want to remove the luck factor from flat rate, then don't play flat rate. there are other settings, as was stated by timminz above, that do this. i hate cards, and generally only play no card games... anyway, just change the type of game you play, and you'll maybe find yourself enjoying CC once again...-0

p.s.-one interesting thing about playing different types of settings is the different set of people you notice in those worlds...
Image
DoomYoshi, "GD has no traffic because of venereal diseases like you."
User avatar
Captain owenshooter
 
Posts: 8925
Joined: Wed Mar 07, 2007 6:01 pm
Location: Deep in the Heart of Tx
Medals: 27
Standard Achievement (1) Doubles Achievement (4) Triples Achievement (3) Quadruples Achievement (2) Polymorphic Achievement (1)
Fog of War Achievement (2) Teammate Achievement (1) Random Map Achievement (1) Cross-Map Achievement (3) Ratings Achievement (3)
Tournament Achievement (1) General Achievement (3) Clan Achievement (2)

Re: Change FLAT RATE bonuses.

Postby Kotaro on Sat Mar 07, 2009 10:01 pm

If you don't like luck, play a different game.
Image
Highest Rank = 2048Image
Kotaro Fuma, The Terror of Death
User avatar
Private Kotaro
 
Posts: 2830
Joined: Sat Mar 03, 2007 2:31 pm
Location: Yer Village
Medals: 41
Standard Achievement (3) Doubles Achievement (3) Triples Achievement (2) Quadruples Achievement (2) Terminator Achievement (2)
Assassin Achievement (2) Freestyle Achievement (2) Fog of War Achievement (3) Speed Achievement (3) Cross-Map Achievement (3)
Ratings Achievement (3) Tournament Achievement (2) General Achievement (2) Tournament Contribution (9)

Re: Change FLAT RATE bonuses.

Postby Optimus Prime on Sat Mar 07, 2009 10:11 pm

I happen to like my flat rate spoils just the way they are to be honest. No need to go fixing something that isn't broken.
User avatar
Cadet Optimus Prime
Retired Administrator
 
Posts: 9751
Joined: Mon Mar 12, 2007 9:33 pm
Medals: 51
Standard Achievement (3) Doubles Achievement (2) Triples Achievement (1) Terminator Achievement (1) Speed Achievement (1)
Teammate Achievement (1) Cross-Map Achievement (3) Ratings Achievement (3) Tournament Achievement (1) General Achievement (2)
Tournament Contribution (30) General Contribution (3)

Re: Change FLAT RATE bonuses.

Postby j35t3r.us on Mon Mar 09, 2009 3:59 pm

Thats what? 7 for and 3 against. More replies please.

As stated above, cards have the same chances to be drawn but are worth different amounts. This is bad math. Make it more rare for the higher handins, makes no sense to have higher handins same probability as lower handins. I mean heck... Flat rate means FLAT RATE, not different rates!

Also noted above, "pick a different option" if you don't want luck. Ok, so there are two other options. NO CARDS, and ESCALATING.

No cards = all dice, no surprises.
Excalating = Fair, and Balanced. Cards are worth same amount because they all have the same probability to be drawn and are worth the same.


then:

Flat Rate = For those that don't want to play a game where it is STRICTLY about handins(aka escalating), but still want that early game(turns 1-15 or so) fun of cashing in or getting cashed in on.

All three versions should be equally as fun. And they are. Except Flat Rate is the only Spoils option that doesn't make sense.

This isn't about switching the way I play. I play them all. This is about making the site/system fair to all. If one version of what I play seems more skewed than the other versions I play, I might as well report it and see what others think. And so far (judging by the replies), others feel the same way.



This needs to be looked into more. There are multiple replies above stating flat rate should be changed, and different amount to consider. I want more replies to this, maybe even a poll, and have this idea/suggestion(or even BUG if you call it that) looked into more, and even considered for change.


I like the 8 units and 10 unit idea personally.
Lieutenant j35t3r.us
 
Posts: 66
Joined: Tue Nov 18, 2008 8:32 pm
Medals: 12
Standard Achievement (2) Terminator Achievement (3) Assassin Achievement (1) Manual Troops Achievement (2) Fog of War Achievement (2)
Cross-Map Achievement (2)

Re: Change FLAT RATE bonuses.

Postby a.sub on Mon Mar 09, 2009 4:31 pm

actually i wnaan change my vote to against as i like the luck aspect
User avatar
Cadet a.sub
 
Posts: 1834
Joined: Thu Jun 14, 2007 2:07 am
Medals: 26
Standard Achievement (2) Doubles Achievement (2) Triples Achievement (1) Quadruples Achievement (1) Terminator Achievement (1)
Assassin Achievement (2) Manual Troops Achievement (1) Freestyle Achievement (2) Fog of War Achievement (1) Speed Achievement (2)
Cross-Map Achievement (1) Ratings Achievement (3) General Achievement (1) Tournament Contribution (6)

Re: Change FLAT RATE bonuses.

Postby GenuineEarlGrey on Mon Mar 09, 2009 4:41 pm

owenshooter wrote:if you want to remove the luck factor from flat rate, then don't play flat rate.


....or even avoid playing flat rate on small maps
User avatar
Sergeant 1st Class GenuineEarlGrey
 
Posts: 176
Joined: Thu May 01, 2008 1:30 am
Medals: 15
Standard Achievement (3) Terminator Achievement (1) Assassin Achievement (1) Freestyle Achievement (2) Fog of War Achievement (2)
Speed Achievement (1) Cross-Map Achievement (1) Ratings Achievement (4)

Re: Change FLAT RATE bonuses.

Postby cicero on Mon Mar 09, 2009 4:42 pm

Optimus Prime wrote:I happen to like my flat rate spoils just the way they are to be honest. No need to go fixing something that isn't broken.
My secretary already typed my response.

:)
User avatar
Sergeant cicero
 
Posts: 1358
Joined: Wed Mar 07, 2007 1:51 pm
Location: with the infected neutrals ... handing out maps to help them find their way to CC
Medals: 9
Standard Achievement (2) Terminator Achievement (1) Speed Achievement (1) Ratings Achievement (2) General Contribution (3)

Re: Change FLAT RATE bonuses.

Postby KernowWarrior on Mon Mar 09, 2009 5:32 pm

I like the Flat Rate bonuses as they are. Could introduce another card selection option for players who dont. Flat rate Original (RRR=4/GGG=6/BBB=8/RGB=10) and Flat Rate lite (all sets of 3, RRR GGG BBB RGB = 10)
User avatar
Sergeant KernowWarrior
 
Posts: 61
Joined: Tue Aug 21, 2007 7:39 am
Location: At work probably!
Medals: 21
Standard Achievement (3) Doubles Achievement (1) Terminator Achievement (2) Assassin Achievement (2) Manual Troops Achievement (1)
Freestyle Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (2) Speed Achievement (1) Random Map Achievement (2) Cross-Map Achievement (3)
Ratings Achievement (3)

Re: Change FLAT RATE bonuses.

Postby iambligh on Mon Mar 09, 2009 5:59 pm

what about 20 for a full-house?
Sergeant 1st Class iambligh
 
Posts: 144
Joined: Thu Jul 17, 2008 7:15 pm
Medals: 22
Standard Achievement (3) Doubles Achievement (3) Triples Achievement (1) Quadruples Achievement (2) Terminator Achievement (1)
Assassin Achievement (2) Speed Achievement (3) Cross-Map Achievement (2) Ratings Achievement (2) Tournament Achievement (2)
Clan Achievement (1)

Re: Change FLAT RATE bonuses.

Postby Woodruff on Mon Mar 09, 2009 6:56 pm

j35t3r.us wrote:Thats what? 7 for and 3 against. More replies please.
As stated above, cards have the same chances to be drawn but are worth different amounts. This is bad math. Make it more rare for the higher handins, makes no sense to have higher handins same probability as lower handins. I mean heck... Flat rate means FLAT RATE, not different rates!


In...that game we all love that brought us here..."flat rate" doesn't even mean any of the above, you may recall. That's really how we should probably go for flat rate.
User avatar
Corporal 1st Class Woodruff
 
Posts: 4973
Joined: Sat Jan 05, 2008 9:15 am
Medals: 27
Standard Achievement (4) Quadruples Achievement (1) Terminator Achievement (2) Manual Troops Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (3)
Speed Achievement (3) Teammate Achievement (1) Random Map Achievement (1) Cross-Map Achievement (3) Ratings Achievement (4)
Tournament Contribution (4)

Re: Change FLAT RATE bonuses.

Postby oVo on Wed Mar 11, 2009 7:22 pm

iambligh wrote:what about 20 for a full-house?

Players with an upper case v in their name should probably get a fresh 20 armies for all sets cashed in.

I like the setup as it is too and feel that escalating set option is there to pick up the slack.
User avatar
Major oVo
 
Posts: 3803
Joined: Fri Jan 26, 2007 1:41 pm
Location: Antarctica
Medals: 10
Standard Achievement (2) Doubles Achievement (1) Triples Achievement (1) Quadruples Achievement (1) Freestyle Achievement (1)
Fog of War Achievement (1) Trench Warfare Achievement (1) Ratings Achievement (2)

Re: Change FLAT RATE bonuses.

Postby Kotaro on Wed Mar 11, 2009 7:25 pm

Optimus Prime wrote:I happen to like my flat rate spoils just the way they are to be honest. No need to go fixing something that isn't broken.
Image
Highest Rank = 2048Image
Kotaro Fuma, The Terror of Death
User avatar
Private Kotaro
 
Posts: 2830
Joined: Sat Mar 03, 2007 2:31 pm
Location: Yer Village
Medals: 41
Standard Achievement (3) Doubles Achievement (3) Triples Achievement (2) Quadruples Achievement (2) Terminator Achievement (2)
Assassin Achievement (2) Freestyle Achievement (2) Fog of War Achievement (3) Speed Achievement (3) Cross-Map Achievement (3)
Ratings Achievement (3) Tournament Achievement (2) General Achievement (2) Tournament Contribution (9)

Re: Change FLAT RATE bonuses.

Postby PLAYER57832 on Wed Mar 11, 2009 8:00 pm

I like it just the way it is. That's why there are OPTIONS in CC... so you can play what you like.

If you don't like Flat Rate, don't play it!

That said, maybe there is room for a fourth option... without eliminated the current Flat rate?
Corporal 1st Class PLAYER57832
 
Posts: 2572
Joined: Fri Sep 21, 2007 9:17 am
Location: Pennsylvania
Medals: 30
Standard Achievement (4) Doubles Achievement (1) Triples Achievement (1) Quadruples Achievement (1) Terminator Achievement (2)
Assassin Achievement (1) Manual Troops Achievement (1) Freestyle Achievement (1) Nuclear Spoils Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (4)
Speed Achievement (2) Teammate Achievement (1) Random Map Achievement (1) Cross-Map Achievement (4) Ratings Achievement (4)
Training Achievement (1)

Re: Change FLAT RATE bonuses.

Postby lancehoch on Thu Mar 12, 2009 9:37 pm

e_i_pi wrote:
Joodoo wrote:
e_i_pi wrote:The chances of having a mixed is the same as the chances of having a coloured set you know


then we should make all of the sets worth 10 armies / 8 armies

That's what I mean.

RRR: 6 armies
GGG: 6 armies
BBB: 6 armies
RGB: 10 armies

is exactly the same as

RRR: 10 armies
GGG: 6 armies
BBB: 6 armies
RGB: 6 armies

statistically

pi, that is not true.
Subject: 10 army sets... are these common to turn in repeatedly?

lancehoch wrote:To answer the question from the thread title, actually mixed sets are more common than any single instance of a single colored set:
3 cards: 27 possibilities- 1/27 red, 1/27 green, 1/27 blue, 6/27 mixed, 18/27 no set
4 cards: 81 possibilities- 9/81 red, 9/81 green, 9/81 blue, 36/81 mixed, 18/81 no set
5 cards (note you can have a mixed set and a plain color set, I am counting these as mixed): 243 possibilities- 31/243 red, 31/243 green, 31/243 blue, 150/243 mixed, 0/243 no set

in percentages (mixed only):
3 cards: 22.22%
4 cards: 44.44%
5 cards: 61.73%

So to answer your question, yes it is very common to get a mixed set.

More in depth analysis for the 5 card situations:
only red: 31/243
only green: 31/243
only blue: 31/243
only mixed: 90/243
red and mixed: 20/243
green and mixed: 20/243
blue and mixed: 20/243

totals:
red: 51/243
green: 51/243
blue: 51/243
mixed: 150/243

What I would suggest is (if there is to be a change) actually changing the values to mixed = 4 and red/green/blue = 10.
Lieutenant lancehoch
 
Posts: 4158
Joined: Wed Dec 05, 2007 4:13 pm
Medals: 11
Standard Achievement (2) Terminator Achievement (1) Cross-Map Achievement (1) Ratings Achievement (1) General Achievement (1)
Tournament Contribution (1) General Contribution (4)

Re: Change FLAT RATE bonuses.

Postby ahunda on Fri Mar 13, 2009 6:41 am

As we all know, CC is derived from a popular board game, and the cash rules for Flat Rate are taken 1:1 from the rules of this board game. Changing the cash values would certainly upset all Flat Rate fans, who have been playing the board game for a long time, before coming to CC.

Whilst the standard setting in the original rules of the board game in the USA was Escalating (with Flat Rate being introduced in later versions as an alternative option), in Europe the standard always was Flat Rate. So especially the Europeans are used to the 10,8,6,4 rule as it is.

Now I don´t mind much, since I rarely (almost never) play Flat Rate, but I think changing the cash values is a really bad idea, for the mentioned reasons. Maybe suggest an additional / new Game Type with different cash values. Then again ... I really don´t care ...
Field Marshal ahunda
 
Posts: 411
Joined: Fri Apr 13, 2007 9:52 am
Medals: 28
Conqueror Achievement (1) Standard Achievement (3) Doubles Achievement (2) Triples Achievement (2) Quadruples Achievement (2)
Terminator Achievement (1) Assassin Achievement (1) Fog of War Achievement (2) Speed Achievement (1) Teammate Achievement (1)
Cross-Map Achievement (3) Ratings Achievement (2) General Achievement (1) Clan Achievement (6)

Next

Return to Archived Suggestions

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users

Login