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Why Spending Needs to be Controlled: MI Food Stamp Lotto

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Why Spending Needs to be Controlled: MI Food Stamp Lotto

Postby Phatscotty on Fri Apr 22, 2011 4:10 pm

Before we give gov't another dime of ANYONE'S money!

Detroit —Detroit Public Library officials say finances have grown so bad they could close most neighborhood branches, but in a few weeks plan to unveil a revamped wing of a main library that even administrators say spares few expenses.

The South Wing is stocked with 20 yellow and orange European lounge chairs that cost $1,092 apiece, artistic pendant light fixtures and two alcohol-burning fireplaces. The project morphed from a $300,000 furniture update to a $2.3 million overhaul with new floors, study rooms, lighting and built-in, wood-framed book shelves.

"$1,100 per chair is reckless spending for a public institution," said Todd Kelly, president of American Federation of State, County and Municipal Employees Local 1259, which represents 125 workers, including clerks, janitors and security staffers.

It's not the only spending to come under question as the system considers closing up to 18 of 23 branches and laying off as many as 191 of 333 workers. A Detroit News review showed that, since 2008, the library has paid at least $160,000 to food vendors, including $1,760 at an ice-cream shop, and spent $1 million on 6 percent raises to union workers at a time counterparts in City Hall took 10 percent pay cuts.


http://detnews.com/article/20110422/MET ... get-crisis

The same thing happened recently in Minnesota. The gov't threatened to cut police because we don't have enough money, but greenlighted a million dollar water fountain project. Our gov'ts need to prove they can spend our money responsibly. When they do that, I will consider supporting higher taxes, if needed.
Last edited by Phatscotty on Wed May 18, 2011 5:24 pm, edited 4 times in total.
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Re: Why Spending Needs to be Controlled...

Postby PLAYER57832 on Fri Apr 22, 2011 4:12 pm

Then try ELEECTING people who care about something other than corporations.
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Re: Why Spending Needs to be Controlled...

Postby Phatscotty on Fri Apr 22, 2011 4:22 pm

PLAYER57832 wrote:Then try ELEECTING people who care about something other than corporations.


or, in this case....public Libraries?
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Postby 2dimes on Fri Apr 22, 2011 5:00 pm

Those Unions are out of control, I'm appalled.
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Re: Why Spending Needs to be Controlled...

Postby john9blue on Fri Apr 22, 2011 8:02 pm

fuckin libraries
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Postby 2dimes on Fri Apr 22, 2011 8:15 pm

Burn the books?
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Re: Why Spending Needs to be Controlled...

Postby Phatscotty on Tue Apr 26, 2011 12:13 am

Scrap the lavishness. keep the other 19 libraries open?

or tax the rich?

hmmmmmmm
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Re: Why Spending Needs to be Controlled...

Postby thegreekdog on Tue Apr 26, 2011 7:47 am

Good article. Poor responses from the CC masses.

Response #1 - Irrelevant.
Responses #4, #5, #6 - Jokes.

Weak guys, weak.
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Re: Why Spending Needs to be Controlled...

Postby Symmetry on Tue Apr 26, 2011 11:20 am

thegreekdog wrote:Good article. Poor responses from the CC masses.

Response #1 - Irrelevant.
Responses #4, #5, #6 - Jokes.

Weak guys, weak.


Scotty often picks up good articles. For some reason he doesn't title his threads accurately, and doesn't know how to title URL links. He gets what he deserves. The link doesn't. There've been a few posts that deserved more respect and attention from PS over the last few weeks, but got let down over PimpDave style misnaming or crap links telling us just to click on something from youtube because it will be interesting.
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Re: Why Spending Needs to be Controlled...

Postby PLAYER57832 on Tue Apr 26, 2011 11:29 am

Phatscotty wrote:
PLAYER57832 wrote:Then try ELEECTING people who care about something other than corporations.


or, in this case....public Libraries?

More like the contractors that got the bids.

and yeah... all things considered, I would rather money go to libaries than corporate tax breaks and cuts in the taxes very, very wealthy people pay.
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Re: Why Spending Needs to be Controlled...

Postby john9blue on Tue Apr 26, 2011 1:08 pm

thegreekdog wrote:Good article. Poor responses from the CC masses.

Response #1 - Irrelevant.
Responses #4, #5, #6 - Jokes.

Weak guys, weak.


well there's not much to say, obviously this is irresponsible spending
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Re: Why Spending Needs to be Controlled...

Postby PLAYER57832 on Tue Apr 26, 2011 1:20 pm

Phatscotty wrote:Before we give gov't another dime of ANYONE'S money!

Detroit —Detroit Public Library officials say finances have grown so bad they could close most neighborhood branches, but in a few weeks plan to unveil a revamped wing of a main library that even administrators say spares few expenses.

The South Wing is stocked with 20 yellow and orange European lounge chairs that cost $1,092 apiece, artistic pendant light fixtures and two alcohol-burning fireplaces. The project morphed from a $300,000 furniture update to a $2.3 million overhaul with new floors, study rooms, lighting and built-in, wood-framed book shelves.

"$1,100 per chair is reckless spending for a public institution," said Todd Kelly, president of American Federation of State, County and Municipal Employees Local 1259, which represents 125 workers, including clerks, janitors and security staffers.

It's not the only spending to come under question as the system considers closing up to 18 of 23 branches and laying off as many as 191 of 333 workers. A Detroit News review showed that, since 2008, the library has paid at least $160,000 to food vendors, including $1,760 at an ice-cream shop, and spent $1 million on 6 percent raises to union workers at a time counterparts in City Hall took 10 percent pay cuts.


http://detnews.com/article/20110422/MET ... get-crisis

The same thing happened recently in Minnesota. The gov't threatened to cut police because we don't have enough money, but greenlighted a million dollar water fountain project. Our gov'ts need to prove they can spend our money responsibly. When they do that, I will consider supporting higher taxes, if needed.

See, here is the problem with your argument that this is a government issue alone..

First, why did these things happen? Because some other people... Businesspeople, capitalists even, saw the opportunity to make a buck and took it. Bottom line.. that is why. Why did the politicians listen? Probably because said business people spent more time and effort talking to the politicians than their constituants, maybe promises were made, (but not actually necessary... and not likely anything direct, given that direct graft is illegal and, well.. folks are smart enough not to do that). Constituents, however seem to speak up mostly to complain... and NOT offer solutions exceot "give us what WE want", which is usually lower taxes and more services (both, at the same time... regardless of whether the complainer is liberal or conservative... all that changes is where they want the cuts and the gains).

Anyway, what you see is capitalism alive and well in politics. YET.. you seem to think that fully handing over the system to private business is the answer? This does not compute! The problem is business, certain special interests having too much influence on government.. but your "answer" is to turn the whole thing over to those same entities!

Look at any company and you see similar largess. Of course, it s not called graft when a corporate head decides to build a fancy new office building and to offer his execs and nice perks. Never mind any layoffs, etc...all that is irrelevant. Recently, some companies have begun scaling back on the lavishness, but if you want to look at true waste, you hardly want to look at big corporations. OOPS, I forgot... since thats "profits" from the paychecks of workers and customers.. oh, yeah, and taxpayers who have to clean up the messes of those companies.. it just doesn't matter in your book.
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Re: Why Spending Needs to be Controlled...

Postby BigBallinStalin on Tue Apr 26, 2011 1:58 pm

PLAYER57832 wrote:Then try ELEECTING people who care about something other than corporations.


I'm not sure taking a politician's by his or her word is really a good way at solving this problem.
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Re: Why Spending Needs to be Controlled...

Postby thegreekdog on Tue Apr 26, 2011 1:59 pm

BigBallinStalin wrote:
PLAYER57832 wrote:Then try ELEECTING people who care about something other than corporations.


I'm not sure taking a politician's by his or her word is really a good way at solving this problem.


I'm pretty sure most Detroit-based politicians are Democrats who, from what I've heard said, care about the average Joe and not about large corporations.
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Re: Why Spending Needs to be Controlled...

Postby Phatscotty on Tue Apr 26, 2011 2:13 pm

thegreekdog wrote:
BigBallinStalin wrote:
PLAYER57832 wrote:Then try ELEECTING people who care about something other than corporations.


I'm not sure taking a politician's by his or her word is really a good way at solving this problem.


I'm pretty sure most Detroit-based politicians are Democrats who, from what I've heard said, care about the average Joe and not about large corporations.


"The state of the art library is for the people. Detroit isn't broke, they are richer than ever before!"
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Re: Why Spending Needs to be Controlled...

Postby Phatscotty on Tue Apr 26, 2011 2:14 pm

Symmetry wrote:
thegreekdog wrote:Good article. Poor responses from the CC masses.

Response #1 - Irrelevant.
Responses #4, #5, #6 - Jokes.

Weak guys, weak.


Scotty often picks up good articles. For some reason he doesn't title his threads accurately, and doesn't know how to title URL links. He gets what he deserves. The link doesn't. There've been a few posts that deserved more respect and attention from PS over the last few weeks, but got let down over PimpDave style misnaming or crap links telling us just to click on something from youtube because it will be interesting.


Spending in Detroit certainly is out of control. Let me show you an example...
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Re: Why Spending Needs to be Controlled...

Postby PLAYER57832 on Tue Apr 26, 2011 6:50 pm

Phatscotty wrote:
Symmetry wrote:
thegreekdog wrote:Good article. Poor responses from the CC masses.

Response #1 - Irrelevant.
Responses #4, #5, #6 - Jokes.

Weak guys, weak.


Scotty often picks up good articles. For some reason he doesn't title his threads accurately, and doesn't know how to title URL links. He gets what he deserves. The link doesn't. There've been a few posts that deserved more respect and attention from PS over the last few weeks, but got let down over PimpDave style misnaming or crap links telling us just to click on something from youtube because it will be interesting.


Spending in Detroit certainly is out of control. Let me show you an example...

I don't live in Detroit and have no say in what happens there, so that aspect wasn't important to me (did not realize Phattscotty did, either :? ). It is a valid article, but I took Phattscotty's post to be yet another of his general condemnations of anything to do with the government.

So, yeah.. article decent and worthy of attention (at least if you live in Illinois), but Phattscotty's assertion that this is just another example of how horrible government is as opposed to the "free" market is garbage.
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Re: Why Spending Needs to be Controlled...

Postby Phatscotty on Tue Apr 26, 2011 7:32 pm

PLAYER57832 wrote:
Phatscotty wrote:
Symmetry wrote:
thegreekdog wrote:Good article. Poor responses from the CC masses.

Response #1 - Irrelevant.
Responses #4, #5, #6 - Jokes.

Weak guys, weak.


Scotty often picks up good articles. For some reason he doesn't title his threads accurately, and doesn't know how to title URL links. He gets what he deserves. The link doesn't. There've been a few posts that deserved more respect and attention from PS over the last few weeks, but got let down over PimpDave style misnaming or crap links telling us just to click on something from youtube because it will be interesting.


Spending in Detroit certainly is out of control. Let me show you an example...

I don't live in Detroit and have no say in what happens there, so that aspect wasn't important to me (did not realize Phattscotty did, either :? ). It is a valid article, but I took Phattscotty's post to be yet another of his general condemnations of anything to do with the government.

So, yeah.. article decent and worthy of attention (at least if you live in Illinois), but Phattscotty's assertion that this is just another example of how horrible government is as opposed to the "free" market is garbage.


oic. So if I don't live in Detroit.. I can't use it as an example. gotchya

the free market has nothing to do with it (wrong as usual player) this is all about wasteful extravagant gov't spending, and only about wasteful extravagant gov't spending
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Re: Why Spending Needs to be Controlled...

Postby Symmetry on Wed Apr 27, 2011 10:14 am

Phatscotty wrote:
PLAYER57832 wrote:
Phatscotty wrote:
Symmetry wrote:
thegreekdog wrote:Good article. Poor responses from the CC masses.

Response #1 - Irrelevant.
Responses #4, #5, #6 - Jokes.

Weak guys, weak.


Scotty often picks up good articles. For some reason he doesn't title his threads accurately, and doesn't know how to title URL links. He gets what he deserves. The link doesn't. There've been a few posts that deserved more respect and attention from PS over the last few weeks, but got let down over PimpDave style misnaming or crap links telling us just to click on something from youtube because it will be interesting.


Spending in Detroit certainly is out of control. Let me show you an example...

I don't live in Detroit and have no say in what happens there, so that aspect wasn't important to me (did not realize Phattscotty did, either :? ). It is a valid article, but I took Phattscotty's post to be yet another of his general condemnations of anything to do with the government.

So, yeah.. article decent and worthy of attention (at least if you live in Illinois), but Phattscotty's assertion that this is just another example of how horrible government is as opposed to the "free" market is garbage.


oic. So if I don't live in Detroit.. I can't use it as an example. gotchya

the free market has nothing to do with it (wrong as usual player) this is all about wasteful extravagant gov't spending, and only about wasteful extravagant gov't spending


I shouldn't have to make it to page 2 before you explain what you're trying to say. Accurate title, and properly named links. That's it. All I'm asking for.

When you do that, then Greek can whine all he wants about lame responses.

It's not so hard, is it?
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Re: Why Spending Needs to be Controlled...

Postby thegreekdog on Wed Apr 27, 2011 10:17 am

Symmetry wrote:I shouldn't have to make it to page 2 before you explain what you're trying to say. Accurate title, and properly named links. That's it. All I'm asking for.

When you do that, then Greek can whine all he wants about lame responses.

It's not so hard, is it?


Phatscotty used to be the master of these types of thread subjects. That torch has since passed to pimpdave.
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Re: Why Spending Needs to be Controlled...

Postby jimboston on Wed Apr 27, 2011 10:45 am

PLAYER57832 wrote:
Phatscotty wrote:
PLAYER57832 wrote:Then try ELEECTING people who care about something other than corporations.


or, in this case....public Libraries?

More like the contractors that got the bids.

and yeah... all things considered, I would rather money go to libaries than corporate tax breaks and cuts in the taxes very, very wealthy people pay.


It's the contractor's fault that Library Officials want to spend $1000 per chair?

Please explain logic.
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Re: Why Spending Needs to be Controlled...

Postby jimboston on Wed Apr 27, 2011 10:51 am

PLAYER57832 wrote: Businesspeople, capitalists even, saw the opportunity to make a buck and took it. Bottom line.. that is why. Why did the politicians listen? Probably because said business people spent more time and effort talking to the politicians than their constituants,


Please explain how this is a "business person's" fault.

The chair salesperson is doing his/her job... selling chairs. The most expensive chairs with the most margin. He or she is doing exactly what they are supposed to do.

The Library Official(s) is NOT doing his/her job. This person is spending public money in an act of self-aggrandizement. The job of this person (these people) is to weigh the costs/benefits of their spending of public money against two thing...
-> Other needs at the library.
-> The relative value of the spending versus the benefit to the public.
The people in charge obviously did NOT do a good job weighing these things.

The blame here rests 100% on the Library Officials.
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Re: Why Spending Needs to be Controlled...

Postby GreecePwns on Wed Apr 27, 2011 10:58 am

jimboston and symmetry are the voices of reason here.
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Re: Why Spending Needs to be Controlled...

Postby PLAYER57832 on Wed Apr 27, 2011 11:04 am

Phatscotty wrote:
PLAYER57832 wrote:
Phatscotty wrote:
Symmetry wrote:
thegreekdog wrote:Good article. Poor responses from the CC masses.

Response #1 - Irrelevant.
Responses #4, #5, #6 - Jokes.

Weak guys, weak.


Scotty often picks up good articles. For some reason he doesn't title his threads accurately, and doesn't know how to title URL links. He gets what he deserves. The link doesn't. There've been a few posts that deserved more respect and attention from PS over the last few weeks, but got let down over PimpDave style misnaming or crap links telling us just to click on something from youtube because it will be interesting.

Spending in Detroit certainly is out of control. Let me show you an example...

I don't live in Detroit and have no say in what happens there, so that aspect wasn't important to me (did not realize Phattscotty did, either :? ). It is a valid article, but I took Phattscotty's post to be yet another of his general condemnations of anything to do with the government.

So, yeah.. article decent and worthy of attention (at least if you live in Illinois), but Phattscotty's assertion that this is just another example of how horrible government is as opposed to the "free" market is garbage.


oic. So if I don't live in Detroit.. I can't use it as an example. gotchya

the free market has nothing to do with it (wrong as usual player) this is all about wasteful extravagant gov't spending, and only about wasteful extravagant gov't spending

Funny, that is pretty much what I said... to you, EVERYTHING bad is only about government overspending.

Trouble is, there are a lot more problems out there, actually worse problems but you choose to ignore all of those and continue to tout how only the government causes problems.

so, yeah, you are correct, but you are also dead wrong.
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Re: Why Spending Needs to be Controlled...

Postby Phatscotty on Wed Apr 27, 2011 1:48 pm

oh yeah, because I could give a crap about the second amendment, or healthcare, or the value of our currency....

:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

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