Three Kingdoms of China - v10.1 [2015-02-01] p15 [Quenched]

[Seamus76]

That would work.

Ok, I have both versions changed, but my question is, now that the bonus is greater should the Capitals go to a starting 3n instead of the current 2n? I'm thinking yes, but does that then discourage anyone from taking them, thus putting us back in the same situation of non-use, etc? Or is the change enough?

[iancanton]

no, don't increase the neutrals, for exactly this reason!

ian.

[Seamus76]

CURRENT UPDATE INFO - 2013-12-31:
- Updated the Capital bonus from being only +4 for 3, to +2 for 2 and +6 for all 3.

Attached are the updated map images and xml.

CURRENT MAP VERSION

v10.0 - Large (840x800)

Click image to enlarge.

v10.0 - Small (630x600)

Click image to enlarge.

[RiffArt]

Hey, sorry if this has been brought up before. I just stumbled across this map and thought I'd mention it:

Some of the writing is very difficult to read. In particular:

The territory names in the darker green region (Riverland)
The territory names in both the darker red regions (Jing and especially Yang)
Wuting/Wuling is obscured by the crease. Moving the wiriting down a little would solve this I think, or maybe make the crease a little less evident there?
The territory names in the darkest blue region (Bei Ping)
Especially difficult is all the writing explaining the regional bonuses

I've not the experience that you guys have but the territory names would probably be easier to read if they were darker, maybe you'll have some different ideas. I hope you take this as the constructive criticism that it's intended to be, and can make the small fix because the map looks good.

[Jippd]

The difference between jing and king in colors is not that noticeable to me. I know that it is outlined to the bottom right in that little mini map but could it be possible to differentiate between those areas a little more?

[KingRat]

i like the map size and i like the bonus structures but the overall colour scheme is not great could use some work - overall a good map

[cooldeals]

I really like this map as I do all of Seamus maps. I really like the city bonuses that are unique from most CC maps as well as the masterfully set up dividers and 1 ways that make it just a little different. Something specific to consider is starting neutrals. In Game 14094126 a poly (3) game you'll notice I have Liang with Liang South being neutral and north also neutral. I also have Yong Cheng with 2 neutrals surrounding it. These essentially made my pink player impossible to take out. It seems maybe it would be better to make this so that drop specifically cannot protect a player.

[jonofperu]

Posting for March Challenge. Great map! The map is visually appealing to me. It has bright colors. The slight differences in shading help to point out the additive bonus structure. The legend is easily understood.
The neutrals balance potentially too-small bonus regions up north, but the only negative I see is Liang North and Bei Ping West always starting n3 (at least as far as I can tell) is a bit much IMO. Maybe the neutrals would be better on Liang and Bei Ping Port? Would n2 be too low there?

[Whatsausage]

I like the idea of the map, it seems pretty balanced and I like maps with city bonuses.
A possible improvement, or something I don't like with how it currently is, is that it is unclear if capitals count as cities, and if they don't, I think they should.

[Tviorr]

I like the balance of the map. The various fairly small bonuses work well. Lots to go for and settle with more or less ease, but only for limited bonus values, so even settling something is not neccessarily decisive for the game. I would think its especially good as a setup for 1v1 or 1 team v 1 team games.

I agree that the original (or recent) setup for the bonus of the capitals is a bit underpowered. Hard to get and hold (comparatively) so it does need some extra incentive to make it worth going for. - Im however wondering if 2 for 2 and 6 for 3 isnt a bit overpowered. - I kind of like the idea of having to get all 3 to achieve something. 6 might be good for that, but still. - It may push at the balance somewhat, cause it is then quite a big bonus for the map. -

Have you considered an alternate importance such as no bonus but a win clause? - Holding 3 capitals could give you the win. - This sort of makes sense to me as holding all capitals would be a logical thing to do to gain absolute power. - However this may also be overpowered, so Im wondering if a bit of an add on would be an option:

Such as: Hold all 3 capitals and the support of - hmmm 2? - villages to achieve ultimate power over the 3 Kingdoms of China. This would be doable, especially with trench setting yet sufficiently hard that youd need a lot of strength or careful and weaselly planning to swing it.

[lokisgal]

To me this is a good solid map - Its what I would refer to as a basic map - fairly well balanced no special tricks. Its a great map for 1 vs 1 or for dubs - I cant see it working for quads - to small.
The play is nice and straight forward

I do like the suggestion above about the capitals. Im not sure how that would play out in reality though. It could make for a very quick game given the size of the map. If you got the right drop you could potentially win in just a few rounds and that doesnt really make for fun game play so the holding of capitals plus 2 villages - (maybe 1 in the north one in the south) seems like an interesting idea

The capitals bonus should be altered in some way not sure exactly how but right now they don't seem to ever come into play and that seems a waste

Also the drop seems to be really one sided in a lot of games with one person being able to grab an entire bonus region very quickly

[Gilligan]

Updated!

[TheCrown]

2014-03-04 08:58:35 - TheCrown: I like this map because it's not easy to get a big bonus, it's usually little ones that you get first
2014-03-04 08:59:30 - TheCrown: What I don't like about this map is the one way attack, it seems a little unfair

[*Pixar*]

as I do like three kingdoms of korea, it is a very simple but takes some strategy to compete:) the only thing I dont like is the capital bonus between holding 2 capitals and 3 capitals a bonus of an extra 4 troops kinda unfair!

[iancanton]

gilligan, is the xml that is currently in play the China-v11(2013-12-31).xml file or a different one? in Game 14110298, despite u suck gaining 2 capitals after the update on 2014-03-08, he did not receive the +2 bonus for holding 2 capitals.

2014-03-09 09:45:49 - u suck assaulted Cheng-du from Yin Ping and conquered it from neutral player
2014-03-09 17:25:53 - u suck assaulted Jianye from Yu Zhang and conquered it from Pander88uk

2014-03-09 17:28:21 - Incrementing game to round 8
2014-03-09 17:29:13 - u suck received 2 troops for holding City Bonus
2014-03-09 17:29:13 - u suck received 6 troops for 20 regions

ian.

[Gamefreakguy]

Hey, posting for the March challenge, but wanted to say that I've really enjoyed this map so far! I like that each player starts with a city and therefore has a potential bonus just 1 city away, or can eliminate that potential for someone else right away. I think the drawback, as is getting a lot of attention in this thread, is the capitals - if I was designing the map, I'd make them +2 for 2 and +4 for 3, but with an additional +1 autodeploy on each. I feel it would provide the best incentive and balance.

[thoffs]

First quality that attracted me to this map was color scheme & simplicity. I am a bit of a purest at times & enjoy geographically accurate maps such as this. I am new to commenting on map design, so forgive me if this is way off. Would it be a good addition to create a one way pass into the green area from the red & bump the overall green bonus up to +9? Thought I would throw that out there just in case you didn't consider it.

[Swifte]

Posting for the BetaMarch challenge - and also to support a great map!

I've mostly played this map as doubles or triples, and I have really enjoyed the games. The great thing about this map to me is the number of small bonuses available, whether its one of the +1 region bonuses, or the endless combination of potential city bonus pairs - there really aren't any sections you can just forget about just because the region is too big to hold - if you ignore an area you are at least giving up a +1, potentially.

A suggestion for the map... the Zhuge Liang quote is great, but to me it kind of becomes a little blurred with the description of the capital/city rewards because it's a similar font. I know space is at a premium on the map, but it might stand out more either right below the map title (which may not be practical at this point because the space really isn't there) or along the lower right of the map where it wouldn't be competing with anything else.

Thanks and great job Seamus, hope this one is out of beta soon so you can keep making great things!

[iancanton]

gilligan, is the xml that is currently in play the China-v11(2013-12-31).xml file or a different one? in Game 14110298, despite u suck gaining 2 capitals after the update on 2014-03-08, he did not receive the +2 bonus for holding 2 capitals.

2014-03-09 09:45:49 - u suck assaulted Cheng-du from Yin Ping and conquered it from neutral player
2014-03-09 17:25:53 - u suck assaulted Jianye from Yu Zhang and conquered it from Pander88uk

2014-03-09 17:28:21 - Incrementing game to round 8
2014-03-09 17:29:13 - u suck received 2 troops for holding City Bonus
2014-03-09 17:29:13 - u suck received 6 troops for 20 regions

ian.

the +2 bonus for holding 2 capitals also failed to trigger in Game 14181868, which was initialised on 2013-03-21, even though JOHNNYROCKET24 held 2 capitals for much of the game.

ian.

[facet]

[beta map challenge]

I loved the design, this is one of the most beautiful maps I have played.

There was very little to dislike! The one way attack was the only slight annoyance. I need to play it a lot more before I can tell if it is unfair.

[jeremscarem]

also seem to be missing the +2 for 2 capitals bonus in game 14245190.
i'm sure you're on it, great map, love the artwork and gameplay.
thanks guys

gilligan, is the xml that is currently in play the China-v11(2013-12-31).xml file or a different one? in Game 14110298, despite u suck gaining 2 capitals after the update on 2014-03-08, he did not receive the +2 bonus for holding 2 capitals.

2014-03-09 09:45:49 - u suck assaulted Cheng-du from Yin Ping and conquered it from neutral player
2014-03-09 17:25:53 - u suck assaulted Jianye from Yu Zhang and conquered it from Pander88uk

2014-03-09 17:28:21 - Incrementing game to round 8
2014-03-09 17:29:13 - u suck received 2 troops for holding City Bonus
2014-03-09 17:29:13 - u suck received 6 troops for 20 regions

ian.

the +2 bonus for holding 2 capitals also failed to trigger in Game 14181868, which was initialised on 2013-03-21, even though JOHNNYROCKET24 held 2 capitals for much of the game.

ian.

[HotShot53]

As has been said before, holding Jianye and Chengdu didn't give me the +2 troop bonus I could have really used it too lol.

(Game http://www.conquerclub.com/game.php?game=14245202)

[Fuchsia tude]

As has been said before, holding Jianye and Chengdu didn't give me the +2 troop bonus I could have really used it too lol.

(Game http://www.conquerclub.com/game.php?game=14245202)

Same in 14068876 with Luoyang and Jianye.

[Tobikera]

As has been said before, holding Jianye and Chengdu didn't give me the +2 troop bonus I could have really used it too lol.

(Game http://www.conquerclub.com/game.php?game=14245202)

Same in 14068876 with Luoyang and Jianye.

I've played this map quite a bit, and like it in general. It's one of my top 10 maps to play. Two suggestions:

1. As an old fart, I find it very difficult to read the territory names. Any chance of boldening them a bit?
2. As with the quoted comments above, I have held every combination of captials multiple times, including all the capitals three times, in games and have yet to get the stated bonus points for same. Hope you can fix that.

Thanks, Tobikera