Flanders 1302V15[Beta] major changes! P19

[DubWarrior]

1. 40 territories on the map.
2. 8 continents.
3. a player gains an auto-deploy +1 by holding one of the rebel strongholds: Ieper, Kortrijk, Gent, Aalst, Antwerpen, Doornik
or a +2 auto deploy for one of the 2 province-capitals: Arras or Brugge (historical 2 important cities, Arras for the French, Brugge for the Flemish)
4. neutrals: A neutral army of 2 on Ieper, Kortrijk, Gent, Aalst, Antwerpen, Doornik
A neutral army of 3 on Brugge and Arras
5. Arras and Brugge are not a of any other bonus.

new maps, TIFF formats, V15
for changes see page 19
http://www.fileden.com/files/2010/1/27/2739987//BOTGS5L.tif
http://www.fileden.com/files/2010/1/27/2739987//BOTGS5S.tif
XML V5
http://www.fileden.com/files/2010/1/27/2739987//xml29102010.xml

Older version V14
Large V14


Small V14


Where the map is about:

At the end of 1200 the king of France, Philips IV declared war on the france province of Flanders, ruled by Gwijde van Dampierre. The france king replaced Dampierre by a new france governor, Jacques de Châtillon. During this change, the rich and wealthy cities begun to revolt angaist the France ruler, led by the ideas of individualism, stimulated by the international business that took place at that time in Flanders. These revolts started in Bruges (Brugge), the so called "Bruges Matins" and resulted on 11 july 1302 in the Battle of the Golden Spurs in Kortrijk. Flanders gained victory, and its autonomy. This day is still celebrated as the official holiday for the Flemish community in Belgium. (France will later take over Flanders once again).

This idea of these powerful cities and their little empires are the basis of the map. Most of the borders are historically situated between 1300 and 1400. (to encourage gameplay, some borders where scaled) All cities existed at that time.



First Draft
Second Draft
Third Draft
Fourth Draft
Fifth Draft
6th draft
7th draft
8th draft
9.1th draft
9.2th draft
10th draft
11th draft
12th draft
12.1th Draft
12.2th draft
12.3th draft
12.4th draft
13.1th draft
13.2th draft
13.3th draft







I hope you guys like it!
DubWarrior

[TaCktiX]

A really good first draft. A few concerns to get you started on the next version:

- A few spelling errors: it's "adDitional" and "passAble", with the obvious "impassAble".
- Kroon Vlaanderen will be hard to tell apart from Krotrijk for the colorblind. I'm not colorblind, and I had difficulty at first.
- The key needs to be on the actual map.
- The bridges could look better, and the swamps look like modified lakes instead of swamps.

Otherwise, a really good start, keep it up.

[DubWarrior]

Okay,
I changed some colors, and did some quick illustration for the bridges. I changed the swamps for city moats.
I did Kortrijk in some kind of blue, but now the borders in it, created by the rivers, are disappearing...so there is still some work to do concerning the colors...
I replaced the spelling errors. Temporary I deleted the region bonus, I'm looking for a better system (maybe with color codes in stead of a little map???)

[Yakinator]

Each capital should get a +1 bonus.
I doubt people will hold 4-6 castles in a normal game unless they are winning

Otherwise, nice start.

[LED ZEPPELINER]

You could probably shave off about 150px, if you move all of the bonus info at the top down so the top of it matches the top of the land, and move the title into the center of the water.

[sailorseal]

I like it but LEGEND has no E

[hecter]

You have a LOT of deadspace on the map. You could really cut down on the size if you spaced it all out properly.

[whitestazn88]

i like the way it looks, and the story behind the map is very nice, but theres nothing in the map itself that makes me think of "flanders 1302" yet... maybe work on that for future drafts

[Industrial Helix]

It's a nice map, that's for sure.

There's a few graphical tidbits that I'm assuming you just havent got to yet. Dotted lines going off page, not cropped to the edges of the map, ect. the border of Aalst.

I think something should be done to make the rivers stand out from the reg. borders. I get kind of confused when looking. add a blue tint?

Duenkerke needs to fit as well

I think axel is gonna need some work with that bridge.

broekburg to oostburg, theline shouldnt go over the ship mast i think. And what exactly is he significance of the ships? Kind of looks like decoration but its slightly confusing given the sea link.

Also, if you decide to stick with ships, i think an extra graphical layer on them would be good, like how you did with the bridges and stuff.

I think you should stick with the swamps over city moats, swamps strike me as more flanders-ish. I see the graphical critiques on it before, but I think it you just played with the graphics you could make it work.

Anyway, best of luck. It's a cool map and I look forward to playing it.

[Merker]

1 Biggy;

You need to worker on borders, continental borders, rivers and swamps as they are all muddled.

To help I suggest;
Combine rivers and streams
Make the lakes darker
Make the territorial and continental lines the same, or similiar.

[MrBenn]

There are definitely ways to optimise use of the space, but this is an incredibly good-looking first draft.

[DubWarrior]

Thanks for all the feedback, With most of it, I see what you mean. I hope to work on it this week-end...

just some questions:
-@Merker: combine streams and rivers...rivers are passable, streams not...so how to combine them?
-@ whitestazn88: what do you mean with 'makes me not think of Flanders 1302'? you'd like to see more knights, castles or something like that?

See you all soon!

[whitestazn88]

Thanks for all the feedback, With most of it, I see what you mean. I hope to work on it this week-end...

just some questions:
-@Merker: combine streams and rivers...rivers are passable, streams not...so how to combine them?
-@ whitestazn88: what do you mean with 'makes me not think of Flanders 1302'? you'd like to see more knights, castles or something like that?

See you all soon!

exactly. the way it is now... it just looks like a map. like i don't know much about the region or the history, but i'm sure the territorial divisions are already historical. but in terms of the feel of the map, it doesn't seem like it is historically set. the background on some territs could include kinghts or whatever was part of flanders in that era

again, i don't really know anything about the setting for the map, but maybe thats why you should include more stuff so that people will know that it is supposed to be set in 1302 and give us a feel for what flanders is about

[eigenvector]

Hey,

Really nice map.

I agree with whitestazn88 - there is a great potential in your idea that is not yet realized. Maybe you can introduce some gameplay elements inspired by the period?

[Merker]

-@Merker: combine streams and rivers...rivers are passable, streams not...so how to combine them?

Sorry, I really just rushed over it.

First of all, aren't streams a lot more passable(than rivers), and if rivers are passable are they needed on the map?

But it is a good map, so continue the good work.

[gimil]

Hi DubWarrior,

You current image, while solid and crisp, lacks any detail. It is a very plain image at the moment with only flat colours and glows. Can I assume that we will see some more textures and detail later on in production?

I can tell that you are a very able artist. I look forward to seeing how your first map develops.

Cheers,
gimil

[DubWarrior]

I'm sorry to keep you waiting guys, within a few days I've got some time to continu (finals for school are taking some time )

[DubWarrior]

Hi, Back with some changes.
I tried to change all thing you guys have posted, and thing are going great I think.
So thanks for all feedback, hope you all like it!

Greets
DubWarrior
Large


small

[eigenvector]

I like the look of the new map much better. It still leaves something to be desired but it is inchoate in my mind exactly what. Probably the more graphics-minded folks will spell it out for me

A question: why two of the areas have no capitals? You just didn't want to have too many bonuses or is there an historical reason?

[hecter]

Make the borders more visible.

[DubWarrior]

I like the look of the new map much better. It still leaves something to be desired but it is inchoate in my mind exactly what. Probably the more graphics-minded folks will spell it out for me

A question: why two of the areas have no capitals? You just didn't want to have too many bonuses or is there an historical reason?

3 areas have no capitals. In fact, for both reasons: I think there are enough bonuses for a pretty small map, but especially, i would like to make some sort of historical campaign: it's about these capitals where it was all about in 1302...so I consider these cities as something special and rare, worth struggling for...

[whitestazn88]

great update. i like the little backstory, the image in the background kinda gives us an idea of what we're reading about, and the capitals, if they are historically accurate, would also do the trick.

about the image, i think its fine how it is now, although the bridges, rivers and captials seem to have too much of a glow, and are taking my focus away from the map

[eigenvector]

I actually love the bridges. Btw, why are some decorated with posts? Are these some sort of special crossing points? And what do the icons for the capitals mean?

[DubWarrior]

Well, for myself, I'm not that sure about the way the bridges are looking, for now...but I think I leave that up to you, unless I find something better. I think it makes things looks complicated?

No, the bridges have all the same function, some have posts and others haven't...I was looking for some diversity, but maybe that makes things too complicated, also...

The capitals (and its icon) are explained on the left...for adding some historical gameplay, conquering a capitals means a bonus of an additional +1
Anyhow, I'm now working on the borders, and I wait a bit before spending more time working on another bridge...i'll see if someone else would replace them or not.

[whitestazn88]

i meant to say, are the images that you are using as the capitals historically accurate? or are they just a figment of your imagination at this point.